Our 'Enry Vs Muhammad Ali - the myth

[Chambers2]

I've seen the fight with Bugner and it was very close, not a robbery but it could have went either way.

Regarding the Ali fight, the extra time Ali got was about 3-6 secs and this clear in the recording. I think the reason Dundee played up the split glove incident was to divert attention away from the fact that a bottle of smelling salts was promptly stuck under Clay/Ali's nose as soon as he got back to the corner after the knockdown. This also is shown clearly in the recording. While smelling salts may have been commonly used in the States(watch Ali V Archie Moore as Moore is seen standing in his corner with a cornerman holding a bottle to his nose) I am not sure if it was legal to use them in British rings. I am surprised that this is not mentioned whenever this subject comes up. If it was illegal then Dundee cheated Cooper out of a potential win.

As far as Cooper the fighter is concerned he knew his limitations and always gave 100% in the ring win, lose or draw. 3 Lonsdale belts outright, Commonwealth, European champ & world title challenger to possibly the greatest Heavyweight in history. Give the man a break I say he's earned the respect he's due.

Cheers, didn't realise about the smelling salts angle.

I wasn't criticising Our 'Enrys ability as a fighter or his achievements, as he was streets ahead of the rest of Britain. I was just surprised that the actual story wasn't quite what I'd heard it was

[Ketchel]

I've seen the fight with Bugner and it was very close, not a robbery but it could have went either way.

Regarding the Ali fight, the extra time Ali got was about 3-6 secs and this clear in the recording. I think the reason Dundee played up the split glove incident was to divert attention away from the fact that a bottle of smelling salts was promptly stuck under Clay/Ali's nose as soon as he got back to the corner after the knockdown. This also is shown clearly in the recording. While smelling salts may have been commonly used in the States(watch Ali V Archie Moore as Moore is seen standing in his corner with a cornerman holding a bottle to his nose) I am not sure if it was legal to use them in British rings. I am surprised that this is not mentioned whenever this subject comes up. If it was illegal then Dundee cheated Cooper out of a potential win.

As far as Cooper the fighter is concerned he knew his limitations and always gave 100% in the ring win, lose or draw. 3 Lonsdale belts outright, Commonwealth, European champ & world title challenger to possibly the greatest Heavyweight in history. Give the man a break I say he's earned the respect he's due.

Cheers, didn't realise about the smelling salts angle.

I wasn't criticising Our 'Enrys ability as a fighter or his achievements, as he was streets ahead of the rest of Britain. I was just surprised that the actual story wasn't quite what I'd heard it was

Chamber2,
I know you were not criticising Cooper. I just mentioned it because I grew up watching the Brut ads and even at that time people were putting Henry down. I went along with it as I didn't know any better but later when I got hold of a few of Henry's fights I realised that people were wrong. He got my respect straight away after that. The guy could fight and he was a handful in the ring.

[Chambers2]

Not seen much of him in action tbh, but his left hook doesn't look too bad Was he an aggressive come forward fighter as the few rounds I've seen would suggest? Were cuts a consistant problem throughout his career? After watching Ali come out fighting the way he did in the 5th I don't think Cooper would have beat Ali without the cuts, which is obviously no embarrassment whatsoever.

What put me off Sir 'Enry abit was when he recently (passed 12 months) done an interview with Joe Bugner, I think it was on BBC1's Inside Sport. Him and Joe hadn't seen each other in a few decades, so I thought all the resentment would have been dead and buried in both their minds, but that wasn't the impression I got from Cooper. The look on Our 'Enrys face was an absolute picture when Joe put his arms round him to hug him when they first met. I'm sure I've seen a recent interview where he talked about how he was still bitter about the glove-ripping incident in the Ali fight as well, but I can forgive stuff like this considering his resume... and his age I suppose boxers have never been known for their impartiality anyway

[harrygreb]

and dont believe all you see on TV, the directors/editors are crafty buggers.

[Ketchel]

and dont believe all you see on TV, the directors/editors are crafty buggers.

I also remember reading in Boxing News when this subject was discussed that someone had been able to hear the radio broadcast of the fight and even here the extra time given to Ali was 3-5 secs.

[bennie]

and dont believe all you see on TV, the directors/editors are crafty buggers.

I also remember reading in Boxing News when this subject was discussed that someone had been able to hear the radio broadcast of the fight and even here the extra time given to Ali was 3-5 secs.

Boxing News - and most people - fail to mention that the time thus given to Clay to recover is 63-65 seconds.

[HomicideHenry]

=sighs= the magic of film editing

[SteveO]

and dont believe all you see on TV, the directors/editors are crafty buggers.

I also remember reading in Boxing News when this subject was discussed that someone had been able to hear the radio broadcast of the fight and even here the extra time given to Ali was 3-5 secs.

Boxing News - and most people - fail to mention that the time thus given to Clay to recover is 63-65 seconds.

The myth has grown out of all proportion over the years and the actual delay was genuinely only a few seconds. Of course there will always be non-believers, especially if it suits their argument - but there is no point denying the truth.

[bennie]

I'm including the full minute between rounds. Add the extra few seconds to that minute and it's invaluable rescue time. Angelo Dundee at his best again.
"You're blowing it, son, you're blowin' it."

[bobmee]

Just like to point out that smelling salts were not illegal at the time. (Not much was!)

[bennie]

Phew! I thought Bob was going to expose me again.