BoxRec

gobbles wrote:I had it by 3 to Sturm. What a joke Jim Watt scoring the last level so he could claim he score Murray the winner. It wasn't even close and Sturm didn't need that last burst to win it either. That round and round 8 to Murray were to clearest rounds of the fight.
Shame we get all the "well in Germany" rubbish. Lot fairer result than a foreigner would get over here.

x2

That was one of the few easy rounds to score (or at least it should've been easy to score).

Great fight and top effort by Murray. Fair result for me as I actually has Sturm a round up due to his better start amd mid rounds.

Macklin did better against Sturm for me though.

Hats off to Murray, he proved himself in there last night. I`d take him to beat Barker.

Great effort from Murray. Surprised me with his quality over the 12 round distance. Could have gone either way so the draw was a fair result, for me.

Surely Hatton/Hearn will be able to secure Barker v Murray for a World title given they tend to be chucked about like confetti. Would be an interesting clash of styles.

Deserter wrote:Murray's shown me nothing to date that suggests he belongs at this level... let's hope I'm proved wrong

Very happy this morning to be eating a large serving of humble pie! The British middleweight scene is really looking good right now

Well done Martin Murray he put in the performance i expected and proved he belongs in that company however, I watched this in a pub with 8 fellas from St Helens (some of whom know Martin) and not one of us thought Murray had won. I had sturm winning by 4 rounds. There was no sound and it looked like Murray was hitting gloves alot and Sturm was landing the cleaner more hurtful punches. Absolutely stunned he got the draw out there. For me Murray undoubtedly benefitted from the the public outcry in Germany in the wake of the Macklin/Sturm fight. I Think i'm gonna have to watch it again when i'm not bevvied though.

binipop wrote:Well done Martin Murray he put in the performance i expected and proved he belongs in that company however, I watched this in a pub with 8 fellas from St Helens (some of whom know Martin) and not one of us thought Murray had won. I had sturm winning by 4 rounds. There was no sound and it looked like Murray was hitting gloves alot and Sturm was landing the cleaner more hurtful punches. Absolutely stunned he got the draw out there. For me Murray undoubtedly benefitted from the the public outcry in Germany in the wake of the Macklin/Sturm fight. I Think i'm gonna have to watch it again when i'm not bevvied though.

I think thats a little harsh on Martin. It was a very even fight with most people having it one round either way. I think Martin and Oliver Harrison learned a lot from the Macklin fight and nullified a lot of what Sturm looked to do to win the rounds. He never allowed Sturm to dominate and always looked to land. Macklin suffered from letting Sturm look good for 30 second spells in a number of rounds, undoing the good work that Matt had done over the first couple of minutes of the round. I was impressed with how Martin looked to impose himself for the full 3 minutes of each round.

I had Murray up a round going into the last, hence with Sturm winning the last a draw (115-115).

A shame. Two things. Had Murray stuck to the same tactics but upped his pace about 20% throughout the fight, he'd have won. He won round eight by a mile in this fashion. Even with the same effort for eleven rounds, had he managed to win the last he'd have pulled off a great victory on the judges' scorecards (I'm presuming the 114 apiece judge gave Sturm the last).

A great performance but could have been REALLY great and I think he'll be kicking himself a bit now.

I don't think 'A draw in Germany means he really won' applies in this case.

To revert to seriousness for a moment, I thought Adam Smith had a shocker. He talked over/ignored most of Murray's good work for the first seven rounds until he had to acknowledge he was doing great stuff in the eighth. Infuriating. Bit like listening to Motson commentating on an England v Germany match.

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:I had Murray up a round going into the last, hence with Sturm winning the last a draw (115-115).

A shame. Two things. Had Murray stuck to the same tactics but upped his pace about 20% throughout the fight, he'd have won. He won round eight by a mile in this fashion. Even with the same effort for eleven rounds, had he managed to win the last he'd have pulled off a great victory on the judges' scorecards (I'm presuming the 114 apiece judge gave Sturm the last).

A great performance but could have been REALLY great and I think he'll be kicking himself a bit now.

I don't think 'A draw in Germany means he really won' applies in this case.

I had it level too.

As well as Murray did he let Sturm back into a couple of rounds which might have been scored to Sturm.

Some of Sturm's work impressed me, his jab was accurate but I was surprised how easily Murray could get through his guard and also worked the body really well.

It won't be much of a consolation to him I'm sure but at least he didn't ''lose'' the fight. It's something he can build on and will obviously work towards another shot. I'd like to see some matchups between our domestic trio at some point in the next 12 months too.

I thought a draw was fair. Instead of Murray and Macklin chasing Sturm rematches I would like to see them leave Felix alone in Germany and fight each other in the UK.

LeedsLad wrote:

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:I had Murray up a round going into the last, hence with Sturm winning the last a draw (115-115).

A shame. Two things. Had Murray stuck to the same tactics but upped his pace about 20% throughout the fight, he'd have won. He won round eight by a mile in this fashion. Even with the same effort for eleven rounds, had he managed to win the last he'd have pulled off a great victory on the judges' scorecards (I'm presuming the 114 apiece judge gave Sturm the last).

A great performance but could have been REALLY great and I think he'll be kicking himself a bit now.

I don't think 'A draw in Germany means he really won' applies in this case.

I had it level too.

As well as Murray did he let Sturm back into a couple of rounds which might have been scored to Sturm.

Some of Sturm's work impressed me, his jab was accurate but I was surprised how easily Murray could get through his guard and also worked the body really well.

It won't be much of a consolation to him I'm sure but at least he didn't ''lose'' the fight. It's something he can build on and will obviously work towards another shot. I'd like to see some matchups between our domestic trio at some point in the next 12 months too.

I felt it was close but feel Martin nicked it, he showed great class and proved many people wrong look what he has done in 3 years or so and 23 fights or so?
If he was champion maybe he would of won but he never lost but gained immensly from from the expierience. How some of you are saying sturm is not world class i question your knowledge, this is a great fighter and many would of been beaten within the distance.
Martin showed class in and out of the ring.This was a much better prepared Sturm who was out to prove a point 2 good fighters

matko wrote:

LeedsLad wrote:

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:I had Murray up a round going into the last, hence with Sturm winning the last a draw (115-115).

A shame. Two things. Had Murray stuck to the same tactics but upped his pace about 20% throughout the fight, he'd have won. He won round eight by a mile in this fashion. Even with the same effort for eleven rounds, had he managed to win the last he'd have pulled off a great victory on the judges' scorecards (I'm presuming the 114 apiece judge gave Sturm the last).

A great performance but could have been REALLY great and I think he'll be kicking himself a bit now.

I don't think 'A draw in Germany means he really won' applies in this case.

I had it level too.




As well as Murray did he let Sturm back into a couple of rounds which might have been scored to Sturm.

Some of Sturm's work impressed me, his jab was accurate but I was surprised how easily Murray could get through his guard and also worked the body really well.

It won't be much of a consolation to him I'm sure but at least he didn't ''lose'' the fight. It's something he can build on and will obviously work towards another shot. I'd like to see some matchups between our domestic trio at some point in the next 12 months too.

I felt it was close but feel Martin nicked it, he showed great class and proved many people wrong look what he has done in 3 years or so and 23 fights or so?
If he was champion maybe he would of won but he never lost but gained immensly from from the expierience. How some of you are saying sturm is not world class i question your knowledge, this is a great fighter and many would of been beaten within the distance.
Martin showed class in and out of the ring.This was a much better prepared Sturm who was out to prove a point 2 good fighters

the guy who posted sayin he was with 8 people from st.helens and they thought he lost is full of shit, not bein funny but even if he'd have been knocked down ten times they'd have sed he won, not gonna moan at the result but thought martin had it by one, great event, great atmosphere (apart from the flying handbag), saw alex mat at the afterparty he was sound, met rocky feilding same applies, in fact everyone i met over there was top draw.

I recorded the fight and only watched it this morning. Here is my scorecard.

* = round could have went either way.
W = Jim Watt's scorecard disagrees with mine.

Round 1: Even (W scored it to Sturm)
Round 2: Sturm
Round 3: Murray
Round 4: Sturm (W scored it to Murray)
Round 5: Sturm *
Round 6: Sturm *
Round 7: Murray
Round 8: Murray
Round 9: Sturm
Round 10: Sturm *
Round 11: Murray *
Round 12: Sturm (W scored it to Murray)

My scorecard: 115-114 to Felix Sturm.

(Sorry if I've pissed on your parade, but I thought Sturm won that fight)

I had it by one to Sturm aswell, Crease. I have watched the fight twice now and scored it the same.

Btw, I think Watt scored the 12th round to Murray. How, I don't know.

Just a few of my notes on the fight:

Martin Murray:
He wasn't as active as he could have been.
Should have been more aggressive.
Power-punching could have really hurt Sturm.
Murray allowed Sturm back in it when he coud've outworked and out-toughed him.
Didn't push through after hurting Sturm in the 8th round.
He didn't sustain pressure (after landing a good combination, he allowed Sturm to answer back)
He was not confident - he covered up when he could've let his hands go.
Should have employed left hook more often.
Murray was not intimidated.

Felix Sturm:
Sturm was a bit classier with his combinations.
Sturm had a higher workrate.

Deno1986 wrote:I had it by one to Sturm aswell, Crease. I have watched the fight twice now and scored it the same.

Well I thought it was a close fight - and the first half of the fight was kinda hard to score - because both fighters were doing much of the same thing. I just thought that Sturm was more active and his combinations were a bit classier, that's why I give Sturm 4 out of the first 5.

I also think that Murray had this fight won after round 8, he showed that when he opened up he could hurt sturm. He was down on the scorecards and he probably needed a knockdown (with the way some English view German hometown favourite decisions) but yet, he didn't open up... And that has baffled me at the moment.

Deno1986 wrote:Btw, I think Watt scored the 12th round to Murray. How, I don't know.

Ah yes he did. I have it in my notes, but I forgot to put it in my post. Edited now.

My scorecard was the same as Darren Barkers - we both scored it to Sturm by one round up.

Contrary to popular belief on here, I would say that this was a clear Sturm victory. I concede that there were 4 or 5 rounds that could have went either way. (because it was a close fight).
But anyone who gives all of these disputed rounds to Martin Murray cannot honestly say that he is being objective. (And without all of these rounds, Murray doesn't win this fight).

So it was far, far from "a robbery".
If anything, the Macklin fight was closer (because he actually beat Sturm)... And that's only my personal opinion not being political about this.


And I remember when Sturm was awarded that fight back in June of this year, Johnny Nelson said:
"Well another hometown descision for Sturm, but maybe his next opponent will benefit from this result".

There will probably be a rematch because neither fighter will be ahppy with this.

Sturm will feel that he won the fight (And justifyably so) and Murray's people will be telling him that he won...

It's shame that Macklin misses out on all of this. And he does not benefit from the injustice fo what happened to him.
:(

I had it 116-115 to Murray, but I can't argue with a draw, or even people given it to Sturm by close decision

The Dark Destroyer wrote:Crease, how can you say I thought this was a clear Sturm victory, I had Sturm by one, and then there were four or five rounds that could have gone either way.

Indeed and the disputed rounds that you have mentioned were shared between both of the fighters. So if you re-assess the fight and take a round of Sturm and give it to Murray, you could very easily do it vice versa.

The Dark Destroyer wrote:If there are four or five rounds that are up for interpretation then there is no clear victory in a fight like this.

Well let's say that there were around 5 disputed rounds, for Murray to win he would have needed to win most of these, which in my opinion, he did not.

For example:
The 4th round (which Watt give to Murray) but I gave to Sturm.
And the 12th round (which Watt give to Murray) and which I think was a clear Sturm round.
So, in that regard, I repeat what I said earlier:

Crease wrote:anyone who gives all of these disputed rounds to Martin Murray cannot honestly say that he is being objective. (And without all of these rounds, Murray doesn't win this fight).

'the guy who posted sayin he was with 8 people from st.helens and they thought he lost is full of shit, not bein funny but even if he'd have been knocked down ten times they'd have sed he won, not gonna moan at the result but thought martin had it by one, great event, great atmosphere (apart from the flying handbag), saw alex mat at the afterparty he was sound, met rocky feilding same applies, in fact everyone i met over there was top draw.'

P$P#1, by all means disagree with my opinion of the fight but please don't call me a liar, not one of them thought he won. Admittedly a few of them weren't really boxing fans but the 4 or 5 that were were deflated at the final bell and then stunned at the decision. Like i said, i had had a fair few and realize my score was at the extreme end of what most people seem to think was an acceptable one so i will be watching it again

In my view Murray had it by a single round but it wasn't a home town decision. A draw was probably fair in hindsight. Murray's team were very honest in the post fight interview, he didn't do enough in the first 3 rounds. What it did show however is that Murray is a very good fighter and Sturm is probably on the slide. I would fancy Murray in a rematch.
What would be great is if one of our three middleweights could get hold of a meaningful world title and then fight off against each other ala Benn, Eubank, Watson, Collins. I think this would create some real excitement for boxing fans. Here is hoping for next year.
IMHO
Murray - surprisingly good - strong guy but not enough snap in his punches
Macklin - warrior - lacks stamina
Barker - probably best technically but is that enough to win against either of the other 2?

As Harry Hill says; only one way to find out....FIGHT

steve689 wrote:I thought a draw was fair. Instead of Murray and Macklin chasing Sturm rematches I would like to see them leave Felix alone in Germany and fight each other in the UK.

i think both can build on their performances vs sturm. macklin gets sympathy for being robbed, especially in the US. murray did one better and got a draw. macklin hopefully gets to challenge sergio martinez. and murray hopefully either gets the sturm rematch, or maybe one of the other champs such as pirog. in russia priog won't be able to afford sturm, but murray...

Autobarn wrote:i think both can build on their performances vs sturm. macklin gets sympathy for being robbed, especially in the US. murray did one better and got a draw.

But this is the double handedness of boxing... (pardon the pun)

Macklin gave the better performance and was officially beat.
Murray gave a lesser performance and he officially drew?

Crease wrote:

Autobarn wrote:i think both can build on their performances vs sturm. macklin gets sympathy for being robbed, especially in the US. murray did one better and got a draw.

But this is the double handedness of boxing... (pardon the pun)

Macklin gave the better performance and was officially beat.
Murray gave a lesser performance and he officially drew?

Dont know how you got Macklin gave a better performance, look at macklins face after the fight and look at murrays then look at sturms after both, I thoght the macklin fight was more entertaining but there was no method to the madness, he was jus goin hell for leather, Murray boxed better imo and the last minute of round 12 cost him the fight in my eyes.