darren sutherland

[stujones]

If memory serves there was no evidence of who wrote the letter or wasn't the person uncontactable for the inquest. To "blame" Frank cos of an unsubstantiated letter is a bit out of order IMO. Surely we need only concrete facts in such a serious event before laying blame.

It might have been another person with a vested interest in Sutherland continuing to box stating unsubstantiated things about Frank for it to continue. Even if Frank said those things, it might have been just a tactic to try and re-motivate Sutherland and not something he would have carried out in practice had Sutherland told Frank "look I am definitely going back home and retiring".

Frank has his faults, but he seems to be someone who has his fighters interest at heart and was an ex boxer himself so understands the hard graft needed. Frank did not exactly lay it on strong or threaten Price when he expressed his desire to fight Thompson again, against Frank's wishes.

[stujones]

If memory serves there was no evidence of who wrote the letter or wasn't the person uncontactable for the inquest. To "blame" Frank cos of an unsubstantiated letter is a bit out of order IMO. Surely we need only concrete facts in such a serious event before laying blame.

It might have been another person with a vested interest in Sutherland continuing to box stating unsubstantiated things about Frank for it to continue. Even if Frank said those things, it might have been just a tactic to try and re-motivate Sutherland and not something he would have carried out in practice had Sutherland told Frank "look I am definitely going back home and retiring".

Frank has his faults, but he seems to be someone who has his fighters interest at heart and was an ex boxer himself so understands the hard graft needed. Frank did not exactly lay it on strong or threaten Price when he expressed his desire to fight Thompson again, against Frank's wishes.

[Tomasino]

If memory serves there was no evidence of who wrote the letter or wasn't the person uncontactable for the inquest. To "blame" Frank cos of an unsubstantiated letter is a bit out of order IMO. Surely we need only concrete facts in such a serious event before laying blame.

It might have been another person with a vested interest in Sutherland continuing to box stating unsubstantiated things about Frank for it to continue. Even if Frank said those things, it might have been just a tactic to try and re-motivate Sutherland and not something he would have carried out in practice had Sutherland told Frank "look I am definitely going back home and retiring".

Frank has his faults, but he seems to be someone who has his fighters interest at heart and was an ex boxer himself so understands the hard graft needed. Frank did not exactly lay it on strong or threaten Price when he expressed his desire to fight Thompson again, against Frank's wishes.

That's some theory. As long as it wasn't Frank eh?

[danconnollyeire]

In my culture (gypsys) suicide by biggest part is cried shame on , in fact when i was growing up as a kid from what i can recall .. the very few times i have known someone take their own life very few mourners actually followed the deceased at the funeral,its looked on a shameful.
My opinion differs tho , each mans pain is his own .

Respect

[stujones]

If memory serves there was no evidence of who wrote the letter or wasn't the person uncontactable for the inquest. To "blame" Frank cos of an unsubstantiated letter is a bit out of order IMO. Surely we need only concrete facts in such a serious event before laying blame.

It might have been another person with a vested interest in Sutherland continuing to box stating unsubstantiated things about Frank for it to continue. Even if Frank said those things, it might have been just a tactic to try and re-motivate Sutherland and not something he would have carried out in practice had Sutherland told Frank "look I am definitely going back home and retiring".

Frank has his faults, but he seems to be someone who has his fighters interest at heart and was an ex boxer himself so understands the hard graft needed. Frank did not exactly lay it on strong or threaten Price when he expressed his desire to fight Thompson again, against Frank's wishes.

That's some theory. As long as it wasn't Frank eh?

All I am saying that we should not speculate without concrete evidence, it could be a number of theories. Tragically, the man who knows the answers took those answers with him when he died.

Just tragic really, but I don't think it is right to speculate. There was some wild theories about reason behind the hanging before the inquest - those were absolute pure speculation.... call them rumours, hearsay or just someone making up stories and sorry to say unless Frank decides to discuss it and be open (which lets face it will never happen even if the blame lies with Frank and he did make those threats) then so is any views about Frank and the heavies.... it's just speculation.

Just like all the stories about Gary Speed, I've read hearsay from apparent "in the know" people about his wife cheating, him being gay and about to be exposed, even heard that he was sexually abused as a kid and that haunted him all his life..... all speculation and I don't think it is right to report it, let alone report it as truth.

[Bodyshot3]

One of the untold issues surrounding Darren's tragic death is the issue of being incredibly lonely and how this is a black curse so many fighters face....having read (probably too many) boxing books it seems to be a constant and consistent theme; the sense of being completely apart from the world because you can't eat or drink what you like, have to go to bed early to get up early and run and basically lock yourself away from the world.

And all of this is faced by young men who are at the exact time in their lives when going out with friends/girls is the most natural thing to do. You're got to be driven to be successful....but the sacrifices are huge/unnatural and often you are hundreds of miles away from your friends and family.

Matt Macklin did a telling interview recently where he described his time living in New York. He had a swanky apartment in the financial district but there was nobody there once business closed for the day and he could not even go out for a coffee because everything for miles around him was shut....he was going slowly, stir crazy. And Matt's a clever, well-travelled guy.

Frank Bruno's first 'ghosted' book, published long before Frank's well-documented mental health problems, absolutely aches of what a difficult, lonely and depressing life it can be. He writes about how much he loves his wife; but there's a chapter where he basically describes how hard he trained and he's seeing his wife basically over the breakfast table. No wonder they became strangers sharing the same house.

Even Calzaghe, the settled 'home boy' from the Valleys with a big, extended Anglo-Italian family, talks about the sense of loneliness and being apart from the world in his book.

God knows what Darren felt, miles away from home, in some tiny flat and with all that huge pressure to be 'a star' on him.

[magwitch]

One of the untold issues surrounding Darren's tragic death is the issue of being incredibly lonely and how this is a black curse so many fighters face....having read (probably too many) boxing books it seems to be a constant and consistent theme; the sense of being completely apart from the world because you can't eat or drink what you like, have to go to bed early to get up early and run and basically lock yourself away from the world.

And all of this is faced by young men who are at the exact time in their lives when going out with friends/girls is the most natural thing to do. You're got to be driven to be successful....but the sacrifices are huge/unnatural and often you are hundreds of miles away from your friends and family.

Matt Macklin did a telling interview recently where he described his time living in New York. He had a swanky apartment in the financial district but there was nobody there once business closed for the day and he could not even go out for a coffee because everything for miles around him was shut....he was going slowly, stir crazy. And Matt's a clever, well-travelled guy.

Frank Bruno's first 'ghosted' book, published long before Frank's well-documented mental health problems, absolutely aches of what a difficult, lonely and depressing life it can be. He writes about how much he loves his wife; but there's a chapter where he basically describes how hard he trained and he's seeing his wife basically over the breakfast table. No wonder they became strangers sharing the same house.

Even Calzaghe, the settled 'home boy' from the Valleys with a big, extended Anglo-Italian family, talks about the sense of loneliness and being apart from the world in his book.

God knows what Darren felt, miles away from home, in some tiny flat and with all that huge pressure to be 'a star' on him.

I've believed for a while that it's a sport that lends itself to obsession. Running the road at anti-social hours, starving yourself, not being able to sleep at night because your hunger won't allow you to sleep. Then you get in a ring and no matter who you are, you lose and you're practically written off. Strange old game. Good post btw

[magwitch]

He did turn pro though and he did accept Franks money , you can't accept all that money and then turn round and say , Naaaw , don't want to box anymore .. And you can't blame Frank he did'nt know he was suicidal , and if others did his parents freinds , whoever , why were they not there with him , keeping a eye on him .

It was Tragic , but not anyones fault , people always look to blame someone , its just human nature , but i'm sure if Frank would off known or suspected it was going to happen , he would of at the least cantacted his parents and said , you better come and look after him , even if only to protect his investment , . IF the parents suspected , i'm sure they would of said to Frank were worried , and coming to see him , keep an eye on him .

Like i said Tragic , but no ones fault .

And Kellie is'nt his name its Frank . He was born and named a man , just cos he puts a dress on does'nt make him a woman so until he chops his knackers off , and they drill him an hole , he's a man .

If he wants to change his name theres a deed poll , until then his legal name is Frank, and Kellie is just a nickname he gave himself ,,, he may change it next week to Rebbeca , Sparkles or something .

But whatever he calls himself , it don't make him responsible for someone taking there own life .

Agree with this post too. I'm sure Maloney would not have wanted Darren to die -money or no money - and I'm sure he'd want to prevent that if he could, like most other human beings.

[coneye]

He did turn pro though and he did accept Franks money , you can't accept all that money and then turn round and say , Naaaw , don't want to box anymore .. And you can't blame Frank he did'nt know he was suicidal , and if others did his parents freinds , whoever , why were they not there with him , keeping a eye on him .

It was Tragic , but not anyones fault , people always look to blame someone , its just human nature , but i'm sure if Frank would off known or suspected it was going to happen , he would of at the least cantacted his parents and said , you better come and look after him , even if only to protect his investment , . IF the parents suspected , i'm sure they would of said to Frank were worried , and coming to see him , keep an eye on him .

Like i said Tragic , but no ones fault .

And Kellie is'nt his name its Frank . He was born and named a man , just cos he puts a dress on does'nt make him a woman so until he chops his knackers off , and they drill him an hole , he's a man .

If he wants to change his name theres a deed poll , until then his legal name is Frank, and Kellie is just a nickname he gave himself ,,, he may change it next week to Rebbeca , Sparkles or something .

But whatever he calls himself , it don't make him responsible for someone taking there own life .

Agree with this post too. I'm sure Maloney would not have wanted Darren to die -money or no money - and I'm sure he'd want to prevent that if he could, like most other human beings.

And to be honest , if he had any idea , and he is has bad has being made out , Even if he did'nt give a flying fack for the lad , he would of stopped it , or done what he could just to save his money , Like i said Tragic , but no ones fault

[denzil1970]

5 years wow ! God bless the fella

[Eddy]

I don't think it's just boxing that can lead to solitary life. A lot of people go through it. There's all kinds of situations like working in a crappy job (unsociable hours), being new to a country/town; Being shy.

[magwitch]

I don't think it's just boxing that can lead to solitary life. A lot of people go through it. There's all kinds of situations like working in a crappy job (unsociable hours), being new to a country/town; Being shy.

there's all manner of people who stay in their houses and just do nowt, lonely. My own life tells me that I've been a solitary type from time to time, and there's people WAY more solitary than that - you just don't see them. Mind you I live in Darlington so being solitary ain't a bad idea here...

[Eddy]

For me it's either go out with pals and go on benders; sticking shite up my nose till the next morning and then feel like shit for weeks, or stay in and go gym in the morning. I can't go out and not drink. I have tried going to a pub and drinking soft drinks but I find it so boring. So I chose to not go out now. So I can understand that solitary feeling 100%.

I'd rather be fit and healthy and bored then walking around feeling like a junky/piss head.

[Tomasino]

For me it's either go out with pals and go on benders; sticking shite up my nose till the next morning and then feel like poo for weeks, or stay in and go gym in the morning. I can't go out and not drink. I have tried going to a pub and drinking soft drinks but I find it so boring. So I chose to not go out now. So I can understand that solitary feeling 100%.

I'd rather be fit and healthy and bored then walking around feeling like a junky/piss head.

I went through this the exact same when I was 20-24. When I was teetotal and living quiet birds who liked clubbing and that were a nitemare and I'd rather not be with them. Then I got a girl who liked doing the same things didn't drink smoke or never take drugs and it was a rare find and great. That solitary feeling mixed with peer pressure to go out and get on it was murder though.

[Eddy]

For me it's either go out with pals and go on benders; sticking shite up my nose till the next morning and then feel like poo for weeks, or stay in and go gym in the morning. I can't go out and not drink. I have tried going to a pub and drinking soft drinks but I find it so boring. So I chose to not go out now. So I can understand that solitary feeling 100%.

I'd rather be fit and healthy and bored then walking around feeling like a junky/piss head.

I went through this the exact same when I was 20-24. When I was teetotal and living quiet birds who liked clubbing and that were a nitemare and I'd rather not be with them. Then I got a girl who liked doing the same things didn't drink smoke or never take drugs and it was a rare find and great. That solitary feeling mixed with peer pressure to go out and get on it was murder though.

I'm going through that now. It's a nightmare lol.

[whiskey]

For me it's either go out with pals and go on benders; sticking shite up my nose till the next morning and then feel like poo for weeks, or stay in and go gym in the morning. I can't go out and not drink. I have tried going to a pub and drinking soft drinks but I find it so boring. So I chose to not go out now. So I can understand that solitary feeling 100%.

I'd rather be fit and healthy and bored then walking around feeling like a junky/piss head.

We'd go out all night then hit the gym at 10am on a Sunday morning and train legs, heavy duty style.

Nowadays I can neither go out nor go gym. I think I'm done !

[Eddy]

lol

I wish I could eat what I wanted and not be a gym rat. In my blood. Feel guilty if I don't train.

[Tomasino]

For me it's either go out with pals and go on benders; sticking shite up my nose till the next morning and then feel like poo for weeks, or stay in and go gym in the morning. I can't go out and not drink. I have tried going to a pub and drinking soft drinks but I find it so boring. So I chose to not go out now. So I can understand that solitary feeling 100%.

I'd rather be fit and healthy and bored then walking around feeling like a junky/piss head.

We'd go out all night then hit the gym at 10am on a Sunday morning and train legs, heavy duty style.

Nowadays I can neither go out nor go gym. I think I'm done !

You burned the candle at both ends mate! Not a good idea

[Tomasino]

For me it's either go out with pals and go on benders; sticking shite up my nose till the next morning and then feel like poo for weeks, or stay in and go gym in the morning. I can't go out and not drink. I have tried going to a pub and drinking soft drinks but I find it so boring. So I chose to not go out now. So I can understand that solitary feeling 100%.

I'd rather be fit and healthy and bored then walking around feeling like a junky/piss head.

I went through this the exact same when I was 20-24. When I was teetotal and living quiet birds who liked clubbing and that were a nitemare and I'd rather not be with them. Then I got a girl who liked doing the same things didn't drink smoke or never take drugs and it was a rare find and great. That solitary feeling mixed with peer pressure to go out and get on it was murder though.

I'm going through that now. It's a nightmare lol.

Get a quiet bird mate, it was a torture without one hahaha the folk who are out on the piss Thursday to Sunday will only drag you down. I'm 35 now, still live life fairly clean and train 6 days. My pals from my youth are mostly still at it.

[arlovski]

One of the untold issues surrounding Darren's tragic death is the issue of being incredibly lonely and how this is a black curse so many fighters face....having read (probably too many) boxing books it seems to be a constant and consistent theme; the sense of being completely apart from the world because you can't eat or drink what you like, have to go to bed early to get up early and run and basically lock yourself away from the world.

And all of this is faced by young men who are at the exact time in their lives when going out with friends/girls is the most natural thing to do. You're got to be driven to be successful....but the sacrifices are huge/unnatural and often you are hundreds of miles away from your friends and family.

Matt Macklin did a telling interview recently where he described his time living in New York. He had a swanky apartment in the financial district but there was nobody there once business closed for the day and he could not even go out for a coffee because everything for miles around him was shut....he was going slowly, stir crazy. And Matt's a clever, well-travelled guy.

Frank Bruno's first 'ghosted' book, published long before Frank's well-documented mental health problems, absolutely aches of what a difficult, lonely and depressing life it can be. He writes about how much he loves his wife; but there's a chapter where he basically describes how hard he trained and he's seeing his wife basically over the breakfast table. No wonder they became strangers sharing the same house.

Even Calzaghe, the settled 'home boy' from the Valleys with a big, extended Anglo-Italian family, talks about the sense of loneliness and being apart from the world in his book.

God knows what Darren felt, miles away from home, in some tiny flat and with all that huge pressure to be 'a star' on him.

That's an excellent and thought provoking post, thanks

[187]

One of the untold issues surrounding Darren's tragic death is the issue of being incredibly lonely and how this is a black curse so many fighters face....having read (probably too many) boxing books it seems to be a constant and consistent theme; the sense of being completely apart from the world because you can't eat or drink what you like, have to go to bed early to get up early and run and basically lock yourself away from the world.

And all of this is faced by young men who are at the exact time in their lives when going out with friends/girls is the most natural thing to do. You're got to be driven to be successful....but the sacrifices are huge/unnatural and often you are hundreds of miles away from your friends and family.

Matt Macklin did a telling interview recently where he described his time living in New York. He had a swanky apartment in the financial district but there was nobody there once business closed for the day and he could not even go out for a coffee because everything for miles around him was shut....he was going slowly, stir crazy. And Matt's a clever, well-travelled guy.

Frank Bruno's first 'ghosted' book, published long before Frank's well-documented mental health problems, absolutely aches of what a difficult, lonely and depressing life it can be. He writes about how much he loves his wife; but there's a chapter where he basically describes how hard he trained and he's seeing his wife basically over the breakfast table. No wonder they became strangers sharing the same house.

Even Calzaghe, the settled 'home boy' from the Valleys with a big, extended Anglo-Italian family, talks about the sense of loneliness and being apart from the world in his book.

God knows what Darren felt, miles away from home, in some tiny flat and with all that huge pressure to be 'a star' on him.

Good post and an interesting point. It's my opinion that being alone like this can be both good and bad, good because it teaches you a lot about yourself and bad because it brings out the demons within.

[Tomasino]

One of the untold issues surrounding Darren's tragic death is the issue of being incredibly lonely and how this is a black curse so many fighters face....having read (probably too many) boxing books it seems to be a constant and consistent theme; the sense of being completely apart from the world because you can't eat or drink what you like, have to go to bed early to get up early and run and basically lock yourself away from the world.

And all of this is faced by young men who are at the exact time in their lives when going out with friends/girls is the most natural thing to do. You're got to be driven to be successful....but the sacrifices are huge/unnatural and often you are hundreds of miles away from your friends and family.

Matt Macklin did a telling interview recently where he described his time living in New York. He had a swanky apartment in the financial district but there was nobody there once business closed for the day and he could not even go out for a coffee because everything for miles around him was shut....he was going slowly, stir crazy. And Matt's a clever, well-travelled guy.

Frank Bruno's first 'ghosted' book, published long before Frank's well-documented mental health problems, absolutely aches of what a difficult, lonely and depressing life it can be. He writes about how much he loves his wife; but there's a chapter where he basically describes how hard he trained and he's seeing his wife basically over the breakfast table. No wonder they became strangers sharing the same house.

Even Calzaghe, the settled 'home boy' from the Valleys with a big, extended Anglo-Italian family, talks about the sense of loneliness and being apart from the world in his book.

God knows what Darren felt, miles away from home, in some tiny flat and with all that huge pressure to be 'a star' on him.

Good post and an interesting point. It's my opinion that being alone like this can be both good and bad, good because it teaches you a lot about yourself and bad because it brings out the demons within.

The solitude wouldn't be so good if some demented cross dressing twat was making threats to you and your family. I don't think for one second little Frank wasn't aware of Darren's issues.

[TheLeprechaun]

I think the Rasalev fight had him doubting himself. Couple that with depression, loneliness and Maloney being Maloney and you get what you get. He always came across like a quiet introspective lad and fairly intelligent.

Sometimes the futility and meaningless of life can get to some people.