BoxRec

From the post fight press conference:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wloqFAx7pTU

Go to 5:40
One of Johnsons' team says:

"Carl won the fight, there's nobody up here who doesn't think he won the fight"

Final; nail in the coffin for the draw arguement.

What exactly did Froch do to win the first beyond a shadow of a doubt?

When you typed out that seven paragraph response to me it's almost as if you forgot that I thought Froch won the fight; I don't see why you are trying so hard to convince me of something that I already believe. I admitted that many of the rounds I gave to Johnson were close, and I can understand why you scored several rounds for Froch that I didn't, but if you cannot understand how a case can be made that Johnson won some of those rounds (particularly the first, seventh, and eighth) then it seems to me like you aren't being objective in scoring. Look at the poll, over 50 people thought Froch won by three rounds or less, and many others had Froch up by four. To me it seems like the consensus is that it was a relatively close fight.

Also, I watched the fight with on mute, so I would not be the one influenced by biased commentary. I never said that Johnson hurt Froch, I said that Froch looked a bit uncomfortable. Just because someone looks uncomfortable when they are getting hit with hard punches to the body doesn't necessarily mean that they are about to take a knee or are wincing in agony.

crusader wrote:if you cannot understand how a case can be made that Johnson won some of those rounds (particularly the first, seventh, and eighth) then it seems to me like you aren't being objective in scoring.

Listen, the point that keeps coming across is that Johnson landed a lot of big right hands. I agree, that's fair enough.
But my point is Froch was unaffected by them, and Johnson had no answer for it, except just to throw another right hand a round later.

crusader wrote:I never said that Johnson hurt Froch, I said that Froch looked a bit uncomfortable. Just because someone looks uncomfortable when they are getting hit with hard punches to the body doesn't necessarily mean that they are about to take a knee or are wincing in agony.

But you said that Johnson landed the harder punches... Froch was bale to force Johnson back, when he got too close, but Johnson's best punches did every little damage to Froch.

crusader wrote:Look at the poll, over 50 people thought Froch won by three rounds or less, and many others had Froch up by four. To me it seems like the consensus is that it was a relatively close fight.

You are being narrow-minded, and ignoring evidence. I voted Froch wins by 4 rounds because there as no other options for my scorecard.
Other posters have actually commented on that topic saying that there should be more options in Froch's favour for a longer winning margin.

You said:

crusader wrote:I don't think Froch controlled the tempo

from:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wloqFAx7pTU

from 6:20
Johnsons' man said:
"Carl controlled the fight"

Everyone recognises that Froch controlled the fight except you.

Crease wrote:

crusader wrote:if you cannot understand how a case can be made that Johnson won some of those rounds (particularly the first, seventh, and eighth) then it seems to me like you aren't being objective in scoring.

Listen, the point that keeps coming across is that Johnson landed a lot of big right hands. I agree, that's fair enough.
But my point is Froch was unaffected by them, and Johnson had no answer for it, except just to throw another right hand a round later.

crusader wrote:I never said that Johnson hurt Froch, I said that Froch looked a bit uncomfortable. Just because someone looks uncomfortable when they are getting hit with hard punches to the body doesn't necessarily mean that they are about to take a knee or are wincing in agony.

But you said that Johnson landed the harder punches... Froch was bale to force Johnson back, when he got too close, but Johnson's best punches did every little damage to Froch.

Johnson wasn't pushed back regularly until the final four rounds, all of which I scored for Froch, and if simply moving backwards means a fighter is feeling his opponent's power (as you fallaciously believe), then Froch was obviously feeling Johnson's power for the first eight rounds of the fight. The fact that Johnson would put his hands up and occasionally move backward when Froch came forward with a flurry doesn't mean that the Road Warrior was hurt or unable to take Froch's shots, it just showed that he was trying to defend himself (i.e. not get hit with punches).

As far as Johnson's offense goes, prior to the ninth round he wasn't just throwing two or three right hands a round and doing nothing else, as you seem to be suggesting; in several rounds Johnson was also hitting Froch square in the face with stiff jabs and digging hard shots to the body. You probably didn’t notice all the dimensions of Johnson's attack because you were mesmerized with Froch’s “eye catching” bursts, even if they were sporadic and largely off the mark.

I will repeat myself, I think Froch won the fight and I can see how some people had him winning by a wide margin. I also, however, think a strong case can be made that Johnson pushed Froch hard and made things relatively close. Your pertinacious effort to convince me otherwise makes it pretty clear that you're a big Froch fan.

Crease wrote:

crusader wrote:Look at the poll, over 50 people thought Froch won by three rounds or less, and many others had Froch up by four. To me it seems like the consensus is that it was a relatively close fight.

You are being narrow-minded, and ignoring evidence. I voted Froch wins by 4 rounds because there as no other options for my scorecard.
Other posters have actually commented on that topic saying that there should be more options in Froch's favour for a longer winning margin.

You said:

crusader wrote:I don't think Froch controlled the tempo

from:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wloqFAx7pTU

from 6:20
Johnsons' man said:
"Carl controlled the fight"

Everyone recognises that Froch controlled the fight except you.

Ok, so 52 people thought that there was no more than a three point gap in the scoring, while only 22 people thought Froch won by 4 points or more, and among that group of 22 I'm sure that there were several people who had no more more than a 4 point gap.

Please stop quoting me out of context. I said that I didn't think Froch controlled the tempo during the sixth round:

the sixth was extremely close (I gave it to Froch when I watched the fight a second time) and could have gone either way, but watching it live I thought Johnson landed the harder punches and I don't think Froch controlled the tempo

Fights are scored round by round, so a judge can still have a fighter winning at the end of the bout (as I had Froch winning) even if that fighter did not control things in every round.

are ppl really trying to say this fight was controversial?

Autobarn wrote:are ppl really trying to say this fight was controversial?

I haven't come across any post arguing that Johnson should've won the fight. The debate here is about how many rounds Johnson could've been given. I'm not sure if Crease has caught on yet, but I actually think that Froch beat Johnson.

who did you think won the fight, crusader?

i think you need to clear that one up.

DRAW!