David Haye vs Mark de Mori - January 16th

[expe]

I'm sure it has, no argument there.

As an adult I just can't help but think if I was put in charge of 20ish yo boxer who a couple months earlier had his 6th fight in 'fight of year' and took punishment against Alex...

When Alex fought Mark, Mark had already had 5 fights.

Mark fought the 15 wins from 38 fights journeyman John Wyborn in his 8th fight. Wyborn had only had 1 win from his previous 6 fights when he fought Mark and retired on a loss only a few months later. So whoever was advising Mark must have thought Wyborn was ripe for the picking, and as above, Mark used the flu as the reason he lost.

Alex fought a 12 wins from 14 fights opponent in his 4th fight, and won the OPBF title by beating the 16 wins from 20 fights Nathan Briggs, who had already fought for the national title, in his 12th fight.

Wyborn was also a blown up light heavyweight who weighed in well inside the cruiserweight limit, over 3st lighter than De Mori.

[Like a Boss]

Happy and sad

http://totalpac.tumblr.com/post/1376035 ... ark-demori

You seem to avoid responding to any question or statement that threatens to pop your bubble of delusion regarding Mark's padded career. But that's somewhat understandable.

I had a flick through your attachment there and you made a few suggestions on what de Mori might have done differently.

One of your suggestions was he could have taken a knee.

I've watched the fight about 4 or 5 times now and there is not a single occasion in the 2 minutes it went for where taking a knee was a genuine option for de Mori.

I think you also suggested de Mori should have got on his bike and ran?

de Mori isn't very immobile at the best of times. But Haye had already hurt him to the body and it was obvious that had further slowed him. Even if he'd managed to hobble away, Haye would have quickly cut off the ring and would probably still have comfortably finished him inside the minute remaining of the 1st round.

The reality is this was a diabolical mismatch and Haye could have picked his round. He probably did.

[Totalpac]

Just feel like I've responded to every question probably twice over the past few years and am over responding to the same ones again and again.

Appreciate you reading my ramble and thoughts.

[Like a Boss]

Just feel like I've responded to every question probably twice over the past few years and am over responding to the same ones again and again.

Appreciate you reading my ramble and thoughts.

I don't recall you previously answering the questions I've raised over the past few days and much of the discussion is as a result of the Haye fight. So you could hardly have answered them years ago. But I understand how unsettling they might be to you so I won't push it.

[Totalpac]

Happy to answer any question I can. Just went back and looked and couldn't find any ?'s. Plenty of statements no questions.

What are you dying to know?

[Like a Boss]

Happy to answer any question I can. Just went back and looked and couldn't find any ?'s. Plenty of statements no questions.

What are you dying to know?

Not dying to know anything. But if you are happy to answer any question start with this one from yesterday that you seem to have conveniently over sighted :

Some of de Mori's opponents were so badly over matched it was a disgrace. Ever spare a thought for those guys???


See also the last post in the "Mark de Mori" thread.

[Totalpac]

Happy to answer any question I can. Just went back and looked and couldn't find any ?'s. Plenty of statements no questions.

What are you dying to know?

Not dying to know anything. But if you are happy to answer any question start with this one from yesterday you seem to have conveniently over sighted :

Some of de Mori's opponents were so badly over matched it was a disgrace. Ever spare a thought for those guys???

For sure. care for any fighter that jumps in the ring. They, as did Mark, knew what they were going into and I'm sure believed they would win.

Fighters take fights for all kinds of reasons and as most fighters will always say 'yes' is up to their team around them to have the level head. In the boxing world this is rarely the case which saddens me the most.

If you are referring to a lot of Marks European opponents, all you are seeing is their pro record. I 'think' most of then had had over 50 amateur fights FYI.

[Like a Boss]

Happy to answer any question I can. Just went back and looked and couldn't find any ?'s. Plenty of statements no questions.

What are you dying to know?

Not dying to know anything. But if you are happy to answer any question start with this one from yesterday you seem to have conveniently over sighted :

Some of de Mori's opponents were so badly over matched it was a disgrace. Ever spare a thought for those guys???

For sure. care for any fighter that jumps in the ring. They, as did Mark, knew what they were going into and I'm sure believed they would win.

What a difference a day makes. Remember this from yesterday :

"As a counter argument, could you see as a possibility the apparent reason 'Mark wanted nothing to do with Aussie opponents' is as a naive early 20yo he went to the east coast got put into his 8th fight in 8 months as a pro against a super experienced tough veteran and ended up getting dropped?"

[Totalpac]

Ah yeah, I wrote it.

Don't see the contradiction. I'm sure Mark thought he could win regardless the circumstances

[DA GOOSE]

Happy and sad

http://totalpac.tumblr.com/post/1376035 ... ark-demori

You seem to avoid responding to any question or statement that threatens to pop your bubble of delusion regarding Mark's padded career. But that's somewhat understandable.

I had a flick through your attachment there and you made a few suggestions on what de Mori might have done differently.

One of your suggestions was he could have taken a knee.

I've watched the fight about 4 or 5 times now and there is not a single occasion in the 2 minutes it went for where taking a knee was a genuine option for de Mori.

I think you also suggested de Mori should have got on his bike and ran?

de Mori isn't very immobile at the best of times. But Haye had already hurt him to the body and it was obvious that had further slowed him. Even if he'd managed to hobble away, Haye would have quickly cut off the ring and would probably still have comfortably finished him inside the minute remaining of the 1st round.

The reality is this was a diabolical mismatch and Haye could have picked his round. He probably did.

[Like a Boss]

Ah yeah, I wrote it.

Don't see the contradiction. I'm sure Mark thought he could win regardless the circumstances

You were making a big sympathy push for Mark yesterday for being matched with the 15 wins from 38 fights journeyman John Wyborn.

Wyborn weighed in at 193.5 pounds and Mark 237 pounds. Mark had a 43.5 pound weight advantage, and Wyborn had only had 1 win from his previous 6 fights.

I put it to you Mark's people probably thought Wyborn was ripe for the picking. Particularly with a 43.5 weight advantage.

I hope you offer the same sympathy for some of the poor, mismatched suckers Mark has fought I'm about to point out below.

[Like a Boss]

Happy and sad

http://totalpac.tumblr.com/post/1376035 ... ark-demori

You seem to avoid responding to any question or statement that threatens to pop your bubble of delusion regarding Mark's padded career. But that's somewhat understandable.

I had a flick through your attachment there and you made a few suggestions on what de Mori might have done differently.

One of your suggestions was he could have taken a knee.

I've watched the fight about 4 or 5 times now and there is not a single occasion in the 2 minutes it went for where taking a knee was a genuine option for de Mori.

I think you also suggested de Mori should have got on his bike and ran?

de Mori isn't very immobile at the best of times. But Haye had already hurt him to the body and it was obvious that had further slowed him. Even if he'd managed to hobble away, Haye would have quickly cut off the ring and would probably still have comfortably finished him inside the minute remaining of the 1st round.

The reality is this was a diabolical mismatch and Haye could have picked his round. He probably did.

It took all of 10 minutes to watch the fight 5 times

[Totalpac]

Ah yeah, I wrote it.

Don't see the contradiction. I'm sure Mark thought he could win regardless the circumstances

You were making a big sympathy push for Mark yesterday for being matched with the 15 wins from 38 fights journeyman John Wyborn.

Wyborn weighed in at 193.5 pounds and Mark 237 pounds. Mark had a 43.5 pound weight advantage, and Wyborn had only had 1 win from his previous 6 fights.

I put it to you Mark's people probably thought Wyborn was ripe for the picking. Particularly with a 43.5 weight advantage.

I hope you offer the same sympathy for some of the poor, mismatched suckers Mark has fought I'm about to point out below.

I apologise if it came across as a 'sympathy' push. It was meant to come across as a 'lesson learnt' push, a 'fornicate this' push, a 'control your own destiny' push.

[Like a Boss]

Happy to answer any question I can. Just went back and looked and couldn't find any ?'s. Plenty of statements no questions.

What are you dying to know?

Not dying to know anything. But if you are happy to answer any question start with this one from yesterday you seem to have conveniently over sighted :

Some of de Mori's opponents were so badly over matched it was a disgrace. Ever spare a thought for those guys???

If you are referring to a lot of Marks European opponents, all you are seeing is their pro record. I 'think' most of then had had over 50 amateur fights FYI.

I'm not just referring to Mark's European opponents. I'm referring to the majority of the opponents of his 12 year career and here's just a summary :

6 of Mark's first 7 opponents were debutants.

When 7-1-1 Mark fought 0-3 Junior Pati.

When 8-1-1 Mark fought 0-2 John Parai.

When 9-1-2 Mark fought 7-7-1 Fatu Tuimanono (his losses included 6 by KO).

When 10-1-2 Mark fought 18-19-1 Richard Tutaki ((his losses included 13 by KO).

When 15-1-2 Mark fought 1-1 Kevin Karusa.

When 20-1-2 Mark fought 22-26-2 Jonathan Pasi (his losses included 12 by KO).

When 24-1-2 Mark fought 20-21 Ivica Perkovic (his losses included 8 by KO)..

When 27-1-2 Mark fought 4-3 Zeljko Bojic.

When 28-1-2 Mark fought 2-5 Radenko Kovac.

The above fights, which constitute about half of Mark's career, were all blatant mismatches against inexperienced fighters, fighters with losing records, or in many cases both.

Mark also fought mismatches against :

42 year old Rob Calloway who had been talking retirement for the 10 years prior and had lost 5 of his last 7 fights (5 by stoppage).

41 year old Damon Reed who was actually in retirement at the time after losing 7 of his last 10 fights (4 by stoppage).

40 year old Troy Weida who had had a 6 year retirement prior to fighting Mark and lost 21of his past 27 fights (10 by stoppage).

Adnan Buharalija who had been knocked out 13 times previously. He has since increased his count to 19.


That's 19 fights of Mark's 34 fight record that were absolute mismatches. Care to argue the merits of any of those fights?????

[Like a Boss]

I double posted. But seeing I can't delete this post I'll fill it with this :



Mark de Mori 15-1-2 defeats the embarrassing by any measure Kevin Karusa 1-1.

Just one example of the diabolical mismatches I was referring to above.

[patron]

there is a poster on this page who earlier tipped a Demori upset in 3 rounds, and 3 years layoff for Hayes
had them leaning towards Demori, the big difference between the pair was one had ability and the other bloke had nothing, he showed that against nobodies, end of story all the best

[Totalpac]

Not dying to know anything. But if you are happy to answer any question start with this one from yesterday you seem to have conveniently over sighted :

Some of de Mori's opponents were so badly over matched it was a disgrace. Ever spare a thought for those guys???

If you are referring to a lot of Marks European opponents, all you are seeing is their pro record. I 'think' most of then had had over 50 amateur fights FYI.

I'm not just referring to Mark's European opponents. I'm referring to the majority of the opponents of his 12 year career and here's just a summary :

6 of Mark's first 7 opponents were debutants.

When 7-1-1 Mark fought 0-3 Junior Pati.

When 8-1-1 Mark fought 0-2 John Parai.

When 9-1-2 Mark fought 7-7-1 Fatu Tuimanono (his losses included 6 by KO).

When 10-1-2 Mark fought 18-19-1 Richard Tutaki ((his losses included 13 by KO).

When 15-1-2 Mark fought 1-1 Kevin Karusa.

When 20-1-2 Mark fought 22-26-2 Jonathan Pasi (his losses included 12 by KO).

When 24-1-2 Mark fought 20-21 Ivica Perkovic (his losses included 8 by KO)..

When 27-1-2 Mark fought 4-3 Zeljko Bojic.

When 28-1-2 Mark fought 2-5 Radenko Kovac.

The above fights, which constitute about half of Mark's career, were all blatant mismatches against inexperienced fighters, fighters with losing records, or in many cases both.

Mark also fought mismatches against :

42 year old Rob Calloway who had been talking retirement for the 10 years prior and had lost 5 of his last 7 fights (5 by stoppage).

41 year old Damon Reed who was actually in retirement at the time after losing 7 of his last 10 fights (4 by stoppage).

40 year old Troy Weida who had had a 6 year retirement prior to fighting Mark and lost 21of his past 27 fights (10 by stoppage).

Adnan Buharalija who had been knocked out 13 times previously. He has since increased his count to 19.


That's 19 fights of Mark's 34 fight record that were absolute mismatches. Care to argue the merits of any of those fights?????

I've talked about his opponents plenty over the past years. In summary. Mark wanted to be fighting most those guys as much as you wanted him too.

[bogan whisperer]

Little wonder every article in the prelude to the Haye fight made reference to de Mori's "padded" record. It is truly diabolical!

[Like a Boss]

If you are referring to a lot of Marks European opponents, all you are seeing is their pro record. I 'think' most of then had had over 50 amateur fights FYI.

I'm not just referring to Mark's European opponents. I'm referring to the majority of the opponents of his 12 year career and here's just a summary :

6 of Mark's first 7 opponents were debutants.

When 7-1-1 Mark fought 0-3 Junior Pati.

When 8-1-1 Mark fought 0-2 John Parai.

When 9-1-2 Mark fought 7-7-1 Fatu Tuimanono (his losses included 6 by KO).

When 10-1-2 Mark fought 18-19-1 Richard Tutaki ((his losses included 13 by KO).

When 15-1-2 Mark fought 1-1 Kevin Karusa.

When 20-1-2 Mark fought 22-26-2 Jonathan Pasi (his losses included 12 by KO).

When 24-1-2 Mark fought 20-21 Ivica Perkovic (his losses included 8 by KO)..

When 27-1-2 Mark fought 4-3 Zeljko Bojic.

When 28-1-2 Mark fought 2-5 Radenko Kovac.

The above fights, which constitute about half of Mark's career, were all blatant mismatches against inexperienced fighters, fighters with losing records, or in many cases both.

Mark also fought mismatches against :

42 year old Rob Calloway who had been talking retirement for the 10 years prior and had lost 5 of his last 7 fights (5 by stoppage).

41 year old Damon Reed who was actually in retirement at the time after losing 7 of his last 10 fights (4 by stoppage).

40 year old Troy Weida who had had a 6 year retirement prior to fighting Mark and lost 21of his past 27 fights (10 by stoppage).

Adnan Buharalija who had been knocked out 13 times previously. He has since increased his count to 19.


That's 19 fights of Mark's 34 fight record that were absolute mismatches. Care to argue the merits of any of those fights?????

I've talked about his opponents plenty over the past years. In summary. Mark wanted to be fighting most those guys as much as you wanted him too.

Mark had options to fight better level opposition along the way but declined them. You aren't trying to pretend that didn't happen are you???

[Totalpac]

Sigh. Yeah I've been through this.

Yes he had options and said yes to all the ones that made sense for his career and no to the ones that didn't. The ones he said yes to didn't materialise. Been through all this.

[Like a Boss]

Sigh. Yeah I've been through this.

Yes he had options and said yes to all the ones that made sense for his career and no to the ones that didn't. The ones he said yes to didn't materialise. Been through all this.

How many of the 19 fights I highlighted above "made sense to his career", other than that they provided him with virtually risk free avenues to another win???

What I'm saying to you, and I'm sure you understand exactly where I'm coming from here, is that Mark had opportunities to fight better level opposition than many of the 19 mismatches I have highlighted above and he turned them down.

Are you going to keep on trying to deny that???

[Gnome]

I hope Mark comes back, maybe fighting at a more competitive level than he did pre-Haye.

I do not know why some people waste so much energy kicking a fighter when he was down. He got knocked out in the first round by a top-class fighter. Everyone knows it and has accepted it. Surely we should be looking to the future instead of constantly complaining about the quality of his past fights.

[Like a Boss]

I hope Mark comes back, maybe fighting at a more competitive level than he did pre-Haye.

I do not know why some people waste so much energy kicking a fighter when he was down. He got knocked out in the first round by a top-class fighter. Everyone knows it and has accepted it. Surely we should be looking to the future instead of constantly complaining about the quality of his past fights.

I didn't expect de Mori to do any better against Haye than he did, and it hasn't changed my opinion of him one bit.

de Mori was completely out of his depth, and part of the reason for that is the poor level opposition he has fought for so long. You don't learn anything beating up mismatched opponents. Nor do you improve.

What irritates me is people trying to pretend that all those mismatches were de Mori's only options at the time. He had offers to fight better level opponents along the way but in many cases simply chose not to.

[Totalpac]

Sigh. Yeah I've been through this.

Yes he had options and said yes to all the ones that made sense for his career and no to the ones that didn't. The ones he said yes to didn't materialise. Been through all this.

How many of the 19 fights I highlighted above "made sense to his career", other than that they provided him with virtually risk free avenues to another win???

What I'm saying to you, and I'm sure you understand exactly where I'm coming from here, is that Mark had opportunities to fight better level opposition than many of the 19 mismatches I have highlighted above and he turned them down.

Are you going to keep on trying to deny that???

I think I'm nearly done mate. We'll have to agree to disagree.

Truth is I haven't discussed every single opponent he's ever faced and who was available on that exact date, agreed to the budget on offer, matched the risk/reward ratio, had the required paperwork, was agreed on by both fighters, promoters and managers etc etc etc.

I've listed the 'better opponents' he agreed to fight I'm sure more than once here or on other forums. If all those had come off, who knows where he'd be and how he'd be thought of by the punters.

I have no idea of your background, but what I've learnt being a mate of Marks is pro boxing is one of the most insane pro sports in the world.

Mark agreed to fight Haye and walked into a fight that he hoped and thought he could win, when 99.9% of the population thought he would get murdered with Haye probably being the worst possible match up for him at HW. Turns out they were right.

Now he knows, which is all he ever wanted. To test himself against the best and I think Haye is that IMO.

[Like a Boss]

Sigh. Yeah I've been through this.

Yes he had options and said yes to all the ones that made sense for his career and no to the ones that didn't. The ones he said yes to didn't materialise. Been through all this.

How many of the 19 fights I highlighted above "made sense to his career", other than that they provided him with virtually risk free avenues to another win???

What I'm saying to you, and I'm sure you understand exactly where I'm coming from here, is that Mark had opportunities to fight better level opposition than many of the 19 mismatches I have highlighted above and he turned them down.

Are you going to keep on trying to deny that???

I think I'm nearly done mate.

That doesn't come as a great surprise.

But with your door-handle-post you have finally got to the crux of the matter by offering the all import words : "matched the risk/reward ratio"

My information, from a few people who worked with Mark along the way, is that he wasn't prepared to take the slightest risk unless the reward for doing so was way out of kilter high, and that is a large part of the reason why he declined a few fights along the way (not the ones you are referring to) and kept treading the easy path.

Does that come as any shock to you??? It shouldn't.