BoxRec

Did quinlins trainer tell you to post this article cos its pure shite talk

ikorolev wrote:

ReggieDiggs wrote:

ikorolev wrote:Yes, he was robbed by himself being pu$$y in the ring.

Its boxing you f#cking moron. There are all sorts of strategies with boxing that don't involving running face first into your opposition winging punches like Rocky Balboa for 36 minutes. If you aren't knowledgeable enough about boxing to know various strategies can prove successful in the ring & that mixing up your game should be part of any high level boxers strategy as well, fair enough. I forgive my harsh comments due to your ignorance about boxing if that is in fact the case.

Oh, you are so smart. You even know about different strategies ! What good did his strategy give to Quillin ? The only two morons in this discussion are Quillin and you.

Edit: besides, Lee was clearly hurt and was unable to throw anything dangerous back. Only a pu$$y could be so cautious in such situation. By stopping Lee in 1, Quillin could raise his status significantly but he blew it.

Yeah we all know Lee isn't able to muster any decent power shots when the going gets rough

Anyway, I a case like this where either man could have gotten the win without much controversy, a draw is probably the most fair outcome.

crusader wrote:

koolkc107 wrote:

crusader wrote:I disagree. I've watched it several times and if I pause the video when the bell first sounds Quillin is throwing a jab and has yet to land the right hand and left hook that come next.

You are wrong about scoring and have given no evidence that the round can only be scored 10-9 if the dropped fighter was dominant. Lee rocked Quillin earlier in the round anyway and I thought he clearly got the better of the action apart from going down.

Actually, under the 10 point must system the round MUST be scored 10-8 because the Ref clearly ruled it a KD.

But my point, and the point of this thread is not about round 3 but round one.

The punch landed right before the bell rang.

No, the round doesn't have to be scored 10-8 and you've given no evidence to the contrary. A score of 10-9 fits with the 10 point must system by the way, since the winner of the round would still get 10 points.

Once again, I disagree with your take on the first round.

Correct. There is no written rule to score anything other than 10-9 all other variations are up to the judge.

Anyone who thinks Quillin was robbed needs to go book themselves in for a full frontal labotomy because you are seriously fricking delusional. He was lucky not to lose the fight. Andy Lee shown him far too much respect in the first few rounds but once Lee found his rhythm and stopped walking on to the right hand Quillin looked devoid of ideas and hardly put two punches together. His work rate was none existent from the 6th round onwards.

No robbery.

I don't see anyone calling either fighter anything but gutsy. Quillan has been extremely classy in interviews. Said what most who have seen Lee know. He is highly dangerous when he is hurt. You don't just walk in. People seem to forget entirely that Lee was beating Chavez till late (and good old Dickie Cole allowed a ton of low blows like always for the favorite fighter), beat Jackson in a war, and then beat Korobov (a very tough opponent). Quillan has been N'Dam - who has looked very good since. Two tough middles both with a lot of power. There was a lot of sharp shooting in the fight. And as Reggie Diggs so rightly points out - that is boxing and strategy. You don't walk in on either of these guys. They can bang and they are tall. I enjoyed the fight a good deal. Emanuel Steward has to be smiling in heaven.

Being over cautious costed Quillin the fight. Yes, they picked the cautious strategy, but he overdid it.

Speaking about being dangerous while hurt, Lee wasn't hurt when he fought Korobov or at the time when he stopped Jackson. The first round KD was hard and he wasn't physically capable of throwing anything dangerous back in the 20 seconds before the bell. That was Peter's chance to prove that he belongs to MW elite, and he blew it.

Sorry but If you had to rewind the fight and you just about caught the punch before the bell....how do you expect people in real time without the benefit of a replay to spot that?

This is no way close to an injustice the blame can be solely placed at quillns door... over weight and under estimated Lee. ..

ikorolev wrote:Being over cautious costed Quillin the fight. Yes, they picked the cautious strategy, but he overdid it.

Speaking about being dangerous while hurt, Lee wasn't hurt when he fought Korobov or at the time when he stopped Jackson. The first round KD was hard and he wasn't physically capable of throwing anything dangerous back in the 20 seconds before the bell. That was Peter's chance to prove that he belongs to MW elite, and he blew it.

I agree with ikorolev.

ajwesty13 wrote:Sorry but If you had to rewind the fight and you just about caught the punch before the bell....how do you expect people in real time without the benefit of a replay to spot that?

This is no way close to an injustice the blame can be solely placed at quillns door... over weight and under estimated Lee. ..

Fair enough. It might indeed be hard to catch in real time.

But I thought someone said replay might be used in the PBC.

If so, then maybe they coulda gotten that one right.

In one replay, you can see the timer still moving as the punch is landed.

Let me clarify one more thing.

I said before the fight that a guy who doesn't make weight, whether he does it on purpose or not, is cheating.

I still believe that.

I am not upset that Quillen didn't win.

The question mark on the title of the OP means I wanted to get takes on the possibility of what happened, not make a definite statement.

koolkc107 wrote: Fair enough. It might indeed be hard to catch in real time.

But I thought someone said replay might be used in the PBC.

If so, then maybe they coulda gotten that one right.

In one replay, you can see the timer still moving as the punch is landed.

Let me clarify one more thing.

I said before the fight that a guy who doesn't make weight, whether he does it on purpose or not, is cheating.

I still believe that.

I am not upset that Quillen didn't win.

The question mark on the title of the OP means I wanted to get takes on the possibility of what happened, not make a definite statement.

For sure mate its good to see what others think get a bit more clairty on the situation ... in all honesty it appears like most people quillen by easy win and i could imagine he was thinking about his next bout...

i am sure if there is a rematch quillen like froch did with Grooves hel be turn up this time.

Gents, you're welcome to agree to disagree, but please refrain from name calling. Number of you had 2 or 1 warnings, therefore I recommend you keep your cool

cletomex wrote:

koolkc107 wrote:Actually, under the 10 point must system the round MUST be scored 10-8 because the Ref clearly ruled it a KD.

What? No. The round can also be scored 10-9.

This is from THIS website:


There are typically three judges for each fight, who calculate points as follows:

If a judge deems that fighter A has out-boxed fighter B in a round, then s/he will score the round 10 points for fighter A, and 9 points for fighter B. If fighter B is knocked down by fighter A, and receives a standing count, then the round is scored 10 points to fighter A and 8 points to fighter B. If the judge decides that neither fighter won a round, then he will score it 10 points to each fighter.

http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/How_to_Score_a_Fight

Scoring anything else but 10-8 after a KD doesn't seem to be an option here...

koolkc107 wrote:

cletomex wrote:

koolkc107 wrote:Actually, under the 10 point must system the round MUST be scored 10-8 because the Ref clearly ruled it a KD.

What? No. The round can also be scored 10-9.

This is from THIS website:


There are typically three judges for each fight, who calculate points as follows:

If a judge deems that fighter A has out-boxed fighter B in a round, then s/he will score the round 10 points for fighter A, and 9 points for fighter B. If fighter B is knocked down by fighter A, and receives a standing count, then the round is scored 10 points to fighter A and 8 points to fighter B. If the judge decides that neither fighter won a round, then he will score it 10 points to each fighter.

http://boxrec.com/media/index.php/How_to_Score_a_Fight

Scoring anything else but 10-8 after a KD doesn't seem to be an option here...

Yes, it's from Boxrec, not New York rules. According to the RULES, the judge has the discretion to score it 10-9 if he wants. You are simply wrong.

PQ was not robbed!! I say again, "PQ was not Robbed!!"

It was a very close fight and one of the knockdowns should not have been counted, I wouldn't have been disappointed with a win for Lee or Quillin by one point either way.

Peter played the puncher's game too long and waited to pull the trigger looking for the one or two big shots that he had success with in the first and while he was doing that Lee was picking him apart working up and down (the body and head).

Quillin landed the harder shots in the beginning and his punches seemed to have a visual effect which may lend to the fact that some think he was more dominant and I get that but Andy was busier in the middle to late rounds but those knockdowns counted against him but lucky for him Peter's lack of output evened up the bout.

I'd love to see a rematch.

I think NY is consistent with most everywhere else.
With a KD, that is a 10-8 round unless the man who hit the canvas had a very good round otherwise.
And aside from the KD, the round could have went either way.

§211.6 Referees powers and duties.
"...the referee shall have the exclusive
authority to decide whether or not a boxer or wrestler
is knocked down during the course of a round and shall
indicate such decision to the timekeeper or alternate
referee whose count shall be accordingly continued or
discontinued, and, if the count is to be continued, the
referee shall pick it up orally and by gesture after first
assuring that the opponent of the fallen participant
shall have retreated to the most distant neutral corner
of the ring;..."

§212.1 Points...At the conclusion of each round, each
judge shall score each participants performance on
these four items, and if the performance of each boxer
is close and competitive to the others performance but
one boxer is just slightly superior to his opponent in
such round, ten points shall be scored for such boxer
and nine points scored for the opponent. If a boxers
performance is decisive and dominant (including a
flash knockdown) compared to the performance of the
opponent in any one round, ten points should be scored
for such boxer and eight points scored for the
opponent. If a round is one-sided and the superior
boxer also scores one or more clean knockdowns, ten
points should be scored for such boxer and seven
points for the opponent. If the performance of each
boxer in a particular round is of identical quality to the
performance of the other ten points shall be scored for
each boxer for such round...


§212.2 Knockdowns. The judges shall score a
knockdown in any one round in a manner which is
consistent with section 212.1 of this Part.

http://www.dos.ny.gov/athletic/pdfs/201 ... awbook.pdf

Knockdowns doesn't always have to amount to 2 points, usually some judges will use discretion in a case where a certain fighter may have been winning the entire round and scores a KD, should he get 2 points in that case? I don't think so!

If anything I can see Lee coming away with a 1 point win, especially if you take the one bogus KD away.

KBB wrote:Knockdowns doesn't always have to amount to 2 points, usually some judges will use discretion in a case where a certain fighter may have been winning the entire round and scores a KD, should he get 2 points in that case? I don't think so!

If anything I can see Lee coming away with a 1 point win, especially if you take the one bogus KD away.

\

Again, it is very rare that in a close round a KD DOESN'T result in a 2 point edge.

No matter who is winning a close round, usually a KD overrules that and the round is scored 10-8.

What that judge did is not unprecedented, but it is very rare.

And perhaps in this case, in error.

koolkc107 wrote:

KBB wrote:Knockdowns doesn't always have to amount to 2 points, usually some judges will use discretion in a case where a certain fighter may have been winning the entire round and scores a KD, should he get 2 points in that case? I don't think so!

If anything I can see Lee coming away with a 1 point win, especially if you take the one bogus KD away.

\

Again, it is very rare that in a close round a KD DOESN'T result in a 2 point edge.

No matter who is winning a close round, usually a KD overrules that and the round is scored 10-8.

What that judge did is not unprecedented, but it is very rare.

And perhaps in this case, in error.

I agree that it is very rare and that it is usually counted as 2 points but that shouldn't be written in stone especially in a case where a fighter is clearly dominating the round.

Personally I saw the KD scored as an error because it is clear from the instant replay that he was only knocked down because of PQ standing on his foot.

The Ref blew the call so rightfully the judges counted it as 2 points although I disagree with it being scored that way.

Lee was not dominating round three.

Winning it? Yeah, probably.

Dominating? No.

And in a close round, in a round either guy could get a 10-9 in, a KD is usually 10-8 for the guy who didn't get put down.

The ref made clear that it was a KD.

The judge needed to follow his instructions.

Yes, judges can exercise discretion...but only where they have the leeway to do so.

A referee ruling a KD is the same as a referee deducting a point.

The judge MUST score it accordingly.

koolkc107 wrote:Lee was not dominating round three.

Winning it? Yeah, probably.

Dominating? No.

And in a close round, in a round either guy could get a 10-9 in, a KD is usually 10-8 for the guy who didn't get put down.

The ref made clear that it was a KD.

The judge needed to follow his instructions.

Yes, judges can exercise discretion...but only where they have the leeway to do so.

A referee ruling a KD is the same as a referee deducting a point.

The judge MUST score it accordingly.

For the record I wasn't trying to imply that Lee was dominating in any round, I was merely using the analogy of how knockdowns can and have been scored (not necessarily in this case).

I agree, I never saw any domination by Andy in any round except where he scored the KD.

The Ref did make it clear that it was a KD but only because he missed the part where PQ stepped on AL's foot which contributed to him being off-balance and knocked down.

So rightfully the judges should score it as a knockdown to which the majority did and one didn't.

The judges must score a KD by subtracting a point from a boxer who was down. If a score without a KD was 10:9, then it becomes 10:8. If a judge thinks that the KD just leveled the things and the round became even 10:10, then after subtracting a point, it becomes 10:9.

ikorolev wrote:The judges must score a KD by subtracting a point from a boxer who was down. If a score without a KD was 10:9, then it becomes 10:8. If a judge thinks that the KD just leveled the things and the round became even 10:10, then after subtracting a point, it becomes 10:9.

And you just stumbled upon my main problem with a 10-9 round 3 for Quillen. If you think Lee won the round, he gets the 10 points then you go from there. So, whatever score you get, you have Lee starting with 10. You can have 10-9 Lee, or 9-9 even after you take a point from Lee for the KD.

But if you have Quillen 10-9, you have him winning the round. If you have him winning, he starts with 10. And if you have him winning because of the KD, it MUST be 10-8 Quillen.

The judge screwed up.

The judge had the round tied at 10:10 based on the 4 components and then subtracted the point for the KD.

ikorolev wrote:The judge had the round tied at 10:10 based on the 4 components and then subtracted the point for the KD.

Might work. But a pretty close round with a KD is still usually scored 10-8.

But, my main point in the OP is to talk about the second KD in round one that was erroneously thought to have occurred after the bell.

The punch was before or with the bell and should have been counted.

koolkc107 wrote:Might work. But a pretty close round with a KD is still usually scored 10-8.

But, my main point in the OP is to talk about the second KD in round one that was erroneously thought to have occurred after the bell.

The punch was before or with the bell and should have been counted.

You're on your own.