BoxRec

greg wrote:

asdfjkl wrote: He got minor traces of meldonium left in his body from 2015.

...i don't feel like going into long discussions here...just have one quick question if you don't mind...how do you KNOW if it was from 2015 and not from 2016? short answer will do...thanks

Povetkin said so, so it must be true

asdfjkl wrote:

scallum2015 wrote:

Pureist wrote:What has the Russian track team have to do with boxing, as some posters have been saying from day one was that the fight was postponed not cancelled, nothing was said about he testing positive by vada or WADA, they said it was an adverse result, if wilder did say he was a drug cheat, he's going to by paying plenty of money over

Calling a guy with Peds in his system a drug Cheat is a court case?

He got minor traces of meldonium left in his body from 2015. Also, it has never been proven that meldonium has any positive effects on athletes at all, no matter how much you take from it.

The reports i read says it can help Athletes tremendously. Clean Athletes dont inject Ped's.

Besides Athletes were informed October of 2015 that it would be put on banned list so if you continued to take a substance you knew was gonna be illegal smh. Povetkin was aware in October but got busted in April. Sounds like he and his team can only blame themselves since it only stays in system for few months

greg wrote:

asdfjkl wrote: He got minor traces of meldonium left in his body from 2015.

...i don't feel like going into long discussions here...just have one quick question if you don't mind...how do you KNOW if it was from 2015 and not from 2016? short answer will do...thanks

Because the number would probably be far higher and next to that the drugs would be traceble for a longer time.

scallum2015 wrote:

asdfjkl wrote:

scallum2015 wrote: Calling a guy with Peds in his system a drug Cheat is a court case?

He got minor traces of meldonium left in his body from 2015. Also, it has never been proven that meldonium has any positive effects on athletes at all, no matter how much you take from it.

The reports i read says it can help Athletes tremendously. Clean Athletes dont inject Ped's.

What reports do you read? Probably only the simple minded ones.
It can give you a headache and skinproblems. Now I admit Povetkin got cut open by Wach in his last fight and it's possible that's because of
meldonium, but when 2016 started and Wada/Vada didn't allow meldonium any more he didn't take it.
Next to that, most articles around it only say it makes your blood flow better, but so does alcohol (and alcohol can also give you a headache), this doesn't mean you will become the ultimate boxer if you're just drinking enough alcohol.

asdfjkl wrote:

greg wrote:

asdfjkl wrote: He got minor traces of meldonium left in his body from 2015.

...i don't feel like going into long discussions here...just have one quick question if you don't mind...how do you KNOW if it was from 2015 and not from 2016? short answer will do...thanks

Because the number would probably be far higher and next to that the drugs would be traceble for a longer time.

...saying "probably" means you don't really know, you just assume..which basically means it could have been taken ANY time in 2015 as well as in 2016...

greg wrote:

asdfjkl wrote:

greg wrote: ...i don't feel like going into long discussions here...just have one quick question if you don't mind...how do you KNOW if it was from 2015 and not from 2016? short answer will do...thanks

Because the number would probably be far higher and next to that the drugs would be traceble for a longer time.

...saying "probably" means you don't really know, you just assume..which basically means it could have been taken ANY time in 2015 as well as in 2016...

The point is that it is unknown. WADA/VADA still don't know how much time it takes for a body to clear itself of meldonium, so Wilder didn't have any valid basis to call Povetkin a drug cheat. Legally, that was defamation, and he will pay for that.

boxing_rocks wrote:

greg wrote:

asdfjkl wrote: Because the number would probably be far higher and next to that the drugs would be traceble for a longer time.

...saying "probably" means you don't really know, you just assume..which basically means it could have been taken ANY time in 2015 as well as in 2016...

The point is that it is unknown. WADA/VADA still don't know how much time it takes for a body to clear itself of meldonium, so Wilder didn't have any valid basis to call Povetkin a drug cheat. Legally, that was defamation, and he will pay for that.

...I understand that but that was NOT my question..

If you look at this document, it is dated on September of 2014, as I assume a heads up for those that use the drugs that will be banned. If you are not sure how long it takes to get something out of your system......well, it looks like boxers had over a year to get their system clean if they were worried about that.

https://wada-main-prod.s3.amazonaws.com ... ons-en.pdf

Badhusker wrote:If you look at this document, it is dated on September of 2014, as I assume a heads up for those that use the drugs that will be banned. If you are not sure how long it takes to get something out of your system......well, it looks like boxers had over a year to get their system clean if they were worried about that.

https://wada-main-prod.s3.amazonaws.com ... ons-en.pdf

They were just assessing if it needed to be banned:

 Meldonium, a drug with potential cardiac effects, was added to the
Monitoring Program to assess the abuse of this substance.

The ban was announced a year later.

Badhusker wrote:If you look at this document, it is dated on September of 2014, as I assume a heads up for those that use the drugs that will be banned. If you are not sure how long it takes to get something out of your system......well, it looks like boxers had over a year to get their system clean if they were worried about that.

https://wada-main-prod.s3.amazonaws.com ... ons-en.pdf

Thanks for the correction. I guess if it were me, if I was taking a drug they are considering banning, I would quit taking it. Apparently the athletes that took it definitely got positive results from it, contrary to what some have said - otherwise they wouldn't take it.

greg wrote:

boxing_rocks wrote:

greg wrote: ...saying "probably" means you don't really know, you just assume..which basically means it could have been taken ANY time in 2015 as well as in 2016...

The point is that it is unknown. WADA/VADA still don't know how much time it takes for a body to clear itself of meldonium, so Wilder didn't have any valid basis to call Povetkin a drug cheat. Legally, that was defamation, and he will pay for that.

...I understand that but that was NOT my question..

I'm not a 100% sure if I would also get 70 nanograms in my body if I kiss Sharapova for example.
But I am sure that meldonium would be traceble for a lot longer time if used.

Badhusker wrote:

Badhusker wrote:If you look at this document, it is dated on September of 2014, as I assume a heads up for those that use the drugs that will be banned. If you are not sure how long it takes to get something out of your system......well, it looks like boxers had over a year to get their system clean if they were worried about that.

https://wada-main-prod.s3.amazonaws.com ... ons-en.pdf

Thanks for the correction. I guess if it were me, if I was taking a drug they are considering banning, I would quit taking it. Apparently the athletes that took it definitely got positive results from it, contrary to what some have said - otherwise they wouldn't take it.

Caffeine and nicotine are on the current watch list, I guess they should stop drinking coffee, red bull...

Worth noting some asthma drugs are on the allowed lost despite it being that they enhance performance.

The inconsistency is a major issue imo

asdfjkl wrote:

scallum2015 wrote:

asdfjkl wrote: He got minor traces of meldonium left in his body from 2015. Also, it has never been proven that meldonium has any positive effects on athletes at all, no matter how much you take from it.

The reports i read says it can help Athletes tremendously. Clean Athletes dont inject Ped's.

What reports do you read? Probably only the simple minded ones.
It can give you a headache and skinproblems. Now I admit Povetkin got cut open by Wach in his last fight and it's possible that's because of
meldonium, but when 2016 started and Wada/Vada didn't allow meldonium any more he didn't take it.
Next to that, most articles around it only say it makes your blood flow better, but so does alcohol (and alcohol can also give you a headache), this doesn't mean you will become the ultimate boxer if you're just drinking enough alcohol.

why are so Many Russian Athletes using it ? If it gives no benefit it would be totally illogical to take it . I read a report that it supplies more oxygen to the tissues. If Povetkin was taking it and he felt it Gave no benefit he should have discontinued immediately in October 2015. According to the test he took it after fair warning was given to all Athletes

scallum2015 wrote:

asdfjkl wrote:

scallum2015 wrote: The reports i read says it can help Athletes tremendously. Clean Athletes dont inject Ped's.

What reports do you read? Probably only the simple minded ones.
It can give you a headache and skinproblems. Now I admit Povetkin got cut open by Wach in his last fight and it's possible that's because of
meldonium, but when 2016 started and Wada/Vada didn't allow meldonium any more he didn't take it.
Next to that, most articles around it only say it makes your blood flow better, but so does alcohol (and alcohol can also give you a headache), this doesn't mean you will become the ultimate boxer if you're just drinking enough alcohol.

why are so Many Russian Athletes using it ? If it gives no benefit it would be totally illogical to take it . I read a report that it supplies more oxygen to the tissues. If Povetkin was taking it and he felt it Gave no benefit he should have discontinued immediately in October 2015. According to the test he took it after fair warning was given to all Athletes

The population uses it, not just the athletes.

"Last year, as part of Wada's monitoring of meldonium, a testing centre in the German city of Cologne found that 182 of 8,320 random urine samples gave positive results for the drug - a rate of 2.2%.

"That's huge," says Dr Bassindale. "The overall positive tests for all other doping was about 2% from 280,000 tests."

BBC Russian's Pavel Fendenko said the drug is frequently sold over the counter in Russia and prescribed by cardiologists."

"After monitoring the use of meldonium and researching its properties, Wada decided it was a performance-enhancing drug and should therefore be added to the banned list.

Dr Bassindale said: "When deciding whether to ban a drug, Wada looks at three things. Will it enhance performance? Is it detrimental to the health of an athlete? Is it against the 'spirit of sport'?

"To be banned, a drug must 'fail' two of these three tests. Presumably, in this case, they have also decided the drug is against the 'spirit of sport'.""


"Will we see more failed tests?

If 2.2% of random samples showed levels of the drug, then it is clearly being widely used, but it is impossible to tell how many samples tested positive for legitimate medical reasons.

Dr Bassindale says Sharapova's positive test may reduce the number of athletes using meldonium.

"This might have persuaded people to be much more careful," he said."

scallum2015 wrote:According to the test he took it after fair warning was given to all Athletes

Not at all. WADA hasn't completed research on how quickly meldonium leaves a body which is why they introduced concentration of 1 microgram not causing automatic sanctions.

Did WADA ever follow up on the huge discovery someone/they? made that hundreds of medalists actually tested positive?

There is a myth in capitalism that competition leads to progress. No. We just get a bunch of companies, one who even lauds Victor Conte , who run around adjusting test results to suit their own economic interests. All of these organizations are money makers, not some genuine entity seeking to level the playing field.

BECAUSE THAT IS OUR REALITY, you have to side with Wilder and any other athlete in this situation. You have one man with a Ph.D telling you it's no big deal. You have another man with equal credentials raising a red flag. Possibly because the red flag raisers are working with a company making a "legal" version of the drug. So Kalan and whoever, I do agree with you. Maybe Povetkin's results are insignificant. Maybe it's like failing a drug test because of a few poppy seed bagels. But, who would you listen to if you were a boxer, and could potentially get killed? And you also had the education of a boxer.

IT'S ALL JUST A JOKE

That's the only opinion that matter, actually.

"The WBC, through its Clean Boxing Program, is continuing to evaluate the positive anti-doping result of Alexander Povetkin for the banned substance Meldonium. As the WBC previously reported, it granted WBC Heavyweight World Champion Deontay Wilder a voluntary defense while continuing to thoroughly weigh and gauge all related scientific and medical factors.

As part of its anti-doping results management, the WBC formed and convened an emergency review committee. The last phase of the WBC's anti-doping results management in the Povetkin case will be to afford Mr. Povetkin and his team the opportunity to present their position in the case and any factual, medical and/or scientific data they deem appropriate. Soon after that phase is completed, the WBC will be in the best position to make and announce its final ruling."
http://wbcboxing.com/wbceng/news/6877-w ... ion-update

scallum2015 wrote:

asdfjkl wrote:

scallum2015 wrote: The reports i read says it can help Athletes tremendously. Clean Athletes dont inject Ped's.

What reports do you read? Probably only the simple minded ones.
It can give you a headache and skinproblems. Now I admit Povetkin got cut open by Wach in his last fight and it's possible that's because of
meldonium, but when 2016 started and Wada/Vada didn't allow meldonium any more he didn't take it.
Next to that, most articles around it only say it makes your blood flow better, but so does alcohol (and alcohol can also give you a headache), this doesn't mean you will become the ultimate boxer if you're just drinking enough alcohol.

why are so Many Russian Athletes using it ? If it gives no benefit it would be totally illogical to take it . I read a report that it supplies more oxygen to the tissues. If Povetkin was taking it and he felt it Gave no benefit he should have discontinued immediately in October 2015. According to the test he took it after fair warning was given to all Athletes

YOU'RE FULL OF CRAP!!!! ... You have NO basis for saying Povetkin took Meldonium after it was announced it was going on the banned list. He tested at 70 nanograms -- and having 14 X as much in his system would still have allowed him to compete under the guidelines of any concentration under 1 microgram being good to go for all competitors. Maria Sharapova tested over that and that's the only reason she was suspended.

Kalan wrote:

scallum2015 wrote:

asdfjkl wrote: What reports do you read? Probably only the simple minded ones.
It can give you a headache and skinproblems. Now I admit Povetkin got cut open by Wach in his last fight and it's possible that's because of
meldonium, but when 2016 started and Wada/Vada didn't allow meldonium any more he didn't take it.
Next to that, most articles around it only say it makes your blood flow better, but so does alcohol (and alcohol can also give you a headache), this doesn't mean you will become the ultimate boxer if you're just drinking enough alcohol.

why are so Many Russian Athletes using it ? If it gives no benefit it would be totally illogical to take it . I read a report that it supplies more oxygen to the tissues. If Povetkin was taking it and he felt it Gave no benefit he should have discontinued immediately in October 2015. According to the test he took it after fair warning was given to all Athletes

YOU'RE FULL OF CRAP!!!! ... You have NO basis for saying Povetkin took Meldonium after it was announced it was going on the banned list. He tested at 70 nanograms -- and having 14 X as much in his system would still have allowed him to compete under the guidelines of any concentration under 1 microgram being good to go for all competitors. Maria Sharapova tested over that and that's the only reason she was suspended.

Any source, outside Riabinski, regarding 70ng??? Not that it matter, the sample was taken after March 1st...

bigman1968 wrote:

Kalan wrote:

scallum2015 wrote: why are so Many Russian Athletes using it ? If it gives no benefit it would be totally illogical to take it . I read a report that it supplies more oxygen to the tissues. If Povetkin was taking it and he felt it Gave no benefit he should have discontinued immediately in October 2015. According to the test he took it after fair warning was given to all Athletes

YOU'RE FULL OF CRAP!!!! ... You have NO basis for saying Povetkin took Meldonium after it was announced it was going on the banned list. He tested at 70 nanograms -- and having 14 X as much in his system would still have allowed him to compete under the guidelines of any concentration under 1 microgram being good to go for all competitors. Maria Sharapova tested over that and that's the only reason she was suspended.

Any source, outside Riabinski, regarding 70ng??? Not that it matter, the sample was taken after March 1st...

Before 1 march he was allowed to have far over 200 times as much lol.

Any source, out of Wilder and his team that Wilder is clean? No, ofcourse not, stop switching the rules the other way around.

Povetkin is the only boxer on earth who are guilty untill proven innocent, that's sad, even despite he already proved himself to be innocent.

The WADA and WBC are only re-enforcing their own rules. Its nothing personal against Povetkin or Russia. Who knows, we may find out all athletes will have suspensions lifted if it is determined they took the drug before it was on the banned list. Actually this wouldn't surprise me since there seems to be more research needed on Meldonium withdrawal time frames.

Badhusker wrote:The WADA and WBC are only re-enforcing their own rules. Its nothing personal against Povetkin or Russia. Who knows, we may find out all athletes will have suspensions lifted if it is determined they took the drug before it was on the banned list. Actually this wouldn't surprise me since there seems to be more research needed on Meldonium withdrawal time frames.

I've heard it's short term but haven't done a ton of research. That would explain why he passed two tests before he got popped. If it's long term, oh well, sucks for everyone involved. He has ZERO case against Wilder.

What exactly did Wilder say?

I like Wilder, so I hope he didn't go overboard on Povetkin for minimal traces of Meldonium.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

Badhusker wrote:The WADA and WBC are only re-enforcing their own rules. Its nothing personal against Povetkin or Russia. Who knows, we may find out all athletes will have suspensions lifted if it is determined they took the drug before it was on the banned list. Actually this wouldn't surprise me since there seems to be more research needed on Meldonium withdrawal time frames.

I've heard it's short term but haven't done a ton of research. That would explain why he passed two tests before he got popped. If it's long term, oh well, sucks for everyone involved. He has ZERO case against Wilder.

If/when WBC clears Povetkin and reordetrs Wilder to defend against him, Ryabinsky will have a really good case.