BoxRec

Tanzio wrote:

boxing_rocks wrote:You are arguing about terminology. The point is that including him in p4p top 10 and making him fighter of the year was way too much.

I disagree. Frampton earned it. LSC deserves respect for his skills, ring intelligence / ability to adapt. Neither of them may be top 10 p4p but they are both top 20 and LSC is very close given that performance. LSC sent a message to anyone within his weight range. He is a formidable challenge for anyone.

We can only compare them to each other, Mares and Quigg. Until they fight Russell Jr and/or Valdez, I am not even sure about top 20 p4p.

boxing_rocks wrote:

Tanzio wrote:

boxing_rocks wrote:You are arguing about terminology. The point is that including him in p4p top 10 and making him fighter of the year was way too much.

I disagree. Frampton earned it. LSC deserves respect for his skills, ring intelligence / ability to adapt. Neither of them may be top 10 p4p but they are both top 20 and LSC is very close given that performance. LSC sent a message to anyone within his weight range. He is a formidable challenge for anyone.

We can only compare them to each other, Mares and Quigg. Until they fight Russell Jr and/or Valdez, I am not even sure about top 20 p4p.

The same can be said about nearly every fighter in the top 20. LSC faced criticism for years for his opposition. He steps it up and he still faces criticism.

Nearly everyone claimed that LSC would never face Frampton. He has twice and he has faced Mares and plenty of other credible foes. Most felt he would be out-boxed by Frampton and possibly stopped. He turned those tables proving his versatility.

Gary Russell Jr. and Valdez are the ones who have something to prove, not LSC or Frampton. TRex junior hasn't fought in nearly a year. Why not fight Valdez or Quigg or Mares? Or anyone ffs.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see a featherweight tourney. My problem is with the moving the goal posts / raising the bar mentality that you are displaying. LSC and Frampton have proven themselves in the ring. They should be judged by that evidence. I think that they are both top 20 and LSC right around number ten. They will have to continue proving themselves as any boxer must and they both have a track record of doing so.

I would prefer that they put their rivalry on the back burner and they face other boxers for at least a year or two though.

Tanzio wrote:

handsofstone wrote:TBH ive not seen anyone say the rematch was a great fight

I think it was an excellent fight, but LSC controlled it throughout and Frampton could not adjust. LSC won it in the preparation and the execution. Frampton (and most of the rest of the boxing world) did not believe that LSC could outbox him.

It was a beautiful fight by Leo Santa Cruz and he deserves huge respect for his ability to completely change styles for this fight. He proved a huge percentage of people wrong last night.

LSC is far better than most thought.

Santa sucks. This opponent was selected to avoid Gary Russell in the first place. LSC would get KTFO

boxing_rocks wrote:

Tanzio wrote:

boxing_rocks wrote:You are arguing about terminology. The point is that including him in p4p top 10 and making him fighter of the year was way too much.

I disagree. Frampton earned it. LSC deserves respect for his skills, ring intelligence / ability to adapt. Neither of them may be top 10 p4p but they are both top 20 and LSC is very close given that performance. LSC sent a message to anyone within his weight range. He is a formidable challenge for anyone.

We can only compare them to each other, Mares and Quigg. Until they fight Russell Jr and/or Valdez, I am not even sure about top 20 p4p.

Besides old Gonzalez, Russell hasn't beat anyone even as good as Mares nor Quigg. Valdez hasn't beaten anyone. I don't see how Russell is relevant after wasting a good portion of his career chasing has been JML and responded to Santa Cruz as "Oh yea,we beat him in the amateurs" Too bad amateur wins don't carry over.

Kalan wrote:

Tanzio wrote:

handsofstone wrote:TBH ive not seen anyone say the rematch was a great fight

I think it was an excellent fight, but LSC controlled it throughout and Frampton could not adjust. LSC won it in the preparation and the execution. Frampton (and most of the rest of the boxing world) did not believe that LSC could outbox him.

It was a beautiful fight by Leo Santa Cruz and he deserves huge respect for his ability to completely change styles for this fight. He proved a huge percentage of people wrong last night.

LSC is far better than most thought.

Santa sucks. This opponent was selected to avoid Gary Russell in the first place. LSC would get KTFO

Who is TRex Jr. fighting next? When? Will it be this year? Will the opponent have a pulse?

Cue "the whole world is ducking TRex Jr." arguments.

Tanzio wrote:

boxing_rocks wrote:

Tanzio wrote: I disagree. Frampton earned it. LSC deserves respect for his skills, ring intelligence / ability to adapt. Neither of them may be top 10 p4p but they are both top 20 and LSC is very close given that performance. LSC sent a message to anyone within his weight range. He is a formidable challenge for anyone.

We can only compare them to each other, Mares and Quigg. Until they fight Russell Jr and/or Valdez, I am not even sure about top 20 p4p.

The same can be said about nearly every fighter in the top 20. LSC faced criticism for years for his opposition. He steps it up and he still faces criticism.

Nearly everyone claimed that LSC would never face Frampton. He has twice and he has faced Mares and plenty of other credible foes. Most felt he would be out-boxed by Frampton and possibly stopped. He turned those tables proving his versatility.

Gary Russell Jr. and Valdez are the ones who have something to prove, not LSC or Frampton. TRex junior hasn't fought in nearly a year. Why not fight Valdez or Quigg or Mares? Or anyone ffs.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see a featherweight tourney. My problem is with the moving the goal posts / raising the bar mentality that you are displaying. LSC and Frampton have proven themselves in the ring. They should be judged by that evidence. I think that they are both top 20 and LSC right around number ten. They will have to continue proving themselves as any boxer must and they both have a track record of doing so.

I would prefer that they put their rivalry on the back burner and they face other boxers for at least a year or two though.

I can agree with most of what you said, but my eye test places Russell Jr. and Valdez above Frampton and Santa Cruz. I may be wrong, but only these guys fighting each other can disprove me. Resumes can't.

boxing_rocks wrote:

Tanzio wrote:

boxing_rocks wrote:
We can only compare them to each other, Mares and Quigg. Until they fight Russell Jr and/or Valdez, I am not even sure about top 20 p4p.

The same can be said about nearly every fighter in the top 20. LSC faced criticism for years for his opposition. He steps it up and he still faces criticism.

Nearly everyone claimed that LSC would never face Frampton. He has twice and he has faced Mares and plenty of other credible foes. Most felt he would be out-boxed by Frampton and possibly stopped. He turned those tables proving his versatility.

Gary Russell Jr. and Valdez are the ones who have something to prove, not LSC or Frampton. TRex junior hasn't fought in nearly a year. Why not fight Valdez or Quigg or Mares? Or anyone ffs.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see a featherweight tourney. My problem is with the moving the goal posts / raising the bar mentality that you are displaying. LSC and Frampton have proven themselves in the ring. They should be judged by that evidence. I think that they are both top 20 and LSC right around number ten. They will have to continue proving themselves as any boxer must and they both have a track record of doing so.

I would prefer that they put their rivalry on the back burner and they face other boxers for at least a year or two though.

I can agree with most of what you said, but my eye test places Russell Jr. and Valdez above Frampton and Santa Cruz. I may be wrong, but only these guys fighting each other can disprove me. Resumes can't.

Fine with me any way you slice it between those four but let's not forget Mares and Quigg. I would like to see Gary v Abner and Quigg v Valdez. Winners get Frampton and LSC, losers get each other, and so on.