BoxRec

Max Molyneux wrote:

pundit wrote:

Max Molyneux wrote:Omg Calzaghe's leagues above Beyer, he will get on the inside after a quick combination or will find a way.

What about this: let's find out? If Calzaghe woudla coudla shoulda do all these miraculous things, why doesn't he?

Your crazy if you think Beyer's as good as Calzaghe

I didn't say that.

I said it's damn hard to get inside Kessler. And if Beyer, a stout and skilled infighter, fails so badly at his first serious attempt, Calzaghe won't find this exactly easy either.

You'll never see Kessler pull out such a performance like that, even I thought he wouldn't win that easy although I thought he was in for a beating!

The Lacy fight proves nothing. Lacy was nothing special, and his style was feeding into Calzaghe's strenghts. Pre-selected for a beating.

Besides, noone is saying that Calzaghe wasn't good. The issue is that he is protected and acts like a chicken.

I still think he might still fight Kessler eventually and I have no doubts about the outcome.

I hope you are right but I don't think you are -- EVERYTHING in Calzaghe's career and behavior suggests that this fight will never be made. If it gets made though, my respect for Calzaghe will skyrocket, even if he loses.

Beyer couldnt get inside, because he has seen better days - It's not a very well grounded arguement to state that just because Beyer couldn't do it, Clazaghe would struggle.

In fact it is lunacy to use that as an arguement.

Beyer is finished at world level, and has been for quite some time - Maybe the Beyer of 7 years ago would have gotten inside Kessler, but even a peak Beyer is a notch or two below Calzaghe.

As for Kessler/Calzaghe fight - I don't think the fight will happen, unless the Taylor fight doesn't come off, and even then I highly doubt it.

In terms of natural talent, I don't mind saying that Calzaghe is an extraordinarly gifted fighter. He excels in many attributes. Speed, chin, skills, tactics and stamina. His footwork and power are good too. But given this talent, his career to date has been a bit of a shambles. Partly due to his own lack of ambition and the incompetence of Warren.

Even now, Calzaghe has been given a second chance to at least redeem some credit from those wasted years by fighting Kessler and proving beyond doubt that he is the best super middlewight of his time.

But who is he fighting? Manfredo. It's ridiculous. What a waste of talent.

Twinkle Toes wrote:Beyer couldnt get inside, because he has seen better days - It's not a very well grounded arguement to state that just because Beyer couldn't do it, Clazaghe would struggle.

In fact it is lunacy to use that as an arguement.

Mundine, a fighter with better footspeed and lateral movement than Calzaghe, couldn't get inside either, although he tried every trick in the book.

Now is this conjecture also illegit because Calzaghe is walking on water, just like the fellow who was born 2006 years ago, and should therefore not be mentioned in the same phrase with mere mortals?

As for Kessler/Calzaghe fight - I don't think the fight will happen, unless the Taylor fight doesn't come off, and even then I highly doubt it.

And? Should it happen? And if does not happen why not?

Les Kendal wrote:In terms of natural talent, I don't mind saying that Calzaghe is an extraordinarly gifted fighter. He excels in many attributes. Speed, chin, skills, tactics and stamina. His footwork and power are good too. But given this talent, his career to date has been a bit of a shambles. Partly due to his own lack of ambition and the incompetence of Warren.

Even now, Calzaghe has been given a second chance to at least redeem some credit from those wasted years by fighting Kessler and proving beyond doubt that he is the best super middlewight of his time.

But who is he fighting? Manfredo. It's ridiculous. What a waste of talent.

Thanks. This is just common sense, really.

If Kessler v Calzaghe were to be made though and that's a big IF at the moment I would take Calzaghe to win it. As much as I'm pissed off at the guy, I think he would prove too good for Kessler. I think he would be able to get inside Kessler and beat him comprehensively in this area. Kessler hasn't needed to fight on the inside in any of his fights to date but I think he would have to against Calzaghe. At least for short bursts. I'm not sure he could do this.
I'd go for Calzaghe TKO 10 but as long as this fight gets made, I don't really care who wins. This fight would be good for boxing.

Les Kendal wrote:If Kessler v Calzaghe were to be made though and that's a big IF at the moment I would take Calzaghe to win it. As much as I'm pissed off at the guy, I think he would prove too good for Kessler. I think he would be able to get inside Kessler and beat him comprehensively in this area. Kessler hasn't needed to fight on the inside in any of his fights to date but I think he would have to against Calzaghe. At least for short bursts. I'm not sure he could do this.
I'd go for Calzaghe TKO 10 but as long as this fight gets made, I don't really care who wins. This fight would be good for boxing.

Wholeheartedly agree with your last phrase. As for the outlook I'd have it 50:50, maybe marginally tilted in favor of Kessler due to styles. But like you I want primarily the fight, who wins it is secondary.

I didn't say that.

I said it's damn hard to get inside Kessler. And if Beyer, a stout and skilled infighter, fails so badly at his first serious attempt, Calzaghe won't find this exactly easy either.

Quote:
You'll never see Kessler pull out such a performance like that, even I thought he wouldn't win that easy although I thought he was in for a beating!


The Lacy fight proves nothing. Lacy was nothing special, and his style was feeding into Calzaghe's strenghts. Pre-selected for a beating.

Besides, noone is saying that Calzaghe wasn't good. The issue is that he is protected and acts like a chicken.

That shoulda coulda bullshite says Calzaghe hasn't proven he's leagues above Beyer either way.

You cannot discredit the Lacy win, I'd say that them two influenced Kessler and Beyer to do so!

Max Molyneux wrote:

I didn't say that.

I said it's damn hard to get inside Kessler. And if Beyer, a stout and skilled infighter, fails so badly at his first serious attempt, Calzaghe won't find this exactly easy either.

Quote:
You'll never see Kessler pull out such a performance like that, even I thought he wouldn't win that easy although I thought he was in for a beating!


The Lacy fight proves nothing. Lacy was nothing special, and his style was feeding into Calzaghe's strenghts. Pre-selected for a beating.

Besides, noone is saying that Calzaghe wasn't good. The issue is that he is protected and acts like a chicken.

That shoulda coulda bullshite says Calzaghe hasn't proven he's leagues above Beyer either way.

You cannot discredit the Lacy win, I'd say that them two influenced Kessler and Beyer to do so!

There's nothing to discredit. Great slugfest against a medicore fighter who was not even one of Joe's 3 best opponents. Proves: nothing.

Kessler wouldn't even beat a slugger that bad and you know it.

It's proves Calzaghe is godlike at Supermiddle.

Max Molyneux wrote:Kessler wouldn't even beat a slugger that bad and you know it.

It's proves Calzaghe is godlike at Supermiddle.

Fine, Max, and merry christmas.

Merry present giving day.

I don't call it Christmas, I'm not Christian.

Max Molyneux wrote:Merry present giving day.

I don't call it Christmas, I'm not Christian.

Call it as you wish then, mate. I know your cult is Calzagheshirtripoffism anyway.

That Shirt Ripping video was well worth it. It got me a medal on my profile saying 44th place in most viewed video.

Max Molyneux wrote:That Shirt Ripping video was well worth it. It got me a medal on my profile saying 44th place in most viewed video.

In which category? Comedy?

pundit wrote:
Mundine, a fighter with better footspeed and lateral movement than Calzaghe, couldn't get inside either, although he tried every trick in the book.

Mundine isn't very good at fighting on the inside either, he's certainly a few levels below that of Calzaghe.

His skill as stated by you is his lateral movement and footspeed, and what has that got to do with fighting on the inside? - Nothing is what, so your point is again flawed.

You can carry on making your predictions on misunderstandings, but your knowledge of the game is negligible to say the least...

..Not that many people would be daft enough to say Mundine has any particular boxing attribute better than that of Calzaghe.

As for the fight itself happening - I'd love to see it, but the reality of the situation is that it is highly unlikely - Calzaghes track record when it comes to making the big fight is poor, but that doesn't mean the guy lacks the ability to give Kessler a good going over.

pundit wrote:

Max Molyneux wrote:That Shirt Ripping video was well worth it. It got me a medal on my profile saying 44th place in most viewed video.

In which category? Comedy?

Yeah.

Twinkle Toes wrote:

pundit wrote:
Mundine, a fighter with better footspeed and lateral movement than Calzaghe, couldn't get inside either, although he tried every trick in the book.

Mundine isn't very good at fighting on the inside either, he's certainly a few levels below that of Calzaghe.

His skill as stated by you is his lateral movement and footspeed, and what has that got to do with fighting on the inside? - Nothing is what, so your point is again flawed.

You can carry on making your predictions on misunderstandings, but your knowledge of the game is negligible to say the least...

..Not that many people would be daft enough to say Mundine has any particular boxing attribute better than that of Calzaghe.

As for the fight itself happening - I'd love to see it, but the reality of the situation is that it is highly unlikely - Calzaghes track record when it comes to making the big fight is poor, but that doesn't mean the guy lacks the ability to give Kessler a good going over.

Mundine is much more athletically gifted than Calzaghe. Better punch delivery, vastly better defence, equal handspeed (without cuffing and slapping). Mundine hasn't always been able to coalesce defence and offense. His first fight with Sean Sullivan or the Kessler fight being a good example.

However, he is rapidly maturing, has fought a range of awkward styles, and ppl are going to have to watch out for him in 2007.

I have to say, a lot of the Mundine bashing over here can be a bit strained, i.e. 'he lost to Siaca for God's sake'. Or 'he was lucky to beat Soliman'.

I had 'The Man' three points clear versus both opponents.



PS Calzaghe isn't going to fight a serious opponent in 2007. Let's none of us get out hopes up then we won't be let down.
PPS Taylor has some SERIOUS tweaking to do, if he is going to be more than a footnote at 168. A move up in weight is not going to be a Cotto-like transformation, because he needs to fix a number of issues.

S Calzaghe isn't going to fight a serious opponent in 2007. Let's none of us get out hopes up then we won't be let down.
PPS Taylor has some SERIOUS tweaking to do, if he is going to be more than a footnote at 168. A move up in weight is not going to be a Cotto-like transformation, because he needs to fix a number of issues.

Evidence please for the Calzaghe part?

Max Molyneux wrote:

S Calzaghe isn't going to fight a serious opponent in 2007. Let's none of us get out hopes up then we won't be let down.
PPS Taylor has some SERIOUS tweaking to do, if he is going to be more than a footnote at 168. A move up in weight is not going to be a Cotto-like transformation, because he needs to fix a number of issues.

Evidence please for the Calzaghe part?

how about 11 of 19 WBO defences, you were asking for that one Max, lol

besides, if we don't get our hopes up he may surprise us again.

Thats the past.

People lost hope when he pulled out with Lacy.

True about not getting hopes up and he may surprise us.

Max Molyneux wrote:Thats the past.

People lost hope when he pulled out with Lacy.

True about not getting hopes up and he may surprise us.

The platform is certainly there, Taylor below, Kessler same weight, Adamek/Briggs/Dawson one weight up drawing the interest of the cable networks, so who knows.

Adamek would get clowned by Calzaghe, thats one fight I'd even pay for PPV to watch.

viciousmaussa wrote: Mundine is much more athletically gifted than Calzaghe. Better punch delivery, vastly better defence, equal handspeed (without cuffing and slapping). Mundine hasn't always been able to coalesce defence and offense. His first fight with Sean Sullivan or the Kessler fight being a good example.

However, he is rapidly maturing, has fought a range of awkward styles, and ppl are going to have to watch out for him in 2007.

I have to say, a lot of the Mundine bashing over here can be a bit strained, i.e. 'he lost to Siaca for God's sake'. Or 'he was lucky to beat Soliman'.

I had 'The Man' three points clear versus both opponents.

PS Calzaghe isn't going to fight a serious opponent in 2007. Let's none of us get out hopes up then we won't be let down.
PPS Taylor has some SERIOUS tweaking to do, if he is going to be more than a footnote at 168. A move up in weight is not going to be a Cotto-like transformation, because he needs to fix a number of issues.

Why don't you just say it, Mundine is the next Roy Jones Jr

Your 3 points margin for Mundine is abit dodgy. I haven't seen the Soliman fight but most say Soliman deserved the win and no way did he do enough to win the Siaca fight by 3 points, which was dull as fook btw.

One of the main issues with Taylor is his stamina, so that would be tweaked with the move up, although Taylor has already proven he has what it takes to beat the very elite. He didn't look great against Ouma as he neglected the jab but truth be told he barely lost a round.

lvlarc_uk wrote:

viciousmaussa wrote: Mundine is much more athletically gifted than Calzaghe. Better punch delivery, vastly better defence, equal handspeed (without cuffing and slapping). Mundine hasn't always been able to coalesce defence and offense. His first fight with Sean Sullivan or the Kessler fight being a good example.

However, he is rapidly maturing, has fought a range of awkward styles, and ppl are going to have to watch out for him in 2007.

I have to say, a lot of the Mundine bashing over here can be a bit strained, i.e. 'he lost to Siaca for God's sake'. Or 'he was lucky to beat Soliman'.

I had 'The Man' three points clear versus both opponents.

PS Calzaghe isn't going to fight a serious opponent in 2007. Let's none of us get out hopes up then we won't be let down.
PPS Taylor has some SERIOUS tweaking to do, if he is going to be more than a footnote at 168. A move up in weight is not going to be a Cotto-like transformation, because he needs to fix a number of issues.

Why don't you just say it, Mundine is the next Roy Jones Jr

Your 3 points margin for Mundine is abit dodgy. I haven't seen the Soliman fight but most say Soliman deserved the win and no way did he do enough to win the Siaca fight by 3 points, which was dull as fook btw.

One of the main issues with Taylor is his stamina, so that would be tweaked with the move up, although Taylor has already proven he has what it takes to beat the very elite. He didn't look great against Ouma as he neglected the jab but truth be told he barely lost a round.

Siaca barely layed a glove on Mundine, I had it 8-4 to Mundine, with Siaca scoring a knockdown making a 3 pt margin. It was a crap fight, a cautious fight. It's hard to score for Siaca, who was outmanoeuvred and beaten to the punch.

Lots of close rounds, but if Siaca stalks and hits arms and air, and Mundine lands one clean uppercut and gets in a couple of quick jabs, who do you go for? There's always a difference between 2 fighters and I favour Mundine on quality work (not to mention a fvcking great defence).

Whether it's 8-4 or 7-5, I find it hard to see any different than Mundine retaining the belt.

If Calzaghe beat Reid, if Taylor beat Hopkins not once but TWICE, I'd say Mudine certainly got the better of the Puerto Rican.


Mundine's a very good fighter who gets a lot of hate for his tactless post 9-11 comments (is he still barred from a WBC ranking?). He's also the highest paid super middleweight in the world and a fine boxer.

With the Soliman fight, again, Mundine's defence makes it so hard to score it for the other guy in low contact bouts. Soliman outworked him in the last 3 rounds, but the first 8 rounds wasn't really close.


Aussies like to score fights for ppl who put the hard work in. They have shitloads of rough, rugged fighters, but a lot of ppl like to score fights based on which way a man's feet are moving. Sam is a tricky bugger known for lacking accuracy, and that's what hurt him on the scorecards.

The Aussie commentators had Sean Sullivan beating Mundine (first fight), which is absolutely baffling because only one fighter was landing clean proper punches and it wasn't Sean, lol.


With Taylor, it's part weight/stamina...However, I would've liked to see him keep Ouma in the middle of the ring. Or maybe land hard shots, then sidestep, as he did with Raul Marquez. Ppl often think I dislike Taylor - I don't. I just want to see him put in a satisying showing.