BoxRec

righthook wrote:

handsofstone wrote:If Bellew was so weight drained which ive no reason to doubt,why did he continue at LHW after losing to Cleverly?

I take weight making excuses with a pinch of salt as pretty much every fighter claims its an issue,but 100% of the time its after a loss

Plus if Cleverly was only a paper champ,then by that notion,Bellew hasnt held any titles as a pro

he continued because he believed he won the fight and he expected an immediate rematch. he also was already ranked high in the division so he had options.
everyone knows that the light heavy to cruiser weight jump is ridiculous, almost 2 stone. bellew continued at light heavy until it was physically impossible to make the weight. just ask yourself this how many of your friends or people u knoe are 6 foot 3 plus and are 12 stone 7? never mind being that weight and competing against top class boxers. every man and his dog could see bellew was weight drained theres been countless threads over that exact topic.

6 foot 3 plus what? He looked fleshy at light heavyweight now looks fleshier at cruiserweight.

Tomasino wrote:

righthook wrote:

handsofstone wrote:If Bellew was so weight drained which ive no reason to doubt,why did he continue at LHW after losing to Cleverly?

I take weight making excuses with a pinch of salt as pretty much every fighter claims its an issue,but 100% of the time its after a loss

Plus if Cleverly was only a paper champ,then by that notion,Bellew hasnt held any titles as a pro

he continued because he believed he won the fight and he expected an immediate rematch. he also was already ranked high in the division so he had options.
everyone knows that the light heavy to cruiser weight jump is ridiculous, almost 2 stone. bellew continued at light heavy until it was physically impossible to make the weight. just ask yourself this how many of your friends or people u knoe are 6 foot 3 plus and are 12 stone 7? never mind being that weight and competing against top class boxers. every man and his dog could see bellew was weight drained theres been countless threads over that exact topic.

6 foot 3 plus what? He looked fleshy at light heavyweight now looks fleshier at cruiserweight.

he looked like a skeleton!

obviously im speaking to someone who knows very little about boxing? do you think that if you look good in your body you are a good boxer? if that is the case why dont body builders turn pro.

look at muhammad ali one of the best of all time i wouldnt say he had the best body. theres countless boxers who havnt got great bodies who are class fighters

righthook wrote:

Tomasino wrote:
6 foot 3 plus what? He looked fleshy at light heavyweight now looks fleshier at cruiserweight.

he looked like a skeleton!

obviously im speaking to someone who knows very little about boxing? do you think that if you look good in your body you are a good boxer? if that is the case why dont body builders turn pro.

look at muhammad ali one of the best of all time i wouldnt say he had the best body. theres countless boxers who havnt got great bodies who are class fighters

Yup. If fights were won on physique alone, Lacy would have battered Calzaghe.

righthook wrote:

handsofstone wrote:If Bellew was so weight drained which ive no reason to doubt,why did he continue at LHW after losing to Cleverly?

I take weight making excuses with a pinch of salt as pretty much every fighter claims its an issue,but 100% of the time its after a loss

Plus if Cleverly was only a paper champ,then by that notion,Bellew hasnt held any titles as a pro

he continued because he believed he won the fight and he expected an immediate rematch. he also was already ranked high in the division so he had options.
everyone knows that the light heavy to cruiser weight jump is ridiculous, almost 2 stone. bellew continued at light heavy until it was physically impossible to make the weight. just ask yourself this how many of your friends or people u knoe are 6 foot 3 plus and are 12 stone 7? never mind being that weight and competing against top class boxers. every man and his dog could see bellew was weight drained theres been countless threads over that exact topic.

Straight after the fight he admitted that he had not done enough. Cleverley then says something at the post fight press conference and all of a sudden Bellew reckons he won the fight.

There are not many that thought Bellew won the first fight. It was close though.

I need to look again, but I remeber looking at both their fights at cruiser and felt that Clev looked much better.

I think Clev on points again. With Bellend claiming he got robbed. And threatening Clev....yawn...

Ps I won't be buying the PPV, so watching the fuzzy stream I am not sure I will be able to judge appropriately. Will rely on Boxrec RbR

="righthook"]

Tomasino wrote:

righthook wrote:

handsofstone wrote:If Bellew was so weight drained which ive no reason to doubt,why did he continue at LHW after losing to Cleverly?

I take weight making excuses with a pinch of salt as pretty much every fighter claims its an issue,but 100% of the time its after a loss

Plus if Cleverly was only a paper champ,then by that notion,Bellew hasnt held any titles as a pro

he continued because he believed he won the fight and he expected an immediate rematch. he also was already ranked high in the division so he had options.
everyone knows that the light heavy to cruiser weight jump is ridiculous, almost 2 stone. bellew continued at light heavy until it was physically impossible to make the weight. just ask yourself this how many of your friends or people u knoe are 6 foot 3 plus and are 12 stone 7? never mind being that weight and competing against top class boxers. every man and his dog could see bellew was weight drained theres been countless threads over that exact topic.

6 foot 3 plus what? He looked fleshy at light heavyweight now looks fleshier at cruiserweight.

he looked like a skeleton!

obviously im speaking to someone who knows very little about boxing? do you think that if you look good in your body you are a good boxer? if that is the case why dont body builders turn pro.

look at muhammad ali one of the best of all time i wouldnt say he had the best body. theres countless boxers who havnt got great bodies who are class fighters[/quote]


Give me a break, I'm not saying all boxers should be built like tanks. You said 6'3" plus, I said plus what? Is he 6'4"?

He's fleshy that's all. I'm not saying you have to be massive to be the best, but Tonys not close anyway, you know that as well as I do.

You've used Bill Gates as an example of Tonys wealth and success and now Ali. He's more like a Sven Ottke type. Ali was ripped when he was young, pre lay off so it's a poor example anyway.

righthook wrote:

Tomasino wrote:

righthook wrote:If Bellew was so weight drained which ive no reason to doubt,why did he continue at LHW after losing to Cleverly?

I take weight making excuses with a pinch of salt as pretty much every fighter claims its an issue,but 100% of the time its after a loss

Plus if Cleverly was only a paper champ,then by that notion,Bellew hasnt held any titles as a pro

he continued because he believed he won the fight and he expected an immediate rematch. he also was already ranked high in the division so he had options.
everyone knows that the light heavy to cruiser weight jump is ridiculous, almost 2 stone. bellew continued at light heavy until it was physically impossible to make the weight. just ask yourself this how many of your friends or people u knoe are 6 foot 3 plus and are 12 stone 7? never mind being that weight and competing against top class boxers. every man and his dog could see bellew was weight drained theres been countless threads over that exact topic.

6 foot 3 plus what? He looked fleshy at light heavyweight now looks fleshier at cruiserweight.

he looked like a skeleton!

obviously im speaking to someone who knows very little about boxing? do you think that if you look good in your body you are a good boxer? if that is the case why dont body builders turn pro.

look at muhammad ali one of the best of all time i wouldnt say he had the best body. theres countless boxers who havnt got great bodies who are class fighters

I agree with righthook, and because someone can get down to a certain weight doesn't mean they should.

This happened with Chris Byrd, he was a successful heavyweight and managed to get himself down to light heavyweight only to get himself beaten up. This has happened to a few successful heavyweights who managed to get themselves down to cruiserweight or light heavyweight and have found they have been nowhere near as successful.

Tony Bellew should have turned pro at cruiserweight at least, he is very lean at the height but he was never a light heavyweight - I remember saying something along those lines when he first turned pro. Never the less, he still did OK.

Tony has the big punch to rely on and as such it's not too difficult to see him stopping cleverly on Saturday, especially a cleverly who could have mental scars after the kovalev fight.

However, I think clev is just the better all round fighter and is tougher than people think. I think he wins on points by 2-3 rounds.

Good domestic match this one.

I think Bellew has been goading Clev into believing it is going to be a phonebox fight, hes going to get on his bike get behind the jab and run. He learns a lot in rematches., will establish the jab early and 1st 6 rounds will be very dull

Tony Bellew should have turned pro at cruiserweight at least, he is very lean at the height but he was never a light heavyweight - I remember saying something along those lines when he first turned pro. Never the less, he still did OK.

@Fatgit.....agreed with that, I am still not entirely sure why Tony has not gone with cruiserweight from the get-go.

Ok, so years ago the cruisers were none too fashionable, popular or profitable. But by the time Tony turned pro it was already way more lively/respected, with some top fighters and match-ups, and I thought he was always a natural cruiser from the outset.

I am still hoplessly undecided about Nathan C......there's only one defeat in there and it's against someone who we now know has the potential to be a stand-out champion in his era; so no shame there.

But something still nags me that Nathan has not kicked-on in the way he was first predicted to achieve (Joe's book underlines the fact the Calzaghes rated him big time) and I worry that Kovalev has done some lasting damage.

Plenty keyboard psychiatrists in here.
Clev has done fine since getting battered by Kov, not sure where all this talk of his head not being in comes from. Far too dangerous to go in to a fight like this if you don't really want to.

Clev to stop Bellew for me, he's no granite chinned warrior. Clev is bigger, quicker, stronger and fitter. All the ingredients for a win.

I think Cleverly picks Bellew apart. Got a feeling Bellews going to get cut bad like he did against Bolonti. Cleverly to win by TKO round 8 would be my prediction.

I'm a fan of both fighters. To be honest when Clev first came on the scene I was mightily impressed and expected him to go on to a great on the world stage. And he still can.

But lack of fights seems to have harmed him. he hasn't progressed as i would have expected. For such a skilled man and intelligent boxer he is remarkably stuck in a groove...

He trundles forwards throwing his blizzard of punches and remains alarmingly hittable. I'd like to see him jab and move more. Concentrate on defence. He needs more strategic variety. And went into the Kov fight with the same approach as all his other fights.

Tony isn't as polished a boxer but he makes the best of what he has. He doesn't fear Clev's power and will have a go.

He has a real will to win. I think he made a big mistake in the Stevenson fight going straight to the corner when hurt. And I wish he would have thrown his right hand more because if he could have landed clean it could have been very different.

But Tony didn't get home advantage in that one.

Tony is emotional and he sues that to get the very best out of himself. I think that also masks the fact that he's an intelligent boxer himself.

I can't split them. But then I scored the first fight a draw.

taffytoon wrote:Watched Cleverly at the open workout today and he looks huge compared to when he was at LH. His shoulders have broudened and his punches were much harder when hitting the bag and pads. May the best man win and I hope if TB loses or wins he respects his opponent.

I can't wait for this whole card if I am honest

i was there too along with the other 30 people :-) , Nathan looked huge????? hes 2 stone heavier so would do. timing looked way out on the pads tho but that may just be as it wasn't a proper session and as for punching hard look at the pad it was like punching a pillow my 6 year old could make it look like he was punching hard. totally off subject lets just hope THE REF doesnt spoil this one

Ezzard wrote: For such a skilled man and intelligent boxer

Tony isn't as polished a boxer

How is Cleverly even remotely a 'skilled boxer'? When you said he trundles forward and remains alarmingly hittable, that was more on the mark.

This will be a close fight. Maybe even a good one.

Expecting a terrific and close fight.

But how is Clev not "even remotely" skilled? He was in The Ring's top 5 LHWs for 4 years.

His height of 6ft 3 means little to do with his weight which is proven by welters and middles who have been that weight. It is down to the individuals skeletal structure, muscle content, fat etc.

I do not know if he should have been a cruiser all along and am not going to dispute that as I do not know the guy but generally speaking I would say just because a guy struggles to get down to a weight does not actually mean it is the wrong weight and the boxing community assumption of that fcuks me right off tbh. It could also be a lack of proper guidance or knowledge on how to cut weight correctly and so have the wrong macros, at the wrong time, not understanding your body properly and so many variables that could be changed with experience to then be someone who makes weight very easily.

I will say on Bellew that he did not look skeletal to me at 175lb and actually looked soft and like someone who could tuck under the limit a lot easier with proper guidance.