BoxRec

Captain Hook wrote:

bad mamma jamma wrote:

King Geedorah wrote:Nice work, Hooky. Never apologise, never explain.

bit pretentious? why never explain? is there some sort of journo's guild on here?

i liked the piece captain hook wrote but it wasnt a beatdown nor a clinic. wlad used his presence to scare haye, which he did, thus wlad only had to use the 1-2 sparingly. both landed few punches per round.

classic beatdowns would include Hagler v Hearns, Chavez v Rosario etc. classic clinics could include fights such as Calzaghe v Lacy, Leonard v Hagler. dont think haye v wlad falls in either catagory to be honest.

Leonard v Hagler is a "classic clinic" ??????????

Have there ever been a more mis-informed bunch posting on this fecking website?!

Have your own opinion by all means, I for one welcome it, but jeez...

you are also a cheeky pudendum for saying someone with a difference of opinion to you is mis-informed..you seem to react poorly to critique and people with a difference of opinion - you related to smigga?

the way leonard made hagler come to him, unload on his arms and gloves, and then fire away with clusters of accurate shots sure was a clinic,
and by the way, i originally said i liked your piece, i just had an issue with one bit of it...fer fks sake

Captain Hook wrote:

Final round wrote:

charlieb wrote:
That's about the size of it.

By all means, Haye's critics are entitled to their pound of flesh, but let's not get fu*king creative with it.

It was a fight decided by jabs. Haye landed the hardest shots of the fight, came out of it wearing less of the fight on his face than Wlad did, made it the full 12 rounds and wasn't visibly hurt at any point in the fight.

Yes Wlads face was pretty beat up, is that what he would class as a pizza face? Plenty close rounds but apparently Haye was dominated and humbled in front of the eyes of the world.

PS He was DOMINATED and HUMBLED in the eyes of the world, we're not making this up...

I see a domination as an unquestionable shut out for 12 rounds. Haye won rounds imo and looked competetive for a few rounds . Hopkins vs Pavlik was a domination, Floyd vs Marquez was a domination this was not no matter what the score cards from Germany said. Humbled....well I'm not sure about that David never seems the most contrite of people is he humbled in my eyes? No because I was slightly worried he'd be completely nullified and get knocked out and hung out to dry by the haters.

I would definitely classify it as a domination and it seems to me like most people are as well; Wlad was ahead the entire fight and at no time past the halfway point did Haye seem "in" the fight. Sure, Wlad didn't go out guns a blazing, but he was throwing and landing more in virtually every round and doing enough to win most of them beyond doubt. A couple good shots here and there from Haye doesn't change the fact that he won three rounds AT BEST (I gave him one round) and neither does the fact that one of those shots created a tiny nick under Wlad's eye. Completely fair scoring in Germany this time around and a very clear winner.

Matt W wrote:

ashedward wrote:I was always realistic about Davids chances and i don`t think the performance was as bad as the football writers are making out.The toe excuse was ill timed and ill judged,it just gave ammunition for the critics to go over the top.If he was humble in the build up and was humble after, the press would of said it was a brave gallant display like they did for Bruno back in the day.The performance was better then any of Wlads recent challengers and he took some punches that most of us thought would of knocked him out,but he was not big or good enough for Wlad.Lennox would of smashed Wlad imo.

But he wasn't. He is being judged by the standards he set himself, "brutal execution" etc etc. Being better than Wlad's recent challengers isn't setting the bar very high and is scant consolation given the scorn he poured on them. At the very least I wanted to see him really take it to Wladimir when it was obvious that his tactics of 1-2 bombs from distance wasn't going to work.

Yep he has brought it on himself,but that should not distort what actually happened in the fight.People took his trash talking way to seriously imo.I bet Wlad is very happy that his bank balance has greatly improved because of Haye`s antics

Whilst the article was a good read and I do agree with most of it, 'dominating' is not a word I would use to describe Wlad's win.

He won, no disputes, and won by a fair few rounds, however 'dominating' is a strong word and slightly blurs what actually happened.

Futhermore, the toe excuse was just that and probably, in hindsight, not the wisest thing Haye should have done but he was obviously disappointed, frustrated and moreso, frustrated that Wlad was better than he thought.A bit of a wake up call, for sure.

Still a nice article, if overstating the manner of the win and Haye's post fight antics.

PS No mention of how he gave and continues to give Wlad props for his skill and win?

Hagler / Leonard, was a close fight how
can it be a clinic.

HAYE MADE A FOOL OPF HIMSELF....AS USUAL.

Wlad dominated the fight behind a strong jab, of course the word dominated can be used.

I would have preferred dominatoed, but never mind :P

Chambers2 wrote:

Captain Hook wrote:http://news.boxrec.com/news/2011/haye-m ... s-humbling

BoxingNews24 couldn't have done a better job

That's right. Quite literally.

Twinkle Toes wrote:Wlad dominated the fight behind a strong jab, of course the word dominated can be used.

I would have preferred dominatoed, but never mind :P

Toetally dominated!

saad muhammad wrote:Hagler / Leonard, was a close fight how
can it be a clinic.

was it close? for some yes, for others it was quite clear who won. wasnt leonard's display a clinical exhibition as to how to diffuse a pressure fighter? surely i cannot be alone in thinking this?

Pretty much everyone thought Leonard-Hagler was a close fight and many people disagreed on who should have won (check out some mixed opinions below). To call that fight a "classic clinic" seems way off to me, but I guess it shows how people can perceive the same fight very differently.

http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=139550

ashedward wrote:

Matt W wrote:

ashedward wrote:I was always realistic about Davids chances and i don`t think the performance was as bad as the football writers are making out.The toe excuse was ill timed and ill judged,it just gave ammunition for the critics to go over the top.If he was humble in the build up and was humble after, the press would of said it was a brave gallant display like they did for Bruno back in the day.The performance was better then any of Wlads recent challengers and he took some punches that most of us thought would of knocked him out,but he was not big or good enough for Wlad.Lennox would of smashed Wlad imo.

But he wasn't. He is being judged by the standards he set himself, "brutal execution" etc etc. Being better than Wlad's recent challengers isn't setting the bar very high and is scant consolation given the scorn he poured on them. At the very least I wanted to see him really take it to Wladimir when it was obvious that his tactics of 1-2 bombs from distance wasn't going to work.

Yep he has brought it on himself,but that should not distort what actually happened in the fight.People took his trash talking way to seriously imo.I bet Wlad is very happy that his bank balance has greatly improved because of Haye`s antics

I agree about Wlad. I strongly disagree about Haye's performance though. As was the case against Valuev he threw very few shots, and he was essentially hoping to get lucky with a big shot. He lasted 12 rounds, had a few moments and took some good shots, but that doesn't make it a good performance, trash talk or no trash talk. It looked like a 'happy to be here' type performance.

Hagler-Leonard was a very close fight I had it 115/113 to Leonard

there wasnt no beating handed out haye ran??

as for mentioning h.o.f & wlad is now able to have a legacy is fuking laughable as it is cringeworthy :!:

Leonard vs Hagler is one of my favourite fights of all time, and had a lot of "historical" moments for me. It was a masterful display from Leonard given the circumstances (for me, those that say he had the rub of the green in turns of the rounds and the ringsize - well Hagler could have said no). However, it wasn't a clinic..... that involves being dominant.... Leonard wasn't end of (but who would be against Hagler).

Clinics include Mosley vs Margarito, Mayweather vs Mosley, Wright vs Mosley 1, Hopkins vs Trinidad etc.

There would be a seperate category for Leonard's performance vs Hagler, and you could Mosley vs DLH 1 to that list.

stujones wrote:Leonard vs Hagler is one of my favourite fights of all time, and had a lot of "historical" moments for me. It was a masterful display from Leonard given the circumstances (for me, those that say he had the rub of the green in turns of the rounds and the ringsize - well Hagler could have said no). However, it wasn't a clinic..... that involves being dominant.... Leonard wasn't end of (but who would be against Hagler).

Clinics include Mosley vs Margarito, Mayweather vs Mosley, Wright vs Mosley 1, Hopkins vs Trinidad etc.

There would be a seperate category for Leonard's performance vs Hagler, and you could Mosley vs DLH 1 to that list.

Leonard had never fought at middleweight and had fought once in 5 years and looked poor. To say he stole the fight at the negotiating table is unfair given what Leonard was able to do that night. I've watched it again and again and can't see it for Hagler (and it was a masterful display, but no clinic).

And you could add Wright-Trinidad to the 'clinic' category.

Matt W wrote:

stujones wrote:Leonard vs Hagler is one of my favourite fights of all time, and had a lot of "historical" moments for me. It was a masterful display from Leonard given the circumstances (for me, those that say he had the rub of the green in turns of the rounds and the ringsize - well Hagler could have said no). However, it wasn't a clinic..... that involves being dominant.... Leonard wasn't end of (but who would be against Hagler).

Clinics include Mosley vs Margarito, Mayweather vs Mosley, Wright vs Mosley 1, Hopkins vs Trinidad etc.

There would be a seperate category for Leonard's performance vs Hagler, and you could Mosley vs DLH 1 to that list.

Leonard had never fought at middleweight and had fought once in 5 years and looked poor. To say he stole the fight at the negotiating table is unfair given what Leonard was able to do that night. I've watched it again and again and can't see it for Hagler (and it was a masterful display, but no clinic).

And you could add Wright-Trinidad to the 'clinic' category.

Completely agree with everything you say...... for me the bigger debate has not been the card but "what would have happened had it been a 15 rounder" - I think, as tired as he was - Leonard would have still found a way.

I was merely pointing out what other people stress about the fight.... as I said, Hagler accepted the terms.... so fight on. I never thought he stole the fight at the negotiating table, others have though so I noted that.

This article gets your disappointment across accurately enough, but its six days after and we've heard it all before.

I felt same as you straight after the fight, but I couldn't really give a toss about it now. I'm looking forward to Mitchell Murray, or Chisora Fury. Write something about that.

leonard squeezed that fight :!: the sweet science :!: like said leonard had been out along time i dont think it was 5 years :!: :!:
anyhow atleast 2 & we have all seen what rust does, but to get back in first fight against a p4p no1 & make it touch & go is unbelievable.i remember being very young & my dad fancied leonard to win & people thought he was off his head,as it was considerd suicide for srl.
for me it wasnt what leonard was doing but what hagler couldnt do & the only enjoyment was srl's last minute of the rd flashy combos that lifted the crowd & judges eyebrow's.srl was meant to be the lamb to the slaughter but it became bull v matador but without the bulll really tiring but getting made to look controlable.

ok guys, respect your opinions, and maybe leonard v hagler was not a classic clinic but it was a masterful display...however surely to call leonard's display a clinic is still much more accurate than the original poster's article which says Wlad v Haye was a "one sided beatdown" ?

hurlock wrote:leonard squeezed that fight :!: the sweet science :!: like said leonard had been out along time i dont think it was 5 years :!: :!:
anyhow atleast 2 & we have all seen what rust does, but to get back in first fight against a p4p no1 & make it touch & go is unbelievable.i remember being very young & my dad fancied leonard to win & people thought he was off his head,as it was considerd suicide for srl.
for me it wasnt what leonard was doing but what hagler couldnt do & the only enjoyment was srl's last minute of the rd flashy combos that lifted the crowd & judges eyebrow's.srl was meant to be the lamb to the slaughter but it became bull v matador but without the bulll really tiring but getting made to look controlable.

very good take on things, i was also a kid at the time and thought hagler would put srl in hospital. however for some reason hagler looked ponderous on that night. the hagler who fought mugabi seemed to have more speed and power...imo

bad mamma jamma wrote:

hurlock wrote:leonard squeezed that fight :!: the sweet science :!: like said leonard had been out along time i dont think it was 5 years :!: :!:
anyhow atleast 2 & we have all seen what rust does, but to get back in first fight against a p4p no1 & make it touch & go is unbelievable.i remember being very young & my dad fancied leonard to win & people thought he was off his head,as it was considerd suicide for srl.
for me it wasnt what leonard was doing but what hagler couldnt do & the only enjoyment was srl's last minute of the rd flashy combos that lifted the crowd & judges eyebrow's.srl was meant to be the lamb to the slaughter but it became bull v matador but without the bulll really tiring but getting made to look controlable.

very good take on things, i was also a kid at the time and thought hagler would put srl in hospital. however for some reason hagler looked ponderous on that night. the hagler who fought mugabi seemed to have more speed and power...imo

leonard was harder to hit & mugabi was a freaky puncher who was a bad liver & thought haglers hunt & kill approach would play into his hands by planting his feet & banging him out & hagler done his approach & looked like the terminator in the process with his granite jaw but once retired recalled mugabi hurt him more then anyone :!: mugabi was a olmpic silver medalist & could really box but never needed to.

Leonard-Hagler, now we are talking...no clinic though, very competitive fight, shifts in pattern. From memory, Leonard first 4, Hagler started slow and orthodox. Hagler came back into it, rallied in the 5th, 7th and 9th, many close rounds, Leonard edged the last 3 rounds and was maybe 2 up, possibly 1?

Biggest myth in boxing though that Hagler was robbed.

Ring size, gloves, 12 rounds...people can claim what they want, all advantages were with Hagler, momentum, size, etc. People always use hindsight, but at the time I think Marvin was 1-3 at the bookies.

2 great fighters, Ray just a tiny tiny bit better?

First time I've read Haye is going anywhere near the Hall of Fame....that's never going to happen. Steve Roberts is ahead of him in the queue for nomination.