BoxRec

I have nothing against him, like i said before many times, he's the better boxer of the recent boxers in the UK.

But for someone who is "46-0", without a single superfight, there will be question marks.

The only Superfight he had i can think of is the BHOP and RJJ fights. both who were at the combined age of 83.
A dodgy SD against one pensioner, and a PPV flop against RJJ - the same RJJ who's career has been in tatters since 2004.

Carl Froch and Andre Ward - Both of whom i cant stand, put Joe to shame. You really think Joe would have been in a tourny like Super Six? i think not.

But i guess if you prefer watching him face mandatories like Mitchell, go ahead.

loathe him or hate him,you have to respect & admire what he has done with his facilities in a little welsh village

it's quite remarkable :!:

observer1 wrote:I have nothing against him, like i said before many times, he's the better boxer of the recent boxers in the UK.

But for someone who is "46-0", without a single superfight, there will be question marks.

The only Superfight he had i can think of is the BHOP and RJJ fights. both who were at the combined age of 83.
A dodgy SD against one pensioner, and a PPV flop against RJJ - the same RJJ who's career has been in tatters since 2004.

Carl Froch and Andre Ward - Both of whom i cant stand, put Joe to shame. You really think Joe would have been in a tourny like Super Six? i think not.

But i guess if you prefer watching him face mandatories like Mitchell, go ahead.

Calzaghe's best win is Kessler by a mile imo.
On topic...two things I want to say are firstly, Enzo's "legacy" is Joe and I think that's a lot more to do with Joe than with Enzo and secondly, I really want a stepladder so I can kick Lennox Lewis in the nuts for adding the word "legacy" to the boxing lexicon (correct me if he didn't).

its a great and unusual legacy.....a real success story

observer1 wrote:I have nothing against him, like i said before many times, he's the better boxer of the recent boxers in the UK.

But for someone who is "46-0", without a single superfight, there will be question marks.

The only Superfight he had i can think of is the BHOP and RJJ fights. both who were at the combined age of 83.
A dodgy SD against one pensioner, and a PPV flop against RJJ - the same RJJ who's career has been in tatters since 2004.

Carl Froch and Andre Ward - Both of whom i cant stand, put Joe to shame. You really think Joe would have been in a tourny like Super Six? i think not.

But i guess if you prefer watching him face mandatories like Mitchell, go ahead.

He's the "better boxer of recent UK boxers" ???

Unbeaten... and if he was protected it was more down his promoters, surely?

RJJ was up at LWW and Hopkins was a weight below when he was making waves in his twenties.....the only fight he could have had and didn't that would have added to his CV was Ottke, and the German deserves more criticism than anyone.

Lacy was a superfight at the time and most on here had him knocking JC out...same goes for Kessler. He floored Eubank in the first round and was tremendous the night he won the title, he didn't lost a bloody round against many fighters and the tighest fight of his career - v Robin Reid - was a good, albeit close victory over a former world champ who later went on to school Ottke in his own backyard and lose a decision.

I had him beating Hopkins by two rounds. Holding the head, fouling and moaning to the ref don't win big fights IMO.

Against Pavlik Bernard put on a boxing lesson, he didn't do that vs Calzaghe because he wasn't allowed to.

You can pick big gaping holes in any argument that Calzaghe was a cowardly slapper who ducked everyone.

He even went over to Germany after destroying Veit and destroyed him again for good measure.

When will it ever be enough? And through all this he was trained by his manic little Sardinian dad in a shed in south Wales.

Props are due, not limp arguments like "he only fought one world class fighter"

observer1 wrote:I have nothing against him, like i said before many times, he's the better boxer of the recent boxers in the UK.

But for someone who is "46-0", without a single superfight, there will be question marks.

The only Superfight he had i can think of is the BHOP and RJJ fights. both who were at the combined age of 83.
A dodgy SD against one pensioner, and a PPV flop against RJJ - the same RJJ who's career has been in tatters since 2004.

Carl Froch and Andre Ward - Both of whom i cant stand, put Joe to shame. You really think Joe would have been in a tourny like Super Six? i think not.

But i guess if you prefer watching him face mandatories like Mitchell, go ahead.

You think a prime Calzaghe would have lost to Froch, Kessler (already beat him), Abraham and Ward?

No chance

Captain Hook wrote:

observer1 wrote:I have nothing against him, like i said before many times, he's the better boxer of the recent boxers in the UK.

But for someone who is "46-0", without a single superfight, there will be question marks.

The only Superfight he had i can think of is the BHOP and RJJ fights. both who were at the combined age of 83.
A dodgy SD against one pensioner, and a PPV flop against RJJ - the same RJJ who's career has been in tatters since 2004.

Carl Froch and Andre Ward - Both of whom i cant stand, put Joe to shame. You really think Joe would have been in a tourny like Super Six? i think not.

But i guess if you prefer watching him face mandatories like Mitchell, go ahead.

You think a prime Calzaghe would have lost to Froch, Kessler (already beat him), Abraham and Ward?

No chance

wouldn't waste your time fella....observer is clearly not all there:

World Class Resumé: - Cotto, Mosley, Martinez, Andre Ward, Carl Froch, Chris John, Morales and Barrera et

Captain Hook wrote:

observer1 wrote:I have nothing against him, like i said before many times, he's the better boxer of the recent boxers in the UK.

But for someone who is "46-0", without a single superfight, there will be question marks.

The only Superfight he had i can think of is the BHOP and RJJ fights. both who were at the combined age of 83.
A dodgy SD against one pensioner, and a PPV flop against RJJ - the same RJJ who's career has been in tatters since 2004.

Carl Froch and Andre Ward - Both of whom i cant stand, put Joe to shame. You really think Joe would have been in a tourny like Super Six? i think not.

But i guess if you prefer watching him face mandatories like Mitchell, go ahead.

He's the "better boxer of recent UK boxers" ???

Unbeaten... and if he was protected it was more down his promoters, surely?

RJJ was up at LWW and Hopkins was a weight below when he was making waves in his twenties.....the only fight he could have had and didn't that would have added to his CV was Ottke, and the German deserves more criticism than anyone.

Lacy was a superfight at the time and most on here had him knocking JC out...same goes for Kessler. He floored Eubank in the first round and was tremendous the night he won the title, he didn't lost a bloody round against many fighters and the tighest fight of his career - v Robin Reid - was a good, albeit close victory over a former world champ who later went on to school Ottke in his own backyard and lose a decision.

I had him beating Hopkins by two rounds. Holding the head, fouling and moaning to the ref don't win big fights IMO.

Against Pavlik Bernard put on a boxing lesson, he didn't do that vs Calzaghe because he wasn't allowed to.

You can pick big gaping holes in any argument that Calzaghe was a cowardly slapper who ducked everyone.

He even went over to Germany after destroying Veit and destroyed him again for good measure.

When will it ever be enough? And through all this he was trained by his manic little Sardinian dad in a shed in south Wales.

Props are due, not limp arguments like "he only fought one world class fighter"

This, On top of that he defeated byron mitchell and charles brewer convincingly just after they were robbed against ottke too. Sure his resume is lacking certain names that should have been there: Steve collins, Sven Ottke, Glen Johnson, 2006 jermain Taylor and maybe even Pavlik. But as time goes on and these people calzaghe should have fought tarnish their legacies then it justifies him not fighting them. At the same time the people he did beat are enhancing his legacy - Kessler beat froch, who beat abraham and direll. And B- Hop beat pavlik and pascal

observer1 wrote:
If you want an ELITE resumé for recent fighters look at: - Hopkins, Mayweather, Paquiao, Marquez, RJJ (Simply for multi-weight achievements) etc.

Sorry but no, not elite, not at all, could be but when the biggest name on his record is an Oscar De La Hoya who had fought 6 rounds in almost 3 years nah. Floyd Mayweather Jr. is an example of what is wrong with boxing, not making fights unless everything is in his favour, making sladerous accusations to worm out of the biggest fight in boxing, the man belongs in the WWE.

'are you listenin now? are you listenin now? are you listenin? economise, economise, economise. economise with the jab. period, it's period, right? economise'

banjo wrote:

observer1 wrote:
If you want an ELITE resumé for recent fighters look at: - Hopkins, Mayweather, Paquiao, Marquez, RJJ (Simply for multi-weight achievements) etc.

Sorry but no, not elite, not at all, could be but when the biggest name on his record is an Oscar De La Hoya who had fought 6 rounds in almost 3 years nah. Floyd Mayweather Jr. is an example of what is wrong with boxing, not making fights unless everything is in his favour, making sladerous accusations to worm out of the biggest fight in boxing, the man belongs in the WWE.

^this.

Captain Hook wrote:

observer1 wrote:I have nothing against him, like i said before many times, he's the better boxer of the recent boxers in the UK.

But for someone who is "46-0", without a single superfight, there will be question marks.

The only Superfight he had i can think of is the BHOP and RJJ fights. both who were at the combined age of 83.
A dodgy SD against one pensioner, and a PPV flop against RJJ - the same RJJ who's career has been in tatters since 2004.

Carl Froch and Andre Ward - Both of whom i cant stand, put Joe to shame. You really think Joe would have been in a tourny like Super Six? i think not.

But i guess if you prefer watching him face mandatories like Mitchell, go ahead.

You think a prime Calzaghe would have lost to Froch, Kessler (already beat him), Abraham and Ward?

No chance

I couldn't care less who loses to who.
I look at who beats who.
Ali lost, Ray robinson lost, Louis lost, leonard lost, Hagler Lost, Holmes lost, Lennox lost.

But look at who they beat. They had superfights, faced the best etc.

banjo wrote:

observer1 wrote:
If you want an ELITE resumé for recent fighters look at: - Hopkins, Mayweather, Paquiao, Marquez, RJJ (Simply for multi-weight achievements) etc.

Sorry but no, not elite, not at all, could be but when the biggest name on his record is an Oscar De La Hoya who had fought 6 rounds in almost 3 years nah. Floyd Mayweather Jr. is an example of what is wrong with boxing, not making fights unless everything is in his favour, making sladerous accusations to worm out of the biggest fight in boxing, the man belongs in the WWE.

Personally, i cant stand Mayweather. He has huge ego issues and is an example of the fallacy and farce of this "hip hop" culture.

Cant knock his skills and 5 weight championship titles though

I say that list says more about fwanks match making and sway with the wbo than anything enzo achieved.

observer1 wrote: Personally, i cant stand Mayweather. He has huge ego issues and is an example of the fallacy and farce of this "hip hop" culture.

Cant knock his skills and 5 weight championship titles though

why y'all diss my boy money like that dawg?

Counter-puncher wrote:

observer1 wrote: Personally, i cant stand Mayweather. He has huge ego issues and is an example of the fallacy and farce of this "hip hop" culture.

Cant knock his skills and 5 weight championship titles though

why y'all diss my boy money like that dawg?

Word

observer1 wrote:I have nothing against him, like i said before many times, he's the better boxer of the recent boxers in the UK.

But for someone who is "46-0", without a single superfight, there will be question marks.

The only Superfight he had i can think of is the BHOP and RJJ fights. both who were at the combined age of 83.
A dodgy SD against one pensioner, and a PPV flop against RJJ - the same RJJ who's career has been in tatters since 2004.

Carl Froch and Andre Ward - Both of whom i cant stand, put Joe to shame. You really think Joe would have been in a tourny like Super Six? i think not.

But i guess if you prefer watching him face mandatories like Mitchell, go ahead.

What's all this superfight crap?

There's hardly anybody who was anybody at 168 over a decade that Calzaghe did not fight. Best at his weight for all that time. Some of those fights were fillers but thats boxing. Of course if he'd fought Tyson or Bruce Lee or Wolverine that would have made it interesting for the no-nothing fan and been a superfight but there's more to boxing than that.

For someone essentially operating out of a market stall in Newbridge Enzo did remarkably well too. Look at the number of Welsh world champions over the last 120 years and then look at how many of them that Enzo trained - that puts him in context.

Two corrections - Evangelou trained with Enzo for about 3 days and then shot off home because he hated the place so much!! Also Lockett was with Brian Hughes when he beat Rhodes

You may be right on the evangelou front however im pretty sure lockett had enzo in the corner for rhodes. Itv made a big deal on how he had 8 guys fighting and 8 guys winning

No he wasn't, that night in question was Williams-Skelton; Maccarinelli-Dominguez and Lockett-Rhodes and Enzo had five on as Doherty and Lockett were still with Brian Hughes. On the Calzaghe-Manfredo bill nine months later, Enzo had seven on :- Calzaghe, Maccarinelli, Pryce, Lockett, Rees, Cleverly and Hope, not eight as you previously stated.

Chris Evangelou trained in the valleys for three days and then disapeared after apparently becoming 'home-sick'.

I always remember watching some pre fight hype show think it was an enzo mac fight where enzo c was going on about how he didnt believe in skipping lol