BoxRec

verlichte wrote:

Ossyrules wrote:

verlichte wrote: Tony Tucker, Charles Martin, John Tate, Trevor Berbick, James "Bonecrusher" Smith, Hasim Rahman, Roy Jones Jr., Samuel Peter, Bermane Stiverne etc.

This list of champions with worst title reigns than Wladimir Klitschko goes on-and-on-and-on...

Have you only recently started following the sport of boxing?

So old autistic EO is back. Which means every little point that 99% can piece together, needs spelling out to him.

Reign, period of rule... not any alphabet champion. The dominant champion of the era. Wlads is one of the weakest ever.

Now f*ck off and change your name again

After all that abuse, you could at least admit that I'm 100% correct, since Wladimir has easily enjoyed a better title reign than the guys I've listed?

You really shouldn't persistently keep moving the goalposts of your original claims whenever someone more knowledgeable than you exposes them to be wholly inaccurate.

Charles Martin is the worst champion I can think of, but if someone thinks he reigned the heavyweight division, then they have a lack of knowledge and appreciation of the situation.

You get spoken to the way you deserve EO. You're an internet boxing fan that gets his knowledge from wiki as you cant get your head around the practical aspects of these discussions.

Now I'll admit you're a c*nt and you can move on

Just ignore Mr. Wrong. Burns is the only longtime champion that wlad could be considered more successful then.

crow wrote:I've watched Wlad these last 12 years and he always came in shape and ready, like a champion should be.

He had some courageous perfs against prime Mc Cline, prime Peter, and prime Haye, as well as some tough losses.

It would be great for the history books if he could beat prime Joshua too. But at the same time, i have to wonder if he deserves this opportunity.

His last fight against Fury was so negative and awful for a true champion that i'm asking myself why does Wlad still fight?
Why pursue the championship when you literally stopped fighting when the going got tough, and looked petrified by fear against a fighter many would consider a sideshow?

Wlad looked entirely unconcerned by the result that night. Why should the fans care this time if he himself doesn't in time of crisis ?

Wlad is the worst heavyweight champion to hold to the title for multiple years. THE WORST.

Ossyrules wrote:

verlichte wrote:

Ossyrules wrote:
So old autistic EO is back. Which means every little point that 99% can piece together, needs spelling out to him.

Reign, period of rule... not any alphabet champion. The dominant champion of the era. Wlads is one of the weakest ever.

Now f*ck off and change your name again

After all that abuse, you could at least admit that I'm 100% correct, since Wladimir has easily enjoyed a better title reign than the guys I've listed?

You really shouldn't persistently keep moving the goalposts of your original claims whenever someone more knowledgeable than you exposes them to be wholly inaccurate.

Charles Martin is the worst champion I can think of, but if someone thinks he reigned the heavyweight division, then they have a lack of knowledge and appreciation of the situation.

You get spoken to the way you deserve EO. You're an internet boxing fan that gets his knowledge from wiki as you cant get your head around the practical aspects of these discussions.

Now I'll admit you're a c*nt and you can move on

Thank you for kindly conceding the errors of your ways.

verlichte wrote:

Ossyrules wrote:

verlichte wrote: After all that abuse, you could at least admit that I'm 100% correct, since Wladimir has easily enjoyed a better title reign than the guys I've listed?

You really shouldn't persistently keep moving the goalposts of your original claims whenever someone more knowledgeable than you exposes them to be wholly inaccurate.

Charles Martin is the worst champion I can think of, but if someone thinks he reigned the heavyweight division, then they have a lack of knowledge and appreciation of the situation.

You get spoken to the way you deserve EO. You're an internet boxing fan that gets his knowledge from wiki as you cant get your head around the practical aspects of these discussions.

Now I'll admit you're a c*nt and you can move on

Thank you for kindly conceding the errors of your ways.

You're beat and will always get beat on these forums by anyone with a sensible POV. Apologies for language before, it's unfair with you being autistic

Ossyrules wrote:

verlichte wrote:

Ossyrules wrote:
Charles Martin is the worst champion I can think of, but if someone thinks he reigned the heavyweight division, then they have a lack of knowledge and appreciation of the situation.

You get spoken to the way you deserve EO. You're an internet boxing fan that gets his knowledge from wiki as you cant get your head around the practical aspects of these discussions.

Now I'll admit you're a c*nt and you can move on

Thank you for kindly conceding the errors of your ways.

You're beat and will always get beat on these forums by anyone with a sensible POV. Apologies for language before, it's unfair with you being autistic

Your delusion is both tragic, yet highly amusing! Good for you kiddo.

verlichte wrote:

Ossyrules wrote:

verlichte wrote: Thank you for kindly conceding the errors of your ways.

You're beat and will always get beat on these forums by anyone with a sensible POV. Apologies for language before, it's unfair with you being autistic

Your delusion is both tragic, yet highly amusing! Good for you kiddo.

If not autistic you argue you like you do. It's a medical condition not your fault

..I believe it's about time the younger generation took over...having said that, I'll keep supporting Wlad till he retires..

crow wrote:I've watched Wlad these last 12 years and he always came in shape and ready, like a champion should be.

He had some courageous perfs against prime Mc Cline, prime Peter, and prime Haye, as well as some tough losses.

It would be great for the history books if he could beat prime Joshua too. But at the same time, i have to wonder if he deserves this opportunity.

His last fight against Fury was so negative and awful for a true champion that i'm asking myself why does Wlad still fight?
Why pursue the championship when you literally stopped fighting when the going got tough, and looked petrified by fear against a fighter many would consider a sideshow?

Wlad looked entirely unconcerned by the result that night. Why should the fans care this time if he himself doesn't in time of crisis ?

Courageous? That's one word I'd never use to describe Wlad. Cautious would be better.

I feel he is physically a great fighter but mentally he isn't. He is a class act as a person and has done incredibly well to stay on top with his negative style. I hate his reign overall. One of the worst periods in heavyweight boxing.

Tomasino wrote:
Courageous? That's one word I'd never use to describe Wlad. Cautious would be better.

...I don't think being cautious and courageous are mutually exclusive..

greg wrote:

Tomasino wrote:
Courageous? That's one word I'd never use to describe Wlad. Cautious would be better.

...I don't think being cautious and courageous are mutually exclusive..

Was he courageous against Haye? McCline? Nope, those were horrible fights.

Tomasino wrote:

greg wrote:

Tomasino wrote:
Courageous? That's one word I'd never use to describe Wlad. Cautious would be better.

...I don't think being cautious and courageous are mutually exclusive..

Was he courageous against Haye? McCline? Nope, those were horrible fights.

..he did a good job in both cases just as expected..

He tried to avoid being hit as much as possible to a point where his fights were coma inducing for people watching. Most of his fights are a cure for insomnia. He will be in the Hall of Fame because of his achievements, but I don't think his legacy will improve with time unless he defeats Joshua which I do not expect to happen.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Rocky didn't lose to 3 of them. I could see someone having wlad rated anywhere from 15-50 at heavyweight. I'd probably have him 25ish.

Around 25 seems fair. Admittedly given his dominance (if you want to call it that), it's hard to see him placed much lower, unless you take guys who were just contenders but achieved better wins than Wlad being seen as higher historically.

punchoutsb wrote:A true professional in every sense of the word, and at the very top of his craft for years.

History will be much kinder to Klitschko than the arm chair analysts are right now, exactly like Lewis.

greg wrote:

Tomasino wrote:

greg wrote: ...I don't think being cautious and courageous are mutually exclusive..

Was he courageous against Haye? McCline? Nope, those were horrible fights.

..he did a good job in both cases just as expected..

I watch boxing to be entertained. Those fights did not provide that. To each his own

Good


Great HW. Arguably top 10
Smart man
Good role model

Bad

Very cautious can make him boring
Didn't have much competition, but that's not his fault

linear note: Is a fighter's primary objective to win (Dundee philosophy) or to entertain (D'Amato philosophy)?

How you answer that question is aligned with how you judge Wlad.

Chippo wrote:The Fury loss was so damaging to his career. That long winning streak was rendered almost irrelevant due to way he meekly handed over his titles to Fury. Plus the questions it raises; if a fighter as bad as Fury could bamboozle him, surely Ali, Holmes etc would stand him on this head. If Fury could intimidate him, surely Foreman, Liston etc would leave him a quivering wreck before the first bell? Right now Wlad's legacy is that all he could do was put a slow, cautious beating on guys that were smaller/older/worse than him.

If he gets smashed by AJ then I think his name won't be heard in Top 20 conversations again. If he beats AJ and puts one more big win on his slate, specifically Fury or Wilder, then history will probably look on him favourably.

Some people are saying things like 'Wlad looks focused and more ready than ever for this one' but I feel like no matter what Wlad looks like in the ring, if he is blown out many will say he's just shot.

No, the 41 year old (by comparison, Lennox was 37 in his last fight) who hasnt fought since 2015 is obviously in his prime

Wlad couldve defended his titles until he was 60, and I think there still would've been people ready to pounce with 'See, he lost! It proves he was shit all along!'

Riddick Blowe wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Rocky didn't lose to 3 of them. I could see someone having wlad rated anywhere from 15-50 at heavyweight. I'd probably have him 25ish.

Around 25 seems fair. Admittedly given his dominance (if you want to call it that), it's hard to see him placed much lower, unless you take guys who were just contenders but achieved better wins than Wlad being seen as higher historically.

I don't care about titles in historical rankings. I'd be hard pressed to rate him higher than will, Jeanette, McVey, Langford, young, etc..

crusader wrote:No, the 41 year old (by comparison, Lennox was 37 in his last fight) who hasnt fought since 2015 is obviously in his prime

Wlad couldve defended his titles until he was 60, and I think there still would've been people ready to pounce with 'See, he lost! It proves he was poo all along!'

Age is completely relevant when it comes to a boxers prime. Different boxers peak at different times. There's physical peak x experience/ringcraft. So whilst a fighter may not be at there absolute physical peak, experience and knowledge can sometimes outweigh that in absolute performance.

Broadly speaking a male athletes peak years physically should be 25-30 years. For me Wlad was roughly at his peak in 2011ish around when he beat haye, so about 35 years old. Arguably not at his absolute physical best in terms of capabilities, but so well drilled in his game plan and experience of what he needed to do.

There can be no argument that Joshua is fighting Wlad in his prime for me, as when your hitting 41 I find it hard to say no matter how much experience you have, you physical capabilities are on the wane enough to outweigh you being at your best. Add into the fact that he was truly out boxed last fight looking very poor, so there's performance to back it up.

I know you're a Wlad fan, but to me, unless someone's like EO, then it's clear out the dominant champions Wlads era of competition has been incredibly weak. His stoppage defeats not avenged go against him, his safety first pacifist style is a negative but that's maybe personal thing.

I struggle to put Wlad top 20 even though he's reigned for so long. If he beats Joshua it's a great win for him though

Tyson called WK one of the greats and says he wants to see WK beat Joshua

crusader wrote:No, the 41 year old (by comparison, Lennox was 37 in his last fight) who hasnt fought since 2015 is obviously in his prime

Wlad couldve defended his titles until he was 60, and I think there still would've been people ready to pounce with 'See, he lost! It proves he was poo all along!'

crusader wrote:No, the 41 year old (by comparison, Lennox was 37 in his last fight) who hasnt fought since 2015 is obviously in his prime

Wlad couldve defended his titles until he was 60, and I think there still would've been people ready to pounce with 'See, he lost! It proves he was poo all along!'

You definitely can't hold fury or whatever happens tomorrow against him. Just icing on the cake at this point, his position can only improve.

Ossyrules wrote:I think both Klitschko bros have the potential to be possibly appreciated more in the future than what they are now. I think the fury loss hurts Wlads standing personally.

To answer the question, I respect Wlad as a terrific athlete, professional and role model, but on the negative side he's been very dour for the sport due to his personality and fighting style. He has entertained at times, more so in his earlier stage before he was exposed as being fraile under pressure from punchers, and then become so safety conscious it was a real turn off.

A Wlad win isn't a win for boxing sat. Any neutral must surely want the Joshua win. Fury open the door to the heavyweight division but due to his problems, he didn't walk through it. Joshua, a young hungry dangerous knockout machine is the future. Let's have the future now. Us boxing fans deserve something new don't we?

Not necessarily. It depends how he wins... or loses...