BoxRec

Nightmare Roy wrote:The guy is 35 next week and he's had about 500 fights, He's bound to be on the slide a bit.

And he was fighting someone probably 20lbs heavier on fight night.

veriton wrote:Think you're doing Jacobs a disservice there pal. He's top level and showed it against GGG. But styles make fights, I still think GGG would hammer canelo but Jacobs was smart and can hit like a mule too. You're writing GGG off on one result (a win!) which is just as bad as the nuthuggers on the other side

Jacobs stuck to a very good gameplan. Every interval, his trainer was very thorough. Stick to the jab, down and up.

A lot of very good fighters have struggled with opponents worse than Jacobs, and GGG still pulled out the win at nearly 35.

OP is one of the most miserable posters around and is always champing at the bit for today's highly rated fighters to fail. I remember how giddy he was getting when Brook had a good round or two

And Tim, I thought you said you were done with boxing? You're negativity certainly doesnt fail to show !

boxingknockout wrote:

Nightmare Roy wrote:The guy is 35 next week and he's had about 500 fights, He's bound to be on the slide a bit.

And he was fighting someone probably 20lbs heavier on fight night.

That's true he looked massive in comparison

Anyway, GGG has definitely been overrated by a number people, but his last fight doesn't change too much for me. He wasn't the greatest middleweight ever before Saturday, it should've already been clear he wasn't the biggest P4P puncher ever, and so on. I've always thought there were fighters out there with good chances of beating him (like Froch and Ward), and Jacobs became the first to make an argument in the ring against GGG, but the decision was correct in my opinion and I'd still take Golovkin over all other active middleweights and JMWs.

In GGG I don't see one of the best few fighters ever, but I do see a very good world champion, one of IBHOF caliber.

dalcumly wrote:ALL the great middleweights needed 'judges' on occasion to win their fights.

The greatest middleweight of all time was Sugar Ray Robinson and in my lifetime, a close second was Marvin Hagler. Golovkin is not at that level, but that doesn't mean he's not at the very top. Its a personal opinion but when you have a boxer in any era who when fighting for a world title can knock the other guy out with one punch, that's stardom. So he couldn't stop Jacobs, but he retained his titles by unanimous decision. Still undefeated and all his defences have been on foreign soil ( for him). Does not not show he can box AND punch.

Agreed

I'm not trying to say GGG is on these guys levels, he hasn't got the resume to rank with the very best
But Monzon had losses and defeats, Hagler lost and drew (To a GGG victims uncle Willie Monroe no less)
Robinson lost at middleweight title level several times and is considered an all time MW great and Greb lost fights at his peak.

Once again, it's acceptable for ATGs of the past to lose fights, but GGG sneaks a narrow UD win and his legacy is cast in massive doubt.

crusader wrote:A lot of very good fighters have struggled with opponents worse than Jacobs, and GGG still pulled out the win at nearly 35.

OP is one of the most miserable posters around and is always champing at the bit for today's highly rated fighters to fail. I remember how giddy he was getting when Brook had a good round or two

And Tim, I thought you said you were done with boxing? You're negativity certainly doesnt fail to show !

So a man got excited in a fight where a huge underdog unexpectedly stood up and landed some good shots? It's a fairly common phenomenon among people who watch boxing. Sylvester Stallone wrote a whole movie franchise around such a moment.

davie wrote:

dalcumly wrote:ALL the great middleweights needed 'judges' on occasion to win their fights.

The greatest middleweight of all time was Sugar Ray Robinson and in my lifetime, a close second was Marvin Hagler. Golovkin is not at that level, but that doesn't mean he's not at the very top. Its a personal opinion but when you have a boxer in any era who when fighting for a world title can knock the other guy out with one punch, that's stardom. So he couldn't stop Jacobs, but he retained his titles by unanimous decision. Still undefeated and all his defences have been on foreign soil ( for him). Does not not show he can box AND punch.

Agreed

I'm not trying to say GGG is on these guys levels, he hasn't got the resume to rank with the very best
But Monzon had losses and defeats, Hagler lost and drew (To a GGG victims uncle Willie Monroe no less)
Robinson lost at middleweight title level several times and is considered an all time MW great and Greb lost fights at his peak.

Once again, it's acceptable for ATGs of the past to lose fights, but GGG sneaks a narrow UD win and his legacy is cast in massive doubt.

Yes, and at a bit lower of a level, Toney was lucky against Dave fuckingg Tiberi, Eubank drew with Ray Close, Benn managed only a SD against Sanderland Williams, and so on.

I don't know what boxing fans were like years ago, but today they are a number who are awfully fickle. One debatable win at 35? Fraud!!

Tuan_Jim wrote:

crusader wrote:A lot of very good fighters have struggled with opponents worse than Jacobs, and GGG still pulled out the win at nearly 35.

OP is one of the most miserable posters around and is always champing at the bit for today's highly rated fighters to fail. I remember how giddy he was getting when Brook had a good round or two

And Tim, I thought you said you were done with boxing? You're negativity certainly doesnt fail to show !

So a man got excited in a fight where a huge underdog unexpectedly stood up and landed some good shots? It's a fairly common phenomenon among people who watch boxing. Sylvester Stallone wrote a whole movie franchise around such a moment.

I recall that you expressed your excitement in terms of GGG 'finally' meeting a hungry, decent level opponent . It was hardly, 'wow, this is a good fight! The underdog is doing well!'

davie wrote:

dalcumly wrote:ALL the great middleweights needed 'judges' on occasion to win their fights.

The greatest middleweight of all time was Sugar Ray Robinson and in my lifetime, a close second was Marvin Hagler. Golovkin is not at that level, but that doesn't mean he's not at the very top. Its a personal opinion but when you have a boxer in any era who when fighting for a world title can knock the other guy out with one punch, that's stardom. So he couldn't stop Jacobs, but he retained his titles by unanimous decision. Still undefeated and all his defences have been on foreign soil ( for him). Does not not show he can box AND punch.

Agreed

I'm not trying to say GGG is on these guys levels, he hasn't got the resume to rank with the very best
But Monzon had losses and defeats, Hagler lost and drew (To a GGG victims uncle Willie Monroe no less)
Robinson lost at middleweight title level several times and is considered an all time MW great and Greb lost fights at his peak.

Once again, it's acceptable for ATGs of the past to lose fights, but GGG sneaks a narrow UD win and his legacy is cast in massive doubt.

How many times does a Robinson, Monzon or Greb lose when boxing twice a year with a 10 week training camp against hand picked opponents? The culture was completely different.

Jacobs was a top ranked middleweight (probably #2 in the division), a mandatory, and was beaten in his own backyard by nearly 35-year-old GGG.

crusader wrote:Jacobs was a top ranked middleweight (probably #2 in the division), a mandatory, and was beaten in his own backyard by nearly 35-year-old GGG.

Yeah but he got knocked out once, so he must be rubbish.

crusader wrote:

Tuan_Jim wrote:

crusader wrote:A lot of very good fighters have struggled with opponents worse than Jacobs, and GGG still pulled out the win at nearly 35.

OP is one of the most miserable posters around and is always champing at the bit for today's highly rated fighters to fail. I remember how giddy he was getting when Brook had a good round or two

And Tim, I thought you said you were done with boxing? You're negativity certainly doesnt fail to show !

So a man got excited in a fight where a huge underdog unexpectedly stood up and landed some good shots? It's a fairly common phenomenon among people who watch boxing. Sylvester Stallone wrote a whole movie franchise around such a moment.

I recall that you expressed your excitement in terms of GGG 'finally' meeting a hungry, decent level opponent . It was hardly, 'wow, this is a good fight! The underdog is doing well!'

Why do you remember such things? A live thread with hundreds of posts from six months ago and still you can recall what I was writing? I couldn't recall one of your posts if my life depended on it.

I have a good memory

Tuan_Jim wrote:

davie wrote:

dalcumly wrote:ALL the great middleweights needed 'judges' on occasion to win their fights.

The greatest middleweight of all time was Sugar Ray Robinson and in my lifetime, a close second was Marvin Hagler. Golovkin is not at that level, but that doesn't mean he's not at the very top. Its a personal opinion but when you have a boxer in any era who when fighting for a world title can knock the other guy out with one punch, that's stardom. So he couldn't stop Jacobs, but he retained his titles by unanimous decision. Still undefeated and all his defences have been on foreign soil ( for him). Does not not show he can box AND punch.

Agreed

I'm not trying to say GGG is on these guys levels, he hasn't got the resume to rank with the very best
But Monzon had losses and defeats, Hagler lost and drew (To a GGG victims uncle Willie Monroe no less)
Robinson lost at middleweight title level several times and is considered an all time MW great and Greb lost fights at his peak.

Once again, it's acceptable for ATGs of the past to lose fights, but GGG sneaks a narrow UD win and his legacy is cast in massive doubt.

How many times does a Robinson, Monzon or Greb lose when boxing twice a year with a 10 week training camp against hand picked opponents? The culture was completely different.

Hand picked opponents?
Behave..... Jacobs is arguably the hardest fight out there for him just now

And he was a mandatory!

Jacobs is the next best guy at MW in my opinion. His length and speed would cause nightmares for short, concrete footed Canelo, who cuts off the ring less effectively than GGG does.

Jacobs is a quality operator but more than that...back in Hagler/Monzon's day he would never have been able to fight at 160. He looked like Godzilla next to Golovkin.

He also fought to a great strategy.

But if I'm reading it right all TJ is saying is that you can never truly judge anyone until they've experienced some adversity. And we can all agree with that.

At Golovkin's age Roy Jones was getting sparked by Tarver.

Nightmare Roy wrote:The guy is 35 next week and he's had about 500 fights, He's bound to be on the slide a bit.

Absolutely. Plus the top Russian/Kazakh/Ukrainian etc talent often reach their physical peak before they even turn pro. I'd include Tszyu, Nazarov, Arbachakov

It's hard to say if this performance puts in context. He was fighting another world champion and a quality operator at that, throw the weight advantage into the mix and that's not an easy opponent.

Personally I've said for ages (and yes numerous times on this site) that GGG is a top draw middle weight but he is being drastically over rated. He could not move up a weight and dominate the SMW division like people were suggesting DeGale now, Froch (when they mentioned him as an opponent) Jack, Groves would have all been favourites against him from my perspective.

I don't think he would have beaten guys like Hopkins, Toney, RJJ or even Eubank in their primes at MW imo but that doesn't mean he's crap. That's a list of some spectacular fighters he would have been competitive against.

Who in the middle weight can beat him? No one would be my guess.

One thing I'd like to add, what an amazing fight was taken away from us when Dmitry Pirog pulled out with a bad back from the Golovkin fight and retired due to his injuries.

What an incredible fight that could've been if Pirog had been able to stay healthier, longer. That guy really looked amazing taking Jacobs out. (Admittedly Jacobs has gained in seasoning and physical strength since then.)

Autobarn wrote:One thing I'd like to add, what an amazing fight was taken away from us when Dmitry Pirog pulled out with a bad back from the Golovkin fight and retired due to his injuries.

What an incredible fight that could've been if Pirog had been able to stay healthier, longer. That guy really looked amazing taking Jacobs out. (Admittedly Jacobs has gained in seasoning and physical strength since then.)

Jacobs had been blowing everyone away with his style at that point and pirog was too seasoned, put the pressure on him and had heavy hands, just shocked the shit out of Jacobs I remember being shocked myself at the time because I had been following Jacobs really rated him. One things for sure pirog against GGG would have been a proper war.

Finn wrote:It's hard to say if this performance puts in context. He was fighting another world champion and a quality operator at that, throw the weight advantage into the mix and that's not an easy opponent.

Personally I've said for ages (and yes numerous times on this site) that GGG is a top draw middle weight but he is being drastically over rated. He could not move up a weight and dominate the SMW division like people were suggesting DeGale now, Froch (when they mentioned him as an opponent) Jack, Groves would have all been favourites against him from my perspective.

I don't think he would have beaten guys like Hopkins, Toney, RJJ or even Eubank in their primes at MW imo but that doesn't mean he's crap. That's a list of some spectacular fighters he would have been competitive against.

Who in the middle weight can beat him? No one would be my guess.

Do you seriously make DeGale, Jack & Groves favourites to beat Golovkin? I don't see that at all, tbh.

At 35 he will only be detereating- I don't think GGG has been over hyped or overrated- he's been a superb fighter who unfortunately, has not had the career defining fights to catapult him into all time great status-- also unfortunately I can see a scenario now whereby Alvarez will finally have the balls to fight him and probably win

DazDiCanio wrote:Well said. I like GGG, he's great for the sport no question.

He is, though, absolutely over-hyped to the limit.

And people can now stop comparing GGG to Monzon/Hagler etc etc etc the jury is still out on GGG and they won't be back for awhile yet

Terminator666 wrote:At 35 he will only be detereating- I don't think GGG has been over hyped or overrated- he's been a superb fighter who unfortunately, has not had the career defining fights to catapult him into all time great status-- also unfortunately I can see a scenario now whereby Alvarez will finally have the balls to fight him and probably win

He still beats a man who's been having nightmare's about him regardless of the Jacobs fight Danny destroys Canelo so he's running out of hiding place's
GGG Ko's Canelo