BoxRec

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:09**

He could certainly take punishment and used his face as a form of defence but he wouldn't get into a top 50 for me. But as you say its all opinions. Oh and he wouldn't beat Lewis!

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:18**

silkov wrote:
Arsenal wrote:Silkov do you really have Coetzer in a top 20 hw of all time?
Yeah, why not?.... people rate Lewis in the top 15, I'm pretty sure that Coetzee could have beaten Lewis... lists are always subjective but Coetzee could certainly have held his own with most of the top heavyweights in the top 20 and I don't see why placing him in the top 20 is so outrageous... the man was a very good fighter in a very decent division...

It is outrageous. How can you rationalize having Coetzee in the top 20? Here are a ton of heavyweights that all are better than Coetzee:

Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Evander Holyfield
Larry Holmes
Rocky Marciano
Sonny Liston
Jack Johnson
Jack Dempsey
Ezzard Charles
James J. Jeffries
Jersey Joe Walcott
Mike Tyson
Gene Tunney
Harry Wills
Sam Langford
John L. Sullivan
Max Schmeling
Max Baer
Floyd Patterson
Ken Norton
Riddick Bowe
Lennox Lewis
Jimmy Bivins
Jerry Quarry
Jack Sharkey
Archie Moore
Earnie Shavers
Ernie Terrell
Jimmy Young
Ron Lyle
Tim Witherspoon
Mike Weaver
James Braddock
Chris Byrd

Theres more than that, but I tried to stay away from prime current fighters.

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:34**

Arsenal wrote:He could certainly take punishment and used his face as a form of defence but he wouldn't get into a top 50 for me. But as you say its all opinions. Oh and he wouldn't beat Lewis!

I suppose you rate Rahman and Mccall in the top ten or top 20?... if both Mccall and Rahman could ko Lewis then Coetzee would as well and he had far better skills than both of them.... calling him a punchbag just shows that you haven't seen many of his fights...

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:36**

evndrbsn wrote:
silkov wrote:
Arsenal wrote:Silkov do you really have Coetzer in a top 20 hw of all time?
Yeah, why not?.... people rate Lewis in the top 15, I'm pretty sure that Coetzee could have beaten Lewis... lists are always subjective but Coetzee could certainly have held his own with most of the top heavyweights in the top 20 and I don't see why placing him in the top 20 is so outrageous... the man was a very good fighter in a very decent division...
It is outrageous. How can you rationalize having Coetzee in the top 20? Here are a ton of heavyweights that all are better than Coetzee:

Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Evander Holyfield
Larry Holmes
Rocky Marciano
Sonny Liston
Jack Johnson
Jack Dempsey
Ezzard Charles
James J. Jeffries
Jersey Joe Walcott
Mike Tyson
Gene Tunney
Harry Wills
Sam Langford
John L. Sullivan
Max Schmeling
Max Baer
Floyd Patterson
Ken Norton
Riddick Bowe
Lennox Lewis
Jimmy Bivins
Jerry Quarry
Jack Sharkey
Archie Moore
Earnie Shavers
Ernie Terrell
Jimmy Young
Ron Lyle
Tim Witherspoon
Mike Weaver
James Braddock
Chris Byrd
Theres more than that, but I tried to stay away from prime current fighters.

Sorry to outrage you, perhaps you should go find yourself a gentler forum....

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:39**

Caulk Rocket wrote:
Arsenal wrote:

THis is something I've said before the raw Lewis before Manny took over was more explosive and took more chances. The Lewis that KOed Ruddock would have KOed Tyson inside 4.

RazorKo we may have our differences but you rate Coetzer in the top 20 HW of all, don't rate Marciano, defend Tyson's rape conviction with opinion best suited to an actual rapist and say Lewis clinched over 1000 times in an 8 rd fight. How can you even take yourself seriuosly cos no-one else can!
If Tyson was guilty, OJ WAS INNOCENT.

I don't think under any cicumstances Lewis could have put Tyson to sleep. Before or after Steward. The further into his prime Lewis got, the further away from reality Tyson got.

You have repeatedly said that Tyson has never been "KTFO," but he clearly was against Douglas at age 23 and against Lewis at age 35. I won't count when he was "KO'd" by Danny Williams at the age of 38 by a blocked punch.

Lewis was driven to the canvas by a huge right hand by Oliver McCall when Lewis was 29, but he was up at about seven and not drooling with his mouthpiece half hanging out of his mouth. Against Rahman, a 35 year old Lewis was KO'd by Rahman, but still he refrained from letting drool pour down his chin and onto the canvas.

Can Tyson make that claim? No.

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:46**

Silkov you know you can't compare one boxers fights with another boxers. For example Forman beat Frazier, Frazier beat Ali and Ali beat Foreman. Always like your opinions Silkov but how on earth can you have Coetzer in an top 50 or 75. If he was that good he would have fought for the World title in its many forms at least once. I know that doesn't always happen but I think he should have at least once. Having said that was it anything to do with Aparteid? But saying I know nothing because I think he is a punchbag is wrong. I have seen quite a few of his fights and he took alot of shots.

Caulk don't be like Razor and defend Tyson's rape convition with some supposed facts.

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:47**

silkov wrote:
evndrbsn wrote:
silkov wrote: Yeah, why not?.... people rate Lewis in the top 15, I'm pretty sure that Coetzee could have beaten Lewis... lists are always subjective but Coetzee could certainly have held his own with most of the top heavyweights in the top 20 and I don't see why placing him in the top 20 is so outrageous... the man was a very good fighter in a very decent division...
It is outrageous. How can you rationalize having Coetzee in the top 20? Here are a ton of heavyweights that all are better than Coetzee:

Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Evander Holyfield
Larry Holmes
Rocky Marciano
Sonny Liston
Jack Johnson
Jack Dempsey
Ezzard Charles
James J. Jeffries
Jersey Joe Walcott
Mike Tyson
Gene Tunney
Harry Wills
Sam Langford
John L. Sullivan
Max Schmeling
Max Baer
Floyd Patterson
Ken Norton
Riddick Bowe
Lennox Lewis
Jimmy Bivins
Jerry Quarry
Jack Sharkey
Archie Moore
Earnie Shavers
Ernie Terrell
Jimmy Young
Ron Lyle
Tim Witherspoon
Mike Weaver
James Braddock
Chris Byrd
Theres more than that, but I tried to stay away from prime current fighters.
Sorry to outrage you, perhaps you should go find yourself a gentler forum....

Maybe you should stop idolizing average 80s heavyweights like Gerrie. Sorry that I produced a list of nearly 40 heavies that are better than him.

Should we petition for a sticky for you so you and RazorKO can dip into your obsessive drivel over Coetzee and the 80s gang without fear of retalitory comments from myself and others like me?

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:49**

Arsenal wrote:I can see why people say Tyson would have beat Leiws. I don't think so but I can see why. But Coetzer? Please! Will someone please check to see if Razor has a brain. I know we all have opinions but I think everyone except Razor can agree that Coetzer is no top 20 HW of all time, not even top 50 and that he wouldn't beat Tyson, Lewis or Holyfield. Also that Marciano is top 10/15 HW all time material. Coatzer wouldn't stand a chance.

Razor don't use info and then when you are mocked for it say you got it from another website. If you know the man exagerates why quote him?
As for the rape case I still can't believe you believe Tyson's innocence on your supposed "facts" of she willingly went to his room, she kissed him, she had no bruises etc. Thats what a rapist would defend himself with. With attitudes like that no wonder rapists get off with it. By the way how can you compare paedophiles to football hooligans? You seem to think that all English people like football and all football fans are hooligans.

One more point. You seem to think that partizan crowds are an unacceptable excuse for any sports people to use to explain defaeat. Thats crap! Are you just on a wind up or are you really that stupid?

Well its my opinion and I stick by it, Coetzee is a top 20 heavyweight and would definetly beat the likes of Lewis, Walcott, Schemling, Johannson, Bowe and maybe the form of Coetzee in the Dokes fight would give Holyfield a good fight also. Coetzee though definetly gets beat by the likes of Foreman, Ali, Holmes, Tyson, Frazier, Joe Louis, Liston - All the great fighters.

By the way how can you compare paedophiles to football hooligans? You seem to think that all English people like football and all football fans are hooligans.

In my opinion I view football hooligans as the lowest of the low. They are a disgrace and therefore sub human and I wish the police will stand up to these types of people and beat them sensless, even it means killing these hooligans so be it. We should not tolerate these people who think they have the right to terrorize other people and whoever assists these hooligans are also sub human.

As for your 2nd point, nope I dont think all English are hooligans , just like not all South Africans are racists or all Italians are facists.

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:53**

silkov wrote:
Arsenal wrote:He could certainly take punishment and used his face as a form of defence but he wouldn't get into a top 50 for me. But as you say its all opinions. Oh and he wouldn't beat Lewis!
I suppose you rate Rahman and Mccall in the top ten or top 20?... if both Mccall and Rahman could ko Lewis then Coetzee would as well and he had far better skills than both of them.... calling him a punchbag just shows that you haven't seen many of his fights...

I completly agree. McCall and Rahman both knocked Lewis whilst he was in his prime by a single punch. Coetzee however had boxing skills as well so if Gerrie couldnt find the target, he could simply match Lewis jab for jab as if Mercer or Bruno could trouble Lewis with their jabs, than Coetzee has a chance as well.

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 15:56**

Just like Bruno stoped Coetzer?

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 16:06**

Arsenal wrote:Just like Bruno stoped Coetzer?

Seeing as Coetzee was some 20 pounds overweight and was already fighting top class competition when Bruno was starting his pro career and also from all the wars Gerrie has been in, they took their toll and it showed in this fight.

But I congratulate Bruno because despite Coetzee not at his best, he still knocked him out flat as no had ever done that to him before. Plus I admire Bruno's heart in the Witherspoon and Tyson fights and showed he has class to match his skill. The same however can not be said about Leiws.

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 16:09**

RazorKO wrote:
Arsenal wrote:Just like Bruno stoped Coetzer?
Seeing as Coetzee was some 20 pounds overweight and was already fighting top class competition when Bruno was starting his pro career and also from all the wars Gerrie has been in, they took their toll and it showed in this fight.

But I congratulate Bruno because despite Coetzee not at his best, he still knocked him out flat as no had ever done that to him before. Plus I admire Bruno's heart in the Witherspoon and Tyson fights and showed he has class to match his skill. The same however can not be said about Leiws.

What about Lewis in the Mercer fight? He showed he had a tremendous heart in that fight. Or do you mean that Lewis was not a classy guy?

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 16:09**

evndrbsn wrote:
silkov wrote:
evndrbsn wrote: It is outrageous. How can you rationalize having Coetzee in the top 20? Here are a ton of heavyweights that all are better than Coetzee:

Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Evander Holyfield
Larry Holmes
Rocky Marciano
Sonny Liston
Jack Johnson
Jack Dempsey
Ezzard Charles
James J. Jeffries
Jersey Joe Walcott
Mike Tyson
Gene Tunney
Harry Wills
Sam Langford
John L. Sullivan
Max Schmeling
Max Baer
Floyd Patterson
Ken Norton
Riddick Bowe
Lennox Lewis
Jimmy Bivins
Jerry Quarry
Jack Sharkey
Archie Moore
Earnie Shavers
Ernie Terrell
Jimmy Young
Ron Lyle
Tim Witherspoon
Mike Weaver
James Braddock
Chris Byrd
Theres more than that, but I tried to stay away from prime current fighters.
Sorry to outrage you, perhaps you should go find yourself a gentler forum....
Maybe you should stop idolizing average 80s heavyweights like Gerrie. Sorry that I produced a list of nearly 40 heavies that are better than him.

Should we petition for a sticky for you so you and RazorKO can dip into your obsessive drivel over Coetzee and the 80s gang without fear of retalitory comments from myself and others like me?

Maybe you need to learn to read, I never said that Coetzee would beat the likes of Ali, Frazier etc but he could definately live with the top 20 heavyweights... is this concept so hard for you to understand?...perhaps you should watch more of the fights from the 80s if you really think that the likes of Chris Byrd could beat Coetzee. As for me fearing your nasty 'retalitory comments' I don't really give a toss what you think, you could say that donald duck would beat Coetzee and you won't see me crying mate... sorry to dissapoint you but your views really don't carry that much weight with me....

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 16:11**

Arsenal wrote:Just like Bruno stoped Coetzer?

That was at the end of Gerries career after he had been controversially koed by Greg Page... and Bruno was not exactly a powder puff puncher....

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 16:18**

silkov wrote:
evndrbsn wrote:
silkov wrote: Sorry to outrage you, perhaps you should go find yourself a gentler forum....
Maybe you should stop idolizing average 80s heavyweights like Gerrie. Sorry that I produced a list of nearly 40 heavies that are better than him.

Should we petition for a sticky for you so you and RazorKO can dip into your obsessive drivel over Coetzee and the 80s gang without fear of retalitory comments from myself and others like me?
Maybe you need to learn to read, I never said that Coetzee would beat the likes of Ali, Frazier etc but he could definately live with the top 20 heavyweights... is this concept so hard for you to understand?...perhaps you should watch more of the fights from the 80s if you really think that the likes of Chris Byrd could beat Coetzee. As for me fearing your nasty 'retalitory comments' I don't really give a toss what you think, you could say that donald duck would beat Coetzee and you won't see me crying mate... sorry to dissapoint you but your views really don't carry that much weight with me....

You can live in your fantasy world where Coetzee is king if you want. I'll stay here in a little place I like to call reality.

Oh, here are the results of "Silkov's Fantasy Land Boxing." Sorry for the delay.

Coetzee KO 1 Byrd
Coetzee KO 1 Ali
Coetzee KO 1 Marciano

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 16:26**

Arsenal wrote:Silkov you know you can't compare one boxers fights with another boxers. For example Forman beat Frazier, Frazier beat Ali and Ali beat Foreman. Always like your opinions Silkov but how on earth can you have Coetzer in an top 50 or 75. If he was that good he would have fought for the World title in its many forms at least once. I know that doesn't always happen but I think he should have at least once. Having said that was it anything to do with Aparteid? But saying I know nothing because I think he is a punchbag is wrong. I have seen quite a few of his fights and he took alot of shots.

Caulk don't be like Razor and defend Tyson's rape convition with some supposed facts.

I think we are on crossed lines here, I'm talking about Gerrie Coetzee not Pierre Coetzeer... Coetzee did win a version of the world title by beating Mike Dokes...

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 16:29**

evndrbsn wrote:
silkov wrote:
evndrbsn wrote: Maybe you should stop idolizing average 80s heavyweights like Gerrie. Sorry that I produced a list of nearly 40 heavies that are better than him.

Should we petition for a sticky for you so you and RazorKO can dip into your obsessive drivel over Coetzee and the 80s gang without fear of retalitory comments from myself and others like me?
Maybe you need to learn to read, I never said that Coetzee would beat the likes of Ali, Frazier etc but he could definately live with the top 20 heavyweights... is this concept so hard for you to understand?...perhaps you should watch more of the fights from the 80s if you really think that the likes of Chris Byrd could beat Coetzee. As for me fearing your nasty 'retalitory comments' I don't really give a toss what you think, you could say that donald duck would beat Coetzee and you won't see me crying mate... sorry to dissapoint you but your views really don't carry that much weight with me....
You can live in your fantasy world where Coetzee is king if you want. I'll stay here in a little place I like to call reality.

Oh, here are the results of "Silkov's Fantasy Land Boxing." Sorry for the delay.

Coetzee KO 1 Byrd
Coetzee KO 1 Ali
Coetzee KO 1 Marciano

Its always rather amusing when someone takes a difference of opinion so personally... but rather sad also...

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 17:04**

Arsenal wrote:Silkov you know you can't compare one boxers fights with another boxers. For example Forman beat Frazier, Frazier beat Ali and Ali beat Foreman. Always like your opinions Silkov but how on earth can you have Coetzer in an top 50 or 75. If he was that good he would have fought for the World title in its many forms at least once. I know that doesn't always happen but I think he should have at least once. Having said that was it anything to do with Aparteid? But saying I know nothing because I think he is a punchbag is wrong. I have seen quite a few of his fights and he took alot of shots.

Caulk don't be like Razor and defend Tyson's rape convition with some supposed facts.

I've always disagreed with Razors view of Tysons rape conviction and have never made excuses for Tyson in any shape or form, in fact if you read my posts you'll see that I'm very far from being a Tyson apologist as Razor will himself most probably agree...

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 17:10**

Bloody Hell! Right lets sort this out!

Are we talking about:

Pierre Coetzer?

Gerrie Coetzee?

Bloody South Africans having such similar names!

I apologise if I made scathing remarks BUT I honestly thought people were talking about Pierre (Use first names its easier!). Was anyone? Razor? Or are we all talking about Gerrie?

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 17:14**

Arsenal wrote:Bloody Hell! Right lets sort this out!

Are we talking about:

Pierre Coetzer?

Gerrie Coetzee?

Bloody South Africans having such similar names!

I apologise if I made scathing remarks BUT I honestly thought people were talking about Pierre (Use first names its easier!). Was anyone? Razor? Or are we all talking about Gerrie?

We are talking about Gerrie Coetzee.

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 17:16**

Arsenal wrote:Bloody Hell! Right lets sort this out!

Are we talking about:

Pierre Coetzer?

Gerrie Coetzee?

Bloody South Africans having such similar names!

I apologise if I made scathing remarks BUT I honestly thought people were talking about Pierre (Use first names its easier!). Was anyone? Razor? Or are we all talking about Gerrie?

We're talking about Gerrie Coetzee as far as I'm concerned... good job noones mentioend Kallie Knoetzee yeT!.... yes, Peirre was a toughie but just short of true top ten class, damn tough guy though, got thrown to the wolves a bit before he was ready I think....

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 17:18**

OK I'm not going back and changing my posts. Fair enough not great but better then Pierre! Top 20 no, top 50 emmmm, top 75 maybe, top 100 probably.

I find it funny how how I misread that!

Pierre Top 20 bloody hell what was I thinking!

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 17:20**

Thats why I was saying he took alot of shots and used his face as a defence! By the way are we saying top 10/20 at the time or top 10/20 of all time?

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 17:21**

Arsenal wrote:Thats why I was saying he took alot of shots and used his face as a defence! By the way are we saying top 10/20 at the time or top 10/20 of all time?

If we are talking top 20 at the time, I would say Coetzee definitely makes the cut. But to my knowledge, we are talking top 20 of all-time. Coetzee doesn't crack the top 40 for me.

Posted: **31 Mar 2006, 19:12**

Arsenal wrote:Bloody Hell! Right lets sort this out!

Are we talking about:

Pierre Coetzer?

Gerrie Coetzee?

Bloody South Africans having such similar names!

I apologise if I made scathing remarks BUT I honestly thought people were talking about Pierre (Use first names its easier!). Was anyone? Razor? Or are we all talking about Gerrie?

I am talking about Gerrie Coetzee, I thought you were mispelling 'Coetzee' with an R at the end just for fun.

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