BoxRec

klompton wrote:Why do the British always try to claim Fitzsimmons? He left Europe at 9 years old and spent the vast majority of the rest of his life (45 years) in NZ, Aus, and the United States. He did nothing boxing related that we know of prior to moving to New Zealand. I don't think Britain has any more claim to him than Denmark has to Battling Nelson.

WTF!... how dare you take Bat away from us Danes! He's probably our 2nd greatest boxer ever (after Tom Bogs), and we are very proud of him!

PS: I would like to nominate George Carpentier for Greatest European Fighter Ever.

If you don't count Fitzsimmons, it is really a tough call. You also would have to consider Owen Moran and Freddie Welsh.

J-C wrote:Who's your pick?

I don't think there is even a default (i.e. Sugar Ray Robinson) answer for this one, is there?

My bet would be in the lower weight classes, someone from perhaps below welter or something or possibly LHW

Right now just bob fitssimmons and LL come to mind perhaps calzaghe he is undefeated but there has to be someone else.

For my first post, I'd have to go for Jimmy Wilde.

Steve Collins had one helluva impressive record. As did Joe Calzaghe for that matter.

HomicideHenry wrote:In no particular order....


Bob Fitzsimmons
Jim Droscoll
Jimmy Wilde
Freddie Mills
Laszlo Papp
Lennox Lewis
Rinty Monagahn
Wayne McCullough
Steve Collins
Marcel Cerdan
Max Schmeling
Ingemar Johanasson

The list is really endless considering this sport that we all love was reborn and became the way it is today in Europe and Great Britain and Ireland, going back into the 1600's. Many an all-time great per era came from Europe.

did u mean to put wayne mc on there?

To me, it has to be the great Jimmy Wilde, "The Mighty Atom" from Wales.

The greatest fighter ever from Wales.
He is the greatest British fighter ever.
The greatest flyweight of all-time.
And the best fighter of the decade of the 1910s.

My top 10 European fighters:
These belong in the top 100 greatest p4p. Only the greats Jimmy Wilde and Bob Fitzsimmons belong in the top 20. Wilde (#8), Fitzsimmons (#11)

Jimmy Wilde (Wales)
Bob Fitzsimmons (England)
Ted "Kid" Lewis (England)
Jack "Kid" Berg (England)
Georges Carpentier (France)
Marcel Cerdan (France)

These are the ones that don't belong in the top 100 p4p in my view
Freddie Welsh (Wales)
Lennox Lewis (England)
Nino Benvenutti (Italy)
Jim Driscoll (Wales)

Youre right about number 1 Elmer, Jimmy Wilde is a fairly easy pick imo. Only European fighter to be rated (arguably) as the best ever in his division

I got to rearrange my list of the greatest Europeans fighters of all time. A great topic for sure. Great fighters from the Old World.

From 1 to 8, makes the top 100 greatest fighters pound per pound list in my view. From 1 to 3, make the top 50 greatest ever, p4p.

1. Jimmy Wilde (Wales)
2. Bob Fitzsimmons (England)
3. Jimmy McLarnin (Ireland)...I forgot about him in my earlier post.

4. Ted "Kid" Lewis (England)
5. Jack "Kid" Berg (England)
6. Georges Carpentier (France)
7. Marcel Cerdan (France)
8. Benny Lynch (Scotland)...I also forgot about him. Great flyweight from the 1930s.


9. Lennox Lewis (England)...The most dominant European heavyweight ever.
10. Freddie Welsh (Wales) or Nino Benvenutti (Italy)

McClarnin is miles greater than Wilde if you're counting him as European. He is usually categorized as Canadian. It's always difficult to determine exactly where to place fighters like that. If you're going strictly by where they were born than Benitez is American.

the ghost gets my vote

@elmersalsa
If you see Great Britain and France as only European countries you might be right with your list. ;)

Friedie wrote:@elmersalsa
If you see Great Britain and France as only European countries you might be right with your list. ;)

Those were SOME of the very best from that region that made the top 100 p4p in my list.... Real great fighters.

Let's see others:
Italy: Nino Benvenutti, Duilio Loi.
Germany: Max Schmeling, Sven Ottke
Denmark: Battling Nelson
Spain: Baltazar Sanchilli, Javier Castillejo, Jose Legra (although he is Cuban)
Sweden: Ingemar Johansson

In my book, in my view, those mentioned that I have written right now, do not make the top 100.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:McClarnin is miles greater than Wilde if you're counting him as European. He is usually categorized as Canadian. It's always difficult to determine exactly where to place fighters like that. If you're going strictly by where they were born than Benitez is American.

Even if he were an American, to me, he is not better than the Mighty Atom. McLarnin beat better quality of opposition, but Wilde to me, was more dominant in his class.

jimmy wilde for me an amazing puncher who would fight guys that would be 7/8 weight classes above him today