BoxRec

We'll see

Got to do what's right for you in life though and if Carl feels something ain't right then it's time for a change

I think it's a big gamble any boxer leaving the Matchroom stable like Frampton did, with their power and ability to promote big PPVs - I think they could have made Frampton a bigger star and more money.

I'm sure McGuigan sold Frampton the whole 'I'm like you, I understand, I'm an ex boxer, plus Northern Irish, I'll look after you in this big bad world' type of vibe, but at the end of the day he's a manager just like any other and he needs to get his boxer the best career and payday opportunities. If it's all just stagnated a bit then I think a change is correct, assuming he's got somewhere better to go.

Hope he goes back to matchroom

Hearn is the greatest ever English promoter as his fighters say..

Fair play to him

Hearn has put boxing on the back pages and aj is the biggest star in British spot atm.

That falling in the shower story for his last opponent just didn't ring true after the debacle on the scales.

Alternative theory: guy asked for more money as compensation then one of the McGs team roughs him up in anger leading to cancellation of whole show and severe embarrassment for carl.

It may not be true but something has led to this. Hopefully someone will clarify soon because they seemed a tight team

hmm on occasion it can be too tight a team....when personal and business relationships cross boundaries...it looks nice when its going well but can turn very bitter.

One of the arts of management is maintaining a distance from the team, so when tough calls come you can make them level headed and not be overly emotionally involved.

this line hasn't been maintained so this may well turn very acrimonious.

history repeating itself here?

Been hearing rumours of this the last couple of weeks from friends in Belfast. Looks as if there's something to it. Sad if true but that's life. Carl has to do what's best for himself and his young family in what's probably gonna be the last few fights in his career I'd imagine.

tobyh5 wrote:

coneye wrote:I can recall eading somewhere that Frampton is financially tied up with cyclone , he;s a director , can't imagine i dreamt it so if he is , leaving could be complicated , but changing trainers should'nt be ,, and for me he should never of been with Shane , i've said it for a while Shanes a celebrity trainer , he has'nt got the experience to be training world champions ,, his success has come because he's training guys who already know what there doing , and when they have needed the experience its not been there ala Cruz 2

He resigned as a director weeks ago. Check companies house, details for all LTD companies are there.

Is he a shareholder has well ,, If he is and the split is not amicable , it could turn nasty

Barry isn't a director of Cyclone any more is he?

coneye wrote:

tobyh5 wrote:

coneye wrote:I can recall eading somewhere that Frampton is financially tied up with cyclone , he;s a director , can't imagine i dreamt it so if he is , leaving could be complicated , but changing trainers should'nt be ,, and for me he should never of been with Shane , i've said it for a while Shanes a celebrity trainer , he has'nt got the experience to be training world champions ,, his success has come because he's training guys who already know what there doing , and when they have needed the experience its not been there ala Cruz 2

He resigned as a director weeks ago. Check companies house, details for all LTD companies are there.

Is he a shareholder has well ,, If he is and the split is not amicable , it could turn nasty

According to Companies House, the only shareholder of Cyclone Promotions Limited is Clifford Nominees Limited, owning the only share allocated for Cyclone Promotions Ltd. Clifford Nominees Limited appears to be owned by one person, Stephen Clifford, via an LLP, of which he/Clifford & Co Group Limited appear to be the only shareholders. Stephen Clifford is/has been a director of 45 limited companies, and unsurprisingly lists his occupation as 'Accountant' on more than one.

Essentially, I think Frampton will be fine. I also think he and everyone involved in Cyclone Promotions Ltd will have had some 'creative' accountancy.

samwbr wrote:Barry isn't a director of Cyclone any more is he?

No - Blain, Jake, Sandra and of course Shane McGuigan are the current directors. Barry ceased to be a director in May 2015.

Certainly a lot of McGuigan hands in the till.

Frampton only really has himself to blame - surely you get a manager who negotiates for you - and you have a promoter who in turn promotes you & the show.

Your manager gets you the best deal from EH/FW for example that your happy to sign.

After that it's up to Heard/Warren to make money from the show - Mcguigan shouldn't be doing both - as he's trying to make the most for Cyclone while paying Frampton. He's built his business on back of Frampton.

Stupidity surely from CF as your not getting best deal while someone else is trying to do both jobs surely ?

MarkMcBurney wrote:

coneye wrote:

tobyh5 wrote:
He resigned as a director weeks ago. Check companies house, details for all LTD companies are there.

Is he a shareholder has well ,, If he is and the split is not amicable , it could turn nasty

According to Companies House, the only shareholder of Cyclone Promotions Limited is Clifford Nominees Limited, owning the only share allocated for Cyclone Promotions Ltd. Clifford Nominees Limited appears to be owned by one person, Stephen Clifford, via an LLP, of which he/Clifford & Co Group Limited appear to be the only shareholders. Stephen Clifford is/has been a director of 45 limited companies, and unsurprisingly lists his occupation as 'Accountant' on more than one.

Essentially, I think Frampton will be fine. I also think he and everyone involved in Cyclone Promotions Ltd will have had some 'creative' accountancy.

So the ownership of Cyclone Promotions doesn't appear to be publicly available - if it's owned by a nominee company, the real ownership will be held behind the scenes. Stephen Clifford will have nothing to do with it in reality.

Boxerbeetle wrote:

MarkMcBurney wrote:

coneye wrote:
Is he a shareholder has well ,, If he is and the split is not amicable , it could turn nasty

According to Companies House, the only shareholder of Cyclone Promotions Limited is Clifford Nominees Limited, owning the only share allocated for Cyclone Promotions Ltd. Clifford Nominees Limited appears to be owned by one person, Stephen Clifford, via an LLP, of which he/Clifford & Co Group Limited appear to be the only shareholders. Stephen Clifford is/has been a director of 45 limited companies, and unsurprisingly lists his occupation as 'Accountant' on more than one.

Essentially, I think Frampton will be fine. I also think he and everyone involved in Cyclone Promotions Ltd will have had some 'creative' accountancy.

So the ownership of Cyclone Promotions doesn't appear to be publicly available - if it's owned by a nominee company, the real ownership will be held behind the scenes. Stephen Clifford will have nothing to do with it in reality.

Is it registered in the isle of man , or some such similar place ,,, Fook me i feel like Columbo

coneye wrote:

Boxerbeetle wrote:

MarkMcBurney wrote: According to Companies House, the only shareholder of Cyclone Promotions Limited is Clifford Nominees Limited, owning the only share allocated for Cyclone Promotions Ltd. Clifford Nominees Limited appears to be owned by one person, Stephen Clifford, via an LLP, of which he/Clifford & Co Group Limited appear to be the only shareholders. Stephen Clifford is/has been a director of 45 limited companies, and unsurprisingly lists his occupation as 'Accountant' on more than one.

Essentially, I think Frampton will be fine. I also think he and everyone involved in Cyclone Promotions Ltd will have had some 'creative' accountancy.

So the ownership of Cyclone Promotions doesn't appear to be publicly available - if it's owned by a nominee company, the real ownership will be held behind the scenes. Stephen Clifford will have nothing to do with it in reality.

Is it registered in the isle of man , or some such similar place ,,, Fook me i feel like Columbo

Boxerbeetle wrote:

MarkMcBurney wrote:

coneye wrote:
Is he a shareholder has well ,, If he is and the split is not amicable , it could turn nasty

According to Companies House, the only shareholder of Cyclone Promotions Limited is Clifford Nominees Limited, owning the only share allocated for Cyclone Promotions Ltd. Clifford Nominees Limited appears to be owned by one person, Stephen Clifford, via an LLP, of which he/Clifford & Co Group Limited appear to be the only shareholders. Stephen Clifford is/has been a director of 45 limited companies, and unsurprisingly lists his occupation as 'Accountant' on more than one.

Essentially, I think Frampton will be fine. I also think he and everyone involved in Cyclone Promotions Ltd will have had some 'creative' accountancy.

So the ownership of Cyclone Promotions doesn't appear to be publicly available - if it's owned by a nominee company, the real ownership will be held behind the scenes. Stephen Clifford will have nothing to do with it in reality.

Precisely.

i think Stephen Clifford will just be the account/solicitor

& you can be a none shareholder director, so its irrelevant what companies shows... although its does look like he has binned them off

sweetscience wrote:i think Stephen Clifford will just be the account/solicitor

& you can be a none shareholder director, so its irrelevant what companies shows... although its does look like he has binned them off

Yes and no. I agree it'll be a very intricate way of setting things up, which Companies House won't show. However, even a non-shareholding director needs to be registered as such on Companies House, so he is 100% no longer a director of the company. What shares or otherwise he has to do with Cyclone Promotions Limited any more, god only knows.

I suspect Stephen Clifford is a professional 'shell', given the number of companies that he individually has been involved with. I suspect his business is in doing exactly this.

This was a thread 2 years ago where expe said that Cyclone is 100% Barry's.
http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p ... 6#p4173626

The McGuigans don't seem to be doing a good job of running their company and for the last 2 years have had the first stage of winding up petitions made in respect of Cyclone Promotions. http://www.bizdb.co.uk/filings/ec/04/ec ... 52a69e.pdf Basically they can't get their accounts in on time and this is especially embarrassing as it happened two years in a row and they are such a small company that they qualify for a total exemption so the accounts really shouldn't be continuously late. This is the accounting equivalent of having your star boxer turn up for a final eliminator 1lb over weight - no professional would allow it.

As for ownership it is highly likely that the McGuigans own 100% of the company (for what it's worth). Stephen Clifford offers "nominee" services in which he acts as a front for the ultimate shareholder and acts on their instructions whilst ensuring discretion as to the final owner. This is cute considering the company is worth -£545k. The use of Nominee services is unusual in this case and signals that the owner is the McGuigans and most likely 100% Barry or a 50/50 arrangement between him and Sandra. It is worth noting that Cyclone Promotions UK is 50/50 owned between Barry and Sandra.

Carl won't have owned any of the company but may have possibly had a profit share arrangement. This is a moot point anyway as it was him who was earning all the money and paying all the wages for the extended McGuigan family.

Tarkus wrote:This was a thread 2 years ago where expe said that Cyclone is 100% Barry's.
http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p ... 6#p4173626

And if you can't believe what a 17 year old, living with his parents, says about boxing business then what can you believe!?

Mark Lloyd wrote:The McGuigans don't seem to be doing a good job of running their company and for the last 2 years have had the first stage of winding up petitions made in respect of Cyclone Promotions. http://www.bizdb.co.uk/filings/ec/04/ec ... 52a69e.pdf Basically they can't get their accounts in on time and this is especially embarrassing as it happened two years in a row and they are such a small company that they qualify for a total exemption so the accounts really shouldn't be continuously late. This is the accounting equivalent of having your star boxer turn up for a final eliminator 1lb over weight - no professional would allow it.

As for ownership it is highly likely that the McGuigans own 100% of the company (for what it's worth). Stephen Clifford offers "nominee" services in which he acts as a front for the ultimate shareholder and acts on their instructions whilst ensuring discretion as to the final owner. This is cute considering the company is worth -£545k. The use of Nominee services is unusual in this case and signals that the owner is the McGuigans and most likely 100% Barry or a 50/50 arrangement between him and Sandra. It is worth noting that Cyclone Promotions UK is 50/50 owned between Barry and Sandra.

Carl won't have owned any of the company but may have possibly had a profit share arrangement. This is a moot point anyway as it was him who was earning all the money and paying all the wages for the extended McGuigan family.

Use of a nominee company isn't at all unusual, particularly when a high profile person(s) is involved in an ownership structure.

Mark Lloyd wrote:The McGuigans don't seem to be doing a good job of running their company and for the last 2 years have had the first stage of winding up petitions made in respect of Cyclone Promotions. http://www.bizdb.co.uk/filings/ec/04/ec ... 52a69e.pdf Basically they can't get their accounts in on time and this is especially embarrassing as it happened two years in a row and they are such a small company that they qualify for a total exemption so the accounts really shouldn't be continuously late. This is the accounting equivalent of having your star boxer turn up for a final eliminator 1lb over weight - no professional would allow it.

As for ownership it is highly likely that the McGuigans own 100% of the company (for what it's worth). Stephen Clifford offers "nominee" services in which he acts as a front for the ultimate shareholder and acts on their instructions whilst ensuring discretion as to the final owner. This is cute considering the company is worth -£545k. The use of Nominee services is unusual in this case and signals that the owner is the McGuigans and most likely 100% Barry or a 50/50 arrangement between him and Sandra. It is worth noting that Cyclone Promotions UK is 50/50 owned between Barry and Sandra.

Carl won't have owned any of the company but may have possibly had a profit share arrangement. This is a moot point anyway as it was him who was earning all the money and paying all the wages for the extended McGuigan family.

Not only that but also he left more profitable deal with Matchroom for Cyclone. He took significant financial and carrier compromise. If that does not qualify him as a large partner then I dont know what does.

He surely made multiple millions from the Quigg fight? OK that won't have done Joshua numbers but surely a PPV only has to do about 250k buys for a fighter taking the lions share to go away a multi millionaire? And the rumours are the PPV did around about that many buys.

jameswilson wrote:

Tarkus wrote:This was a thread 2 years ago where expe said that Cyclone is 100% Barry's.
http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p ... 6#p4173626

And if you can't believe what a 17 year old, living with his parents, says about boxing business then what can you believe!?

To be fair, he spends a serious amount of time on Google does Expe.