BoxRec

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote: In terms of Eastern Europe, the list of fighters that came before GGG is huge: Kostya Tzyu, Vitali and Wladimir Klitschko, Andrew Golota, Nikolay Valuev, Louis Kaplan, Benny Bass, Vic Darchinyan, Orzubek Nazarov, Artur Grigorian, Sultan Ibragimov, Vasily Jirov etc.

You're welcome.

There's hasn't been a Russian-ish boxer to ever reach the level that GGG is at right now so no one gets credit for paving the way for this kid. GGG is in unchartered territory right now. He's far more popular that the Kilts ever were. Those 2 cavemen have more praise then they ever deserved.

Cobblers. The klitchskos are huge stars all over eastern europe, russia and germany. Just because they didn't ever catch on in the US, doesn't make them small fry.

caldo2025 wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:
There's hasn't been a Russian-ish boxer to ever reach the level that GGG is at right now so no one gets credit for paving the way for this kid. GGG is in unchartered territory right now. He's far more popular that the Kilts ever were. Those 2 cavemen have more praise then they ever deserved.

Cobblers. The klitchskos are huge stars all over eastern europe, russia and germany. Just because they didn't ever catch on in the US, doesn't make them small fry.

I'm talking worldwide popularity. GGG is at a level unreached by any Eastern European EVER. No one even comes close to what the kid is doing. I don't know why it's so hard for people to admit right now. Comparing what GGG is doing to anything the Klits have done in the sport is futile. It's not even remotely close.

Thomastearns wrote:All fans like to identify with their heroes. Some need to identify with their favourites or its simply no dice, no matter how good they are.

This identification is usually based on race and record. Cultural background too plays a big part. I can't of any British boxers who were massive in the traditional heart of the pugilistic art, America. The Cold War made it even worse for Baltic states boxers. Hence why its taken GGG so long to get this far.

To make epic money Golovkin needs to do a lot more for his image in America whilst chasing titles and defending his belts. None of this would have been necessary if he had been a homegrown US boxer...

Enlightened-One wrote:

Thomastearns wrote:All fans like to identify with their heroes. Some need to identify with their favourites or its simply no dice, no matter how good they are.

This identification is usually based on race and record. Cultural background too plays a big part. I can't of any British boxers who were massive in the traditional heart of the pugilistic art, America. The Cold War made it even worse for Baltic states boxers. Hence why its taken GGG so long to get this far.

To make epic money Golovkin needs to do a lot more for his image in America whilst chasing titles and defending his belts. None of this would have been necessary if he had been a homegrown US boxer...

To be fair, it's hard to build a mainstream brand within English-speaking territories on the back of an individual that barely speaks English, barring a few excessively-used catchphrases.

To be honest, it shows a terrible lack of respect for his US fan base to be so poor at speaking English, considering how long he's been based in America.

Enlightened-One wrote:

Thomastearns wrote:All fans like to identify with their heroes. Some need to identify with their favourites or its simply no dice, no matter how good they are.

This identification is usually based on race and record. Cultural background too plays a big part. I can't of any British boxers who were massive in the traditional heart of the pugilistic art, America. The Cold War made it even worse for Baltic states boxers. Hence why its taken GGG so long to get this far.

To make epic money Golovkin needs to do a lot more for his image in America whilst chasing titles and defending his belts. None of this would have been necessary if he had been a homegrown US boxer...

To be fair, it's hard to build a mainstream brand within English-speaking territories on the back of an individual that barely speaks English, barring a few excessively-used catchphrases.

To be honest, it shows a terrible lack of respect for his US fan base to be so poor at speaking English, considering how long he's been based in America.

Horse wrote:Golovkin shows his contempt for America by not speaking English fluently.

Chuck him in the ocean.

Tanzio wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote:

Thomastearns wrote:All fans like to identify with their heroes. Some need to identify with their favourites or its simply no dice, no matter how good they are.

This identification is usually based on race and record. Cultural background too plays a big part. I can't of any British boxers who were massive in the traditional heart of the pugilistic art, America. The Cold War made it even worse for Baltic states boxers. Hence why its taken GGG so long to get this far.

To make epic money Golovkin needs to do a lot more for his image in America whilst chasing titles and defending his belts. None of this would have been necessary if he had been a homegrown US boxer...

To be fair, it's hard to build a mainstream brand within English-speaking territories on the back of an individual that barely speaks English, barring a few excessively-used catchphrases.

To be honest, it shows a terrible lack of respect for his US fan base to be so poor at speaking English, considering how long he's been based in America.

"A terrible lack of respect?" What a load of crap. 3G has made an effort to learn English and he has improved significantly. Some people do not have the capacity to learn another language fluently in adulthood. In fact most adults are challenged by picking up new languages. There are only so many hours in the day.

Did you have to learn English as a second or third language in adulthood? There is a reason why intelligence organizations weight their recruiting efforts heavily towards linguistic skill and capacity.

I think that 3G's challenged English has been a source of endearment with many fans.

ValMar wrote:It is rather difficult to express yourself properly in your third or fourth language. Would you, English speaking guys, try to speak Russian,Italian or Slovenian ?

Enlightened-One wrote:

ValMar wrote:It is rather difficult to express yourself properly in your third or fourth language. Would you, English speaking guys, try to speak Russian,Italian or Slovenian ?

After almost five years, when it’s in my financial interest to do so, I’d be incredibly motivated to become fluent in a secondary language, especially considering the fact that it also happens to be the native dialect of the fan base that funds the vast majority of your income.

I don’t dislike Golovkin, but I feel that he should be better at speaking English, which isn’t such an unreasonably harsh criticism.

MachoTime wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote:

ValMar wrote:It is rather difficult to express yourself properly in your third or fourth language. Would you, English speaking guys, try to speak Russian,Italian or Slovenian ?

After almost five years, when it’s in my financial interest to do so, I’d be incredibly motivated to become fluent in a secondary language, especially considering the fact that it also happens to be the native dialect of the fan base that funds the vast majority of your income.

I don’t dislike Golovkin, but I feel that he should be better at speaking English, which isn’t such an unreasonably harsh criticism.

You don't sound to Enlightened that GGG hasn't learned the English Language to your specifications..

MachoTime wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote:

ValMar wrote:It is rather difficult to express yourself properly in your third or fourth language. Would you, English speaking guys, try to speak Russian,Italian or Slovenian ?

After almost five years, when it’s in my financial interest to do so, I’d be incredibly motivated to become fluent in a secondary language, especially considering the fact that it also happens to be the native dialect of the fan base that funds the vast majority of your income.

I don’t dislike Golovkin, but I feel that he should be better at speaking English, which isn’t such an unreasonably harsh criticism.

You don't sound to Enlightened that GGG hasn't learned the English Language to your specifications..

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

MachoTime wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote: After almost five years, when it’s in my financial interest to do so, I’d be incredibly motivated to become fluent in a secondary language, especially considering the fact that it also happens to be the native dialect of the fan base that funds the vast majority of your income.

I don’t dislike Golovkin, but I feel that he should be better at speaking English, which isn’t such an unreasonably harsh criticism.

You don't sound to Enlightened that GGG hasn't learned the English Language to your specifications..

He's an ass clown. Ggg speaks plenty of English, we couldn't care less. He's one of less than a handful of draws here in a dead sport.

Tanzio wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote: You used the term "paving the way" during your original claim, learn what it means, because it doesn't mean the "biggest" commercially or most "successful" sporting-wise.

In terms of basic English, your original claim was wrong.

Even if GGG is the biggest Eastern European boxing star right now, your original claim is still wrong.

Personally-speaking, I think you've accidentally misused a phrase in your original argument that you didn't quite understand, which we've all done at some point.

GGG is in a position that no other Eastern European has been in before. Period. If no one has been there before and he's the first one to do it, inspiring kids growing up now that didn't think it possible, then he's paving the way. Why am i explaining this to you? I have no idea. There are little GGG''s all over the map right now and his popularity on a world stage is immense. If you don't understand that then you should probably not read anything i write because i'm not into explaining phrases to someone that appears to be a grown person.

You are also obviously "not into" verifying your own claims, understanding what you are saying, or learning how to communicate more accurately. You are clearly the "don't confuse me with facts, I think therefore I know" brand of vacuum, caldOHm.

The Siamese Klit are the builders of the infrastucture that post Soviet Bloc boxers utilize today. There were boxers that preceded them but they are the prime contractors of the edifice.

IT wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:
There's hasn't been a Russian-ish boxer to ever reach the level that GGG is at right now so no one gets credit for paving the way for this kid. GGG is in unchartered territory right now. He's far more popular that the Kilts ever were. Those 2 cavemen have more praise then they ever deserved.

Cobblers. The klitchskos are huge stars all over eastern europe, russia and germany. Just because they didn't ever catch on in the US, doesn't make them small fry.

Yeah undoubtedly Golovkin is a bigger star in the US (although the fact he's predominantly fought in the US has factored into that aswell) but globally, the Klitschko's are/were bigger stars.

Is Golovkin that huge of a star anyway? Did his PPV numbers hugely surpass Kovalev's for instance?

caldo2025 wrote:

Tanzio wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:
GGG is in a position that no other Eastern European has been in before. Period. If no one has been there before and he's the first one to do it, inspiring kids growing up now that didn't think it possible, then he's paving the way. Why am i explaining this to you? I have no idea. There are little GGG''s all over the map right now and his popularity on a world stage is immense. If you don't understand that then you should probably not read anything i write because i'm not into explaining phrases to someone that appears to be a grown person.

You are also obviously "not into" verifying your own claims, understanding what you are saying, or learning how to communicate more accurately. You are clearly the "don't confuse me with facts, I think therefore I know" brand of vacuum, caldOHm.

The Siamese Klit are the builders of the infrastucture that post Soviet Bloc boxers utilize today. There were boxers that preceded them but they are the prime contractors of the edifice.

All that and still you can't miss a word that i put down on this site. Admit it, you are entertained by my musings. It's ok....say it after me...IT'S OK...IT'S OK (Good Will Hunting movie scene). For instance, I clicked on a BNovel post the other day by accident and after reading the guys whole post, I still hated it. Not a great example but you know what i mean.

Enlightened-One wrote:Gennady Golovkin was universally recognised as a world-rated top-ten 160lb fighter in 2008, with his career-best victories coming against the likes of David Lemieux, Daniel Geale & Danny Jacobs. Those are GGG’s career-best victories during a professional career spanning almost eleven years, but the people that frequent this forum are passionately arguing that he should already be considered an “all-time-great”.

Over a timespan of ONE YEAR AND NINE MONTHS, a legitimate “all-time-great”, Sugar Ray Leonard engaged in fights against the likes of the following fighters:

• Captured the WBC World welterweight title against the unbeaten Hall-of-Famer, Wilfred Benitez, who himself had competed in seven world title fights over two weight divisions, losing only two of them (to Thomas Hearns and Ray Leonard), and holds victories over the likes of Carlos Palomino, Maurice Hope and Roberto Duran.

• Successfully defended his WBC World welterweight title against the WBC's 10th rated 147lb-er in the form of Dave 'Boy' Green.

• Lost the WBC World welterweight title against the Hall-of-Famer, Roberto Duran, who himself had only tasted defeat once over a twelve year and three month career.

• Regained the WBC World welterweight title against the Hall-of-Famer, Roberto Duran, becoming only the second man to inflict a defeat on an all-time-great that had been competing as a pro for more than twelve years and nine months.

• Successfully defended his WBC World welterweight title against the WBC's 6th rated 147lb-er in the form of Larry Bonds.

• Captured the WBA World super welterweight title against the undefeated Ayub Kalule, who himself had competed in six world title fights, losing only one of them and holds a victory of the great Sumbu Kalambay. His four losses came against naturally bigger and genuinely greater fighters, such as Ray Leonard, Mike McCallum, Herol Graham and Davey Moore.

• Unified the WBC and WBA World welterweight title when he became the first man to inflict a defeat on the Hall-of-Famer, Thomas Hearns' resume.

I think that people need to appreciate what an “all-time-great” actually is before making over-the-top claims.

Crease wrote:

world ranked wrote:How is Golovkin is an ATG having never fought one

Well that's just untrue. Golvokin has proven himself to be the one of the best P4P fighters in the world and because of his fearsome reputation as a heavy puncher, there are many opponents who won't face him (Chris Eubank Jr, Billy Joe Saunders, Saul Alvarez).

It's not actually GGG's fault that people won't step up to face him. All Golovkin can do is just keep on doing what he's doing, staying active and busy, keep on defending his many belts and try to get another one (the WBO if Saunders would man up)

world ranked wrote:Just because you get ducked doesn't make you an ATG