PACMAN v MARQUEZ 2

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 20 Mar 2008, 09:43

Still can't see how that judge scored the last round for PacMan though.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 20 Mar 2008, 09:44

It's a shame we cannot get Marquez v Guzman, I would favour Guzman, because he is the fresher fighter, and quicker too, would be a great technical battle though.

Not a big money fight for Guzman however, neither man is a massive draw, and are only likely to take fights where they can piggy back off of someone else's support if they want a big money fight.

Guzman must be getting bloody well paid to fight Arthur on his home ground.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 20 Mar 2008, 09:46

SticknMove wrote:Yeah I watched it again last night. Absolute quality fight.

Funnily enough this time around I scored it a draw after having Marquez up by 2 the first time I watched it. There were 8 rounds that I scored exactly the same both times so are relatively clear to me, but rounds 1, 4, 7 and 11 were open to dispute. Round 11 I just couldn’t separate so had it 10-10 both times.

R1 10-10
R2 10-9 M clear
R3 10-8 P clear
R4 10-10
R5 10-9 M clear
R6 10-9 M clear
R7 10-10
R8 10-9 M clear
R9 10-9 P clear
R10 10-9 P clear
R11 10-10
R12 10-9 M clear

In the first viewing I gave Marquez the benefit of Rounds 1 and 4 and Pacquaio the benefit of round 7 leading to a 115-113 in favour of Marquez. The second viewing I gave Pacquaio the benefit of 1 and 4 (somewhat surprisingly to myself) and Marquez the benefit of round 7 – making the fight a 114-114 draw. If I left these 3 rounds as 10-10 then the outcome would be 116-115 to Marquez. So in short Marquez for me was very unlucky to not get at least a draw in this one – but it was a close competitive fight.

Must watch it again.

Been trying to upload shit to a boxing torrent site so I can use it, but to no avail, just won't seem to let me start my own torrent and upload.

THEBUTCH · Post by **THEBUTCH** » 20 Mar 2008, 09:56

Steve689, You're probably right, but look at the other world title fight on the bill, which was excellent as well incidently, where Leuvano boxed really beautifully and the judges gave him the win.

Everything you would want to see from a slickster, boxing off of the back foot was on display from Leuvano.

SticknMove · Post by **SticknMove** » 20 Mar 2008, 09:56

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
SticknMove wrote:Yeah I watched it again last night. Absolute quality fight.

Funnily enough this time around I scored it a draw after having Marquez up by 2 the first time I watched it. There were 8 rounds that I scored exactly the same both times so are relatively clear to me, but rounds 1, 4, 7 and 11 were open to dispute. Round 11 I just couldn’t separate so had it 10-10 both times.

R1 10-10
R2 10-9 M clear
R3 10-8 P clear
R4 10-10
R5 10-9 M clear
R6 10-9 M clear
R7 10-10
R8 10-9 M clear
R9 10-9 P clear
R10 10-9 P clear
R11 10-10
R12 10-9 M clear

In the first viewing I gave Marquez the benefit of Rounds 1 and 4 and Pacquaio the benefit of round 7 leading to a 115-113 in favour of Marquez. The second viewing I gave Pacquaio the benefit of 1 and 4 (somewhat surprisingly to myself) and Marquez the benefit of round 7 – making the fight a 114-114 draw. If I left these 3 rounds as 10-10 then the outcome would be 116-115 to Marquez. So in short Marquez for me was very unlucky to not get at least a draw in this one – but it was a close competitive fight.
Must watch it again.

Been trying to upload shit to a boxing torrent site so I can use it, but to no avail, just won't seem to let me start my own torrent and upload.

Don't know if you ever use Megaupload James. But you can download the fight in 2 parts and join with hjsplit from the following:

http://www.boxingforum.com/boxing-video ... pload.html

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 20 Mar 2008, 09:59

Would love to see Marquez v Soto for the WBC title when Pac vacates. It would be a brilliant fight. It would not only be a rivalry between two Mexicans of great offensive ability, but also a rivalry between GBP and Top Rank. I just think these 2 will gel brilliantly.

Though Soto lost to Guzman, it was competitive. Ppl are forgetting that Marquez lost his 1st big fight to Lil' Hagler (Freddie Norwood); and that Soto handed Rocky Juarez his big fight losing streak, AND won a total of three WBC elims and got no WBC title shots.

Also, Marquez v Chris John rematch. Or Rafael Marquez v Chris John to get payback for his brother.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 20 Mar 2008, 09:59

Problem is, the site I'm with requires the uploading of 5 gigs. Which is fine, I have some stuff I'm happy to share. When I follow their instructions however, it doesn't seem to start seeding. I think maybe I need to change my torrent client.

Chambers2 · Post by **Chambers2** » 20 Mar 2008, 10:06

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Problem is, the site I'm with requires the uploading of 5 gigs. Which is fine, I have some stuff I'm happy to share. When I follow their instructions however, it doesn't seem to start seeding. I think maybe I need to change my torrent client.

I've successfully used ABC torrent and Bit tornado in the past, they were quite easy to setup as I recall (must have been if I managed it)

chesh · Post by **chesh** » 20 Mar 2008, 17:44

jamesmcdonnell wrote:It's a shame we cannot get Marquez v Guzman, I would favour Guzman, because he is the fresher fighter, and quicker too, would be a great technical battle though.

Not a big money fight for Guzman however, neither man is a massive draw, and are only likely to take fights where they can piggy back off of someone else's support if they want a big money fight.

Guzman must be getting bloody well paid to fight Arthur on his home ground.

Surprisingly, I think the winning purse bid was only in the region of £210-£220k with a purse split of 70-30 (or 80-20?) in favour of the champ. One can only assume Guzman sees this as easy money with the bigger rewards lying ahead.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 21 Mar 2008, 09:38

Feel really sorry for Marquez... thats twice now IMO he has been denied a victory vs Pacquaio -this time IMO he won more clearly than the first - and now Pacquaio says its this series of fights is over. He was no more of Marquez.

Really annoyed actually... I want to see these two go at it again. Pacquiao knows he isn't the better man, knows he has got a kind decision and wants none of JMM.

THEBUTCH · Post by **THEBUTCH** » 26 Mar 2008, 09:23

I had Marquez winning both bouts too, but I think your comments on Pacman are a little OTT, stujones.

How many others boxers have got in with Marquez again other than Pacman? Not many.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 28 Mar 2008, 09:09

In the aftermath of Pacquiao-Marquez II

By Thomas Hauser
Special to ESPN.com

What was going on when referee Kenny Bayless' back was turned?
The rematch between Manny Pacquiao and Juan Manuel Marquez was a great fight, but several questions linger in its aftermath.

Marquez suffered two cuts during the fight. The first, a small cut beside his right eyebrow, was insignificant. The second, a horrible gaping wound on his right eyelid, was sustained in Round 9 and was so deep that it filleted open.

Thereafter, Marquez's trainer, Nacho Beristain, could be seen on television packing what appeared to be a long yellow string soaked in an undetermined liquid solution into the wound, covering the cut with Vaseline, and sending Marquez out for the next round with the string still inside the wound. This appeared to happen after both Rounds 9 and 11. The HBO telecast was inconclusive regarding what happened after Round 10.

In Nevada, it's illegal to apply any medication -- except coagulants Avetine, thrombin and epinephrine -- to a cut during a fight. It's also illegal to place a foreign object inside a cut and leave it there during a round. But the ring physician assigned to Marquez's corner appeared not to notice -- or maybe he noticed and just didn't care.

Nevada is skating on thin ice when it comes to fighter safety. Last year, a fighter (who prefers not to be publicly named) was licensed by the Nevada State Athletic Commission despite the fact that an ophthalmologic examination report submitted to the commission showed a vision-impairing cataract in one eye. The same report was submitted to the California State Athletic Commission, which refused to license the fighter.

The NSAC has to be more vigilant with regard to fighter safety than it is now.

The second question surrounding Pacquiao-Marquez II concerns the issue of how carefully Marquez's promoter, Golden Boy, vetted Tom Miller (the Ohio judge whose 114-113 scorecard gave Pacquiao a split decision victory).

Miller was a last-minute replacement for Dick Flaherty, who was removed prior to the fight because of a conflict of interest.

Miller is a competent judge, and his scoring was well within the realm of reason. But there's an interesting entry on his résumé.

Pacquiao is one of three elite fighters whom Top Rank has under contract. Kelly Pavlik is also on that short list. Pavlik has fought four fights in his home state of Ohio. Miller was a judge in three of them.

Pavlik might fight in Ohio again later this year. One assumes that Miller would like to be one of judges assigned to that bout.

Pacquiao-Marquez could have gone either way. Maybe there's a connection between the dots; maybe not.

And while on the subject of Pacquiao-Marquez …

WBC president Jose Sulaiman reportedly was very upset by the fact that the Nevada State Athletic Commission replaced Flaherty, a WBC judge, with Miller, a WBO judge, in what was a WBC title fight.

Whether or not that was the reason, neither Sulaiman nor his son, WBC executive secretary Mauricio Sulaiman, attended the fight. And there's a school of thought that it was suggested to other WBC officials that they also not attend. WBA supervisor Juan Sanchez was the only WBC official to work the main event with Sulaiman's blessing.

But keep in mind that a lot of people wanted to see Pacquiao-Marquez. Could this have been the first time ever that WBC personnel requested seats off-camera for a major fight?

Thomas Hauser is the lead writer for Secondsout.com. His most recent collection of boxing columns -- "The Greatest Sport of All" -- has been published by the University of Arkansas Press. He can be reached by e-mail at [email protected].

TerribleTerry · Post by **TerribleTerry** » 28 Mar 2008, 09:19

I remember seeing that little yellow string getting placed into the cut and thinking "what the fu ck is that?!"

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 28 Mar 2008, 09:36

Yeah WTF is that all about, sending him out with string in the cut??

Something a bit weird about the last min judge replacement as well - wonder if he'll judge Pavlik's next fight? Not that he'll likely be needed.

conspiracies, gotta love em

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 28 Mar 2008, 10:15

THEBUTCH wrote:I had Marquez winning both bouts too, but I think your comments on Pacman are a little OTT, stujones.

How many others boxers have got in with Marquez again other than Pacman? Not many.

Maybe... but I just don't like it that Pacquiao has basically said "I've proven my superiority" - no he hasn't IMO, no he hasn't in the opinion of many.

Pacquiao is an ATG in my opinion, who fought and beat most of the best. He is running out of challengers... but still his main rival is Marquez and thats the fight I want to see again.

Chambers2 · Post by **Chambers2** » 28 Mar 2008, 12:34

stujones wrote: Pacquiao is an ATG in my opinion, who fought and beat most of the best. He is running out of challengers... but still his main rival is Marquez and thats the fight I want to see again.

Totally agree, the wheels should already be in motion for the third fight after they produced fights like I and II.