BoxRec

He achieved far more in the ring then then at least a quarter the inductees to the IBHOF and it will be a complete joke if he dosen't get in this time. Unfortunately most of the voting members are probably like Bert Sugar and stuck in the good ole days wheras Naz actually understood how to sell boxing to a young crowd and made his fights Events.

exittored wrote:He achieved far more in the ring then then at least a quarter the inductees to the IBHOF and it will be a complete joke if he dosen't get in this time. Unfortunately most of the voting members are probably like Bert Sugar and stuck in the good ole days wheras Naz actually understood how to sell boxing to a young crowd and made his fights Events.

I nearly fainted when I read that, until I realised you mean Naz (and not Ottke)

Tommy hearns seems to have taken a long time getting there?

Terminator666 wrote:Tommy hearns seems to have taken a long time getting there?

Got to be inactive (retired) for 5 years

Micheal Jackson came to watch Naz train simples. Tyson Fury gets Josie from big bro and stacey soloman. David Haye gets dizzee rascal.

Hall of fame deffo. He brought showbiz and entertainment together.

I went to his fight at wembley arena and I wanted to see his entrance more than the fight.

I feel his ego was so big the defeat just deflated him so badly he could not sort his head out.

wesley 05 totally agree NAZ LEG END

Nassam annoyed the hell out of most people with his bragging about being a legend, a five weight champion, his overlong entrances, his religious rants post fight and his numerous non-starting comebacks.

Last year Tyson was inducted and there were career similairities. In his prime 86-88, he was one of the best heavyweights of all time, youngest ever heavyweight champ and then it all went wrong, he had enough natural skill and talant to remain at the top for several years in his decline but crashed and burned very quickly.

Nassem was a revelation around 20, he had an illusive slippery defense, was a switch hitter that had power in both hands. He wiped the floor with experienced former European Champions like Belcastro and was magical against Stevie Robinson.

He was criticised for facing old washed up champions by his detractors but then he also beat fighters that would then go onto win belts such as Medina, and Ingle. He faced 10 champions of one form or another

His decline set in as soon as he signed for HBO his ego involved him in a war with Kevin Kelley that was entertaining but unecessarily dangerous, he neglected the defensive skills and the movement that was such an effective part of his package and progressively relied more on single punch power.

He was unimpressive against Medina but had a cold, body slammed Soto in a drab fight and then benefited from special status from the WBO that allowed him to line up domestic contender after domestic contender and avoid a live mandatory like Marquez. Eventually his skills eroded to suh an extend that Augie Sanchez involved him in an up and down war just like Kelley had 5 years previously. However Sanchez was not Kevin Kelly

Barrara exposed his one dimensional style and sheepskin gloves became more important than revenge. A final fight against Calvo confirmed just how far he had declined since he beat Belcastro all the years ago.

I used to argue and argue on forums with Americans that would not give him any credit for his achievements. That was not accurate, he achieved a lot and defined a lot of the benchmarks of modern TV boxing, but to put him into the HOF would only dilute the status anymore. It is wrong to contend that if Stallone and McGuiggan get in so should Nassem.

He did rule a division for five years but avoided his best mandatory for at least a year and never avenged his only defeat. That is not the stuff of legend.

What exactly is the criteria?

coghaugen11 wrote:What exactly is the criteria?

that's the problem, as with most thing's in boxing it's a grey area.

I'd lean towards No to be honest, and I was a huge Naz fan.

Signature wins just weren't of a high enough quality.

Petaling Pete wrote:Nassam annoyed the hell out of most people with his bragging about being a legend, a five weight champion, his overlong entrances, his religious rants post fight and his numerous non-starting comebacks.

Last year Tyson was inducted and there were career similairities. In his prime 86-88, he was one of the best heavyweights of all time, youngest ever heavyweight champ and then it all went wrong, he had enough natural skill and talant to remain at the top for several years in his decline but crashed and burned very quickly.

Nassem was a revelation around 20, he had an illusive slippery defense, was a switch hitter that had power in both hands. He wiped the floor with experienced former European Champions like Belcastro and was magical against Stevie Robinson.

He was criticised for facing old washed up champions by his detractors but then he also beat fighters that would then go onto win belts such as Medina, and Ingle. He faced 10 champions of one form or another

His decline set in as soon as he signed for HBO his ego involved him in a war with Kevin Kelley that was entertaining but unecessarily dangerous, he neglected the defensive skills and the movement that was such an effective part of his package and progressively relied more on single punch power.

He was unimpressive against Medina but had a cold, body slammed Soto in a drab fight and then benefited from special status from the WBO that allowed him to line up domestic contender after domestic contender and avoid a live mandatory like Marquez. Eventually his skills eroded to suh an extend that Augie Sanchez involved him in an up and down war just like Kelley had 5 years previously. However Sanchez was not Kevin Kelly

Barrara exposed his one dimensional style and sheepskin gloves became more important than revenge. A final fight against Calvo confirmed just how far he had declined since he beat Belcastro all the years ago.

I used to argue and argue on forums with Americans that would not give him any credit for his achievements. That was not accurate, he achieved a lot and defined a lot of the benchmarks of modern TV boxing, but to put him into the HOF would only dilute the status anymore. It is wrong to contend that if Stallone and McGuiggan get in so should Nassem.

He did rule a division for five years but avoided his best mandatory for at least a year and never avenged his only defeat. That is not the stuff of legend.

That's pretty much what i was saying, it was a combination of his ego and a neglect of his style that cost him

Ottke? is a joke, he should not be in there. Hometown advantage during his entire career. Robin Reid boxed his head off and still lost. What a joke.

Naz deserves his place, he dominated his division and put people away in convincing fashion. It's just a pity he stopped when he did. He could have gone on and won other titles I'm sure. He should have stayed a switch-hitter, and I'm sure the Barrera fight would have been more exciting and competitive.

100% yes naz lit up boxing like no other how can mcguigan be in ant not naz? naz would have splattered mcguigan, like naz said a while back in a interview he was bloody good

Naz did nmore for the sport in this country than bruno, arguably. People loved Bruno but theywere old grannies included. I doubt they took up the sort. Naz played the role of the bad man to a T!

Naz = 1st ballot!

Wrists wrote:If Barry McGuigan got in (and this is not a pop at Barry) then a featherweight whose accomplishments in the ring are better as well as the added charisma he brought to the sport then Naz should be a shoe in.

An absolute shoe in

My feelings in a nutshell. The big money he bought to the lighter weights is also not to be overlooked.

It's a hall of fame, not of accomplishment.

JimJim2009 wrote:

exittored wrote:He achieved far more in the ring then then at least a quarter the inductees to the IBHOF and it will be a complete joke if he dosen't get in this time. Unfortunately most of the voting members are probably like Bert Sugar and stuck in the good ole days wheras Naz actually understood how to sell boxing to a young crowd and made his fights Events.

I nearly fainted when I read that, until I realised you mean Naz (and not Ottke)

Believe it or not but i'm a Sven Ottke fan and admired his brand of very technical boxing and would argue he's very under-rated. Sure most people found him boring and a fake champion especially compared to Calzaghe but for me take away Mikkel Kessler from Joes resume and there isn't much difference between the quality of opposition they both fought at Super Middleweight. Of cause Joe beat the alot of the same opposition by tko/ko but he was a natural puncher especially in his younger days and had greater hand-speed and footwork but Sven still managed to win his fights despite not having any one advantage physcially but rather use his boxing brain which allowed him to beat opponents through very accurate punching mainly from pinpoint jabbing. His ethos was very much the amateur style of scoring points rather then the power and volume of the pro's.

Yes he probably benefited from favourable ref and judging in Germany but i'll be honest and say having seen all his fights that he was never given a decision that was an out and out robbery, sure he'd get the nod in close fights like Brewer and Johnson but even against Robin Reid he basically won every round from the 6th onwards so did enough to earn at least the draw.

You can't argue with 20 World title defences, unified IBF/WBA champion and wins over Present and Past world champions amongst those 20 defences like Charles Brewer, Glen Johnson, Silvio Branco, Anthony Mundine, Byron Mitchell and Robin Reid plus good defences against Top 10 opponents like Mads Larsen, David Starie, Rudy Markussen, Thomas Tate and James Butler.

Add to this the fact he turned Pro just a few months before turning 30 years old so we probably never got to see the best of Sven Ottke and winning a World title in under 18 months from turning Pro is still a great achievement. Also he had to win nearly all his fights via decisions due to having Zero power. I'm not going to make the case that he would have beaten Calzaghe but it would have been alot closer then people think.

exittored wrote:

JimJim2009 wrote:

exittored wrote:He achieved far more in the ring then then at least a quarter the inductees to the IBHOF and it will be a complete joke if he dosen't get in this time. Unfortunately most of the voting members are probably like Bert Sugar and stuck in the good ole days wheras Naz actually understood how to sell boxing to a young crowd and made his fights Events.

I nearly fainted when I read that, until I realised you mean Naz (and not Ottke)

Believe it or not but i'm a Sven Ottke fan and admired his brand of very technical boxing and would argue he's very under-rated. Sure most people found him boring and a fake champion especially compared to Calzaghe but for me take away Mikkel Kessler from Joes resume and there isn't much difference between the quality of opposition they both fought at Super Middleweight. Of cause Joe beat the alot of the same opposition by tko/ko but he was a natural puncher especially in his younger days and had greater hand-speed and footwork but Sven still managed to win his fights despite not having any one advantage physcially but rather use his boxing brain which allowed him to beat opponents through very accurate punching mainly from pinpoint jabbing. His ethos was very much the amateur style of scoring points rather then the power and volume of the pro's.

Yes he probably benefited from favourable ref and judging in Germany but i'll be honest and say having seen all his fights that he was never given a decision that was an out and out robbery, sure he'd get the nod in close fights like Brewer and Johnson but even against Robin Reid he basically won every round from the 6th onwards so did enough to earn at least the draw.

You can't argue with 20 World title defences, unified IBF/WBA champion and wins over Present and Past world champions amongst those 20 defences like Charles Brewer, Glen Johnson, Silvio Branco, Anthony Mundine, Byron Mitchell and Robin Reid plus good defences against Top 10 opponents like Mads Larsen, David Starie, Rudy Markussen, Thomas Tate and James Butler.

Add to this the fact he turned Pro just a few months before turning 30 years old so we probably never got to see the best of Sven Ottke and winning a World title in under 18 months from turning Pro is still a great achievement. Also he had to win nearly all his fights via decisions due to having Zero power. I'm not going to make the case that he would have beaten Calzaghe but it would have been alot closer then people think.

Good post - out of their common opponents - only a bitter Robin Reid predicted that Calzaghe would beat Ottke. Starie, Mitchell etc said it was tough to call. Starie made a comment, albeit probably a sarcastic comment based on his style, but I would say it is a backhanded compliment anyway (with the emphasis on compliment) - that Ottke could move backwards faster than he could move foreward.

Ottke resume was better than Calzaghe's at Super Middleweight if you discount Kessler no two ways about it.

I did chuckle though cause I remember it being debated on these forums when Joe and Sven were active and when they just retired.... many were saying Ottke would be forgotton about and a few years and will not go down in history at all and will never make the HoF..... I never thought he would get in also..... but here he is first ballot. Shocked, but in someways glad - boxing is thriving in Germany, far far far healthier than it is in the UK - and Ottke played a massive part in that.

Deserves to be in ahead of Michaelswecki IMO.

Funny you should mention the Hitman, If my memory serves me correctly isn't Virgil Hill (whom Hearns defeated) the former WBA Light-Heavyweight world titlist also eliigible for the Hall of Fame next year as he lost in 2007 as he lost against Arslan in Germany in his last fight. But he had two long reigns of 4 and 5 years respectively as a tilist he deserves entrance into the Hall of Fame, and I do think that Prince Nasseem should be entered into the Hall of Fame as well.

stujones wrote:

only a bitter Robin Reid predicted that Calzaghe would beat Ottke.

Not sure the "bitter" comment is fair, although it wouldn't be unreasonable if he was.

I thought Reid beat Calzaghe (can't remember why there wasn't a rematch - probably money/options) and the decision in the Otke fight was crazy.

bripez wrote:

stujones wrote:

only a bitter Robin Reid predicted that Calzaghe would beat Ottke.

Not sure the "bitter" comment is fair, although it wouldn't be unreasonable if he was.

I thought Reid beat Calzaghe (can't remember why there wasn't a rematch - probably money/options) and the decision in the Otke fight was crazy.

I watched Ottke vs Reid as a Robin Reid fan and had never seen Sven before as i'd heard he was really boring to watch.

I actually had Ottke beating Reid 7rds to 5 due mainly to Sven taking over the second half of the fight and giving Reid a bit of a boxing lesson and i included the KD too so had a score of 114-113 Ottke. I accept the ref was biased towards Ottke but at the same time Reid was fighting dirty at times too so the 1 point deduction wasn't that unexpected. I just remember the British commentary doing what they do best and giving a very one sided take on the fight without giving credit to what Sven was doing.

I was impressed by Otke's brand of Technical boxing so checked out alot of his other fights and yeah they're an aquired taste in the same way watching someone like B-hops can be as both don't throw alot of punches but they're both very accurate when they do. Sven won fights through precision punching, if he fought the same way in America or Britain where they tend to go for power and volume then he may have ended his career with 3 or 4 losses but his style worked for the German market where the amateur style of point scoring is more appreciated.

Without a doubt for me. The memories he gave us all, the entertainment, the Kelly fight. And more importantly, the skills he had. Hardest hitting featherweight you could wish to see, such speef, such skill. No brainer

ryanst1982 wrote:Without a doubt for me. The memories he gave us all, the entertainment, the Kelly fight. And more importantly, the skills he had. Hardest hitting featherweight you could wish to see, such speef, such skill. No brainer

one word yes

The 1bangkid wrote:

ryanst1982 wrote:Without a doubt for me. The memories he gave us all, the entertainment, the Kelly fight. And more importantly, the skills he had. Hardest hitting featherweight you could wish to see, such speef, such skill. No brainer

one word yes

x 2

HERE COME DA HOTSTEPPER......Saw his 1st amateur bout and from hating all that " hands down bollox!" as me dad called it, grew to accept, then embrace the excitement,power and god given talent this kid had. His name was on every1s lips for a long time and whenever you mention boxing to the most casual fan his along with Benn and Eubank are the 1st to be recalled. As for his record, while he did benefit from FW's mantra of matching his kids with champs either before or just after their peaks, he still did some serious damage to the 126 pounders in his era. 100 PER CENT IN!!!!

IRLangmaid25 wrote:Funny you should mention the Hitman, If my memory serves me correctly isn't Virgil Hill (whom Hearns defeated) the former WBA Light-Heavyweight world titlist also eliigible for the Hall of Fame next year as he lost in 2007 as he lost against Arslan in Germany in his last fight. But he had two long reigns of 4 and 5 years respectively as a tilist he deserves entrance into the Hall of Fame, and I do think that Prince Nasseem should be entered into the Hall of Fame as well.

I aint sure if it is 5 years from the announcement or 5 years from the HoF day - so maybe he just misses the cut.

Given the type of fighter they are putting in now - he will be a certainty in the near future. Only real advantage Ottke and DM have is fame in the respected home countries. They were bigger stars in Germany and Poland (DM) than Hill was in the states... but in terms of Achievements I would give Hill a definate edge.

stujones wrote:

IRLangmaid25 wrote:Funny you should mention the Hitman, If my memory serves me correctly isn't Virgil Hill (whom Hearns defeated) the former WBA Light-Heavyweight world titlist also eliigible for the Hall of Fame next year as he lost in 2007 as he lost against Arslan in Germany in his last fight. But he had two long reigns of 4 and 5 years respectively as a tilist he deserves entrance into the Hall of Fame, and I do think that Prince Nasseem should be entered into the Hall of Fame as well.

I aint sure if it is 5 years from the announcement or 5 years from the HoF day - so maybe he just misses the cut.

Given the type of fighter they are putting in now - he will be a certainty in the near future. Only real advantage Ottke and DM have is fame in the respected home countries. They were bigger stars in Germany and Poland (DM) than Hill was in the states... but in terms of Achievements I would give Hill a definate edge.

Hill losing to Hearns is enough for him not to get into the IBHOF for me. Hall of famers beat blown up, aging welterweights.

keithmoonhangover wrote:

stujones wrote:

IRLangmaid25 wrote:Funny you should mention the Hitman, If my memory serves me correctly isn't Virgil Hill (whom Hearns defeated) the former WBA Light-Heavyweight world titlist also eliigible for the Hall of Fame next year as he lost in 2007 as he lost against Arslan in Germany in his last fight. But he had two long reigns of 4 and 5 years respectively as a tilist he deserves entrance into the Hall of Fame, and I do think that Prince Nasseem should be entered into the Hall of Fame as well.

I aint sure if it is 5 years from the announcement or 5 years from the HoF day - so maybe he just misses the cut.

Given the type of fighter they are putting in now - he will be a certainty in the near future. Only real advantage Ottke and DM have is fame in the respected home countries. They were bigger stars in Germany and Poland (DM) than Hill was in the states... but in terms of Achievements I would give Hill a definate edge.

Hill losing to Hearns is enough for him not to get into the IBHOF for me. Hall of famers beat blown up, aging welterweights.

Yeah Keith but he's a 3 time champ, he won the CW title also.

Still can't get over Roy Jones cracking his spine with one punch though