BoxRec

Posted: **02 May 2018, 19:38**

candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).

Its possible. Hearn can play UK fans like a fiddle. He said himself in interviews that its a 100 million dollar fight before all this took place.

Posted: **02 May 2018, 22:17**

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 19:38
candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).
Its possible. Hearn can play UK fans like a fiddle. He said himself in interviews that its a 100 million dollar fight before all this took place.

Did he? Hearn has tweeted 'at what point are people going to realise this isn't a 100m fight £ or $.'

Posted: **02 May 2018, 22:19**

candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).

Doubt it. Wilder looks beatable and nearly lost his last fight. He can't drag it on forever as he risks losing a 12m+ payday.

Posted: **02 May 2018, 22:21**

dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:19
candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).
Doubt it. Wilder looks beatable and nearly lost his last fight. He can't drag it on forever as he risks losing a 12m+ payday.

...bold statement...

Posted: **02 May 2018, 22:26**

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:21
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:19
candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).
Doubt it. Wilder looks beatable and nearly lost his last fight. He can't drag it on forever as he risks losing a 12m+ payday.
...bold statement...

But correct. We all know Wilder doesn't sell. He doesn't make much money. He can't really hold Joshua to ransom because Joshua can go off and make 20m fighting David Haye or probably make 30m fighting Tyson Fury.

Wilder can play ball and take what he's given, or he can go back to fighting people like Molina for a handful of change.

Posted: **02 May 2018, 22:27**

dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:26
oogiebe wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:21
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:19

Doubt it. Wilder looks beatable and nearly lost his last fight. He can't drag it on forever as he risks losing a 12m+ payday.
...bold statement...
But correct. We all know Wilder doesn't sell. He doesn't make much money. He can't really hold Joshua to ransom because Joshua can go off and make 20m fighting David Haye or probably make 30m fighting Tyson Fury.

Wilder can play ball and take what he's given, or he can go back to fighting people like Molina for a handful of change.

Ok!

Posted: **02 May 2018, 23:31**

dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:17
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 19:38
candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).
Its possible. Hearn can play UK fans like a fiddle. He said himself in interviews that its a 100 million dollar fight before all this took place.
Did he? Hearn has tweeted 'at what point are people going to realise this isn't a 100m fight £ or $.'

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one

Posted: **02 May 2018, 23:34**

dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:19
candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).
Doubt it. Wilder looks beatable and nearly lost his last fight. He can't drag it on forever as he risks losing a 12m+ payday.

And who exactly is going to beat wilder out of the current crop? Let me guess, whyte? Lol

Posted: **02 May 2018, 23:43**

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:34
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:19
candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).
Doubt it. Wilder looks beatable and nearly lost his last fight. He can't drag it on forever as he risks losing a 12m+ payday.
And who exactly is going to beat wilder out of the current crop? Let me guess, whyte? Lol

He was seconds away from losing against Ortiz in his last fight. It really wouldn't be a massive shock if someone like Pulev or Parker beat him. Don't get me wrong - it would be an upset. But not a massive upset. Fury could end up beating him as well and then the Fury Joshua fight becomes even bigger.

But the point is if Wilder doesn't take the offer from Hearn he goes back to 1m paydays and Joshua goes back to earning twenty times that against the likes of Fury. Joshua has the options because he's the one selling out stadiums and earning mega money whilst Wilder doesn't.

Posted: **02 May 2018, 23:53**

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:31
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:17
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 19:38

Its possible. Hearn can play UK fans like a fiddle. He said himself in interviews that its a 100 million dollar fight before all this took place.
Did he? Hearn has tweeted 'at what point are people going to realise this isn't a 100m fight £ or $.'

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one

Hearn is allowed to revise his opinion like anyone is. If Wilder fights Breazeale next in a massive sold out stadium with a million PPV buys and earns himself 20m I'll change my opinion too. If he earns a million and barely anyone watches and the venue is a third empty I'll carry on thinking what I do now; that he's a poorly promoted, barely recognised in his home country nobody who to all intents and purposes might as well be self promoted.

Hearn also states he hoped the fight could do more than Lewis Tyson (76m), but it's entirely on the proviso of him promoting both. Of course he's not going to say Dibella and Finkel can promote it like he can; he palpably thinks they're doing a useless job with Wilder since he's an unbeaten American knock out artist who does a twentieth of the business Joshua does in a country six times bigger.

Posted: **02 May 2018, 23:54**

dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:53
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:31
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:17

Did he? Hearn has tweeted 'at what point are people going to realise this isn't a 100m fight £ or $.'

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one
Hearn is allowed to revise his opinion like anyone is. If Wilder fights Breazeale next in a massive sold out stadium with a million PPV buys and earns himself 20m I'll change my opinion too. If he earns a million and barely anyone watches and the venue is a third empty I'll carry on thinking what I do now; that he's a poorly promoted, barely recognised in his home country nobody who to all intents and purposes might as well be self promoted.

Hearn also states he hoped the fight could do more than Lewis Tyson (76m), but it's entirely on the proviso of him promoting both. Of course he's not going to say Dibella and Finkel can promote it like he can; he palpably thinks they're doing a useless job with Wilder since he's an unbeaten American knock out artist who does a twentieth of the business Joshua does in a country six times bigger.

Sorry but with this post I have to add you to my ignore list

Posted: **03 May 2018, 00:04**

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:54
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:53
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:31

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one
Hearn is allowed to revise his opinion like anyone is. If Wilder fights Breazeale next in a massive sold out stadium with a million PPV buys and earns himself 20m I'll change my opinion too. If he earns a million and barely anyone watches and the venue is a third empty I'll carry on thinking what I do now; that he's a poorly promoted, barely recognised in his home country nobody who to all intents and purposes might as well be self promoted.

Hearn also states he hoped the fight could do more than Lewis Tyson (76m), but it's entirely on the proviso of him promoting both. Of course he's not going to say Dibella and Finkel can promote it like he can; he palpably thinks they're doing a useless job with Wilder since he's an unbeaten American knock out artist who does a twentieth of the business Joshua does in a country six times bigger.
Sorry but with this post I have to add you to my ignore list

Your response to legitimate questions about this suggests you're just chucking your toys out of the pram after a few home truths about your beloved Deontay.

Thing is, we all know it'll happen on Joshua's terms. Wilder isn't dumb enough to think he's going to earn a proper payday on his own. He knows when he sees Joshua in a sold out 90k stadium doing over a million PPV buys that he cannot do that. He knows he's the B side.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 00:23**

Just to add, you also seem to have crucially missed a very obvious point. What a fight generates and what the fighters are paid are two very different things. Hearn comments that Lewis Tyson generated £73m. But both men were paid 17.5m USD - around £13m each.

So we have a total purse which comes to just over a third of the entire pot. In this fight, Wilder has offered Joshua a guaranteed £36.8m purse - £10m more than what Lewis and Tyson took home combined.

Even if Wilder didn't receive a penny, the fight would have to be enormously bigger than Lewis Tyson. It would have to be bigger than Mayweather Canelo. And we both know it won't be which is why the $50m offer looks so ridiculous.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 00:36**

This fight is not far from being made. Both sides are talking behind closed doors. The Haymon side has already provided proof of funds to Hearn. The deal may allow an interim fight for both fighters, or they may just wait until a show down sometime in fall.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 02:25**

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:54
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:53
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:31

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one
Hearn is allowed to revise his opinion like anyone is. If Wilder fights Breazeale next in a massive sold out stadium with a million PPV buys and earns himself 20m I'll change my opinion too. If he earns a million and barely anyone watches and the venue is a third empty I'll carry on thinking what I do now; that he's a poorly promoted, barely recognised in his home country nobody who to all intents and purposes might as well be self promoted.

Hearn also states he hoped the fight could do more than Lewis Tyson (76m), but it's entirely on the proviso of him promoting both. Of course he's not going to say Dibella and Finkel can promote it like he can; he palpably thinks they're doing a useless job with Wilder since he's an unbeaten American knock out artist who does a twentieth of the business Joshua does in a country six times bigger.
Sorry but with this post I have to add you to my ignore list

Oh my God .... Diiiiiirk !!!! .... however are you going to survive ?

dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:19
candyslim wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 14:51 That's a good point EO it even occurred to me that Eddie might have put Dibella up to it. You know what they say about bad publicity (no such thing as).
Doubt it. Wilder looks beatable and nearly lost his last fight. He can't drag it on forever as he risks losing a 12m+ payday.

Like I say, it crossed my mind but the fact I didn't post it speaks for itself doesn't it?

Posted: **03 May 2018, 08:31**

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:31
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:17
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 19:38

Its possible. Hearn can play UK fans like a fiddle. He said himself in interviews that its a 100 million dollar fight before all this took place.
Did he? Hearn has tweeted 'at what point are people going to realise this isn't a 100m fight £ or $.'

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one

Context: It COULD be a £100m fight IF Wilder signed with Matchroom, and allowed Hearn to properly build the fight.

Nothing new there. We all know it could be in the future. £100m generated would leave £50-60m max for fighter purses, by the way. The point is, it's not right now. It would be lucky to generate £50m, if the fight happened this year - that leaves £30m max to pay the fighters (being generous). In US money, that's $40.8m, which is $9.2 less than Joshua's guarantee, even before taking into account Wilder's earnings, and undercard purses.

Eddie has at no point said the fight would generate above £50m, if it were to happen next.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 08:50**

Deleted_Scenes wrote: ↑03 May 2018, 08:31
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:31
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:17

Did he? Hearn has tweeted 'at what point are people going to realise this isn't a 100m fight £ or $.'

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one
Context: It COULD be a £100m fight IF Wilder signed with Matchroom, and allowed Hearn to properly build the fight.

Nothing new there. We all know it could be in the future. £100m generated would leave £50-60m max for fighter purses, by the way. The point is, it's not right now. It would be lucky to generate £50m, if the fight happened this year - that leaves £30m max to pay the fighters (being generous). In US money, that's $40.8m, which is $9.2 less than Joshua's guarantee, even before taking into account Wilder's earnings, and undercard purses.

Eddie has at no point said the fight would generate above £50m, if it were to happen next.

Lets forget about how much it makes for a second.

If Joshua is guaranteed 50 million, as he asked for and lets say the money is sitting in an account and verified, would you still say he shouldn't take the fight?

Posted: **03 May 2018, 09:11**

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑03 May 2018, 08:50
Deleted_Scenes wrote: ↑03 May 2018, 08:31
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:31

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one
Context: It COULD be a £100m fight IF Wilder signed with Matchroom, and allowed Hearn to properly build the fight.

Nothing new there. We all know it could be in the future. £100m generated would leave £50-60m max for fighter purses, by the way. The point is, it's not right now. It would be lucky to generate £50m, if the fight happened this year - that leaves £30m max to pay the fighters (being generous). In US money, that's $40.8m, which is $9.2 less than Joshua's guarantee, even before taking into account Wilder's earnings, and undercard purses.

Eddie has at no point said the fight would generate above £50m, if it were to happen next.

Lets forget about how much it makes for a second.

If Joshua is guaranteed 50 million, as he asked for and lets say the money is sitting in an account and verified, would you still say he shouldn't take the fight?

What about the other contract stipulations?

50m is ludicrous money which of course Joshua would take. On the proviso that it's a serious offer. In business you agree terms and sign a contract. You don't sign a contract without knowing the terms. It's all simple stuff.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 09:31**

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑03 May 2018, 08:50
Deleted_Scenes wrote: ↑03 May 2018, 08:31
TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 23:31

Yes he did.

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gen ... 78021.html

I wonder what mental gymnastics you'll use to get around this one
Context: It COULD be a £100m fight IF Wilder signed with Matchroom, and allowed Hearn to properly build the fight.

Nothing new there. We all know it could be in the future. £100m generated would leave £50-60m max for fighter purses, by the way. The point is, it's not right now. It would be lucky to generate £50m, if the fight happened this year - that leaves £30m max to pay the fighters (being generous). In US money, that's $40.8m, which is $9.2 less than Joshua's guarantee, even before taking into account Wilder's earnings, and undercard purses.

Eddie has at no point said the fight would generate above £50m, if it were to happen next.

Lets forget about how much it makes for a second.

If Joshua is guaranteed 50 million, as he asked for and lets say the money is sitting in an account and verified, would you still say he shouldn't take the fight?

If the $50mil is real, and satisfies Hearn's request of being placed in escrow (basic business for amounts this large), then yes Joshua absolutely should take the fight.

Obviously, all other details need to be reasonable. Not saying for a second that Hearn should get things all his own way, as DiBella as lead promoter in such a deal should rightfully have the most control, but things like reasonable time for a full training camp, reasonable location (i.e UK or USA, not some random country of a rich investor's choice), and not in violation of any existing contractual obligations (for either fighter).

Those would all be fair requests in anyone's mind. Under those circumstances, then Joshua absolutely should accept the fight.

Problem is, Finkel/Haymon/DiBella haven't done any of that. They flat out refused to even discuss any of it.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 09:57**

The offer is real. They need a few weeks to work out the details. Eddie is flying back to the states after Bellew-Haye for meetings. They have been talking all along.

How can you take Eddie seriously when he says he doesn't know how to contact Wilders management team but has put together fights with Haymon in the past. Errol Spence Jr vs Kell Brook anyone?

Posted: **03 May 2018, 10:06**

marvelous marv wrote: ↑03 May 2018, 09:57 The offer is real. They need a few weeks to work out the details. Eddie is flying back to the states after Bellew-Haye for meetings. They have been talking all along.

How can you take Eddie seriously when he says he doesn't know how to contact Wilders management team but has put together fights with Haymon in the past. Errol Spence Jr vs Kell Brook anyone?

are you working for haymon?

Posted: **03 May 2018, 10:15**

Deleted_Scenes wrote: ↑03 May 2018, 09:31
If the $50mil is real, and satisfies Hearn's request of being placed in escrow (basic business for amounts this large), then yes Joshua absolutely should take the fight.

Agreed.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 10:17**

I don't work in the boxing industry. I am just reiterating what Eddie has said in interviews lately.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 11:02**

dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:26
oogiebe wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:21
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:19

Doubt it. Wilder looks beatable and nearly lost his last fight. He can't drag it on forever as he risks losing a 12m+ payday.
...bold statement...
But correct. We all know Wilder doesn't sell. He doesn't make much money. He can't really hold Joshua to ransom because Joshua can go off and make 20m fighting David Haye or probably make 30m fighting Tyson Fury.

Wilder can play ball and take what he's given, or he can go back to fighting people like Molina for a handful of change.

You know, I am a fan of Wilder (full disclosure). He reminds me of a big Hearns without Hearns' boxing skills and a better jaw. I believe he's underrated. Why? Because his offset to a lack of "pure boxing skills" is his athleticism and awkwardness. Folks look at the pure boxing skill set and think he's a one trick pony, but he's more than that. He showed a lot in his fight with Ortiz, despite the shellacking Wilder took from these forums. I'm a fan, but that doesn't mean I'm biased. AJ is a better technician, but Wilder ALWAYS has the punchers chance whereby he can turn around a fight with one punch. Regarding his ability to make money, it has nothing to do with his effectiveness, more because of poor promoting and management. Sorry for the long post (Long for me). The beauty of AJ; Pedvetkin; and Wilder is they are all vulnerable, which makes for exciting fights. PS: This is also why I don't look at today's HW's as being better than any era as of yet. Time will tell.

Posted: **03 May 2018, 11:51**

oogiebe wrote: ↑03 May 2018, 11:02
dirk2686 wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:26
oogiebe wrote: ↑02 May 2018, 22:21

...bold statement...
But correct. We all know Wilder doesn't sell. He doesn't make much money. He can't really hold Joshua to ransom because Joshua can go off and make 20m fighting David Haye or probably make 30m fighting Tyson Fury.

Wilder can play ball and take what he's given, or he can go back to fighting people like Molina for a handful of change.
You know, I am a fan of Wilder (full disclosure). He reminds me of a big Hearns without Hearns' boxing skills and a better jaw. I believe he's underrated. Why? Because his offset to a lack of "pure boxing skills" is his athleticism and awkwardness. Folks look at the pure boxing skill set and think he's a one trick pony, but he's more than that. He showed a lot in his fight with Ortiz, despite the shellacking Wilder took from these forums. I'm a fan, but that doesn't mean I'm biased. AJ is a better technician, but Wilder ALWAYS has the punchers chance whereby he can turn around a fight with one punch. Regarding his ability to make money, it has nothing to do with his effectiveness, more because of poor promoting and management. Sorry for the long post (Long for me). The beauty of AJ; Pedvetkin; and Wilder is they are all vulnerable, which makes for exciting fights. PS: This is also why I don't look at today's HW's as being better than any era as of yet. Time will tell.

I am not really a fan of Wilder or Joshua, I think they are both flawed. I think Joshua is very robotic and has looked pretty poor in recent fights. Nowhere near the explosive dangeous puncher he's touted. His last three fights have been pretty boring. His robotic style is tough to watch. Wilder is flawed but with his power combined with Joshua's roboticness, I think Wilder starches him. I can see Joshua winning but I most of all really see him being put on queer street by a right hand and finished. I don't even know if AJ is a better technician than Wilder. He's just been plodding in recent fights throwing one punch at a time. He definitely seems gunshy after the Wlad fight. In the UK people think he is the second coming.

I think Lennox Lewis would do both of them on the same night.

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