BoxRec

keithmoonhangover wrote:Tyson before prison wins. Tyson after prison loses.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

Idisagree wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Lyle was a huge puncher & this is Old Foreman anyway. He was never floored

And Tyson was not a huge puncher? Lyle I believe had more brute force but he was not a better puncher than Tyson. Tyson had better technique, way more speed, and better timing.

I never said Mike wasn't. But using Lyle as an example why George didn't have a granite chin is pretty silly. And George was even sturdier during his comeback from what I saw.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:He faced plenty of punchers in his comeback. Stewart,Morrison,Moorer, Cooney and Holyfield has underrated power.

Since this thread is about his comeback, when he never touched the canvas, you might want to give up whatever point you're trying to make about the huge punching Lyle hurting him several times. I'd disagree that he didn't exhibit an excellent chin in that fight anyway. Most any other Heavyweight would have been finished from those shots.

And where in the world are you getting that Tyson couldn't hurt him? I don't recall saying that.

BarryWashington wrote:

Dave81 wrote:1988 Tyson destroys any version of Foreman.

nope.

'70-'74 foreman destroys any version of tyson (including the '85-'88 version). a prime foreman is actually the worst match-up possible for a prime tyson. tyson die-hards would have been crying for a while after what that version of foreman would have done to him.

BarryWashington wrote:

Dave81 wrote:

BarryWashington wrote: nope.

'70-'74 foreman destroys any version of tyson (including the '85-'88 version). a prime foreman is actually the worst match-up possible for a prime tyson. tyson die-hards would have been crying for a while after what that version of foreman would have done to him.

Nope!

Tyson would of been to fast and relentless, Foreman wasn't quick enough, not saying it's an easy fight, but reckon it would of been a simliar ended as the Pinklon Thomas fight.

i see that you're a tyson die-hard. so i know logic won't be apart of this conversation, but anyone who was bigger than mike - someone mike couldn't bully around - someone that wouldn't be afraid to punch mike - someone who could go the distance - some one who could mike would not want to fight anymore (past the 6th) is going to kick mike's ass and no one fits this recipe better than a prime big george.

it's been reported multiple times that if mike couldn't get you out of there right away he would get discouraged and would almost look for a way out. mike would be "relentless" for maybe the first two/three rounds before he realizes that george's stiff jab and uppercut are no joke. prime foreman after the fourth round would see that mike's psyche was folding and it would be curtains for mike around the 8th.

pinky was kickin' mike's ass (i don't know what the eff fight those three judges were watching) before that KO in the 6th. foreman would take what pinky did but only better.

what you have to realize is that mike in his prime wasn't invincible and that a lot of his game when discussing hypothetical fights involves his lack of mental toughness.

i'm a fan of that tyson too but i also know how to look at things realistically/objectively. if that fight ever happened that is the one fight (that if it were possible) i would bet every single penny to my name and would tell my parents the same so we could be rich forever. no way in hell does mike a) win this fight & b) see the final bell.

BarryWashington wrote:

Dave81 wrote:

BarryWashington wrote: nope.

'70-'74 foreman destroys any version of tyson (including the '85-'88 version). a prime foreman is actually the worst match-up possible for a prime tyson. tyson die-hards would have been crying for a while after what that version of foreman would have done to him.

Nope!

Tyson would of been to fast and relentless, Foreman wasn't quick enough, not saying it's an easy fight, but reckon it would of been a simliar ended as the Pinklon Thomas fight.

i see that you're a tyson die-hard. so i know logic won't be apart of this conversation, but anyone who was bigger than mike - someone mike couldn't bully around - someone that wouldn't be afraid to punch mike - someone who could go the distance - some one who could mike would not want to fight anymore (past the 6th) is going to kick mike's ass and no one fits this recipe better than a prime big george.

it's been reported multiple times that if mike couldn't get you out of there right away he would get discouraged and would almost look for a way out. mike would be "relentless" for maybe the first two/three rounds before he realizes that george's stiff jab and uppercut are no joke. prime foreman after the fourth round would see that mike's psyche was folding and it would be curtains for mike around the 8th.

pinky was kickin' mike's ass (i don't know what the eff fight those three judges were watching) before that KO in the 6th. foreman would take what pinky did but only better.

what you have to realize is that mike in his prime wasn't invincible and that a lot of his game when discussing hypothetical fights involves his lack of mental toughness.

i'm a fan of that tyson too but i also know how to look at things realistically/objectively. if that fight ever happened that is the one fight (that if it were possible) i would bet every single penny to my name and would tell my parents the same so we could be rich forever. no way in hell does mike a) win this fight & b) see the final bell.

BarryWashington wrote:

Dave81 wrote:

BarryWashington wrote: i see that you're a tyson die-hard. so i know logic won't be apart of this conversation, but anyone who was bigger than mike - someone mike couldn't bully around - someone that wouldn't be afraid to punch mike - someone who could go the distance - some one who could mike would not want to fight anymore (past the 6th) is going to kick mike's ass and no one fits this recipe better than a prime big george.

it's been reported multiple times that if mike couldn't get you out of there right away he would get discouraged and would almost look for a way out. mike would be "relentless" for maybe the first two/three rounds before he realizes that george's stiff jab and uppercut are no joke. prime foreman after the fourth round would see that mike's psyche was folding and it would be curtains for mike around the 8th.

pinky was kickin' mike's ass (i don't know what the eff fight those three judges were watching) before that KO in the 6th. foreman would take what pinky did but only better.

what you have to realize is that mike in his prime wasn't invincible and that a lot of his game when discussing hypothetical fights involves his lack of mental toughness.

i'm a fan of that tyson too but i also know how to look at things realistically/objectively. if that fight ever happened that is the one fight (that if it were possible) i would bet every single penny to my name and would tell my parents the same so we could be rich forever. no way in hell does mike a) win this fight & b) see the final bell.

Yes im a big Tyson fight, but im also a realist, Tyson went 12 rounds with Tucker and Smith and took probably ever round. I hear what your saying with Foremans power and toughness, but if Lyle puts Foreman down, so doe's Tyson, and one thing Tyson did possibly better than any other fighter, was finish the job when the opponent was hurt. Tyson would of been able to elude Foremans big shots and counter with his quick hooks to the body and head, shortly after that the uppercuts would follow, Tyson could of thrown 4 fast knockout shots by the time Foreman had got one off. Anyway this debate could go on forever, you have your opinion and i have mine.

yeah, we'll have to agree to disagree. the one thing i will say with the lyle fight was that foreman was coming off a 14 month lay-off and i believe it was much easier for lyle to hit foreman than it would have been tyson. i think tyson would have had to lunge/jump at foreman to catch him solid and i believe foreman would have used some tactics to clinch and bully around mike or hold him beside/behind the head and not mike to do much attack upstairs.

and tyson didn't always finish people when he hurt them. he put tillis down pretty hard in the 4th and tillis got up and still gave him a very tough fight. even though it's the not the '85-'88 tyson, tyson had holyfield hurt in the 1st round of their first fight and couldn't do anything after that round (i may have given him a 10-10 round in another round - can't remember which one).

i also believe tucker got some rounds under his belt and it looked like in the smith fight that both were content with just hugging and not trying hurt each other mid-way through the fight.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I didn't think an explanation was necessary. Lyle was a huge puncher, getting hurt and dropped by him does not eliminate you from having a great chin.

I already stated that Tyson was a bigger puncher than those guys. You brought up George's chin and insinuated that it's overrated and that is what I responded to. What does Tyson's power have to do with that?

And for the second time. I never said that Tyson couldn't hurt him. Why do you continue to act like I did?

BarryWashington wrote:pinky was kickin' mike's ass (i don't know what the eff fight those three judges were watching) before that KO in the 6th.

BarryWashington wrote:for all those that seem to want to hang on my one comment about the thomas/tyson fight. i had thomas up 4-1 before the 6th. i haven't seen it in a while so maybe i'll go back and re-watch since it seems to be so blasphemous that that one comment needs to get dissected. pick a new sport to follow? please eff out of here with that noise wanna be experts.

Idisagree wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I didn't think an explanation was necessary. Lyle was a huge puncher, getting hurt and dropped by him does not eliminate you from having a great chin.

I already stated that Tyson was a bigger puncher than those guys. You brought up George's chin and insinuated that it's overrated and that is what I responded to. What does Tyson's power have to do with that?

And for the second time. I never said that Tyson couldn't hurt him. Why do you continue to act like I did?

I never said that Foreman didn’t have a great chin. I responded to the comment that Tyson did not have a chance because Foreman had a granite chin which I disagree. He had a great chin but not quite a granite chin. Juan LaPorte I consider him to have a granite chin. Foreman could be hurt by a huge puncher like Tyson and that is why I would not classify his chin as granite. Maybe you and I define granite chin differently.

Heartbreak_Kid79 wrote:In the late 80s Foreman was continually calling out Tyson:
But remember what a prime Tyson did to a 38 year old Larry Holmes?

I see Tyson winning this on decision as George tires from the mid rounds onwards.

A prime Tyson was much better than the Michael Moorer that Foreman KO'd (whilst losing on points) to win the title.

Tyson decision

BoxBuzz wrote:Just an FYI to those in doubt

Say what you want about who would win and when.....but keep in mind.....

Tyson honestly ducked Foreman..or if you prefer his management ducked Foreman.......and not the other way around.

It's clearly documented in many ways.....here is just one example.

Foreman NEVER backed away from making this fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmG_gR576EA