BoxRec

Larry used to post on here and I liked him, he shouldn't have told tales but he's not a terrible person.

Palooka,

Your a good poster and got nothing against you personally (don't know you), but massively disagree there..... you don't like that fact that Larrry told tales, but call him a "good fella".... the only decent thing Larry did was tell tales.

The man lived one big lie in terms of his boxing career, and this is no cycling where the only damage he was doing was to his own body. Just imagine the family if something would have happened to one of his opponents and believe it or not, there was a much more of an increased risk of injury if one fighter has an unfair advantage over another.

Hurlock,

Again your a top poster IMO, but how in the hell can you call Larry honest. He has never been clean pre suspension.... his career was one dangerous cheating lie.

The other poster who said the PED's did Larry no good. Oh we hear this every now and again also, Shane Mosley wasn't as good when he was on them, neither was Fernando Vargas. BS..... they might have trained differently because of the performance benefits to do more things, but it wasn't directly because of the steriods they got stiffer.... and anyway has Larry won a single fight since his return? Larry post suspension is worst than pre.

Not sure why people say there should have been criminal proceedings against Margarito for getting caught ABOUT to cheat, Larry did cheat and his cheating could have had almost as big an impact as Margarito, yet Larry is honest who has served his time.

Both should never have been allowed in a ring again. Larry never fought clean.

stujones wrote:Palooka,

Your a good poster and got nothing against you personally (don't know you), but massively disagree there..... you don't like that fact that Larrry told tales, but call him a "good fella".... the only decent thing Larry did was tell tales.

The man lived one big lie in terms of his boxing career, and this is no cycling where the only damage he was doing was to his own body. Just imagine the family if something would have happened to one of his opponents and believe it or not, there was a much more of an increased risk of injury if one fighter has an unfair advantage over another.

Hurlock,

Again your a top poster IMO, but how in the hell can you call Larry honest. He has never been clean pre suspension.... his career was one dangerous cheating lie.

The other poster who said the PED's did Larry no good. Oh we hear this every now and again also, Shane Mosley wasn't as good when he was on them, neither was Fernando Vargas. BS..... they might have trained differently because of the performance benefits to do more things, but it wasn't directly because of the steriods they got stiffer.... and anyway has Larry won a single fight since his return? Larry post suspension is worst than pre.

Not sure why people say there should have been criminal proceedings against Margarito for getting caught ABOUT to cheat, Larry did cheat and his cheating could have had almost as big an impact as Margarito, yet Larry is honest who has served his time.

Both should never have been allowed in a ring again. Larry never fought clean.

Are you one of these people who thinks Larry was the only one doing it?

thepocketrocket wrote:I know Larry got his ban reduced for ratting out Craig Windsor, but did he dish the dirt on anyone else?

I was told he was going to give two very big names but something must have made him change his mind.

Pugilist-specialist wrote:

thepocketrocket wrote:I know Larry got his ban reduced for ratting out Craig Windsor, but did he dish the dirt on anyone else?

I was told he was going to give two very big names but something must have made him change his mind.

Hmmm....legal threats aplenty let me guess.

TheLeprechaun wrote:

stujones wrote:Palooka,

Your a good poster and got nothing against you personally (don't know you), but massively disagree there..... you don't like that fact that Larrry told tales, but call him a "good fella".... the only decent thing Larry did was tell tales.

The man lived one big lie in terms of his boxing career, and this is no cycling where the only damage he was doing was to his own body. Just imagine the family if something would have happened to one of his opponents and believe it or not, there was a much more of an increased risk of injury if one fighter has an unfair advantage over another.

Hurlock,

Again your a top poster IMO, but how in the hell can you call Larry honest. He has never been clean pre suspension.... his career was one dangerous cheating lie.

The other poster who said the PED's did Larry no good. Oh we hear this every now and again also, Shane Mosley wasn't as good when he was on them, neither was Fernando Vargas. BS..... they might have trained differently because of the performance benefits to do more things, but it wasn't directly because of the steriods they got stiffer.... and anyway has Larry won a single fight since his return? Larry post suspension is worst than pre.

Not sure why people say there should have been criminal proceedings against Margarito for getting caught ABOUT to cheat, Larry did cheat and his cheating could have had almost as big an impact as Margarito, yet Larry is honest who has served his time.

Both should never have been allowed in a ring again. Larry never fought clean.

Are you one of these people who thinks Larry was the only one doing it?

No, as my post mentioned two fighters.... but is that supposed to vindicate Larry. The point is that SOME fighters, whether that is a minority or majority are playing it fair and those that are cheating are at an unfair advantage and more likely to cause serious damage.

Anyway, even if it is one roid monkey vs another roid monkey the likelihood of sustaining a serious injury and putting a black mark on this sport is increased.

stujones wrote:Palooka,

Your a good poster and got nothing against you personally (don't know you), but massively disagree there..... you don't like that fact that Larrry told tales, but call him a "good fella".... the only decent thing Larry did was tell tales.

The man lived one big lie in terms of his boxing career, and this is no cycling where the only damage he was doing was to his own body. Just imagine the family if something would have happened to one of his opponents and believe it or not, there was a much more of an increased risk of injury if one fighter has an unfair advantage over another.

Hurlock,

Again your a top poster IMO, but how in the hell can you call Larry honest. He has never been clean pre suspension.... his career was one dangerous cheating lie.

The other poster who said the PED's did Larry no good. Oh we hear this every now and again also, Shane Mosley wasn't as good when he was on them, neither was Fernando Vargas. BS..... they might have trained differently because of the performance benefits to do more things, but it wasn't directly because of the steriods they got stiffer.... and anyway has Larry won a single fight since his return? Larry post suspension is worst than pre.

Not sure why people say there should have been criminal proceedings against Margarito for getting caught ABOUT to cheat, Larry did cheat and his cheating could have had almost as big an impact as Margarito, yet Larry is honest who has served his time.

Both should never have been allowed in a ring again. Larry never fought clean.

Stu, thanks for disagreeing so politely - it happens rarely

I liked how Larry came across and to me it was as obvious as the nose on my face that Larry took some form of body building steroid regularly. If it was apparent to me it had ought to have been obvious to people (professionals) within a sporting industry. There were/are obviously others boxing that take similarly banned drugs - they may be better connected and not screened at all. The affair raised larger questions than just Larry and his honesty issues :( .

Larry was a bodybuilder and a bouncer before he became a boxer, he didn't do his gym work and sneak off to take the expensive steroids out of sight; trainers and others in the gyms are aware of it Drug use is a part of boxing and the authorities know it, that is why the screening process is so lax - they do not want to find out. The authorities dangled a carrot for Larry to take and he gave up a half retired boxer from Scotland instead of other, big earning boxers based around the London gyms Larry trained in. He was between a rock and a hard place; I think I can empathise more with what he did than with the authorities who know what is going on in a big way and pretend otherwise or come down with a big weight on some and not at all on others.

In any case

Pugilist-specialist wrote:

thepocketrocket wrote:I know Larry got his ban reduced for ratting out Craig Windsor, but did he dish the dirt on anyone else?

I was told he was going to give two very big names but something must have made him change his mind.

Very big names make very big money and there are some very persuasive people who are around them - those sort of people know more than one way of persuading someone.

I've met him and spoken to him, he's actually a really nice guy. He's mates with a mate of mine (well, more a mate of a mate of my brother's, but I knew him well socially) who used to go regularly to the same gym. That's how I ended up at so many of his early fights.

Someone on another forum I go on said a few years back that he was on the juice and all of a sudden he popped up on the forum and started posting, then emailed a few of us and said "who said that". It was kinda funny at the time but also not, cos obviously it would have impacted negatively if the cat was out the bag so early.

stujones wrote:Palooka,

Your a good poster and got nothing against you personally (don't know you), but massively disagree there..... you don't like that fact that Larrry told tales, but call him a "good fella".... the only decent thing Larry did was tell tales.

The man lived one big lie in terms of his boxing career, and this is no cycling where the only damage he was doing was to his own body. Just imagine the family if something would have happened to one of his opponents and believe it or not, there was a much more of an increased risk of injury if one fighter has an unfair advantage over another.

Hurlock,

Again your a top poster IMO, but how in the hell can you call Larry honest. He has never been clean pre suspension.... his career was one dangerous cheating lie.

The other poster who said the PED's did Larry no good. Oh we hear this every now and again also, Shane Mosley wasn't as good when he was on them, neither was Fernando Vargas. BS..... they might have trained differently because of the performance benefits to do more things, but it wasn't directly because of the steriods they got stiffer.... and anyway has Larry won a single fight since his return? Larry post suspension is worst than pre.

Not sure why people say there should have been criminal proceedings against Margarito for getting caught ABOUT to cheat, Larry did cheat and his cheating could have had almost as big an impact as Margarito, yet Larry is honest who has served his time.

Both should never have been allowed in a ring again. Larry never fought clean.

I agree he should of been banned,but what can you do. The man is basically an expert with steroids & I don't respect him but I respect his honesty in explaining the facts of steroid abuse & the only reason for testing dirty was due to being sloppy.im just happy to learn more about steroids & once you know about them it opens your eyes to its users that will shock
You

palooka wrote:
Stu, thanks for disagreeing so politely - it happens rarely

I liked how Larry came across and to me it was as obvious as the nose on my face that Larry took some form of body building steroid regularly. If it was apparent to me it had ought to have been obvious to people (professionals) within a sporting industry. There were/are obviously others boxing that take similarly banned drugs - they may be better connected and not screened at all. The affair raised larger questions than just Larry and his honesty issues :( .

Larry was a bodybuilder and a bouncer before he became a boxer, he didn't do his gym work and sneak off to take the expensive steroids out of sight; trainers and others in the gyms are aware of it Drug use is a part of boxing and the authorities know it, that is why the screening process is so lax - they do not want to find out. The authorities dangled a carrot for Larry to take and he gave up a half retired boxer from Scotland instead of other, big earning boxers based around the London gyms Larry trained in. He was between a rock and a hard place; I think I can empathise more with what he did than with the authorities who know what is going on in a big way and pretend otherwise or come down with a big weight on some and not at all on others.

In any case

I know what your saying, and yes I agree I did like how he came across in the pre-caught days.

However, post getting caught I didn't like his attitude to be honest. He posted here as a response and he showed no remorse, is attitude mirrors your post about the lax testing and everyone is on them.

My view is to fighters who are cheating is give the sport some more respect, one thing steroids cannot do is strengthen the brain to withstand harder shots and make you less susceptible to brain bleeds.

Okay you can say - well their all on it (which Larry did).... but then what you should do is do a Floyd Mayweather and refuse to fight a certain fighter (that you suspect or know is on it) unless tested. Yes, it might halt their earnings, but I would hazzard a guess that the publicity a small hall fighter, such as Larry, would have got for making such a stand might have earned him more coin than the actual fight.

I've followed this sport since I was a nipper and you've got to respect the danger to your health that you face, but also the damage you could do to others. Imagine if Nazim Richardson said - okay Margarito you want to fight with plaster caste against Mosley.... fair enough, we'll do the same. There would have been outrage.

Off course I am aware that Larry was on them well before his career started, for me that means nothing. Look at whats happened to Edwards and to Keiran Farrel a year or so ago.... got to respect the damage a clean person can make. A roid monkey could seriously damage the reputation of the sport.

hurlock wrote:
I agree he should of been banned,but what can you do. The man is basically an expert with steroids & I don't respect him but I respect his honesty in explaining the facts of steroid abuse & the only reason for testing dirty was due to being sloppy.im just happy to learn more about steroids & once you know about them it opens your eyes to its users that will shock
You

His honesty AFTER getting caught that is.

Not sure I would personally call him an experts on PED's when he posted on here (post getting caught) and got into some debate about the side effects and negative health effects of PED's. If Larry does not think the cocktail of drugs he was one wasn't increasing his risk of long term health issues then he isn't a much of an expert as he claims to be.

stujones wrote:

palooka wrote:
Stu, thanks for disagreeing so politely - it happens rarely

I liked how Larry came across and to me it was as obvious as the nose on my face that Larry took some form of body building steroid regularly. If it was apparent to me it had ought to have been obvious to people (professionals) within a sporting industry. There were/are obviously others boxing that take similarly banned drugs - they may be better connected and not screened at all. The affair raised larger questions than just Larry and his honesty issues :( .

Larry was a bodybuilder and a bouncer before he became a boxer, he didn't do his gym work and sneak off to take the expensive steroids out of sight; trainers and others in the gyms are aware of it Drug use is a part of boxing and the authorities know it, that is why the screening process is so lax - they do not want to find out. The authorities dangled a carrot for Larry to take and he gave up a half retired boxer from Scotland instead of other, big earning boxers based around the London gyms Larry trained in. He was between a rock and a hard place; I think I can empathise more with what he did than with the authorities who know what is going on in a big way and pretend otherwise or come down with a big weight on some and not at all on others.

In any case

I know what your saying, and yes I agree I did like how he came across in the pre-caught days.

However, post getting caught I didn't like his attitude to be honest. He posted here as a response and he showed no remorse, is attitude mirrors your post about the lax testing and everyone is on them.

My view is to fighters who are cheating is give the sport some more respect, one thing steroids cannot do is strengthen the brain to withstand harder shots and make you less susceptible to brain bleeds.

Okay you can say - well their all on it (which Larry did).... but then what you should do is do a Floyd Mayweather and refuse to fight a certain fighter (that you suspect or know is on it) unless tested. Yes, it might halt their earnings, but I would hazzard a guess that the publicity a small hall fighter, such as Larry, would have got for making such a stand might have earned him more coin than the actual fight.

I've followed this sport since I was a nipper and you've got to respect the danger to your health that you face, but also the damage you could do to others. Imagine if Nazim Richardson said - okay Margarito you want to fight with plaster caste against Mosley.... fair enough, we'll do the same. There would have been outrage.

Off course I am aware that Larry was on them well before his career started, for me that means nothing. Look at whats happened to Edwards and to Keiran Farrel a year or so ago.... got to respect the damage a clean person can make. A roid monkey could seriously damage the reputation of the sport.

See, the problem is, you have a utopian view. It sounds great on paper but it's just unrealistic.

I've found that the majority of boxing fans are just massively ignorant of the amount of PED use in boxing. If you don't take them, you have to assume that you are at some kind of disadvantage because your peers are taking them. You only have to look at the body of some fighters to see they are on the stuff. I'm not going to mention any names but im sure a british heavyweight prospect comes to mind. My mates are bodybuilders who are on gear and when I asked them if they thought that particular fighter was on the stuff, they laughed hard and called me an idiot for even asking. It's that obvious by the guys body alone.

Your argument falls down due to your utter naievity at the sheer amount of PED usage occurring. Larry is a nice guy, very humble and if felt that he was doing genuine wrong he would come out and say he was remorseful and apologize. The fact that he feels no remorse tells you something.

It's just something that is going to come hand in hand with boxing from here on out. The overwhelming majority of the fighters are going to be on something.

Now, taking that into account, when you KNOW that a seriously large percentage of your opponents are on it & your life is on the line vs these enhanced opponents when you step into the ring, it's not hard to imagine what fighters that aren't on PEDs are going to think, and then start doing.

I would agree with the post above. Boxing in particular is a sport with very defined levels and huge financial incentives to get title shots. Take a random example - Lee Purdy. Do I have any evidence of drug misuse. No. But here is a fighter desperate to reach a higher level, a level that is beyond his talent level. If I was a gambling man if wager he did everything and then some to try and get ready for his title shots. PED abuse is almost certainly widespread. I don't doubt that for a second.

Larry came from prison, did a pharmaceutical degree and did 100m sprinting before entering boxing with a physique and eyes like Ben Johnson. It couldn't have been more obvious if Sky had shown him shooting up in a Larry-McDermott 24/7.

The testing is so lax compared to other sports that it has to be assumed that the Governing bodies are just playing lip service to it. There are highly paid, hugely marketed boxers who it is plain are using some form of steroid or PED.

Boxers come into the ring plastered with supplement company logos; many of the supplements used are a molecule away from illegal PED's. If a boxer is sponsored by these firms and has supplementary and dietary help given to them, where is the level playing field for their opponent? And that is entirely in the rules?

It would be interesting how many boxers fight 'clean'; the days of raw eggs and milk have long gone I know.

It is the double standards and hypocrisy of the industry and its suits and governing bodies that annoy me more than a single boxer cheating - that is the more rotten thing.

mickey1975 wrote:Larry came from prison, did a pharmaceutical degree and did 100m sprinting before entering boxing with a physique and eyes like Ben Johnson. It couldn't have been more obvious if Sky had shown him shooting up in a Larry-McDermott 24/7.

almost certianly my post of the week

palooka wrote:The testing is so lax compared to other sports that it has to be assumed that the Governing bodies are just playing lip service to it. There are highly paid, hugely marketed boxers who it is plain are using some form of steroid or PED.

Boxers come into the ring plastered with supplement company logos; many of the supplements used are a molecule away from illegal PED's. If a boxer is sponsored by these firms and has supplementary and dietary help given to them, where is the level playing field for their opponent? And that is entirely in the rules?

It would be interesting how many boxers fight 'clean'; the days of raw eggs and milk have long gone I know.

It is the double standards and hypocrisy of the industry and its suits and governing bodies that annoy me more than a single boxer cheating - that is the more rotten thing.

Good post,

Now I might be naïve to the PED use in boxing, but whilst I know Larry and the fighter he "ratted" aren't the only ones who have been guilty. I still don't think it is that "everyone" is at it.

Whether it is a majority or minority I am not sure, I remember the boxers and ex boxers coming up on here in the period directly after Larry getting caught claiming it is not as rife as people think..... where they lying, maybe, maybe not.... I don't think ANYONE can answer that question as to whether it is a majority or minority. I don't even think the most well connected insider would know the details of the majority of UK boxers well enough to categorically say 100% they are on it. Boxing might be a relatively small family, but there are still lots of pro boxers in the UK and it is a huge accusation to state that the vast majority are on the gear.

We can talk about the physique of Larry and that young British Heavyweight prospect.... is that representing the majority of British pro's.... absolutely not.

On the part about the supplements yeah, good point, but as long as it isn't breaking the rules then surely it is fair game. We could go down a silly path if we seek an entirely fair sport. Should we penalise someone who has inherited an allotment and can produce his own beetroot? The supplements are available to all and legal. Sure some might have greater access to them and get them for free, but then what about fighters whose work gives them a sabattical to live the dream.... unfair advantage over those that still work 37 hours a week?

If this british prospect people are suspecting as a ped user attended the olympics then he would likely have been caught during them unless he started post competition for turning pro. I still genuinely believe that british boxing isnt as rife with ped abuse as people may believe. There will still be random lower level fighters taking their chance with it, some amateurs etc also but over all i believe the sport (in britain) to be reasonably clean. I have no inside info or contacts whatsoever so could also be totally wrong!

I do find this to be an interesting subject right enough and anyone else who does should consider reading the Seven Deadly Sins book by David Walsh. Its not about boxing, as some of you may know its about Lance Armstrong and was written throughout his career before he admitted to his doping and this book details the lengths that people and organisations went to in order to keep lance armstrong 'clean'. If he could get away with it with such rigourous testing then boxers defo could with the lax approach to it in this sport. (Although not many boxers would have the same financial clout as armstrong to carry out the programmes)

Emmseegee wrote:If this british prospect people are suspecting as a ped user attended the olympics then he would likely have been caught during them unless he started post competition for turning pro. I still genuinely believe that british boxing isnt as rife with ped abuse as people may believe. There will still be random lower level fighters taking their chance with it, some amateurs etc also but over all i believe the sport (in britain) to be reasonably clean. I have no inside info or contacts whatsoever so could also be totally wrong!

I do find this to be an interesting subject right enough and anyone else who does should consider reading the Seven Deadly Sins book by David Walsh. Its not about boxing, as some of you may know its about Lance Armstrong and was written throughout his career before he admitted to his doping and this book details the lengths that people and organisations went to in order to keep lance armstrong 'clean'. If he could get away with it with such rigourous testing then boxers defo could with the lax approach to it in this sport. (Although not many boxers would have the same financial clout as armstrong to carry out the programmes)

I imagine you've hit the nail on the head.