Dana White

Spud
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Dana White

Post by Spud »

There are various rumours Dana White will be taking a dip into boxing…

Quite simply… does boxing need him ?

If so why?

Has the emergence of the “Saudi’s” scuppered any chance of Dana.
SeanBrennan
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Re: Dana White

Post by SeanBrennan »

Spud wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 07:49 There are various rumours Dana White will be taking a dip into boxing…

Quite simply… does boxing need him ?

If so why?

Has the emergence of the “Saudi’s” scuppered any chance of Dana.
he co-promoted the Mcgregor-Mayweather farce iirc.

I don't think he would hurt boxing though, he's turned UFC into something massive. I quite like him.
Coco
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Re: Dana White

Post by Coco »

SeanBrennan wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 07:51
Spud wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 07:49 There are various rumours Dana White will be taking a dip into boxing…

Quite simply… does boxing need him ?

If so why?

Has the emergence of the “Saudi’s” scuppered any chance of Dana.
he co-promoted the Mcgregor-Mayweather farce iirc.

I don't think he would hurt boxing though, he's turned UFC into something massive. I quite like him.
But would boxing hurt him?

Promoting isn't for the faint hearted unless you are called Ben Shallom
SeanBrennan
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Re: Dana White

Post by SeanBrennan »

Coco wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 08:06
SeanBrennan wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 07:51
Spud wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 07:49 There are various rumours Dana White will be taking a dip into boxing…

Quite simply… does boxing need him ?

If so why?

Has the emergence of the “Saudi’s” scuppered any chance of Dana.
he co-promoted the Mcgregor-Mayweather farce iirc.

I don't think he would hurt boxing though, he's turned UFC into something massive. I quite like him.
But would boxing hurt him?

Promoting isn't for the faint hearted unless you are called Ben Shallom
hahaha very possibly.

Ben comment made me chuckle.
maverick23
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Re: Dana White

Post by maverick23 »

Dana is an excellent promoter and businessman.

He’s worth a fortune and has a good thing going with TKO and UFC.

Boxing’s linear TV ratings with Top Rank have been poor and are declining whilst their UFC numbers have been decent. Also the cost to ESPN of boxing will likely be a lot more than the UFC.

A UFC prelims show gets more viewers on ESPN than say the Beterbiev/Smith show or the recent Teofimo Lopez show. Lopez was probably paid $4-5m for that which ultimately comes from ESPN and their ad revenue would be less than the main fighter purses.

Dana will know this but will also know that to make a mark in boxing he’d have to pay well over the odds to get the guys at the higher levels and I can’t see him wanting to lose money on shows.

There’s been a bit of talk of TKO buying/investing in either Top Rank or Matchroom but I’d be surprised if either happens.

It wouldn’t surprise me if ESPN don’t renew their deal with Top Rank next year and Dana does something albeit at a lower level and try and build guys from a low base but have guys active and them in consistently competitive fights which was the hallmark of the rise of the UFC.
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Re: Dana White

Post by joshj909 »

The rumours have been around for nearing on 10 years. He's said he's interested then denies it then says he's interested again.

Boxers will not sign with Dana if he gives them UFC style contracts, in fact, they can't because of the Ali Act. I don't think Dana has much success if he can't control and underpay his fighters like he does in the UFC.
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Re: Dana White

Post by Spud »

joshj909 wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 09:44 The rumours have been around for nearing on 10 years. He's said he's interested then denies it then says he's interested again.

Boxers will not sign with Dana if he gives them UFC style contracts, in fact, they can't because of the Ali Act. I don't think Dana has much success if he can't control and underpay his fighters like he does in the UFC.
Good post

I agree with a lot of what you have written.

The main point is the boxers purses … the saudis have inflated them big time
maverick23
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Re: Dana White

Post by maverick23 »

joshj909 wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 09:44 The rumours have been around for nearing on 10 years. He's said he's interested then denies it then says he's interested again.

Boxers will not sign with Dana if he gives them UFC style contracts, in fact, they can't because of the Ali Act. I don't think Dana has much success if he can't control and underpay his fighters like he does in the UFC.
Dana can control boxers like he does with MMA fighters. MMA fighters are allowed managers to negotiate with the UFC. They’d sign a deal and get paid the contractual amounts per fight just like with a boxing promoter. What from the Muhammed Ali act isn’t allowed in UFC deals?

His main issue is that boxing has far more competition so his UFC pay scale wouldn’t attract the best fighters. His brand wouldn’t have the pull like the UFC does either.
maverick23
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Re: Dana White

Post by maverick23 »

Spud wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 09:54
joshj909 wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 09:44 The rumours have been around for nearing on 10 years. He's said he's interested then denies it then says he's interested again.

Boxers will not sign with Dana if he gives them UFC style contracts, in fact, they can't because of the Ali Act. I don't think Dana has much success if he can't control and underpay his fighters like he does in the UFC.
Good post

I agree with a lot of what you have written.

The main point is the boxers purses … the saudis have inflated them big time
US boxing purses were already inflated before the Saudis came in. The Saudis have take it to the next level though for light heavyweights and above.

The big issue in US boxing is fighters being paid more than their commercial worth. It’s been happening since PBC entered the market really and we’ve seen many networks move away from boxing since then and the lack of ‘free’ PBC shows on Prime is a bad sign.
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Re: Dana White

Post by deadpan »

I watch UFC but can't abide White and his double standards. I don't think the man behind the deplorable Power Slap would be a welcome addition to boxing.
Kilburn
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Re: Dana White

Post by Kilburn »

The Powerslap thing is a tad bizarre from White, and will surely only go on for as long as it takes for someone to get seriously hurt. Or maybe I’m just being dramatic.

It may just be my personal perception but I feel like the UFC is struggling somewhat, there seems to be a distinct lack of charisma among the roster these days, most of the big names are getting up there in age. UFC 300 isn’t exactly a mouth watering event, not to me anyway. Aspinall, Edwards, Khamzat and Machachev are looking good but are not set to appear in any big showdowns any time soon.

Whether any of this is relevant to White’s potential foray into boxing promotion, I couldn’t say. I actually thought he was already doing it to some degree, I’m probably wrong.
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Re: Dana White

Post by Spud »

I do think Eddie has introduced a lot of what Dana does.

Whilst I am impressed with Dana, I feel he has midsed the boat concerning boxing.
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Re: Dana White

Post by si7dog7 »

Spud wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 14:56 I do think Eddie has introduced a lot of what Dana does.

Whilst I am impressed with Dana, I feel he has midsed the boat concerning boxing.
He has been talking about it for at least 15 years.
Apart from cross overs. (I’m not talking Allen Iversen either).
Nah.
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Re: Dana White

Post by SeanBrennan »

si7dog7 wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 14:59
Spud wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 14:56 I do think Eddie has introduced a lot of what Dana does.

Whilst I am impressed with Dana, I feel he has midsed the boat concerning boxing.
He has been talking about it for at least 15 years.
Apart from cross overs. (I’m not talking Allen Iversen either).
Nah.
that made me chuckle, I loved Iversen when I was going through my 13 year old "I love Tupac and basketball" phase. I remember doing my ankle in trying to do the Iversen crossover!
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Re: Dana White

Post by The_Don1 »

As others have said, Dana has long time talked about getting involved in boxing, and then not getting involved in boxing.

He won't get involved in boxing per se, but I can see him, along with TKO getting their weight behind Tom Loeffler who's shows appear on UFC Fight Pass. They seem to be moulding Callum Walsh into a star, with White and the top brass of WWE being at his last fight, and then Walsh appearing at WWE show, that would make sense.
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Re: Dana White

Post by SeanBrennan »

The_Don1 wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 16:36 As others have said, Dana has long time talked about getting involved in boxing, and then not getting involved in boxing.

He won't get involved in boxing per se, but I can see him, along with TKO getting their weight behind Tom Loeffler who's shows appear on UFC Fight Pass. They seem to be moulding Callum Walsh into a star, with White and the top brass of WWE being at his last fight, and then Walsh appearing at WWE show, that would make sense.
interesting, why Walsh? Young Irish fella, clearly talented but odd choice, not a massive name or weight.
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Re: Dana White

Post by The_Don1 »

SeanBrennan wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 18:50
The_Don1 wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 16:36 As others have said, Dana has long time talked about getting involved in boxing, and then not getting involved in boxing.

He won't get involved in boxing per se, but I can see him, along with TKO getting their weight behind Tom Loeffler who's shows appear on UFC Fight Pass. They seem to be moulding Callum Walsh into a star, with White and the top brass of WWE being at his last fight, and then Walsh appearing at WWE show, that would make sense.
interesting, why Walsh? Young Irish fella, clearly talented but odd choice, not a massive name or weight.
Young Irish fella, being the key words. He also goes out with UFC fighter Tabatha Ricci, so there's a link there.
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Re: Dana White

Post by Fray Bentos »

Yeah, he understands the basic logic of professional fighting sports, fights are meant to be well matched and people will pay lots of money to watch it. Nobody cares about records, he has took MMA all over the globe, he has held successful promotions on every continent. Boxing badly needs him and he is a boxing fan more than anything - the fights he makes will be the fights we want to watch.

Boxing needs a massive overhaul and he's the man to do it.
si7dog7
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Re: Dana White

Post by si7dog7 »

Fray Bentos wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 01:36 Yeah, he understands the basic logic of professional fighting sports, fights are meant to be well matched and people will pay lots of money to watch it. Nobody cares about records, he has took MMA all over the globe, he has held successful promotions on every continent. Boxing badly needs him and he is a boxing fan more than anything - the fights he makes will be the fights we want to watch.

Boxing needs a massive overhaul and he's the man to do it.
Maybe
But breaking the current “cartel” might be impossible.
Perhaps if he got In cahoots with Ring Magazine and their ranking system. Updated it and had clear World Champions. ? The status quo might be broken.
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Re: Dana White

Post by Oiky »

Boxing doesn't need him but could definitely do with him imo, 100%

Boxing fans can get over excited and exaggerate when 2 or 3 good fights are made back to back, and call it a good year, but looking at the bigger picture that's 2 or 3 good fights out of how much absolute jank, lots of boxing matches might aswell be pre determined like WWE, there's hardly any competitive match making to them, and some fights you watch and you ask yourself why cos you know who's winning

Yeah there is cracking scraps out there that Boxing people will be aware of, but its like those that are involved can't be messed to promote them.

I'm Boxing through and through but I do love MMA, how can you not the way it's run, yeah it's easier cos it's under the one banner but fairplay, lots of MMA fights are unpredictable, and you watch knowing anything can happen. Like all combat sports it has its s**t matches that aren't worth watching, but Boxing takes the piss in that regard

Boxing will never change though, it keep giving out poor or mediocre fights on the whole, then everyone will get giddy when 2 good fights happen and go over the top about it

And I'll be watching :lol:
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Re: Dana White

Post by SeanBrennan »

The_Don1 wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 20:01
SeanBrennan wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 18:50
The_Don1 wrote: 27 Feb 2024, 16:36 As others have said, Dana has long time talked about getting involved in boxing, and then not getting involved in boxing.

He won't get involved in boxing per se, but I can see him, along with TKO getting their weight behind Tom Loeffler who's shows appear on UFC Fight Pass. They seem to be moulding Callum Walsh into a star, with White and the top brass of WWE being at his last fight, and then Walsh appearing at WWE show, that would make sense.
interesting, why Walsh? Young Irish fella, clearly talented but odd choice, not a massive name or weight.
Young Irish fella, being the key words. He also goes out with UFC fighter Tabatha Ricci, so there's a link there.
thanks Don, that makes sense. Thanks for the context.
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Re: Dana White

Post by maverick23 »

Fray Bentos wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 01:36 Yeah, he understands the basic logic of professional fighting sports, fights are meant to be well matched and people will pay lots of money to watch it. Nobody cares about records, he has took MMA all over the globe, he has held successful promotions on every continent. Boxing badly needs him and he is a boxing fan more than anything - the fights he makes will be the fights we want to watch.

Boxing needs a massive overhaul and he's the man to do it.
How can he do it though? Boxing promotion in the US is a massively competitive market for the top fighters whilst the UFC have built a great brand which they’d struggle to take advantage of with boxing and are notorious for paying fighters less than they probably should.
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Re: Dana White

Post by Fray Bentos »

maverick23 wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 05:56
Fray Bentos wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 01:36 Yeah, he understands the basic logic of professional fighting sports, fights are meant to be well matched and people will pay lots of money to watch it. Nobody cares about records, he has took MMA all over the globe, he has held successful promotions on every continent. Boxing badly needs him and he is a boxing fan more than anything - the fights he makes will be the fights we want to watch.

Boxing needs a massive overhaul and he's the man to do it.
How can he do it though? Boxing promotion in the US is a massively competitive market for the top fighters whilst the UFC have built a great brand which they’d struggle to take advantage of with boxing and are notorious for paying fighters less than they probably should.
The one thing boxing is missing is competitive fights all around the board - if he could hold cards where all the fights were competitive - from six rounders to the main event - then people would pay good money to watch them, think of these 'misfits' fights, they sell out arenas AND get PPV because they're competitive even though the skill level isn't very good and sometimes it's atrocious but because they're usually well matched, people will pay to watch it. All people want to see is a good, honest scrap between two evenly matched fighters.

He might not be able to start at the very top but he is a known brand and I would like to see him try, I have a hunch a lot of top class boxers like it how it is at the moment - they can duck fighters, pick and choose etc - it would be nice for him to come in and shake it up, it needs shaking up, it really does.
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Re: Dana White

Post by maverick23 »

Fray Bentos wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 06:23
maverick23 wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 05:56
Fray Bentos wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 01:36 Yeah, he understands the basic logic of professional fighting sports, fights are meant to be well matched and people will pay lots of money to watch it. Nobody cares about records, he has took MMA all over the globe, he has held successful promotions on every continent. Boxing badly needs him and he is a boxing fan more than anything - the fights he makes will be the fights we want to watch.

Boxing needs a massive overhaul and he's the man to do it.
How can he do it though? Boxing promotion in the US is a massively competitive market for the top fighters whilst the UFC have built a great brand which they’d struggle to take advantage of with boxing and are notorious for paying fighters less than they probably should.
The one thing boxing is missing is competitive fights all around the board - if he could hold cards where all the fights were competitive - from six rounders to the main event - then people would pay good money to watch them, think of these 'misfits' fights, they sell out arenas AND get PPV because they're competitive even though the skill level isn't very good and sometimes it's atrocious but because they're usually well matched, people will pay to watch it. All people want to see is a good, honest scrap between two evenly matched fighters.

He might not be able to start at the very top but he is a known brand and I would like to see him try, I have a hunch a lot of top class boxers like it how it is at the moment - they can duck fighters, pick and choose etc - it would be nice for him to come in and shake it up, it needs shaking up, it really does.
I agree that boxing could do with being shaken up but I disagree with your example of Misfits. People don’t watch and pay PPV because it’s competitive fights. They watch and pay because they’re personalities they want to see fight.

Fighters would join Dana if he’s going to pay them more than their current promoter. However it’s hard to make the numbers stack when they don’t even work currently with Top Rank/ESPN and Dana is notorious for paying fighters below their commercial worth whilst in the last 10 years boxers, at the top level, have often been paid far more than their commercial worth.

Unless Dana/TKO is willing to buy out all the main sanctioning bodies, I think any move into boxing will be at a low level with competitive fights. I can’t see him going after any world champions because it’s seemingly not in his nature to make losses on fighters.

He also may not be bothered with boxing. UFC in 2023 made $1.3bn revenue and $755m EBITDA (their measure of profit). Boxing would be more of a headache for him I think.
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Re: Dana White

Post by jamesmcdonnell »

maverick23 wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 07:10
Fray Bentos wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 06:23
maverick23 wrote: 28 Feb 2024, 05:56

How can he do it though? Boxing promotion in the US is a massively competitive market for the top fighters whilst the UFC have built a great brand which they’d struggle to take advantage of with boxing and are notorious for paying fighters less than they probably should.
The one thing boxing is missing is competitive fights all around the board - if he could hold cards where all the fights were competitive - from six rounders to the main event - then people would pay good money to watch them, think of these 'misfits' fights, they sell out arenas AND get PPV because they're competitive even though the skill level isn't very good and sometimes it's atrocious but because they're usually well matched, people will pay to watch it. All people want to see is a good, honest scrap between two evenly matched fighters.

He might not be able to start at the very top but he is a known brand and I would like to see him try, I have a hunch a lot of top class boxers like it how it is at the moment - they can duck fighters, pick and choose etc - it would be nice for him to come in and shake it up, it needs shaking up, it really does.
I agree that boxing could do with being shaken up but I disagree with your example of Misfits. People don’t watch and pay PPV because it’s competitive fights. They watch and pay because they’re personalities they want to see fight.

Fighters would join Dana if he’s going to pay them more than their current promoter. However it’s hard to make the numbers stack when they don’t even work currently with Top Rank/ESPN and Dana is notorious for paying fighters below their commercial worth whilst in the last 10 years boxers, at the top level, have often been paid far more than their commercial worth.

Unless Dana/TKO is willing to buy out all the main sanctioning bodies, I think any move into boxing will be at a low level with competitive fights. I can’t see him going after any world champions because it’s seemingly not in his nature to make losses on fighters.

He also may not be bothered with boxing. UFC in 2023 made $1.3bn revenue and $755m EBITDA (their measure of profit). Boxing would be more of a headache for him I think.
Dana has zero chance of making it in boxing - his business model simply doesn't work for fighters who are used to commanding a million a fight minimum.

He's going to be going up against well established promoters, and their ties to sanctioning bodies.
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