Darchinyan to defend his title, not Nashiro's

claudevsq · Post by **claudevsq** » 13 Jan 2010, 16:33

Hi! You have Vic Darchinyan defend his titles on March 6 against Raúl Martínez, the ~ WBC super flyweight title ~ and the ~ WBA World super flyweight title ~. The first one is correct, whilst the second one belongs to Nobuo Nashiro. It should be ~ WBA Super World super flyweight title ~. Please someone correct this, thanks!

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 13 Jan 2010, 17:20

claudevsq wrote:Hi! You have Vic Darchinyan defend his titles on March 6 against Raúl Martínez, the ~ WBC super flyweight title ~ and the ~ WBA World super flyweight title ~. The first one is correct, whilst the second one belongs to Nobuo Nashiro. It should be ~ WBA Super World super flyweight title ~. Please someone correct this, thanks!

No Sir.
Darchinyan is 'unified' not 'super' champ, therefore classed by us 'world' as is Nashiro

claudevsq · Post by **claudevsq** » 13 Jan 2010, 19:46

Of course, Sir, Darchinyan is "unified" champion. See latest WBA rankings: http://wbanews.com/artman/uploads/1/WBA_10-11__09_.pdf
Therefore, you have to put him as "WBA Super World", just as you have Mosley-Berto for January 30 and Ward for April 17. As you can see in the ratings, Vic is "unified", Nashiro is "regular" and Donaire is "interim".

As soon as you have the WBA plus one other title (and in other cases, too), you are listed by BoxRec as "WBA Super World".

claudevsq · Post by **claudevsq** » 13 Jan 2010, 19:48

Or do you think he defends a different title against Martínez and has against Rojas than against Mijares or Arce?!? You're really nuts, have a beer...

claudevsq · Post by **claudevsq** » 13 Jan 2010, 19:49

Caballero and Márquez are also unified, and you have them matches under "WBA Super World", which means the same as Super, because we don't want to create another title category for the WBA, do we???

Emaster · Post by **Emaster** » 13 Jan 2010, 20:43

I agree with claudevsq. Take a look at this article on the WBA site, which uses several terms seemingly interchangeably to refer to what is commonly known as the "super champion": super champion, undisputed champion, unified champion, undisputed super champion, or unified super champion.

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 13 Jan 2010, 23:47

Darch was 'super champ' when he also held IBF, which is now history.
You can rave on as much as you like, but he'll remain classed 'world' by us.

WBA SUPER CHAMPIONSHIPS
(by WBA - Feb 11, 2009 - 11:12:37 AM)

DEFINITION

The SUPER WORLD CHAMPION CATEGORY OR UNDISPUTED WORLD CHAMPION was created for those World Champions who hold the title of two or more organizations recognized by the WBA, like the World Boxing Council (WBC), the International Boxing Federation (IBF) and the World Boxing Organization (WBO).

The creation of the category of SUPER WORLD CHAMPIONS or UNDISPUTED WORLD CHAMPIONS was born from a suggestion sent to us by Lennox Lewis, World Boxing Association former Heavyweight Champion, which we have considered convenient in order to give the Unified Champions a more flexible time to defend their titles as well as the challengers the chance to fight for the title.

I'll have a look at others, when I got time on my hands.

claudevsq · Post by **claudevsq** » 14 Jan 2010, 03:45

Yeah, like Juan Manuel Márquez... He's got the "WBA Super World" and the WBO title... do you really now want to change back for all those records and years? I don't mind, but logically, you are wrong...

What if, in a few years, people will look up "super flyweight" under "titles" at "WBA World", and they find Darchinyan and Nashiro for the same span of time? That's why Darch should be "WBA Super World", because Nashiro is already "WBA World"...just as Donaire (interim)... Just like E-Master said before, terms like unified, Super, Undisputed and so on seem indeed interchangeable for some time now, if you follow the WBA...

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 14 Jan 2010, 04:43

WBA created the problem not us.
We can't class him 'super world' champ if WBA doesn't.

END OF STORY

Emaster · Post by **Emaster** » 14 Jan 2010, 18:24

AntonS wrote:WBA created the problem not us.
We can't class him 'super world' champ if WBA doesn't.

BoxRec should shed as much light on this WBA-created mess as possible. If the term "super champion" is now being rejected, how about calling the "nonregular" title holder the "unified champion" (altough this term is misleading when it comes to "nonregular" champions who are only recognized by the WBA)? But not distinguishing him from the "regular" titlist at all causes confusion.

Having said that, I don't think sticking to the "super championship" is a problem. As shown above, different terms refer to the "nonregular" champion. Vic Darchinyan, for instance, is called "undisputed champion" in these ratings.

Another thread on the WBA disorder: WBA Ordinary World Title

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 14 Jan 2010, 19:08

WBA no longer uses 'undisputed' terminology.
We'll stick to super, world & interim & let historians of the time worry about it.
Feel free to insert explanation in Wiki. Most of us don't have the time to stuff around with WBA's CRAP
Cheers

Blue · Post by **Blue** » 14 Jan 2010, 19:09

U guys should be talking to the ABC's about their titles instead of BoxRec.

Whenever I bring up the subject with them, I'm accused of trying to be the police of boxing.
The WBA, more than any, don't cooperate nor send us promos or keep their site updated.

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 14 Jan 2010, 19:15

Updating its website would air too much dirty linen

Emaster · Post by **Emaster** » 15 Jan 2010, 06:39

AntonS wrote:We'll stick to super, world & interim & let historians of the time worry about it.

(Darchinyan's record needs to be edited accordingly with his latest and next fights being for the "WBA Super World super flyweight title".)

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 15 Jan 2010, 08:01

Emaster wrote:
AntonS wrote:We'll stick to super, world & interim & let historians of the time worry about it.
(Darchinyan's record needs to be edited accordingly with his latest and next fights being for the "WBA Super World super flyweight title".)

Blue wrote: U guys should be talking to the ABC's about their titles instead of BoxRec.
Whenever I bring up the subject with them, I'm accused of trying to be the police of boxing.
I'm usually not accused of anything, but just ignored.

Why!!

Emaster · Post by **Emaster** » 15 Jan 2010, 09:26

AntonS wrote:
Emaster wrote:
AntonS wrote:We'll stick to super, world & interim & let historians of the time worry about it.
(Darchinyan's record needs to be edited accordingly with his latest and next fights being for the "WBA Super World super flyweight title".)

Blue wrote: U guys should be talking to the ABC's about their titles instead of BoxRec.
Whenever I bring up the subject with them, I'm accused of trying to be the police of boxing.
I'm usually not accused of anything, but just ignored.
Why!!

Assuming you refer to what is marked in red, I can only repeat that Darchinyan is the WBA super unified undisputed champion while Nashiro is the regular champion and that BoxRec seems to have settled on sticking to the "WBA super world champion" and the "(interim) WBA world champion" tags:

AntonS wrote:We'll stick to super, world & interim

claudevsq · Post by **claudevsq** » 15 Jan 2010, 10:27

Absolutely correct, Emaster...

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 15 Jan 2010, 16:36

I guess the 2 of you fail to understand there's a difference between Unified & Super

Emaster · Post by **Emaster** » 15 Jan 2010, 17:58

AntonS wrote:I guess the 2 of you fail to understand there's a difference between Unified & Super

I don't think so. In any case Darchinyan's and Nashiro's titles should not be named the same as they're different titles. And the other WBA titles which have been called "super world titles" in BoxRec might need to be changed as well if they are not considered "super world titles" any more.

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 15 Jan 2010, 18:14

It's a terrible situation. I can foresee boxing fans focused on WBA titles becoming suicidal

claudevsq · Post by **claudevsq** » 16 Jan 2010, 04:47

Hi, this is Claude's wife. My husband hanged himself last night. It's terrible. I just wanted to let you know...

DD

AntonS · Post by **AntonS** » 16 Jan 2010, 04:59

........and now my Honourable friends Claude's life has come to an end, we must create Super Heavyweight belt in his memory......

Blue · Post by **Blue** » 16 Jan 2010, 05:25

http://www.fightnews.com/?p=35051#more-35051

claudevsq · Post by **claudevsq** » 23 Jan 2010, 11:48

http://wbanews.com/artman/publish/campi ... ndex.shtml

There, on the WBA page, you can see that "Super", "Unified" or "Undisputed Super" champions is all the same meaning. So, as Vic has got two titles, he should be moved to the "WBA Super World" category. Nashiro is already in the "WBA World" category, and there are no more categories, and there's also no need to create more...

Reenthelawman · Post by **Reenthelawman** » 24 Jan 2010, 16:58

claudevsq wrote:http://wbanews.com/artman/publish/campi ... ndex.shtml

There, on the WBA page, you can see that "Super", "Unified" or "Undisputed Super" champions is all the same meaning. So, as Vic has got two titles, he should be moved to the "WBA Super World" category. Nashiro is already in the "WBA World" category, and there are no more categories, and there's also no need to create more...

Not to add fuel to the fire, but my understanding of that page is exactly the opposite of yours. The use of the precise terms seems to have meaning.

Darchinyan to defend his title, not Nashiro's

Darchinyan to defend his title, not Nashiro's

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