BoxRec

Feel sorry for David Barnes. Missing out on this fight after the last one got stopped on cuts. That's how the game is though I suppose

Surely a promoter puts in a purse bid based on their due dilligence (i.e. they have looked at who the boxers are and what he could "sell" and what he would need to pay them both - he then bids accordingly).

For a promoter to turn around months later saying it "did not work out financially" is wrong - if they cannot sell the fight then don't bid. If a bid is made then it is up to the promoter to promotes the fight (it is in their job title !)

If the boxers want a high purse, or he thinks that he can only sell so many tickets then bid lower - how simple could it be ? it is supplier/demand economics at the most basic level.[/quote]
Says alot how the winning promotor annouced fight one week and cancelled the next. As you say surely a promotor shoul donly put a bid in they can afford.

Leforge ,

This fight was agreed in private between all parties before the purse bid and therefore never went out to bids - the promoter then changed the date for it !.

Regards,

STEVE WOOD

STEVE WOOD wrote:Leforge ,

This fight was agreed in private between all parties before the purse bid and therefore never went out to bids - the promoter then changed the date for it !.

Regards,

STEVE WOOD

CHeers. Why did he change the date when it was annouced for 13th October?

leforge wrote:

STEVE WOOD wrote:Leforge ,

This fight was agreed in private between all parties before the purse bid and therefore never went out to bids - the promoter then changed the date for it !.

Regards,

STEVE WOOD

CHeers. Why did he change the date when it was annouced for 13th October?

So was it impossible for Rose to fight someone in the British Top Ten? Instead of fighting a welterweight who last fought at 10.3

I think most guys in top ten would like a title shot if given the chance at the champ which involve a bit more cash than a none tv show can provide.
Plus its hard to geta guy in the top ten not signed to a promoter and most other promoters wouldnt take a chance of there guy losing when theres no gain.

jonp wrote:I think most guys in top ten would like a title shot if given the chance at the champ which involve a bit more cash than a none tv show can provide.
Plus its hard to geta guy in the top ten not signed to a promoter and most other promoters wouldnt take a chance of there guy losing when theres no gain.

I can understand when boxers like Joe Selkirk threatens to retire because of boxing politics.

winkveron wrote:Feel sorry for David Barnes. Missing out on this fight after the last one got stopped on cuts. That's how the game is though I suppose

How do you mean you feel sorry for Barnes? Missing out on what fight?
Don't understand?

d wrote:

winkveron wrote:Feel sorry for David Barnes. Missing out on this fight after the last one got stopped on cuts. That's how the game is though I suppose

How do you mean you feel sorry for Barnes? Missing out on what fight?
Don't understand?

Well he had the fight with Harris, which would've been a great name to make a comeback against. Then it got stopped on an accidental cut didn't it. Just meant it's a shame that this scenario didn't work out for him. That's all.

winkveron wrote:

d wrote:

winkveron wrote:Feel sorry for David Barnes. Missing out on this fight after the last one got stopped on cuts. That's how the game is though I suppose

How do you mean you feel sorry for Barnes? Missing out on what fight?
Don't understand?

Well he had the fight with Harris, which would've been a great name to make a comeback against. Then it got stopped on an accidental cut didn't it. Just meant it's a shame that this scenario didn't work out for him. That's all.

Ah, yeah it was a shame how it worked out.
No point in a rematch though which is why we've moved him onto the Heffron fight.

STEVE WOOD wrote:Leforge ,

This fight was agreed in private between all parties before the purse bid and therefore never went out to bids - the promoter then changed the date for it !.

Regards,

STEVE WOOD

Couldnt Rose of fought anyone else in the British Top ten like Erick Ochieng?

mcato wrote:

jonp wrote:I think most guys in top ten would like a title shot if given the chance at the champ which involve a bit more cash than a none tv show can provide.
Plus its hard to geta guy in the top ten not signed to a promoter and most other promoters wouldnt take a chance of there guy losing when theres no gain.

I can understand when boxers like Joe Selkirk threatens to retire because of boxing politics.

Selkirk threatened to quit because his Promoter was not giving him fights and when he did get a fights, they were called off, Selkirk needs to move up to his proper weight either Middleweight or Supermiddle, because I don't believe he can make 11 stone, he also needs to build his stamina because he looks a bit suspect in that area, maybe it is lack of fights or easy fights, It could be he has not made the transition from the Ams fully yet. Selkirk not getting fights is partly because they want light middles to fight him at a higher weight, that suits him, on the day of the fight he would go up to nearlt 13 stone, plus he is a banger. Who wants to fight someone much heavier and who can punch hard ? Part of it also is that his Promoter does not seem get his fighters out much or his promoter does not work with certain other promters, no doubt he is talented and can punch, but weighing in at middleweight the day before and then filling out for fight day, together with his punch power and skills, I can understand why light middles would avoid him

safeerah wrote:

mcato wrote:

jonp wrote:I think most guys in top ten would like a title shot if given the chance at the champ which involve a bit more cash than a none tv show can provide.
Plus its hard to geta guy in the top ten not signed to a promoter and most other promoters wouldnt take a chance of there guy losing when theres no gain.

I can understand when boxers like Joe Selkirk threatens to retire because of boxing politics.

Selkirk threatened to quit because his Promoter was not giving him fights and when he did get a fights, they were called off, Selkirk needs to move up to his proper weight either Middleweight or Supermiddle, because I don't believe he can make 11 stone, he also needs to build his stamina because he looks a bit suspect in that area, maybe it is lack of fights or easy fights, It could be he has not made the transition from the Ams fully yet. Selkirk not getting fights is partly because they want light middles to fight him at a higher weight, that suits him, on the day of the fight he would go up to nearlt 13 stone, plus he is a banger. Who wants to fight someone much heavier and who can punch hard ? Part of it also is that his Promoter does not seem get his fighters out much or his promoter does not work with certain other promters, no doubt he is talented and can punch, but weighing in at middleweight the day before and then filling out for fight day, together with his punch power and skills, I can understand why light middles would avoid him

But if he makes 11 st on the day of the weight in nobody can say anything, however he hasn't fought in a title fight where he has to make 11st that would be interesting.

mcato wrote:

STEVE WOOD wrote:Leforge ,

This fight was agreed in private between all parties before the purse bid and therefore never went out to bids - the promoter then changed the date for it !.

Regards,

STEVE WOOD

Couldnt Rose of fought anyone else in the British Top ten like Erick Ochieng?

Its a none title fight .Would Eric have taken a none title fight for less money same risk no reward? Also would his promoters let him take a none title tv fight not on there shows?

jonp wrote:

mcato wrote:

STEVE WOOD wrote:Leforge ,

This fight was agreed in private between all parties before the purse bid and therefore never went out to bids - the promoter then changed the date for it !.

Regards,

STEVE WOOD

Couldnt Rose of fought anyone else in the British Top ten like Erick Ochieng?

Its a none title fight .Would Eric have taken a none title fight for less money same risk no reward? Also would his promoters let him take a none title tv fight not on there shows?

Boxing has to be more flexibly if the Webb fight couldnt be agreed another promoter who has the money to put on the fight should be allowed to get his fighter a shot if fighter is in top 10.

Firstly Mcato there is no official top ten, just eliminators that sometime don't amount to much, only a final eliminator carries real weight, though even the winner of that is subject to purse bids, tickets, promters, you name it,really the system should work with progression, through area titles to english title and then british title, but even that is flawed because certain promoters control area and english titles and their champions can hang on to the title for long periods without defending i.e Jamie Ball Midland area, about well over a year and Adnan Amar who did not defend his English title for about 2 years when he held it, there are many more cases like this around the country, promoters either holding on to titles for possible future main events or to position their fighter for bigger titles, sometimes they put their own fighters against each other, so they keep the title in the stable or they pass it about between them and other promoters they have a close relationship with.

Dont see a huge problem with this fight, plenty worse out there.

Webb will get his chance soon, Rose wants a decent marking time fight, Harris whilst well past it is a decent 8 round fight - a lot better than a lot of other British champions marking time fights

mcato wrote:

safeerah wrote:But if he makes 11 st on the day of the weight in nobody can say anything, however he hasn't fought in a title fight where he has to make 11st that would be interesting.

If that is the boxers attitiude, then no wonder he has only had 9 fights in 4 years as a pro.

Also, as he hasn't been near a title fight why would he need to weigh in the day before a fight ?

There are definitely a couple of tiers in boxing that are doing the sport no good.

It seems that you get some boxers who train full time and are given dates on which they will fight. Their opponents are invariably "journeymen" who have a day job, get a phone call at short notice and are not expected to win.

If they are now expected to weigh in the day before and face an opponent a stone or more heavier on the night (because journeymen are more on the weight due to the nature and frequency of their job) then you can't blame them for turning these fights down.

bripez wrote:

mcato wrote:

safeerah wrote:But if he makes 11 st on the day of the weight in nobody can say anything, however he hasn't fought in a title fight where he has to make 11st that would be interesting.

If that is the boxers attitiude, then no wonder he has only had 9 fights in 4 years as a pro.

Also, as he hasn't been near a title fight why would he need to weigh in the day before a fight ?

There are definitely a couple of tiers in boxing that are doing the sport no good.

It seems that you get some boxers who train full time and are given dates on which they will fight. Their opponents are invariably "journeymen" who have a day job, get a phone call at short notice and are not expected to win.

If they are now expected to weigh in the day before and face an opponent a stone or more heavier on the night (because journeymen are more on the weight due to the nature and frequency of their job) then you can't blame them for turning these fights down.

I think it's the prospects turning Selkirk down, because they want an even playing field, unfortunately boxing in this country does not work that way, Journeymen may take the fight, but would want more money then normal, because if they get stopped they will have 28 day ban, so wil lose out on work.

d wrote: Ah, yeah it was a shame how it worked out.
No point in a rematch though which is why we've moved him onto the Heffron fight.

Yeah that makes sense, just in a perfect world.....

So you're in his camp I take it? What's the plan for the next year or two? Been following him since day 1 so interested. Would be great if he could get his career back on track for one last push.

safeerah wrote:I think it's the prospects turning Selkirk down, because they want an even playing field, unfortunately boxing in this country does not work that way, Journeymen may take the fight, but would want more money then normal, because if they get stopped they will have 28 day ban, so wil lose out on work.

That is what I was trying to say - but you worded it much better !

9 fights in 4 years is no good for anybody - he needs to re-think his career strategy as it isn't working.

The answer is simple - either pay the journeymen more (if this is what you want to do) or as you say make a fair match with other "prospects".

At the end of day money talks - any fight can be made and people will accept an unfair playing field if they are being paid enough.

saturday_kid wrote:Dont see a huge problem with this fight, plenty worse out there.

Webb will get his chance soon, Rose wants a decent marking time fight, Harris whilst well past it is a decent 8 round fight - a lot better than a lot of other British champions marking time fights

What do you mean you can't see a huge problem with this fight? Why cant he fight someone his own weight? People pay money to attend these shows for Rose to fight someone who is 10st 3!!!

mcato wrote:

saturday_kid wrote:Dont see a huge problem with this fight, plenty worse out there.

Webb will get his chance soon, Rose wants a decent marking time fight, Harris whilst well past it is a decent 8 round fight - a lot better than a lot of other British champions marking time fights

What do you mean you can't see a huge problem with this fight? Why cant he fight someone his own weight? People pay money to attend these shows for Rose to fight someone who is 10st 3!!!

Eh i'm not saying its a great match up - i'm just saying there are plenty worse fights out there.

And its not like its on TV or for a belt, so if you're not a fan of the fight its simple - dont go to it.

mcato wrote:

saturday_kid wrote:Dont see a huge problem with this fight, plenty worse out there.

Webb will get his chance soon, Rose wants a decent marking time fight, Harris whilst well past it is a decent 8 round fight - a lot better than a lot of other British champions marking time fights

What do you mean you can't see a huge problem with this fight? Why cant he fight someone his own weight? People pay money to attend these shows for Rose to fight someone who is 10st 3!!!

Eh i'm not saying its a great match up - i'm just saying there are plenty worse fights out there.

And its not like its on TV or for a belt, so if you're not a fan of the fight its simple - dont go to it.

mcato wrote:

saturday_kid wrote:Dont see a huge problem with this fight, plenty worse out there.

Webb will get his chance soon, Rose wants a decent marking time fight, Harris whilst well past it is a decent 8 round fight - a lot better than a lot of other British champions marking time fights

What do you mean you can't see a huge problem with this fight? Why cant he fight someone his own weight? People pay money to attend these shows for Rose to fight someone who is 10st 3!!!

Eh i'm not saying its a great match up - i'm just saying there are plenty worse fights out there.

And its not like its on TV or for a belt, so if you're not a fan of the fight its simple - dont go to it.