That's a tough one, being able to say you fought one of the great ones but knowing the outcome would probably not be favorable, that's why you were the right guys to be guiding your boys another guy may have thought the $35,000 would be worth the ass whipping.kikibalt wrote:We were offer a fight with the GREAT Alexis Arguello for Frankie around early 1980, the purse that was offer was $35,000, Jackie McCoy and I didn't want the fight at that time even though Frankie was ranked #1 by RIng magazine and #2 by the WBC, but we didn't want to say no, so we asked for $75,000 knowing that the promoter was going to say no, the promoter said no, I think we save Frankie an ass beating....
Expug wrote:Its a sad day with the loss of Alexis Arguello.
He was a great fighter and a class act. Back in the seventies and eighties when trash talk really became the rule , not the exception, Alexis always carried himself like a gentleman.Always with respect towards his opponent. I remember after stopping Mancini on national tv, Alexis consoled the kid and encouraged the young fighter.
After he knocked out Billy Costello, same deal. I'll never forget Arguello telling Costello after knocking him out, "you can do better then that Billy". He was sincere. I was a fan of" El Flaco Explosivo".
I remember that when Arguello fought Ruben Olivares, one of our fighters - a bantam named James Martinez - fought Carlos Zarate on the undercard and Pat accompanied James to the coast. Jeanne O'Grady told me that Pat had called from LA and all he could talk about was Arguello, whom he had seen in the gym. He told her to tell me that my favorite fighter (Olivares) was about to get a beating.Rick Farris wrote:Brian . . I boxed with Arguello at the Main Street Gym prior to his challenging Ruben Olivares for the featherweight title.Expug wrote:Rick, and Randy, when you guys watched Arguello fight , you saw the same things I did Im sure.
Remember how smooth that guys punches flowed ? He threw great combinations . Jab, hook off the jab to the body, straight right hand, left uppercut, etc.
He was really something.He could hurt a guy with both hands. I dont know if it can be articulated...he was a real fighters, fighter.He was really something to see.
I knew immediatly that Olivares might be in big trouble, especially after Alexis parted me down the middle with that booming right hand. It landed high on my forehead, I think, it wasn't on the chin luckily, even so it rattled me. I knew that if Olivares wasn't in the best of condition, he'd lose the title. I never really spoke to him, but you could see his class. And I felt his power. To be perfectly honest, I felt like a lost ball in high grass.
-Rick Farris
Bruce,Bobbin & Weavin wrote:That's a tough one, being able to say you fought one of the great ones but knowing the outcome would probably not be favorable, that's why you were the right guys to be guiding your boys another guy may have thought the $35,000 would be worth the ass whipping.kikibalt wrote:We were offer a fight with the GREAT Alexis Arguello for Frankie around early 1980, the purse that was offer was $35,000, Jackie McCoy and I didn't want the fight at that time even though Frankie was ranked #1 by RIng magazine and #2 by the WBC, but we didn't want to say no, so we asked for $75,000 knowing that the promoter was going to say no, the promoter said no, I think we save Frankie an ass beating....
Bruce
At one time in my like something got larger when I got "Hot", sorry to say "No more"...raylawpc wrote:(Obviously, I got this joke from somebody else since I've never gone to engineering school or worked in a scrap yard)
During a summer break from my studies at an engineering university, I worked in a scrap yard repairing construction equipment. One afternoon, I was taking apart a piling hammer that had some very large bolts holding it together. One of the nuts had corroded onto the bolt, so I started heating the nut with an oxyacetylene torch. As I was doing this, one of the dimmest apprentices I have ever known came along and asked me what I was doing. I patiently explained that if I heated the nut, it would grow larger and release its grip on the bolt so I could then remove it.
"So things get larger when they get hot, do they?" he asked.
Suddenly, an idea flashed into my mind. "Yes," I said, "that's why days are longer in summer and shorter in winter."
There was a long pause, then his face cleared. "You know, I always wondered about that," he said.
A great write-up on a great champion by a great writer. Thanks RandyRandyman wrote:Alexis Arguello
1952-2009
Alexis Arguello vs Aaron Pryor
Orange Bowl, Miami, Florida
November 12, 1982
"See, I respect boxing because it has given me so much and that’s why I will never allow anyone to mistreat the sport of boxing if I can help it."
- Alexis Arguello
In an era that produced such stellar fighters as; Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Marvin Hagler, Tommy Hearns, Wilfredo benitz, Wilfredo Gomez, Salvador Sanchez, Bobby Chacon, Danny "Little Red" Lopez, Ruben Olivares , and in a sport where even the contenders held the mantel of greatness with aplomb and grace, Alexis Arguello stood as tall as any of them. In an era where great fighters fought each other for the right to be called the best, Alexis Arguello fought the best.
Arguello fought his first fight forty one years ago, August 1, 1968 in Managua, Nicaragua against someone named Cachorro Amaya, getting stopped in the first round of a scheduled four round fight. He fought his last fight on January 21, 1995 in Las Vegas, Nevada, losing a ten round decision to Scott Walker. In between those years Arguello won titles in three weight classes; Featherweight, Super Featherweight, and Lightweight. He lifted the WBA Featherweight crown from Mexican great "Rockabye" Ruben Olivares on November 23, 1974 stopping Olivares in the 13th round of their 15 round fight. He successfully defended his title several times before moving up in weight to challenge Alfredo Escalera for the WBC Super Featherweight title. The fight took place on January 1, 1978 in Escalera's home turf of San Juan, Puerto Rico. Arguello won a hard fought and exciting fight by stopping Escalera in the 13th round. On June 20, 1981 Arguello once again moved up to challenge the respected WBC Lightweight champion from the United Kingdom, Jim Watt. The fight, which took place at the Empire Pool, Wembley, London, went the distance. Arguello won the fight with a 15 round unanimous decision. It was Watt's last fight and Alexis Arguello's third title.
Arguello defended his titles against the likes of Bobby Chacon, Ruben Castillo, Cornelius Boza Edwards, Jose Luis Ramirez, Rafael "Bazooka" Limon, Andy Ganigan, Ray Mancini and so many more. He never gave anything but his best when he stepped into the ring. He was a champion in the truest sense of the world. He was also a champion with compassion. Who can forget his fight with Ray Mancini, who fighting valiantly, as much for his father as for himself, was finally stopped in the 14th round of their fight. Arguello, as much a gentleman as he was a champion, put his arm around Mancini and reminded him, that he too failed in his first bid for a world title, a 15 round decision to Ernesto Marcel of Panama. He encouraged Mancini and let him know that his day would come. That act of mercy and compassion would become his signature, his trademark.
Arguello was already an all time great when he moved up once again to
challenge the great Aaron Pryor for Pryor's WBA Junior welterweight title, for an unprecedented fourth title. On November 12, 1982, Alexis Arguello and Aaron Pryor fought their way into boxing immortality, in one of the great fights of the 1980's, a fight that would stand out in any era.
On this night it would be Aaron Pryor that would have his arms raised in victory. In the 14th round, after a grueling, exhausting and exciting fight, Alexis Arguello was knocked out, and in a sickening manner. It was painful. Up to that point it was still anyone's fight. Arguello had landed right hands that would have knocked out middleweights but Pryor was at the top of his game that night. There would be no fourth title for Arguello.
Arguello had two more fights before once again challenging Aaron Pryor for the title. His first fight after his loss to Pryor was against Vilomar Fernandez of the Bronx, New York, by way of the Dominican Republic, winning a 10 round decision and avenging an 1978 loss to Fernandez. Next up was former WBALightweight Champ Claude Noel. Noel was knocked out in the 3rd round. The second Arguello-Pryor fight ended with a 10th round KO of Arguello. Arguello retired but came back two years later to fight Pat Jefferson, knocking him out in the 5th round. His next fight was with former WBC Lightweight Champion Billy Costello. The durable Costello was stopped in the fourth round.
Arguello has been a favorite of mine from the very beginning. He was the epitome of coolness in the ring and the master of patience. He was a master counter puncher and a consumate professional. It's not enough to say that he was a great Latin fighter, he was a great fighter, a great champion. He will be missed by his fans.
I met Alexis Arguello in 1976 while training at the Main Street Gym in Los Angeles. He was training for a fight. I can't remember who his opponent was but looking at his record the only fight that shows in that time frame is a fight with Salvador Torres at the Forum in Inglewood, a fight he won by a 3rd round knockout. Arguello was only there a week or so but I had the chance to meet him, talk with and shake his hand. He was very humble, reserved and quiet.
Alexis Arguello died earlier today, the victim of a self inflicted gun shot wound. A suicide. I cannot imagine what demons drove him to such an act. Alexis was born on April 19, 1952. He was 57 at the time of his death. It is a great loss to his family and friends, his countrymen and the sport of boxing. He will always be remembered as a class act. A good guy. A man who gave his all to his sport. Even in losing, he lost like a champion, going out on his shield. He will always be a champion. He belongs to history now.
My condolences to the family of Alexis Arguello. Rest in peace Champ! You will be missed.
kikibalt wrote:At one time in my like something got larger when I got "Hot", sorry to say "No more"...raylawpc wrote:(Obviously, I got this joke from somebody else since I've never gone to engineering school or worked in a scrap yard)
During a summer break from my studies at an engineering university, I worked in a scrap yard repairing construction equipment. One afternoon, I was taking apart a piling hammer that had some very large bolts holding it together. One of the nuts had corroded onto the bolt, so I started heating the nut with an oxyacetylene torch. As I was doing this, one of the dimmest apprentices I have ever known came along and asked me what I was doing. I patiently explained that if I heated the nut, it would grow larger and release its grip on the bolt so I could then remove it.
"So things get larger when they get hot, do they?" he asked.
Suddenly, an idea flashed into my mind. "Yes," I said, "that's why days are longer in summer and shorter in winter."
There was a long pause, then his face cleared. "You know, I always wondered about that," he said.
They are fine sentiments Frank and yet another interesting and insightful story into Frankie and Tony's careers.kikibalt wrote: Its great when a fighters can say, "I fought the greatest fighters of my era" some can say it, other's can't, even though they did fight the great ones, case in point, Bobby Chacon, who fought the Arguello's of the boxing world, but who now needs 24/7 care. Was I going to let my son Frankie in the ring with a monster when he wasn't ready? no, and to be honest I don't think Frankie would ever have gotten to the point of been ready for a fighter like Alexis.
I like to say that I was always honest about my sons boxing abilitys, and knew their limitations, so I was not about to risk their health and well being for $35,000, it wouldn't have been worth it when they had their life to live after boxing, I'm happy to say that the boys are able to work, take care of their familys and enjoy life without somebody looking after them.
Thanks Rob,Boxingnut wrote:They are fine sentiments Frank and yet another interesting and insightful story into Frankie and Tony's careers.kikibalt wrote: Its great when a fighters can say, "I fought the greatest fighters of my era" some can say it, other's can't, even though they did fight the great ones, case in point, Bobby Chacon, who fought the Arguello's of the boxing world, but who now needs 24/7 care. Was I going to let my son Frankie in the ring with a monster when he wasn't ready? no, and to be honest I don't think Frankie would ever have gotten to the point of been ready for a fighter like Alexis.
I like to say that I was always honest about my sons boxing abilitys, and knew their limitations, so I was not about to risk their health and well being for $35,000, it wouldn't have been worth it when they had their life to live after boxing, I'm happy to say that the boys are able to work, take care of their familys and enjoy life without somebody looking after them.
Frank, if either of my sons had boxed, I would have wanted you to be their manager.kikibalt wrote:Thanks Rob,Boxingnut wrote:They are fine sentiments Frank and yet another interesting and insightful story into Frankie and Tony's careers.kikibalt wrote: Its great when a fighters can say, "I fought the greatest fighters of my era" some can say it, other's can't, even though they did fight the great ones, case in point, Bobby Chacon, who fought the Arguello's of the boxing world, but who now needs 24/7 care. Was I going to let my son Frankie in the ring with a monster when he wasn't ready? no, and to be honest I don't think Frankie would ever have gotten to the point of been ready for a fighter like Alexis.
I like to say that I was always honest about my sons boxing abilitys, and knew their limitations, so I was not about to risk their health and well being for $35,000, it wouldn't have been worth it when they had their life to live after boxing, I'm happy to say that the boys are able to work, take care of their familys and enjoy life without somebody looking after them.
Those are just my true and honest feelings. The boys know how I feel and sometimes they didn't agree with me, like Frankie, he would have step into the ring against Arguello had it been up to him, but like I told Frankie and Tony, as your manager my best interest is in your well being, if I feel that a certain fight is you best interest I'll take the fight, if not I won't, regardless of what you say, I wish more managers would feel the same way, thus, preventing less Bobby Chacon's.
Who or what is Chata?kikibalt wrote:
My wife was reading this Best Buy ad this morning and she asked me if I would buy her the washer/dryer and refrigeator on the ad, I told her, what if I buy you a wash board and ice box instead, she looked at me with a face that looked like Chata and she flipped me the bird, now why would she do that?....
No, I won't tell her, she'll want to go to St. Louie right away....raylawpc wrote:Who or what is Chata?kikibalt wrote:
My wife was reading this Best Buy ad this morning and she asked me if I would buy her the washer/dryer and refrigeator on the ad, I told her, what if I buy you a wash board and ice box instead, she looked at me with a face that looked like Chata and she flipped me the bird, now why would she do that?....
(P.S.: Don't tell her she can get the same refrigerator in St. Louis for $1,900 . . .)
Tom, I would have been happy to have been co-managers with you if your sons had boxed.raylawpc wrote:Frank, if either of my sons had boxed, I would have wanted you to be their manager.kikibalt wrote:They are fine sentiments Frank and yet another interesting and insightful story into Frankie and Tony's careers.kikibalt wrote: Its great when a fighters can say, "I fought the greatest fighters of my era" some can say it, other's can't, even though they did fight the great ones, case in point, Bobby Chacon, who fought the Arguello's of the boxing world, but who now needs 24/7 care. Was I going to let my son Frankie in the ring with a monster when he wasn't ready? no, and to be honest I don't think Frankie would ever have gotten to the point of been ready for a fighter like Alexis.
I like to say that I was always honest about my sons boxing abilitys, and knew their limitations, so I was not about to risk their health and well being for $35,000, it wouldn't have been worth it when they had their life to live after boxing, I'm happy to say that the boys are able to work, take care of their familys and enjoy life without somebody looking after them.
Thanks Rob,
Those are just my true and honest feelings. The boys know how I feel and sometimes they didn't agree with me, like Frankie, he would have step into the ring against Arguello had it been up to him, but like I told Frankie and Tony, as your manager my best interest is in your well being, if I feel that a certain fight is you best interest I'll take the fight, if not I won't, regardless of what you say, I wish more managers would feel the same way, thus, preventing less Bobby Chacon's.
kikibalt wrote:Bruce,Bobbin & Weavin wrote:That's a tough one, being able to say you fought one of the great ones but knowing the outcome would probably not be favorable, that's why you were the right guys to be guiding your boys another guy may have thought the $35,000 would be worth the ass whipping.kikibalt wrote:We were offer a fight with the GREAT Alexis Arguello for Frankie around early 1980, the purse that was offer was $35,000, Jackie McCoy and I didn't want the fight at that time even though Frankie was ranked #1 by RIng magazine and #2 by the WBC, but we didn't want to say no, so we asked for $75,000 knowing that the promoter was going to say no, the promoter said no, I think we save Frankie an ass beating....
Bruce
Its great when a fighters can say, "I fought the greatest fighters of my era" some can say it, other's can't, even though they did fight the great ones, case in point, Bobby Chacon, who fought the Arguello's of the boxing world, but who now needs 24/7 care. Was I going to let my son Frankie in the ring with a monster when he wasn't ready? no, and to be honest I don't think Frankie would ever have gotten to the point of been ready for a fighter like Alexis.
I like to say that I was always honest about my sons boxing abilitys, and knew their limitations, so I was not about to risk their health and well being for $35,000, it wouldn't have been worth it when they had their life to live after boxing, I'm happy to say that the boys are able to work, take care of their familys and enjoy life without somebody looking after them.
I second that, great story Randy!kikibalt wrote:A great write-up on a great champion by a great writer. Thanks RandyRandyman wrote:Alexis Arguello
1952-2009
Alexis Arguello vs Aaron Pryor
Orange Bowl, Miami, Florida
November 12, 1982
"See, I respect boxing because it has given me so much and that’s why I will never allow anyone to mistreat the sport of boxing if I can help it."
- Alexis Arguello
In an era that produced such stellar fighters as; Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Marvin Hagler, Tommy Hearns, Wilfredo benitz, Wilfredo Gomez, Salvador Sanchez, Bobby Chacon, Danny "Little Red" Lopez, Ruben Olivares , and in a sport where even the contenders held the mantel of greatness with aplomb and grace, Alexis Arguello stood as tall as any of them. In an era where great fighters fought each other for the right to be called the best, Alexis Arguello fought the best.
Arguello fought his first fight forty one years ago, August 1, 1968 in Managua, Nicaragua against someone named Cachorro Amaya, getting stopped in the first round of a scheduled four round fight. He fought his last fight on January 21, 1995 in Las Vegas, Nevada, losing a ten round decision to Scott Walker. In between those years Arguello won titles in three weight classes; Featherweight, Super Featherweight, and Lightweight. He lifted the WBA Featherweight crown from Mexican great "Rockabye" Ruben Olivares on November 23, 1974 stopping Olivares in the 13th round of their 15 round fight. He successfully defended his title several times before moving up in weight to challenge Alfredo Escalera for the WBC Super Featherweight title. The fight took place on January 1, 1978 in Escalera's home turf of San Juan, Puerto Rico. Arguello won a hard fought and exciting fight by stopping Escalera in the 13th round. On June 20, 1981 Arguello once again moved up to challenge the respected WBC Lightweight champion from the United Kingdom, Jim Watt. The fight, which took place at the Empire Pool, Wembley, London, went the distance. Arguello won the fight with a 15 round unanimous decision. It was Watt's last fight and Alexis Arguello's third title.
Arguello defended his titles against the likes of Bobby Chacon, Ruben Castillo, Cornelius Boza Edwards, Jose Luis Ramirez, Rafael "Bazooka" Limon, Andy Ganigan, Ray Mancini and so many more. He never gave anything but his best when he stepped into the ring. He was a champion in the truest sense of the world. He was also a champion with compassion. Who can forget his fight with Ray Mancini, who fighting valiantly, as much for his father as for himself, was finally stopped in the 14th round of their fight. Arguello, as much a gentleman as he was a champion, put his arm around Mancini and reminded him, that he too failed in his first bid for a world title, a 15 round decision to Ernesto Marcel of Panama. He encouraged Mancini and let him know that his day would come. That act of mercy and compassion would become his signature, his trademark.
Arguello was already an all time great when he moved up once again to
challenge the great Aaron Pryor for Pryor's WBA Junior welterweight title, for an unprecedented fourth title. On November 12, 1982, Alexis Arguello and Aaron Pryor fought their way into boxing immortality, in one of the great fights of the 1980's, a fight that would stand out in any era.
On this night it would be Aaron Pryor that would have his arms raised in victory. In the 14th round, after a grueling, exhausting and exciting fight, Alexis Arguello was knocked out, and in a sickening manner. It was painful. Up to that point it was still anyone's fight. Arguello had landed right hands that would have knocked out middleweights but Pryor was at the top of his game that night. There would be no fourth title for Arguello.
Arguello had two more fights before once again challenging Aaron Pryor for the title. His first fight after his loss to Pryor was against Vilomar Fernandez of the Bronx, New York, by way of the Dominican Republic, winning a 10 round decision and avenging an 1978 loss to Fernandez. Next up was former WBALightweight Champ Claude Noel. Noel was knocked out in the 3rd round. The second Arguello-Pryor fight ended with a 10th round KO of Arguello. Arguello retired but came back two years later to fight Pat Jefferson, knocking him out in the 5th round. His next fight was with former WBC Lightweight Champion Billy Costello. The durable Costello was stopped in the fourth round.
Arguello has been a favorite of mine from the very beginning. He was the epitome of coolness in the ring and the master of patience. He was a master counter puncher and a consumate professional. It's not enough to say that he was a great Latin fighter, he was a great fighter, a great champion. He will be missed by his fans.
I met Alexis Arguello in 1976 while training at the Main Street Gym in Los Angeles. He was training for a fight. I can't remember who his opponent was but looking at his record the only fight that shows in that time frame is a fight with Salvador Torres at the Forum in Inglewood, a fight he won by a 3rd round knockout. Arguello was only there a week or so but I had the chance to meet him, talk with and shake his hand. He was very humble, reserved and quiet.
Alexis Arguello died earlier today, the victim of a self inflicted gun shot wound. A suicide. I cannot imagine what demons drove him to such an act. Alexis was born on April 19, 1952. He was 57 at the time of his death. It is a great loss to his family and friends, his countrymen and the sport of boxing. He will always be remembered as a class act. A good guy. A man who gave his all to his sport. Even in losing, he lost like a champion, going out on his shield. He will always be a champion. He belongs to history now.
My condolences to the family of Alexis Arguello. Rest in peace Champ! You will be missed.
It would have had to have been a solo act - for their sakes. I'm not a very good father. I would have been a worse manager. I put too much pressure on my boys.kikibalt wrote:Tom, I would have been happy to have been co-managers with you if your sons had boxed.raylawpc wrote: Frank, if either of my sons had boxed, I would have wanted you to be their manager.
As you wish, but I'm sure you're a great father, and might have made a great manager also....raylawpc wrote:It would have had to have been a solo act - for their sakes. I'm not a very good father. I would have been a worse manager. I put too much pressure on my boys.kikibalt wrote:Tom, I would have been happy to have been co-managers with you if your sons had boxed.raylawpc wrote: Frank, if either of my sons had boxed, I would have wanted you to be their manager.
Thanks Rick, what made it work was that for the most part the boys listen to me, more so Frankie then Tony, with Tony I had to crack the whip more often, eventually he would come around to my way of thinking even if he didn't agree with me 100%.Rick Farris wrote:kikibalt wrote:That's a tough one, being able to say you fought one of the great ones but knowing the outcome would probably not be favorable, that's why you were the right guys to be guiding your boys another guy may have thought the $35,000 would be worth the ass whipping.kikibalt wrote:We were offer a fight with the GREAT Alexis Arguello for Frankie around early 1980, the purse that was offer was $35,000, Jackie McCoy and I didn't want the fight at that time even though Frankie was ranked #1 by RIng magazine and #2 by the WBC, but we didn't want to say no, so we asked for $75,000 knowing that the promoter was going to say no, the promoter said no, I think we save Frankie an ass beating....
Bruce
Bruce,
Its great when a fighters can say, "I fought the greatest fighters of my era" some can say it, other's can't, even though they did fight the great ones, case in point, Bobby Chacon, who fought the Arguello's of the boxing world, but who now needs 24/7 care. Was I going to let my son Frankie in the ring with a monster when he wasn't ready? no, and to be honest I don't think Frankie would ever have gotten to the point of been ready for a fighter like Alexis.
I like to say that I was always honest about my sons boxing abilitys, and knew their limitations, so I was not about to risk their health and well being for $35,000, it wouldn't have been worth it when they had their life to live after boxing, I'm happy to say that the boys are able to work, take care of their familys and enjoy life without somebody looking after them.
Frank . . . You did a great job with your boys from start-to-finish. You saw they were will trained and prepared for all of their fights, and aligned them with the great Jackie McCoy, etc. Seeing Frankie Jr. for the first time in years was a pleasure for me when we all attended that amateur card in El Monte. As you remember, Frankie and I walked back to the dressing room area together and had a nice chat. A fine man that shows no evidence of having been a world class pro fighter. Smart, great personality and lots of fun.
The apple didn't fall far from the tree.
-Rick Farris
Brian...It would have been my pleasure. Laugh? I'm alway ready for some laughs.Expug wrote:If I would have known Frank in the eighties, I would have wanted him to manage me.
I would have been on the first plane out of Chicago . No joke.
I needed guidance. Who knows what would have happened.
Either way, we would have had a few laughs.
I had to do a double-take. For a second, I thought that was a photo of Jim Jeffries that I'd never seen before. However, Jim was a USC fan, not a UCLA fan, so that should have immediately alerted me.kikibalt wrote:No, I won't tell her, she'll want to go to St. Louie right away....raylawpc wrote:Who or what is Chata?kikibalt wrote:
My wife was reading this Best Buy ad this morning and she asked me if I would buy her the washer/dryer and refrigeator on the ad, I told her, what if I buy you a wash board and ice box instead, she looked at me with a face that looked like Chata and she flipped me the bird, now why would she do that?....
(P.S.: Don't tell her she can get the same refrigerator in St. Louis for $1,900 . . .)
Tom, meet Chata Baltazar...
