BoxRec

klompton wrote:I find all of these Tyson rants strange. Savarese? Suspicious? Jobbed by the ref? Have you watched that fight? Tyson was on his way to killing Savarese whose head was bobbing around like a cork on a rolling sea.

Initially I thought Tyson Etienne was suspicious but when you watch it from different angles Tyson clearly lands a very nice punch. Etienne wasnt exactly made of granite. This is the guy who was dropped by Botha, and umpteen times by Oquendo of all people.

Tyson-Spinks LOL, Spinks' eyes were dancing around in his head like he had just come out of the ether and to suggest the second knockdown (which was worse than first) was from a nothing punch is pretty hilarious.

Tyson Norris was suspicious but only because of Norris' quit job. You can clearly hear his manager screaming from outside the ring "stay down, we'll get another fight!" Norris looked pretty pathetic trying to make up an excuse. Blaming his knee, after getting up and walking to his corner completely fine, no limp, and under total control after the knockdown. They just wanted a DQ or NC and a rematch to double their money.

re the Savarese fight-

I think the word "jobbed" by the ref is way too strong, but I do think the ref jumped in too early.

Tyson doubtless was going to overwhelm Savarese, but the fight was definitely stopped too quickly.

a more recent one is JMM's first round KO of Ramos. no doubt the punch landed cleanly and probably would have floored him, but it was not a flat on your back, eyes closed, unconcious type of punch.

Tyson didn't hit Stewart or Seldon with anything that would make me blink. Suspect doesn't mean that money was exchanged for a service. It could just mean that someone was too scared to fight and took the easy way out. That's my guess on both of those.

Mike almost knocked Etienne's head off. That was not only legit, it was brutal.

bluerosekiller wrote:Tyson-Stewart was totally legit.
I worked corners for two fighters on the undercard & as a result I was around both fighters & both locker rooms that night & Stewart was pretty much a wreck going into it. It was a perfect example of a fighter's nerves getting the best of him LONG before he set foot in the ring.
I don't believe that he was frightened of Tyson or of what he could/would do to him physically. I mean he'd hung tough with a young peaking Holyfield for almost 8 rounds, had a war with Moorer when Moorer was still in his destroyer mode, then post Tyson went another 12 with Holyfield & engaged in a brutal, bloody war with Foreman. So, he had heart.
He was just afraid of being embarrassed.
He didn't want to get knocked down in the first round.
He was SO concerned about that. much less get knocked out in the first round!
So, he went into that first round overly concerned about staying upright, which, of course made him tight as a drum & down he went three times...
Poor guy, I felt really bad for him.

Whose corners did you work?

Dokes-Weaver. Someone was paid off.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Tyson didn't hit Stewart or Seldon with anything that would make me blink. Suspect doesn't mean that money was exchanged for a service. It could just mean that someone was too scared to fight and took the easy way out. That's my guess on both of those.

Mike almost knocked Etienne's head off. That was not only legit, it was brutal.

If I may speak for GNIrene on this one. I think his problem with the knock out is that Cliff very clearly could have gotten up. He immediatly took his own mouth piece out with his glove, which isn't easy to do if you are hurt. He layed there listening to the count. The second 10 was hit he was able to stand up and hug Mike and was clearly seen saying long full sentences into Mike's ear.

He didn't take a dive, or get punched on purpose, but he had no intention of fighting to win and that punch was his first opportunity out of it.

I think what sealed that opinion for me was what Etienne said in an interview I did with him just after he went to prison. When he showed up in Memphis he was told Tyson was canceling the fight. The next morning he was told the fight was back on. He was pissed off and said he wasn't going to put up with Mike's nonsense and he refused to fight. His promotor or manager finally convinced him just to "go get that money." ..."And so that is what I did."

That didn't sound good to me.

I will agree it was certainly a hard punch compared to most anything else in this topic though.

Irene and I have had that argument before, I know his stance.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Irene and I have had that argument before, I know his stance.

I wasn't trying to intrude Saad. I actually glanced over that you had written the comment. Either way, I would agree it isn't a "suspicious" KO in the way the others on here are. I would label that first round KO as annoying. I will never get that 50 bucks back.

As I mentioned in another thread: Luisito Espinosa vs Khaokor Galaxy. Now that was suspicious. One of the oddest KO's I've ever seen. I've heard Galaxy was exceptionally weight-drained, and if so it makes some sense, as it looks like he just kind of fainted in mid ring. Otherwise it was the most unconvincing fall job I've ever seen.

jrc26 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Irene and I have had that argument before, I know his stance.

I wasn't trying to intrude Saad. I actually glanced over that you had written the comment. Either way, I would agree it isn't a "suspicious" KO in the way the others on here are. I would label that first round KO as annoying. I will never get that 50 bucks back.

I didn't take it that way. I think that was on Showtime.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

jrc26 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Irene and I have had that argument before, I know his stance.

I wasn't trying to intrude Saad. I actually glanced over that you had written the comment. Either way, I would agree it isn't a "suspicious" KO in the way the others on here are. I would label that first round KO as annoying. I will never get that 50 bucks back.

I didn't take it that way. I think that was on Showtime.

Unfortunately it was Showtime PPV. I remember well because my 3 buddies came over, drank my beer, and of course they would get me their cut of the PPV buy later. Needless to say, after the :49 seconds I never actually saw that money.

I don't think it was on PPV, just regular Showtime.

BarryWashington wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I don't think it was on PPV, just regular Showtime.

Okay, well that was my first time (I think) watching a Showtime/HBO Boxing event. Either that or the Mosley/Forrest fight.

It was a lot of bong hits ago, I could be wrong. But I don't think so. My memory is pretty strong.

Tyson-Ettienne was in fact a regular Showtime boxing card...for the record

jrc26 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Tyson didn't hit Stewart or Seldon with anything that would make me blink. Suspect doesn't mean that money was exchanged for a service. It could just mean that someone was too scared to fight and took the easy way out. That's my guess on both of those.

Mike almost knocked Etienne's head off. That was not only legit, it was brutal.

If I may speak for GNIrene on this one. I think his problem with the knock out is that Cliff very clearly could have gotten up. He immediatly took his own mouth piece out with his glove, which isn't easy to do if you are hurt. He layed there listening to the count. The second 10 was hit he was able to stand up and hug Mike and was clearly seen saying long full sentences into Mike's ear.

He didn't take a dive, or get punched on purpose, but he had no intention of fighting to win and that punch was his first opportunity out of it.

I think what sealed that opinion for me was what Etienne said in an interview I did with him just after he went to prison. When he showed up in Memphis he was told Tyson was canceling the fight. The next morning he was told the fight was back on. He was pissed off and said he wasn't going to put up with Mike's nonsense and he refused to fight. His promotor or manager finally convinced him just to "go get that money." ..."And so that is what I did."

That didn't sound good to me.

I will agree it was certainly a hard punch compared to most anything else in this topic though.

You may indeed speak for me, with a post so eloquent as that.

Saad & I, obviously, very much agree to disagree on this one.

The first Michael Dokes vs Mike Weaver bout comes to mind. Suspect = referee Joey Curtis, in the Ring, with a bow tie.

The thing about Walcott-Marciano 2 that I found strange was the count itself. Watch it closely. something weird about the audio. Id dosent realy line up with the actual time. If u count 1 from the first time the ref pics it up and disregaurd the audio the count only goes to 9 then Walcott springs up and is confused as to why it was stopped. Check it out. Id like to see if anyone else picked up on this. The right uppercut however def. landed and the type of punch it was , im sure it was very damaging. A short right uppercut in close as Marciano was moving forward and Walcott's head was down. That IS a deadly punch. It's the count the stuck out for me.

The Scranton Assassin wrote:The thing about Walcott-Marciano 2 that I found strange was the count itself. Watch it closely. something weird about the audio. Id dosent realy line up with the actual time. If u count 1 from the first time the ref pics it up and disregaurd the audio the count only goes to 9 then Walcott springs up and is confused as to why it was stopped. Check it out. Id like to see if anyone else picked up on this. The right uppercut however def. landed and the type of punch it was , im sure it was very damaging. A short right uppercut in close as Marciano was moving forward and Walcott's head was down. That IS a deadly punch. It's the count the stuck out for me.

Watch this you tube of it (very clear):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRvQ8UPOKpY

Yes, at first blush, it looks like Walcott got a short count. However, if you look in the bottom of the screen, you can see the timekeeper's hand. The referee picks it up at the timekeeper's two count; THAT's why it looks like the referee counted only to nine. But the timekeeper made it to ten, and Walcott missed the count by just a split-second. (I've just checked it ten or 11 times with my digital stopwatch and the count is accurate. Walcott's glove is still on the canvas and he's still rising for a split-second after the ten count.)