Froch v Dirrell - Was it really a robbery?

[Sweet P]

What has me stuffed on here is all the theries on how Froch come forward and Dirrell went backwards during the fight so thats how you score it.

That is totally irrelivant, Boxing is about landing punches and not getting hit. Its as simple as that. Whether Froch come forward or not he still needed to land more punches, Or harder punches. He did neither.

Im totally Unbiased i was hoping Froch would win, He got outclassed, He was made to look amaturish at times with his akward lunges. Id say Froch is on the same level as Sakio Bika . Good Tough solid Pro fighter but deffinently not Worldclass.
Froch will get soundly beaten by Kessler and Abraham in this tournament.

And how the hell froch had the nerve to call out Joe Calzaghe is beyond me. Joe would have given him a similar beating to the one he gave Lacy IMO.

[Chambers2]

Dan Rafaels review of Froch-Dirrell

Froch isn't the smoothest or most skilled boxer, but he makes up for it with a physical, relentless style. It served him well when he outslugged Jean Pascal (who would go on to win a light heavyweight belt) to win a vacant super middleweight title in December. It served him well when he rallied to starch Jermain Taylor with 14 seconds left in the fight in his first defense in April. And it served him well again as he eked out a split decision against Flint, Mich., native and 2004 U.S. Olympic bronze medalist Dirrell to retain his title in a Group Stage 1 match of Showtime's Super Six World Boxing Classic six-man super middleweight tournament.

Froch had the luxury of fighting in his hometown, but had to enter the ring in the wee hours of the morning to accommodate Showtime's live telecast to the East Coast of the United States while Dirrell had simply stayed on his normal body schedule for the fight. Dirrell also fought in his normal negative, agonizing style. He ran, he cried to the referee about just about everything and he held. And grabbed. And wrestled. At times, it was like watching a smaller, faster, more skilled version of John Ruiz.

It was ugly. When Dirrell, who has all the talent in the world but still fights like an amateur, would stand and fight, he landed some nice counter right hands. But he didn't do it nearly enough. The first half of the fight was an abomination because of Dirrell's unwillingness to do anything but run and grab. All the while, Froch was making the fight, coming forward and firing in what degenerated into a somewhat dirty fight. But in the eighth round, Froch nailed Dirrell with a left hook late in the round that definitely rattled him.

Both fighters fouled each other often with low blows, elbows, blows to the back of the head and punches on the break. Referee Hector Afu did his best, but had a very hard time maintaining control. Both guys could have had points deducted at various times but Afu did not pull the trigger until finally docking a point from Dirrell for holding and hitting in the 10th round, during which Dirrell hurt Froch with two hard left hands. In the end, two judges gave it to Froch, which was the right call.

How can you give Dirrell the fight when, for the most part, he fought scared, complained to the referee about everything and barely threw any punches in the first half or two-thirds of the fight? He finished very strong, but it wasn't enough to warrant or deserve the decision. At best, he could have had a draw, which would have still not given him the title.

That's pretty accurate IMO

[nobby_nobbins]

I respect Bunce's knowledge and journalistic ability but I find the idea that he's "one of us" quite laughable. He is actually Don King's albino love-child.

[dondada]

The flaw in my poll was that I forgot to add the option of a draw.

The amount of posters calling it a poor decision was overwhelming which is why it's laid out like it is (plus you can only use 10 lines for a poll).

But there is a clear option to go for a Froch win and only 27% so far have done so:

http://news.boxrec.com/

Nice article, how longs the news section been up (about time)

About time? If only you knew what goes in to this type of thing... Still plenty to do!

Cheers - only been up a few days now.

[Ezzard]

I think the fight exposed both men.

Froch must have known what he was up against. Why didn’t he have any fresh ideas of how to go about getting the job done? What about a basic crouch? Why not just go to the body as an easier target? I mean there’s no reason why an opponent has to stand and trade. Dirrell wasn’t going to do that, especially if he watched a video of Froch's 2 title fights, and Froch just had to make more of it. Also, that side-on style is fine BUT you can’t reach in with a jab and hold your right back. Froch made himself a one-handed fighter. Also, if the crouch was not right for Froch then why not set a few traps? Wait for Dirrell to jump in and time him onto one. Poor showing. Just don't think he really did his homework on his opponent.

Dirrell? For many rounds he’d land one or two shots, then jab Froch’s gloves for 2 mins. He couldn’t fall to the floor quick enough. At times he was like a rag doll. And if Froch can’t expect opponents to duke it out with him then Dirrell can’t expect not to get roughed up on the inside. It was as if Dirrell thought it was a non-contact sport. Then when he did open up he seemed to be in control of the action. This is a guy looking to be a star but the way he fought did him no favours at all.

I had it to Dirrell by 1 point but thought it could have gone either way. Dirrell won his rounds more convincingly but that's not how the game works.

To be honest, without TV replays, when Froch was scuffing him in a corner it's understandable people would give him the benefit of the doubt because there was nothing else to watch.

[chesh]

The flaw in my poll was that I forgot to add the option of a draw.

The amount of posters calling it a poor decision was overwhelming which is why it's laid out like it is (plus you can only use 10 lines for a poll).

But there is a clear option to go for a Froch win and only 27% so far have done so:

http://news.boxrec.com/

Nice article, how longs the news section been up (about time)

About time? If only you knew what goes in to this type of thing... Still plenty to do!

Cheers - only been up a few days now.

It's looking good already.

[Cotteyroo]

Im happy the majority on here had Froch winning. Ive been reading some bizzare scorecards. Badlefthook gave it 117-110. OK i understand the case Dirrell may have been knicking it by one round but no more. On my card (I was sitting in the press so yet to rewatch it) i had Froch winning by 2. Now i score fights based on agression and ring genrealship along with who i fought was landing the cleaner shots. I saw Froch coming forward all night, I saw Froch landing a sweet jab many a time to Dirrell's face and i saw Dirrell backing off and running away all night along with complaining to the referee constantly and obviously the point dedutcion. At one point the ref even said "Do you want to fight".

However Dirrell showed he can mix it at the top of the division and i can see if he changes this negativity into more positive actions (As Froch said) he can really trouble Abraham.

I don't think it's the majority. Dirrell's options are spread over 9 choices

42 people think it wasn't a robbery AT ALL it's pretty unanimous

[Cyclops]

It kind of annoyed me that people went on about Froch being a 'caveman' and a throwback fighter. He's just sh*t.

Sh*t fighters don't beat Pascal and Taylor. You didn't watch the fight, so shut up.

My OPINION is based on those two fights you mentioned. F*ck it maybe sh*t is too harsh. Anyone who gets in a ring gets my respect. Can't be bothered arguing. I didn't watch the fight so I WILL shut up.

OK I just finished watching the fight, and bear in mind what I've said about Froch already when I say I scored the fight 115-112 FOR FROCH. (That's taking into account the iffy points deduction in round 10- Dirrell's excessive holding was in the early rounds and was really annoying but I dunno if that deduction was justified at that stage.)

The first 3 rounds were difficult to score very close with not a lot going on but Dirrell did a lot of running whereas Carl was clearly the aggressor so I give them all to him.

Rounds 4-6 were pretty close with Dirrell starting strongly and then Froch coming back in at the end, but I give those to Dirrell.

Rounds 7&8, I thought were pretty exciting, rough rounds. I like it when it's a proper tear-up. Carl hit Dirrell with a peach in round 9. It was messy, but Froch roughed Dirrell up and so he gets both those rounds on my score card. These are the easiest rounds to score in my opinion.

Round 9 was very close but again I think Froch edged it, just by being aggressive.

Round 10 I have to make it a 9-9 round because although he got the point deduction afterwards, Dirrell really beat Froch back in this round and would have won it easy if he hadn't lost the point. That said, maybe he wouldn't have fought so well had he not had the incentive to.

11- That's Dirrell's round.

12- It's a close one again but I think Froch edges this one too.

I didn't vote for this being a clear Froch win because I think you could score rounds 1,2,3,5,6,9 and 12 to either fighter. To me Froch clearly won rounds 7 and 8 and Dirrell won rounds 4 and 7. Dirrell won round 10 too and I really don't think he should've lost that point. I would still have Froch winning though.

I am more inclined to give the rounds to the boxer who wants to make it a fight in close fights like this, rather than the 'classier' fighter who counters off the back foot. It's supposed to be exciting, and it's supposed to be a FIGHT, so in a close fight I go with the guy who works to make it a fight. That's why Calzaghe beat B-Hop in my book, and that's why Froch won this fight.

So no robbery. I don't think this was a great fight by any stretch, but I actually thought it was pretty cool. I don't see how you could think it was boring. I actually think this was a good start to the tournament, dare I say it. I will have to check out Abraham-Taylor now. Poor Jermain Taylor. I hope he gets at least one win.

Oh and just leave the dude alone if he wants to use capitals. It would be a shame if things degenerated into Youtube with kids throwing insults at each other. Just f*cking chill out and talk about boxing?

Anyway 115-112 FOR CARL FROCH.

[chesh]

Code: Select all

My scorecard:

     Froch     Dirrell
1     10        10
2     10         9
3      9        10
4      9        10
5      9        10
6     10         9
7     10         9
8     10         9
9     10         9
10     9         9 (inc. point deduction)
11     9        10
12     9        10
     114       114

A draw!

[dondada]

42 people think it wasn't a robbery AT ALL it's pretty unanimous

113 people, at the time of this post, think it was some kind of robbery against 43 who think Froch won.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Im happy the majority on here had Froch winning. Ive been reading some bizzare scorecards. Badlefthook gave it 117-110. OK i understand the case Dirrell may have been knicking it by one round but no more. On my card (I was sitting in the press so yet to rewatch it) i had Froch winning by 2. Now i score fights based on agression and ring genrealship along with who i fought was landing the cleaner shots. I saw Froch coming forward all night, I saw Froch landing a sweet jab many a time to Dirrell's face and i saw Dirrell backing off and running away all night along with complaining to the referee constantly and obviously the point dedutcion. At one point the ref even said "Do you want to fight".

However Dirrell showed he can mix it at the top of the division and i can see if he changes this negativity into more positive actions (As Froch said) he can really trouble Abraham.

I don't think it's the majority. Dirrell's options are spread over 9 choices

42 people think it wasn't a robbery AT ALL it's pretty unanimous

No actually, you're completely wrong, only 27% of people on here think it's not a robbery, it's on the front page of the boxrec website you douchebag!

[dondada]

The flaw in my poll was that I forgot to add the option of a draw.

The amount of posters calling it a poor decision was overwhelming which is why it's laid out like it is (plus you can only use 10 lines for a poll).

But there is a clear option to go for a Froch win and only 27% so far have done so:

http://news.boxrec.com/

What's your own take Ian, I don't think you've told us.

I don't think my initial take would have any validity, James. I was absolutely knackered and finding it difficult to maintain a proper focus. I did keep a card but such is the reaction I'm going to have to watch it compos mentis and think again.

[He's Gone Jim!]

Thought Froch won it by a round. Dirrell blew it though. His negativity cost him when he really could've beaten Froch(who I dont rate) with ease. Possibly his lack of experience cost him as well.

[J]

No actually, you're completely wrong, only 27% of people on here think it's not a robbery, it's on the front page of the boxrec website you douchebag!

douchebag? u ponce

[dondada]

No actually, you're completely wrong, only 27% of people on here think it's not a robbery, it's on the front page of the boxrec website you douchebag!

douchebag? u ponce

bumba!

[J]

raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaasclaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat!!!!!!!!!!

[WildWaylon]

Damian Hucker

Carry on with the caps mate!!!

These ***ts on here hate it when I used to do the ... between some of my sentences ... so I changed it to - and now look how many of the sweaty ***ts do it themselves.

If you keep up with the caps and maybe introduce a bit of colour here and there - now that will really annoy them and make me laugh!!!

spot on mate!!!

I might follow suit!!!

We have two applicants for the kindergaten, any more of you.

[rhino222]

What has me stuffed on here is all the theries on how Froch come forward and Dirrell went backwards during the fight so thats how you score it.

That is totally irrelivant, Boxing is about landing punches and not getting hit. Its as simple as that. Whether Froch come forward or not he still needed to land more punches, Or harder punches. He did neither.

Im totally Unbiased i was hoping Froch would win, He got outclassed, He was made to look amaturish at times with his akward lunges. Id say Froch is on the same level as Sakio Bika . Good Tough solid Pro fighter but deffinently not Worldclass.
Froch will get soundly beaten by Kessler and Abraham in this tournament.

And how the hell froch had the nerve to call out Joe Calzaghe is beyond me. Joe would have given him a similar beating to the one he gave Lacy IMO.

but the beauty of the froch v kessler or abraham fight is tht those 2 guys will stand and fight..so it becomes a question of power v chin. and thats a department froch is very strong in, so lets wait and see. if froch beats kessler..then we will all be in awe !!

personally, i can see dirrell boxing rings round abraham and beating him. so the 3 points froch took off dirrell may well end up being very very valuable.

[n1ebf]

so the 3 points froch took off dirrell may well end up being very very valuable.

i don't even follow the format to this thing but I thought it was universal knowledge that Froch took 2 (TWO) POINTS off Dirrell......DEUX PWA!! ZWEI PUNKTE!!

Can I ask you something....is this how you scored the Hunter Pickering fight.....3 points for each knockdown, bloody hell man.

[Steve89]

OK I just finished watching the fight, and bear in mind what I've said about Froch already when I say I scored the fight 115-112 FOR FROCH. (That's taking into account the iffy points deduction in round 10- Dirrell's excessive holding was in the early rounds and was really annoying but I dunno if that deduction was justified at that stage.)

The first 3 rounds were difficult to score very close with not a lot going on but Dirrell did a lot of running whereas Carl was clearly the aggressor so I give them all to him.

Rounds 4-6 were pretty close with Dirrell starting strongly and then Froch coming back in at the end, but I give those to Dirrell.

Rounds 7&8, I thought were pretty exciting, rough rounds. I like it when it's a proper tear-up. Carl hit Dirrell with a peach in round 9. It was messy, but Froch roughed Dirrell up and so he gets both those rounds on my score card. These are the easiest rounds to score in my opinion.

Round 9 was very close but again I think Froch edged it, just by being aggressive.

Round 10 I have to make it a 9-9 round because although he got the point deduction afterwards, Dirrell really beat Froch back in this round and would have won it easy if he hadn't lost the point. That said, maybe he wouldn't have fought so well had he not had the incentive to.

11- That's Dirrell's round.

12- It's a close one again but I think Froch edges this one too.

I didn't vote for this being a clear Froch win because I think you could score rounds 1,2,3,5,6,9 and 12 to either fighter. To me Froch clearly won rounds 7 and 8 and Dirrell won rounds 4 and 7. Dirrell won round 10 too and I really don't think he should've lost that point. I would still have Froch winning though.

I am more inclined to give the rounds to the boxer who wants to make it a fight in close fights like this, rather than the 'classier' fighter who counters off the back foot. It's supposed to be exciting, and it's supposed to be a FIGHT, so in a close fight I go with the guy who works to make it a fight. That's why Calzaghe beat B-Hop in my book, and that's why Froch won this fight.

So no robbery. I don't think this was a great fight by any stretch, but I actually thought it was pretty cool. I don't see how you could think it was boring. I actually think this was a good start to the tournament, dare I say it. I will have to check out Abraham-Taylor now. Poor Jermain Taylor. I hope he gets at least one win.

Oh and just leave the dude alone if he wants to use capitals. It would be a shame if things degenerated into Youtube with kids throwing insults at each other. Just f*cking chill out and talk about boxing?

Anyway 115-112 FOR CARL FROCH.[/quote]

Wow...just wow .

Here's mine.

I gave rounds 1,2 & 3, to Froch because I liked the way he looks in his cobra shorts.
Rounds 4 & 5 to Dirrell because he has nice teeth.
Rounds 6,7 & 8 to Froch for stopping Taylor in the 12 round of their fight and for being such a warrior.
I gave round 9 to Dirrell because...just because.
Rounds 10, 11, and 12 clearly go to the Cobra for being the hometown fighter and for having a hot girlfriend.

That's about as much sense as your scoring made.

[n1ebf]

That's outrageous Steve.....only 3 rounds for stopping Taylor like a warrior, at least 4 surely.....

[Cyclops]

OK I just finished watching the fight, and bear in mind what I've said about Froch already when I say I scored the fight 115-112 FOR FROCH. (That's taking into account the iffy points deduction in round 10- Dirrell's excessive holding was in the early rounds and was really annoying but I dunno if that deduction was justified at that stage.)

The first 3 rounds were difficult to score very close with not a lot going on but Dirrell did a lot of running whereas Carl was clearly the aggressor so I give them all to him.

Rounds 4-6 were pretty close with Dirrell starting strongly and then Froch coming back in at the end, but I give those to Dirrell.

Rounds 7&8, I thought were pretty exciting, rough rounds. I like it when it's a proper tear-up. Carl hit Dirrell with a peach in round 9. It was messy, but Froch roughed Dirrell up and so he gets both those rounds on my score card. These are the easiest rounds to score in my opinion.

Round 9 was very close but again I think Froch edged it, just by being aggressive.

Round 10 I have to make it a 9-9 round because although he got the point deduction afterwards, Dirrell really beat Froch back in this round and would have won it easy if he hadn't lost the point. That said, maybe he wouldn't have fought so well had he not had the incentive to.

11- That's Dirrell's round.

12- It's a close one again but I think Froch edges this one too.

I didn't vote for this being a clear Froch win because I think you could score rounds 1,2,3,5,6,9 and 12 to either fighter. To me Froch clearly won rounds 7 and 8 and Dirrell won rounds 4 and 7. Dirrell won round 10 too and I really don't think he should've lost that point. I would still have Froch winning though.

I am more inclined to give the rounds to the boxer who wants to make it a fight in close fights like this, rather than the 'classier' fighter who counters off the back foot. It's supposed to be exciting, and it's supposed to be a FIGHT, so in a close fight I go with the guy who works to make it a fight. That's why Calzaghe beat B-Hop in my book, and that's why Froch won this fight.

So no robbery. I don't think this was a great fight by any stretch, but I actually thought it was pretty cool. I don't see how you could think it was boring. I actually think this was a good start to the tournament, dare I say it. I will have to check out Abraham-Taylor now. Poor Jermain Taylor. I hope he gets at least one win.

Oh and just leave the dude alone if he wants to use capitals. It would be a shame if things degenerated into Youtube with kids throwing insults at each other. Just f*cking chill out and talk about boxing?

Anyway 115-112 FOR CARL FROCH.

Wow...just wow .

Here's mine.

I gave rounds 1,2 & 3, to Froch because I liked the way he looks in his cobra shorts.
Rounds 4 & 5 to Dirrell because he has nice teeth.
Rounds 6,7 & 8 to Froch for stopping Taylor in the 12 round of their fight and for being such a warrior.
I gave round 9 to Dirrell because...just because.
Rounds 10, 11, and 12 clearly go to the Cobra for being the hometown fighter and for having a hot girlfriend.

That's about as much sense as your scoring made.[/quote]

You really want me to give a complete breakdown of every round, every punch landed? Would anybody read that? I just watched the fight and made a note of who I thought won each round and a little reason why to myself. When I posted my scoring of the rounds that's all I had to go on, because I WAS WATCHING THE FIGHT not writing a f*cking novel.

Anyway, if you would be arsed to read that you should go back and read my original post (before someone posted the fight on Youtube where I hadn't seen it yet) where I stated quite clearly I didn't really rate Froch. Everyone seemed to be moaning that it was a robbery so I jumped the gun a little and said sorry to the American fans; that I thought robberies only happened in mainland Europe and that I was embarrassed if one had happened in Britain, especially at this early stage of the tournament. Then someone told me to shut up and watch the fight. So I DID shut up, and waited for someone to post it.

That's my honest, unbiased scorecard. I'm not on Froch's dick at all I don't think he's all that good. Dirrell is obviously more talented, but that doesn't mean I think he won.

Do you want me to sit through the whole fight again and make proper notes? I'm not actually going to do this for you, by the way.

Just out of interest, how did you score the fight? Break it down for me seeing as my 'analysis' (I'm being ironic here- it wasn't really intended to be that I'm not a boxing journalist am I?) was so awful. If you've posted it already just quote yourself in your reply as I'm not going through 8 pages to find it.

Am I right in thinking you thought Dirrell won?

Still, your post is pretty funny Carl Froch has got a hot girlfriend you're right.

[Cyclops]

Oh when saying I thought robberies only happened in mainland Europe I forgot John McDermott v Tyson Fury, a robbery that happened in Britain just recently that Americans probably won't give a toss about, but most of us did over here.

[crusader]

What has me stuffed on here is all the theries on how Froch come forward and Dirrell went backwards during the fight so thats how you score it.

That is totally irrelivant, Boxing is about landing punches and not getting hit. Its as simple as that. Whether Froch come forward or not he still needed to land more punches, Or harder punches. He did neither.

Im totally Unbiased i was hoping Froch would win, He got outclassed, He was made to look amaturish at times with his akward lunges. Id say Froch is on the same level as Sakio Bika . Good Tough solid Pro fighter but deffinently not Worldclass.
Froch will get soundly beaten by Kessler and Abraham in this tournament.

And how the hell froch had the nerve to call out Joe Calzaghe is beyond me. Joe would have given him a similar beating to the one he gave Lacy IMO.

but the beauty of the froch v kessler or abraham fight is tht those 2 guys will stand and fight..so it becomes a question of power v chin. and thats a department froch is very strong in, so lets wait and see. if froch beats kessler..then we will all be in awe !!

personally, i can see dirrell boxing rings round abraham and beating him. so the 3 points froch took off dirrell may well end up being very very valuable.

Imo Abraham hits just as hard if not harder than Froch and he has never been hurt, even when he had his jaw broken. Froch has been hurt his last two times by guys who arn't "big" punchers and I can't see him winning a slugfest with AA, who also has very underrated defense.

[rhino222]

so the 3 points froch took off dirrell may well end up being very very valuable.

i don't even follow the format to this thing but I thought it was universal knowledge that Froch took 2 (TWO) POINTS off Dirrell......DEUX PWA!! ZWEI PUNKTE!!

Can I ask you something....is this how you scored the Hunter Pickering fight.....3 points for each knockdown, bloody hell man.

i could not judge the pickering hunter fight, i was not actually there, remember, the law of NEBF states that any man is unable to comment on a boxing match/decision/score if they were not actually in the northeastern venue surrounded by UB40 documentation, welcome to hartlepool leaflets, dog ends, flat caps, whippets, mackem movers, geordie dancers, boddy robson t-shirts and any other associated 'north of the wash' shite that you lot of warm brown beer swilling twats get up to up there !! ....

but in reality, yes, you were right, froch did earn 2 points and not 3.