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 Post subject: Nationality
PostPosted: 21 Feb 2009, 17:06 

Joined: 18 May 2008, 15:01
Posts: 471
Location: Berlin, Germany
Here's a couple of posts on the nationality issue, which has been discussed in a myriad of threads, especially as to the nationality of Northern Irish boxers:

tegenm wrote:
We deal with thousands of boxers at this site, we don't have the means to decipher whether a Northern Irish boxer wants to be British or Irish, so we call them British.


They could also be called "Northern Irish" or more accurately "British or Irish" if BoxRec has no information on their nationality, "Irish" if BoxRec has evidence they have chosen to be Irish, or "British" if BoxRec has evidence they have chosen to be British.

JohnShep wrote:
We don't list passports we list countries, the information that so and so has a passport from country X is not as meaningful (in my opinion) as so and so hails from country X. International law is a red herring, a boxer born and bred in the USA who has at least one Mexican parent is entitled under Mexican law to hold both Mexican and US passports, however under US law he is not entitled to hold a Mexican passport. Anyway I've had an idea on this as to how to make the data more factual, I'm going to put it to the vote on the editor forum. Wait and see ......


A definition might be hard to find, though. What if boxers have moved from country to country in their childhood? Or are the parents' nationality/nationalities decisive?

Maybe a boxer could even be attributed more than one nationality.


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 Post subject: Re: Nationality
PostPosted: 21 Mar 2009, 07:42 

Joined: 19 Oct 2007, 19:30
Posts: 47
This topic is really complicated..... Nationality doesn't mean what passport you got. It's how you feel.

Citizenship is another thing and we must not be confused by that.

If John Duddy say's he is Irish by blood, than who has the right to tell him what he is. A piece of paper (passport) doesn't make him British.
Boxing has a lot to do with pride.... and if somebody is proud to be Irish, you can't take that away from him.

We Albanians had a lot of debate about this topic, since Luan Krasniqi choose to be presented as German. He choose that himself and nobody can say nothing to him. But if Elvir Muriqi declares himself as Albanian, nobody can call him American.


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 Post subject: Re: Nationality
PostPosted: 21 Mar 2009, 08:04 
Editor
Editor

Joined: 16 Sep 2003, 04:38
Posts: 3884
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
"nobody can call him American"

We are not.
We are now simply rating him as US boxer, because all (except 2) of his fight to date were there.

He was born in Kosovo, which is clearly stated. He can class himself any nationality he likes....and anyone else for that matter.


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 Post subject: Re: Nationality
PostPosted: 21 Mar 2009, 08:35 
Editor
Editor

Joined: 16 Sep 2003, 04:38
Posts: 3884
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
Some boxers play nationality game to suit the occasion.
e.g Vic Darchinyan
When he kicked-off his pro career in Australia he was proud to be an Aussie. Now that he's on world stage he's Armenian.

What would be the point rating him as Armenian when he never fought there as pro or OZ, when he now only campaigns out of here & not here?

New system certainly assists me 'cos of numerous New Zealanders, Samoans, Tongans, Africans, Filipinos who reside & campaign here.
Most requested we rate them in Aussie ratings, but I couldn't oblige 'cos in the past they could only be rated according to their nationality.


Last edited by AntonS on 21 Mar 2009, 09:06, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Nationality
PostPosted: 21 Mar 2009, 09:56 

Joined: 19 Jun 2007, 14:35
Posts: 1999
Location: Dudelange, Luxembourg
Darchinyan is now rated as U.S. American, as I just saw... Is that correct?


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 Post subject: Re: Nationality
PostPosted: 21 Mar 2009, 10:16 
Editor
Editor

Joined: 16 Sep 2003, 04:38
Posts: 3884
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
claudevsq wrote:
Darchinyan is now rated as U.S. American, as I just saw... Is that correct?

Yes, because all bar 2 of his fights since 2006 were in US. He campaigns out of OZ and does not campaign here.

Dexter Dunworth is an Aussie, who resides in OZ but only fights in US, hence US rating.
http://www.boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?hu ... &cat=boxer


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 Post subject: Re: Nationality
PostPosted: 23 Mar 2009, 14:07 

Joined: 16 Jan 2006, 14:23
Posts: 894
Location: Republic of Ireland
Doni_albo wrote:
This topic is really complicated..... Nationality doesn't mean what passport you got. It's how you feel.

Citizenship is another thing and we must not be confused by that.

If John Duddy say's he is Irish by blood, than who has the right to tell him what he is. A piece of paper (passport) doesn't make him British.


Well the thing is with Duddy that his piece of paper(passport) said he was Irish, Duddy didn't have a British passport and said all along that he was Irish. Under law Northern Irish people have the right to Irish or British citizenship, they can also have both.

Anyway the matter is sorted now.


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 Post subject: Re: Nationality
PostPosted: 20 Apr 2009, 15:36 

Joined: 18 May 2008, 15:01
Posts: 471
Location: Berlin, Germany
Some world champions are assigned two nationalities in the encyclopaedia whereas BoxRec assigns only one nationality to a boxer. As the encyclopaedia should match BoxRec, either the latter should be enabled to list more than one nationality per boxer or the encyclopaedia should restrict the number of nationalities per boxer to one. A list of discrepancies between BoxRec and its encyclopaedia has been compiled.


Last edited by Emaster on 17 Sep 2009, 01:58, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Nationality
PostPosted: 21 Apr 2009, 17:56 

Joined: 03 Dec 2005, 03:05
Posts: 6878
A friend of mine is a Catholic born in Northern Ireland. As far as he is concerned there is only one Ireland, the UK just happens to occupy some of it.


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