BoxRec

ironbeard wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 00:54 My point was not a criticism of AJ. It was just defending Wilder. AJ is the current king of the hill.

Why the hell are you trying to defend Wilder?!

This is the guy that has been ducking Whyte and Joshua for what seems almost forever now. Of course Stiverne and Ortiz rematches are much more their worth to his legacy or his bank balance.

Finkel wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 03:27 Well you did make a pretty bold claim from a minority position. It's hardly outrageous that I (or someone else) would ask you to back it up.

I'm pretty sure we were both in the minority at the weekend in giving Jacobs the draw against Canelo. But I can recognize I was holding a minority position on what I saw to be a close fight, but it's not like I would ever try to argue that Jacobs won (which would be required to justify a draw on the cards).

As I say, I'm all ears on where you would pull a Deontay victory from...

It was a razor close fight. “Robbery” has absolutely no business in the conversation.

I would have made no “robbery” claim if Fury had gotten a close decision. Almost every round was very close. Per usual, if people don’t get what they want, it’s a “robbery!!!!”

Bvllsh!t.

didnt you have 116-110 wilder, thats not close

i had thought ppl had mostly stopped with the fury vs wilder decision convo anyway, i mean did u want to hear ppl cry robbery again

Rob3_142 wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 03:59 Why the hell are you trying to defend Wilder?!

This is the guy that has been ducking Whyte and Joshua for what seems almost forever now. Of course Stiverne and Ortiz rematches are much more their worth to his legacy or his bank balance.

I don’t really like Wilder, but people are overboard in their criticisms.

Wilder does not have elite boxing skills, but he is better than most give him credit for.

Wilder does not have a great resume but he has fought Ortiz and Fury and is about to fight Breazeale who has only lost to AJ.

Wilder has obviously been brought along slowly for equally obvious reasons; he had precious little amateur experience, he was raw. How many fights did Alvarez have before he got going? How about JCC? He is far from the first fighter who has been brought along slowly / very protected.

I have always said that he is a preying mantis on ice waiting to happen, but he has proved me wrong up to now. He has great heart, which got him through the Ortiz ordeal and earned him a draw v Fury.

Wilder is the most exciting HW on the planet currently. Every minute of every fight is tense due to his ability to end it as well as his vulnerability.

Fury is a great HW boxer, but his fights, besides v Wilder are generally snoozers.

AJ is the king but few of his fights entail much drama besides what round or if he will KTFO his opponents.

AJ v Fury would be huge but not as anticipated as AJ v Wilder.

Why? Because Wilder could KTFO AJ, while Fury’s only legit avenue to the W would be another borefest.

Highly forgettable fight. Nothing to bicker about. Could have went either way.

It is easy to defend the absurd wilder hate around here. Schooled by a guy landing 3 or 4 light jabs a round.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 14:54 It is easy to defend the absurd wilder hate around here. Schooled by a guy landing 3 or 4 light jabs a round.

You forgot waving his arms in the air. Obviously a point scoring move...

jamamb wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 14:45 didnt you have 116-110 wilder, thats not close

i had thought ppl had mostly stopped with the fury vs wilder decision convo anyway, i mean did u want to hear ppl cry robbery again

He's just upset that no one in their right mind believes the narrative that Wilder deserved a draw.

oogiebe wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 14:55 You forgot waving his arms in the air. Obviously a point scoring move...

I know Wilder has bad technique, but that is just a harsh description of those airshots Fury was slipping and rolling all night

Finkel wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:18 I know Wilder has bad technique, but that is just a harsh description of those airshots Fury was slipping and rolling all night

Finkel wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:16 He's just upset that no one in their right mind believes the narrative that Wilder deserved a draw.

No, I am not upset at all. I am not one of you bellyaching fools who cannot admit that the fight was close and there is not a damn thing you can do about the draw., with the exception of talk sh!t for the rest of your life.

Finkel wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:18 I know Wilder has bad technique, but that is just a harsh description of those airshots Fury was slipping and rolling all night

Yeah “those airshot” that put Fury on his ass were nothing compared to that masterful bobbing and weaving and acting like he won the lottery by not getting KTFO at the end of every round.

ironbeard wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:26 No, I am not upset at all. I am not one of you bellyaching fools who cannot admit that the fight was close and there is not a damn thing you can do about the draw., with the exception of talk sh!t for the rest of your life.

Behave yourself
All that comes out of you has been unsubstantiated whining because Wilder isn't getting the recognition he hasn't earned.

You are right the draw is on the record. But luckily the thing about the internet is people can still watch the fight back if they want to enjoy an out of shape master boxer schooling a knock out artist who only had a punchers chance

ironbeard wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:31 Yeah “those airshot” that put Fury on his ass were nothing compared to that masterful bobbing and weaving and acting like he won the lottery by not getting KTFO at the end of every round.

Well of course,
The objective is hit and not be hit

He was out of shape, no one gave him a cat in hell's chance against the most fearsome puncher in the division. And he showed the world that if you take that right hand away, wilder is floundering

Finkel wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:31 Behave yourself
All that comes out of you has been unsubstantiated whining because Wilder isn't getting the recognition he hasn't earned.

You are right the draw is on the record. But luckily the thing about the internet is people can still watch the fight back if they want to enjoy an out of shape master boxer schooling a knock out artist who only had a punchers chance

oogiebe wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:35

It's easier to sleep if you put down your phone

Finkel wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:37 It's easier to sleep if you put down your phone

On laptop. I'm not even a really big wilder fan, butthe bvllshvt one-sided crap guys like you post gets tiring. G'nite cupcake.

oogiebe wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:39 On laptop. I'm not even a really big wilder fan, butthe bvllshvt one-sided crap guys like you post gets tiring. G'nite cupcake.

Cheers sweetheart

Any of you could have just explained where I'm going wrong...
I know you know how to score a fight, so I don't see why you getting upset with me reiterating the view of the vast majority of boxing public

Read back, it's not me who started talking about a robbery. But we can leave it there, no need to dissect the obvious, again and again

Back to Breazeale, and his marginal likelihood of success

Finkel wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:44 Cheers sweetheart

Any of you could have just explained where I'm going wrong...
I know you know how to score a fight, so I don't see why you getting upset with me reiterating the view of the vast majority of boxing public

Read back, it's not me who started talking about a robbery. But we can leave it there, no need to dissect the obvious, again and again

LOL! Just so you don't make the wrong assumption, I had Fury by a round.

Finkel wrote: ↑07 May 2019, 22:44 Cheers sweetheart

Any of you could have just explained where I'm going wrong...
I know you know how to score a fight, so I don't see why you getting upset with me reiterating the view of the vast majority of boxing public

Read back, it's not me who started talking about a robbery. But we can leave it there, no need to dissect the obvious, again and again

Back to Breazeale, and his marginal likelihood of success

It is not a majority rules sport. The majority got it wrong in Ward v Kovalev I too, and many others.

Fury did precious little more than get sat on his ass twice. Beyond that nearly every round was very close.

Wilder will likely finish him next time. That is why Fury is stepping it up to Schwarz.

ironbeard wrote: ↑08 May 2019, 00:05 It is not a majority rules sport. The majority got it wrong in Ward v Kovalev I too, and many others.

Fury did precious little more than get sat on his ass twice. Beyond that nearly every round was very close.

Wilder will likely finish him next time. That is why Fury is stepping it up to Schwarz.

Erm, it is EXACTLY a majority rules sport. That is how it is judged. 3 judges, the majority decision goes the way of the winner.

Look, fair play to Wilder, he never gave up against Fury and showed some good mental strength, also impressive that he can carry that kind of power late on. He deserves credit for that.
And as you say Wilder might very well knock him out in a rematch, but he clearly lost that last fight:

https://ringside24.com/en/video/2515/

For two judges to favor Wilder so much, clearly shows it was a robbery.

At the end of the day, Wilder only showed effective aggression in rounds 1, 2, 9 and 12,
Only out-landed Fury for power punches in 9 and 12, and for jabs in 7, 9 and 12
Where as Fury had the better defense in every round, and controlled the pace of the fight for the vast majority.
Fury's standout rounds were 8 and 10, both of them were a masterclass.
And to be honest Wilder only won 2 rounds clearly, the two knock down rounds (9 and 12).
There is a case for giving Wilder 2 further rounds, but no more than that.

I can give you a break down round by round, but I won't bore you any further with my subjective thoughts.

But lets take a moment to look at those judges score cards:

https://www.mmamania.com/2018/12/2/1812 ... ision-draw

Round 1 and 2 were close, so I could understand the judges giving round 1 to the champ then round 2 to the challenger, as Wilder didn't deserve to be two rounds ahead. Even though I scored it round 1 for Fury and round 2 for Wilder.

I can understand Robbert Tapper giving Wilder round 7, just so the score cards weren't getting out of hand - call it the benefit of being the defending champ.

Phil Edward changed his scoring after Fury started running away with the fight at the end of round 5 to favor Wilder. It's weird because he gave round 2 to Fury, and Rounds 1, 6 and 7 to Wilder. Whereas round 2 was the only one Wilder arguably won before round 9. I think he just wasn't expecting two knock down rounds late on, which made his card look really bad (i would like to believe it was unintentional).

Whereas Alejandro Rochin, just didn't give a fornicate, and gave Wilder the first 4 rounds - just criminal
And, like seriously, go back and watch round 8, how the fornicate could anyone give that round to Wilder?? Fury absolutely dominated that round if you watch it back, offensively and defensively). Alenjadro had clearly already decided that Wilder would win a tight victory, and the two knock downs just ended up making his card look the robbery it always was meant to be.
He needs investigating.

That is why that fight was considered a robbery.
I actually agree with you that a lot of the rounds were close, but once you factor in effective aggression, ring generalship and defense, I just don't see a case for a draw on a score card without showing deliberate favoritism to Wilder, let alone the monstrosity that Alejandro Rochin turned it.

Finkel wrote: ↑08 May 2019, 03:21 Erm, it is EXACTLY a majority rules sport. That is how it is judged. 3 judges, the majority decision goes the way of the winner.

Look, fair play to Wilder, he never gave up against Fury and showed some good mental strength, also impressive that he can carry that kind of power late on. He deserves credit for that.
And as you say Wilder might very well knock him out in a rematch, but he clearly lost that last fight:

https://ringside24.com/en/video/2515/

For two judges to favor Wilder so much, clearly shows it was a robbery.

At the end of the day, Wilder only showed effective aggression in rounds 1, 2, 9 and 12,
Only out-landed Fury for power punches in 9 and 12, and for jabs in 7, 9 and 12
Where as Fury had the better defense in every round, and controlled the pace of the fight for the vast majority.
Fury's standout rounds were 8 and 10, both of them were a masterclass.
And to be honest Wilder only won 2 rounds clearly, the two knock down rounds (9 and 12).
There is a case for giving Wilder 2 further rounds, but no more than that.

I can give you a break down round by round, but I won't bore you any further with my subjective thoughts.

But lets take a moment to look at those judges score cards:

https://www.mmamania.com/2018/12/2/1812 ... ision-draw

Round 1 and 2 were close, so I could understand the judges giving round 1 to the champ then round 2 to the challenger, as Wilder didn't deserve to be two rounds ahead. Even though I scored it round 1 for Fury and round 2 for Wilder.

I can understand Robbert Tapper giving Wilder round 7, just so the score cards weren't getting out of hand - call it the benefit of being the defending champ.

Phil Edward changed his scoring after Fury started running away with the fight at the end of round 5 to favor Wilder. It's weird because he gave round 2 to Fury, and Rounds 1, 6 and 7 to Wilder. Whereas round 2 was the only one Wilder arguably won before round 9. I think he just wasn't expecting two knock down rounds late on, which made his card look really bad (i would like to believe it was unintentional).

Whereas Alejandro Rochin, just didn't give a eff, and gave Wilder the first 4 rounds - just criminal
And, like seriously, go back and watch round 8, how the eff could anyone give that round to Wilder?? Fury absolutely dominated that round if you watch it back, offensively and defensively). Alenjadro had clearly already decided that Wilder would win a tight victory, and the two knock downs just ended up making his card look the robbery it always was meant to be.
He needs investigating.

That is why that fight was considered a robbery.
I actually agree with you that a lot of the rounds were close, but once you factor in effective aggression, ring generalship and defense, I just don't see a case for a draw on a score card without showing deliberate favoritism to Wilder, let alone the monstrosity that Alejandro Rochin turned it.

I did not read past your literally moronic statement that boxing is a majority rules sport.

Simple math.

Three people out of the millions who have watched the fight had votes that mattered. That is not majority rule, Finkenstoned

But be my guest and write another pointless novel about a very close fight that Fury would have won if Wilder had not put him on his ass, twice.

ironbeard wrote: ↑08 May 2019, 07:51 I did not read past your literally moronic statement that boxing is a majority rules sport.

Simple math.

Something you evidently struggle with going by this lengthy conversation.

But be my guest and write another pointless novel about a very close fight that Fury would have won if Alejandro Rochin wasn't obviously corrupt .

There I've corrected that for you.

I'm starting to think I'm arguing with a mental infant who is happy in their world of delusion.
Shame on me I guess

Finkel wrote: ↑08 May 2019, 08:33 Something you evidently struggle with going by this lengthy conversation.



There I've corrected that for you.

I'm starting to think I'm arguing with a mental infant who is happy in their world of delusion.
Shame on me I guess

All Fury had to do to win the fight was stay standing throughout the 12th. He failed, with a bit of help from Wilder.

If you could pull your face from betwixt Fury’s ass cheeks, you could recognize that. You are obviously comfortable where you are though.

ironbeard wrote: ↑09 May 2019, 13:29 All Fury had to do to win the fight was stay standing throughout the 12th. He failed, with a bit of help from Wilder.

If you could pull your face from betwixt Fury’s ass cheeks, you could recognize that. You are obviously comfortable where you are though.