BoxRec

Spud wrote:[

Anyone who treats the losing of Kerry Kayes lightly from Team Hatton I honestly cannot fathom out - and your comments concerning buidling up and cutting bodybuilders I am afraid tells me you are ignorant to the facts of what Kayes meant to Ricky Hatton - or if are you are in any way involved with Team Hatton your comments are a rather sad attempt to water down the fantastic work Kerry Kayes did for Ricky.

With regards to one of your final points - It is my opinion Ricky Hatton did not just lose against Mayweather he got schooled by him - and yes before anyone says I actually stated to Ricky and on this and any other forum I did not think Ricky should face Mayweather until his very last fight as I thought there would be only one result. At the time I got a playful tap in the ribs from a member of Team Hatton and a decent debate then ensued!!!

.

Spud, I dont think my comments were ignorant or sad, and im in no way involved with team hatton. Im not denying that Kerry kayes was a massive influence and friend to Ricky both in and out of training camps. But i personally feel that theres been to much emphasis on working on the style that beat Kosta, rushing in/mauling trying to bully and outstrength an opponent. While this plan worked to perfection that night, even though he got tagged at the start of nearly every round, that style of fighting doesnt work against everyone, and maybe a change to a less weight training more boxing camp may benefit Ricky. Obviously we will see Sunday morning

Ketchel_2008 wrote:Seems to be a big discussion as to the effect of losing Kerry kayes from the camp, for me i think it could work in his favour. Hattons a natural strong lad whos body obviously responds well to weight training, but post Kosta hes always looked like hes forgotten his main attributes (jab and coming in at angles) to basically rush, punch, maul and try and exert his extra strength. Maybe working with Kerry whos fantastic at building up and cutting bodybuilders wasnt the best training method for a boxer. I sincerely hope a move to Floyd senior is a positive and hatton can have a couple more exciting fights throwing punches rather than mauling whether you think hattons a charlatan, arsehole, satan.
One final thing for Jeej, thats the problem with boxing, fans like you just because he lost to the best he should retire ???? please see UFC, guys win lose and fight another day.

Oh and hello, be nice its my first day

Ricky's tactics have nothing to do with Kayes - Kayes is a nutrition and conditioning expert - not a boxing trainer.

Kayes was brought in so that Hatton could make weight safely and without having to kill himself to make the scales.

James i didnt say he had anything to do with tactics, but with a weight training based programme mobility/stamina will be down and we have all seen this in hatton over the last three years. Of course this may be hattons lifestyle catching up with him and not anything to do with kayes. :??

ketchel i know what you are saying

i recall saying on another forum a while back reading an interview with Kayes, that his training regime, his whole focus, seemed heavily influenced by a bodybuilding approach and it seemed building pure mass/strength was a big part of it

i asked someone on the forum with better knowledge than my own rather sketchy knowledge on issues related to S&C training, if he was worried (on Hatton's behalf) that Kaye's regime seemed rather too 'weights-based' and not 'sports-specific' enough

from the answer I got (from a pro S&C trainer, maybe phenomenal-nutrition could help me out here) its not necessarily true that if you focus on a weight-based programme, that you will lose mobility or stamina. however if weights are done without specifically applying most of the movements to boxing-related activity, involving the APPLICATION of strength to movement (rather than the kind of static stregnth of weight training) then it is a possibility you can lose speed etc

basically plyometric-type training, or in weight training, Olympic lifts and their variants, are at least as useful to boxers if not more so. from what i could work out Kaye's training was more based around the powerlifting exercises (and variants). okay so i have heard very impressive numbers on what hatton can benchpress/ legpress, he's a beast of a man for his weight

but given that he is so naturally strong, surely what they need to work on is not what is strong already (he's probably physically stronger than anyone he's fought, bar Urango, and would possibly have been so without much or any weights?), but what can be developed more in him??

spud i don't think you should just react to any criticism of Team Hatton as though its ignorant etc. it ain't directed at you personally mate

btw i totally take your point that kaye was highly influential in hatton's weight-cutting, however there is a great deal moreto the job of an S&C coach as I am sure you know.

if Team Hatton, including Kaye, have been so spot-on in their preparation, how come in probably 4 of his last 5 fights Hatton has clearly tired in the last few rounds? something is rotten in the state of Hatton, maybe?

clearly you can't blame kaye for tactics but sometimes there has to be a relation between the type of training a fighter has and the way he fights and i think ketchel is at least part right when he says the Tszuyu fight mauling style has taken over with Hatton to the detriment of his movement

maybe thats just down to a decline in hatton's own abilities. maybe its that standard of competition is much better than when he DID have that more mobile style, IE vs a Tackie or Phillips it was easy for him to look mobile, against a Collazo or floyd who were so much quicker than his WBU opponents, maybe he'd never be able to outmatch them for mobility so maybe his only option was to maul and brawl.

Sorry to take this thread in another direction, but has anyone considered that Paulie may be having weight problems ?
I've spoken to a close friend who's over there and he went to the open session the other day, and he turned up late, took ages to get going, and was sipping his water - like just drops.
Hatton will win this fight, no problem.

Are we saying that Ricky has completely forgotten what and how much he eats from the Kayes days??
I presume it was a fairly tried and tested formula and shouldn't be that hard to stick too.
Or is it really necessary for Kerry to mix all his drinks for him, perhaps he sticks in special ingredients known only to him!

interesting info 26!

Coco wrote:Are we saying that Ricky has completely forgotten what and how much he eats from the Kayes days??
I presume it was a fairly tried and tested formula and shouldn't be that hard to stick too.
Or is it really necessary for Kerry to mix all his drinks for him, perhaps he sticks in special ingredients known only to him!

Hatton is a known glutton and binge-drinker - he is ageing and therefore having someone like Kaye around is a real boon. It's not easy for Hatton to get down to that weight - without Kaye it is only going to be harder for him to maintain discipline.

People underestimate how negative changing trainers can be. That is why so many fighters end up returning to their original trainer -

Thanks 26, but now I dunno who to put me money on again.

Losing Kayes, changing trainers, and not looking that great recently notwithstanding, as the fight draws closer, I'm increasingly convinced that Hatton is going to piss this. Malignaggi is talking it up, but I'm not sure he fancies it.

Terry D wrote:

Coco wrote:Are we saying that Ricky has completely forgotten what and how much he eats from the Kayes days??
I presume it was a fairly tried and tested formula and shouldn't be that hard to stick too.
Or is it really necessary for Kerry to mix all his drinks for him, perhaps he sticks in special ingredients known only to him!

Such as?

No matter how many times we visit a doctor we do not become a doctor. No matter how many times we consult a lawyer we do not become a lawyer. I imagine that nutrition is a science that is changeable, depending on lifestyle and age. As Hatton gets older his metabolism will slow down, meaning the programme needs constant tweaking. Consequently you need someone to make sure the tweaking is done correctly. You cannot just say "Hey, you used to pass me my water, fancy being my new nutrition guy?" (not saying Hatton has done this, just being humourous, or trying to be. Floyd Senior probably has his own guy, Mr Creosote, judging by the Guzan debacle).

If you have the same medical complaint or legal query every single time you would know the remedy. Of course you need to see the doctor for the prescription but you would know what pills he was going to give you.
Ricky's suppliments etc are sold over the counter, he should know what he needs, and if he is a touch tighter at the weight due to age and metabolism, he would just train a touch harder and eat a little less.
Your nutritionalist can only help you so much, the loss of his trainer is more likely to have a bigger impact. The nuritionalist doesn't have a magic formula, he gives dietary advice which Ricky should be familiar with now.
The fight will be won in the gym, Ricky always trains hard, he will turn up at the weight in good shape and beat the American clearly enough

Maglianaggi is a really bad fighter, this fight isnt even a contest. Gotta agree with FM snr ''he has no chance''. This is a hyped up mismatch in the same way Hattons loss was.

Boxing is a joke, all boxers are running scared of someone. Why cant the associations get together and sort something out where world title means best in the world. Until this happens we'll continue to have so called undisputed champions like Tarver was.

I meen come on this is the only way we are going to have the best fights being made in each division. Surely a mandatry should be the best fighter in the division, not anyone ranked in the top 50

twenty six wrote:Hatton will win this fight, no problem.

No he won't.

Spud wrote:

twenty six wrote:Hatton will win this fight, no problem.

No he won't.

Hard being fired, is it not, Spud?

Hatton will win. I'm on the rigs. He always wins when I'm on the rigs and have no chance of seeing the fight!

Spud wrote:

twenty six wrote:Hatton will win this fight, no problem.

No he won't.

And only your view counts yes Spud, if Spud thinks Hatton will lose Hatton will lose for so

he looks in good nick, nothing out of the ordinary?!

Fancying tackie to turn matt over more and more tbh

Spud wrote:

twenty six wrote:Hatton will win this fight, no problem.

No he won't.

Love how Spud always seeks to make the Brit the Under-Dog and try and make him out to be some sort of Legend.

Seriously Spud, i think it's fairly obvious who is the favorite in this fight: Hatton.

observer1 wrote:Legend

Why do people throw this word around all the time?

There's very few "true legends" in boxing and only one fighting today

Today as in 22nd November 2008 ?

Wales wrote:Today as in 22nd November 2008 ?

No, today as in the modern era

Oh... whos that then?

You couldnt have Hopkins without Jones (or vice versa)... could you?

Barrera fought last week too, he's gotta be in with a shout of "legend" status. Calzaghe will be a legend in Wales.

Wales wrote:Oh... whos that then?

You couldnt have Hopkins without Jones (or vice versa)... could you?

Oscar

Interesting. More so than Jones Jr?