Muhammad Ali 'Set the Record in Holding against Joe Frazier'

[ThatOne]

I didn't even see {Steve O's} mouth move when he posted this............


-Il Duce

If you and Mr. O would like to engage in a private conversation the private message mechanism exists for that very purpose.

[Tomasino]

No, I'm pretty sure that fight between those two prime undefeated all time greats for the undisputed heavyweight championship of the world was the biggest fight of their careers.
Anyway serf on, maybe bronze age Santa will change history and make Ali the winner of FOTC.

-hhaere

Your logic is flawed. He never becomes champion if he doesn't upset Sonny Liston as a 7-1 underdog. However as a gentleman I will meet you in the middle. It was the biggest fight in Joe Frazier's career.


Ali needs no more gifts from God beyond those he has already bestowed on him. ""There'll never be another like him. He is the Alpha and the Omega."

You are almost as much a troll and zealot as Duce. I think both you guys need to have a break from posting.

[gilgamesh]

Yeah referring to Ali as "The Alpha and Omega" is pretty damn ridiculous as well.

[ThatOne]

The quote is from Coretta Clay, hence the quotation marks...

[ThatOne]

No, I'm pretty sure that fight between those two prime undefeated all time greats for the undisputed heavyweight championship of the world was the biggest fight of their careers.
Anyway serf on, maybe bronze age Santa will change history and make Ali the winner of FOTC.

-hhaere

Your logic is flawed. He never becomes champion if he doesn't upset Sonny Liston as a 7-1 underdog. However as a gentleman I will meet you in the middle. It was the biggest fight in Joe Frazier's career.


Ali needs no more gifts from God beyond those he has already bestowed on him. ""There'll never be another like him. He is the Alpha and the Omega."

You are almost as much a troll and zealot as Duce. I think both you guys need to have a break from posting.

Thank you for your counsel but I will heed my own.

Oh, as I said the quote is from his mother, hence the quotation marks, ergo:

Coretta Clay, a small woman with the firm-boned features of the world champion's father, abandoned herself to a high, ecstatic laugh at the door of the kitchen. `There'll never be another like him,' she shrilled when she recovered. `He is the Alpha and the Omega.'


http://www.kilmarnockacademy.co.uk/famo ... tagain.htm


And I appreciate Il Duce...He's nothing if not provocative. And even on the rarest of occasions, actually funny...

[ThatOne]

Tomasino

Master of Wisdom

But, isn't he who cast the first stone, an expert.

He should heed the admonition of his fellow Brit who opined "If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind. "

The bloke actually learned something...

[ThatOne]

Il Duce, for your act to really excel you need That One to participate. But you need some fresh material, dawg...

Here are my five favorite fighters:

The GOAT
Sugar Ray Leonard
Lennox Lewis
Joe Louis
George Foreman

You need to give them the Il Duce treatment.

[ThatOne]

That Way

First off, I don't comment on any GOAT.

You need to up your game, dawg, or it will only be you and that professional scold, Tomasino, here...

[ThatOne]

Overview

The 'GOAT'
* Very talented boxer, but a better showman.
* Quick-fisted, and as equally quick-witted.
* Lightning reflexes {early career}.
* A 'Dance Master' that featured the 'stick-and-move' tactic.
* Tremendous courage in the Ring.
* Ability to adjust to the force opposing him.
* Came along when the 'Boxing Game' needed an injection of juice.
* Boxing's greatest entertainer.
* Opened the doors for 'big fight purses'.
* Brewed tremendous confidence in himself.

I wonder if Tomasino will approve of that. He seems to be quite the "stick in the mud".

[yancey]

Overview

The 'GOAT'
* Very talented boxer, but a better showman.
* Quick-fisted, and as equally quick-witted.
* Lightning reflexes {early career}.
* A 'Dance Master' that featured the 'stick-and-move' tactic.
* Tremendous courage in the Ring.
* Ability to adjust to the force opposing him.
* Came along when the 'Boxing Game' needed an injection of juice.
* Boxing's greatest entertainer.
* Opened the doors for 'big fight purses'.
* Brewed tremendous confidence in himself.

And got whipped in the biggest fight of his career.

[ThatOne]

Overview

The 'GOAT'
* Very talented boxer, but a better showman.
* Quick-fisted, and as equally quick-witted.
* Lightning reflexes {early career}.
* A 'Dance Master' that featured the 'stick-and-move' tactic.
* Tremendous courage in the Ring.
* Ability to adjust to the force opposing him.
* Came along when the 'Boxing Game' needed an injection of juice.
* Boxing's greatest entertainer.
* Opened the doors for 'big fight purses'.
* Brewed tremendous confidence in himself.

And got whipped in the biggest fight of his career.

"A dream is a wish the heart makes."

-Cinderella

The biggest fight of his career is when he dispatched of the heretofore undefeated and seemingly invincible George Foreman as a 3-1 underdog in eight rounds. The same George Foreman who dispatched of Joe Frazier and Ken Norton in less time then it took the procrastinators to get to their ringside seats.

It was certainly the biggest fight in Joe Frazier's career...

[yancey]

Overview

The 'GOAT'
* Very talented boxer, but a better showman.
* Quick-fisted, and as equally quick-witted.
* Lightning reflexes {early career}.
* A 'Dance Master' that featured the 'stick-and-move' tactic.
* Tremendous courage in the Ring.
* Ability to adjust to the force opposing him.
* Came along when the 'Boxing Game' needed an injection of juice.
* Boxing's greatest entertainer.
* Opened the doors for 'big fight purses'.
* Brewed tremendous confidence in himself.

And got whipped in the biggest fight of his career.

"A dream is a wish the heart makes."

-Cinderella

The biggest fight of his career is when he dispatched of the heretofore undefeated and seemingly invincible George Foreman as a 3-1 underdog in eight rounds. The same George Foreman who dispatched of Joe Frazier and Ken Norton in less time then it took the procrastinators to get to their ringside seats.

It was certainly the biggest fight in Joe Frazier's career...

"Nothing is so difficult as not deceiving oneself."

Ludwig Wittgenstein

Come on man, face it.

Your guy lost.....

The Big One.

[ThatOne]

"Nothing is so difficult as not deceiving oneself."

Ludwig Wittgenstein

Come on man, face it.

Your guy lost.....

The Big One.

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."

John Adams

President of the United States and father of another one>>>some Austrian-British navel gazer.

[BoxBuzz]

Overview

The 'GOAT'
* Very talented boxer, but a better showman.
* Quick-fisted, and as equally quick-witted.
* Lightning reflexes {early career}.
* A 'Dance Master' that featured the 'stick-and-move' tactic.
* Tremendous courage in the Ring.
* Ability to adjust to the force opposing him.
* Came along when the 'Boxing Game' needed an injection of juice.
* Boxing's greatest entertainer.
* Opened the doors for 'big fight purses'.
* Brewed tremendous confidence in himself.

And got whipped in the biggest fight of his career.

Yancey.....And for you...the story ends I guess. But for those who survived to live into later years, there were more chapters to the story.

1. He who was whipped, came back to "whip the whipper"
2. After "whipping the whipper" He who was whipped came back again to "whip (by stoppage) the whipper of the whipper"
3. And for good measure...he came back and "stopped the whipper"


Now....had this been Joe's story, instead of Ali's story.....wouldn't Joe be worthy of some post "FOTC" accolades? Or no.....would the story simply end with loss of the FOTC?


MEMO to IL DUCE.

Your assessment is fair. It is clear to me that you have been evolving on this subject. As you would NEVER have began your campaign here with your signature tied to that document.

I suspect it won't be long, before you drop your rancorous ramblings and begin singing more praises of the man that you yourself have described as: (and I quote)

"* Very talented boxer
* Quick-fisted, and as equally quick-witted.
* Lightning reflexes
* A 'Dance Master' that featured the 'stick-and-move' tactic.
* Tremendous courage in the Ring.
* Ability to adjust to the force opposing him.
* Came along when the 'Boxing Game' needed an injection of juice.
* Boxing's greatest
* Opened the doors for 'big fight purses'.
* tremendous confidence"


Your words......and very accurate I must say!
You sir are improving with time.
And much like the Hokey Pokey...,that's what it's all about.

[yancey]

"Nothing is so difficult as not deceiving oneself."

Ludwig Wittgenstein

Come on man, face it.

Your guy lost.....

The Big One.

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."

John Adams

President of the United States and father of another one>>>some Austrian-British navel gazer.

"Reason does not always appeal to unreasonable men."

John F. Kennedy
President of the United States

or....


"You must have the courage to change."

Albert Gore
Presidential Wannabe


Take your choice of the above. They both apply to your untenable position.

[ThatOne]

"Nothing is so difficult as not deceiving oneself."

Ludwig Wittgenstein

Come on man, face it.

Your guy lost.....

The Big One.

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."

John Adams

President of the United States and father of another one>>>some Austrian-British navel gazer.

"Reason does not always appeal to unreasonable men."

John F. Kennedy
President of the United States

or....


"You must have the courage to change."

Albert Gore
Presidential Wannabe


Take your choice of the above. They both apply to your untenable position.

"Yancey.....And for you...the story ends I guess. But for those who survived to live into later years, there were more chapters to the story.

1. He who was whipped, came back to "whip the whipper"
2. After "whipping the whipper" He who was whipped came back again to "whip (by stoppage) the whipper of the whipper"
3. And for good measure...he came back and "stopped the whipper"


Now....had this been Joe's story, instead of Ali's story.....wouldn't Joe be worthy of some post "FOTC" accolades? Or no.....would the story simply end with loss of the FOTC? "

-Box Buzz
Revered boxing historian

[SaadOffTheDeck]

No, I'm pretty sure that fight between those two prime undefeated all time greats for the undisputed heavyweight championship of the world was the biggest fight of their careers.
Anyway serf on, maybe bronze age Santa will change history and make Ali the winner of FOTC.

-hhaere

Your logic is flawed. He never becomes champion if he doesn't upset Sonny Liston as a 7-1 underdog. However as a gentleman I will meet you in the middle. It was the biggest fight in Joe Frazier's career.


Ali needs no more gifts from God beyond those he has already bestowed on him. ""There'll never be another like him. He is the Alpha and the Omega."

You are almost as much a troll and zealot as Duce. I think both you guys need to have a break from posting.

Almost? He's already there.

[ThatOne]

I don't know...It seems Il Duce and I are doing a stellar job. This thread has more posts than any thread on the main board that isn't pinned.

[gilgamesh]

I don't know...It seems Il Duce and I are doing a stellar job. This thread has more posts than any thread on the main board that isn't pinned.

Quality beats Quantity

[ThatOne]

Round 2

The 'supposed' Controversy

{2:44} > Muhammad Ali is in his corner, looking exhausted with his arms hanging over the top rope-strands.

{2:44} > Is standing in his corner, waiting.

{2:48} > After '4-Seconds' pass, Referee - Tony Perez realizes his mistake, and calls for both fighters to resume.

{2:49} > Joe Frazier is already making a 'bee-line toward center-ring on spry legs.

{2:49} > Muhammad Ali 'slowly' leaves his corner, and heads towards center-ring.

{2:50} > Both fighters meet at 'center-ring', but Joe Frazer is there first and is still moving forward.

Il Duce, could you please add a touch of levity to your posts? It seems the denizens of this august site are getting a bit angry.

[BoxBuzz]

As long as the "argument" stays civil....it does not have to be decipherable lol.

Anyway.....once upon a time in this very forum....things could have devolved to expletives and hatespeech rather than frustrated disagreement.....and although I continue to see difference of opinion t I don't see full blown insanity.


repetition? yeah......but that's how you sell soap.

[ThatOne]

As long as the "argument" stays civil....it does not have to be decipherable lol.

Anyway.....once upon a time in this very forum....things could have devolved to expletives and hatespeech rather than frustrated disagreement.....and although I continue to see difference of opinion t I don't see full blown insanity.


repetition? yeah......but that's how you sell soap.

For the most part it is civil and most of the epithets are done tongue in cheek...I see a lot of tut tutting...This isn't the Mensa board.

I think we should follow two rules; not bring our battles into other poster's threads and keep the amount of threads on the same topic to an agreeable minimum...

[BoxBuzz]

Il Duce....you say you do not lie....but when you choose to "opine" or "dramatize" you do it in a bit of a weighted manner.

If Joe had just put Ali through the same sort of momentary shakiness....and the ref botched the moment, wouldn't you have been more concerned? Or would you see it precisely the same way? I mean you give credit to Joe for a knockdown in the first fight, when it was perhaps something less than a knockdown.

And I have heard nothing from you about the official knockdown that Wepner imposed on Ali.

I take from that, that you see the Wepner kd as legit, and thankfully ruled correctly.....and the Frazier kd as legit, whether ruled correctly or not.

Are my assumptions correct here?

[BoxBuzz]

A million miles away? That journey is never more than seconds away depending on opportunity.

And I would say a referee calling the round over at such a critical time would just about double that mileage to two million miles I guess.

Still no comment on the official knockdown from Wepner......I guess it was a good clean shot from your vantage point? Or simply so obviously an error that it is not worthy of attention?

[yancey]

What I'm Saying

Is that, though Joe Frazier was 'stung' near the end of Round 2, he was far from being in any
sort of real danger of getting stopped.

And, Muhammad Ali was a 'Million Miles' away from putting Joe Frazier down.

All true and all of which apparently escapes Buzz.