BoxRec

caldo2025 wrote:An AJ and Wilder fight would make peanuts if they decided to fight now. That is the result of not having a big outfit like HBO in charge of marketing and building interest for the fight for you. This is also why this fight will not happen for years. AJ hasn't fought since April and STILL hasn't announced his next fight and defense...how is that possible? This is why the heavyweight division sucks. Joshua had us all eating out of his hand and that seems like an eternity now since that last fight. 5 months since and nothing.

Don't even talk about Wilder..he hasn't fought since Feb...he's obviously a joke. But Joshua needs to stay busy if he wants to be the next great one.

Wilder is just cruising to bum fights hoping he's gonna hit the lottery against AJ. That's it!

KiwiRider wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote:

KiwiRider wrote:
Eddie was pretty clear about AJ's future and it didn't include an immediate match with Wilder. To make the fight saleable Wilder needs one decent opponent,to raise his profile, and so does Parker for that matter- and I mean after Huey Fury. Discerning fans are not going to PPV for just anybody. And that is where the money is.

Anthony Joshua’s bouts against Eric Molina, Dominic Breazeale, Charles Martin & Dillian Whyte were all televised by Sky Sports’ Box Office, which is PPV.

Yes, in the UK and for Wlad a fee more countries. I was thinking of the wider market like the USA and Europe.

To be perfectly honest with you, I think a bout between Joshua and Wilder would be commercially bigger if it was staged in the UK.

For some strange reason, Deontay’s audience figures in the US have been on the decline.

For instance: 1.76m watched his bout against Washington, but he previously attracted 2.54m when he faced Arreola and 2.36m against Duhaupas.

Wilder only attracted a 500K audience for the Artur Szpilka fight, but that was on Showtime, so you can’t really compare this number to the other three bouts I’ve listed. Regardless, that’s a very low viewing figure, even for Showtime.

What I’m basically saying, is that Deontay Wilder is going to struggle to become a big enough name in the next twelve months to headline a Showtime PPV event, unless he faces someone that is already considered a star attraction in the US. And I don’t think that AJ is considered a big name on American shores either.

caldo2025 wrote:

Ossyrules wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:An AJ and Wilder fight would make peanuts if they decided to fight now. That is the result of not having a big outfit like HBO in charge of marketing and building interest for the fight for you. This is also why this fight will not happen for years. AJ hasn't fought since April and STILL hasn't announced his next fight and defense...how is that possible? This is why the heavyweight division sucks. Joshua had us all eating out of his hand and that seems like an eternity now since that last fight. 5 months since and nothing.

Don't even talk about Wilder..he hasn't fought since Feb...he's obviously a joke. But Joshua needs to stay busy if he wants to be the next great one.

If wilder fights Joshua in England I can guarantee that makes money

Re Joshua inactivity and no fight announced, Wlad took his time on whether he wanted the rematch, so a lot of water has passed under the bridge while Joshua has been waiting on him. He's not been sitting on his arse refusing fights. This current delay is mostly out his hands

Fair enough. Wlad's announcement wasn't too long ago so you're right. He's got to get something on the books now though...even if it's against a fish like Wilder only defends his title against. Yes, I agree that any Joshua fight in England will be a huge draw in England but not worldwide like it could be with proper marketing. Wilder vs. Joshua would be a fantastic fight IMO that is PPV worthy and it would be a shame to leave so much money on the table when it could be the largest grossing fight in 2018.

Does Wilder have much of a following? I don't know much about his fanbase to be honest.

A lot of US fighters don't really sell much outside their home towns, and I would say Wilder is far from being some sort of global superstar.

I would imagine Joshua is a fairly big name relatively speaking in the US, after his up and down thriller against Wlad.

Enlightened-One wrote:
For some strange reason, Deontay’s audience figures in the US have been in decline.

That made me laugh

On another matter;
Is AJ really unknown in the USA?
I would have thought the Wlad fight was a launch pad into Eastern Europe and the USA on the back of Wlad's name and like James said- the entertaining nature if the fight?
I mean, he is currently The Name and #1 in the HW division. And with a perfect KO record, which I believe goes down well over there, so I would expect all boxing fans to be aware of him at the very least.
19-0 with 19 KO's is Tyson territory isn't it?

Edit; Mike Tyson territory

I'm glad someone is impressed by Pulev....I'm not. a 38 yr old Wlad knocked him down 4 times and stopped him in 5. Pulev said Wlad was "lucky". He turns down Joshua last year apparently, and now says he wants 3 or 4 months to train. Wlad retired a month ago, so the fight should be made already. I hope they fight soon. In the meantime, hopefully Wilder fights Ortiz.

KiwiRider wrote:Is AJ really unknown in the USA?
I would have thought the Wlad fight was a launch pad into Eastern Europe and the USA on the back of Wlad's name and like James said- the entertaining nature if the fight?
I mean, he is currently The Name and #1 in the HW division. And with a perfect KO record, which I believe goes down well over there, so I would expect all boxing fans to be aware of him at the very least.
19-0 with 19 KO's is Tyson territory isn't it?

Edit; Mike Tyson territory

I didn’t say Anthony Joshua was “unknown” on US shores. It’s just that I personally doubt that he’s currently considered a big name in America.

For sure, if AJ was given the opportunity to engage in a couple of fights against heavyweights that were well-known to the US audience, with those bouts being staged in America, then perhaps he’ll eventually become a big enough name in that market to justify Showtime covering a Joshua-Wilder bout as a PPV event.

I just don’t think AJ he has a big enough following yet to do this. Showtime and Matchroom probably need to build his name in the US territory.

Shouldn't all Wilder complaints have a Povetkin asterisk?

BAD INTENTIONS wrote:Shouldn't all Wilder complaints have a Povetkin asterisk?

Had to laugh at this. But it's true

Don't think AJ is too well known in the US. His first two Showtime fights did awful numbers, and the Wlad fight did roughly what Wlad fights usually do.

Badhusker wrote:I'm glad someone is impressed by Pulev....I'm not. a 38 yr old Wlad knocked him down 4 times and stopped him in 5. Pulev said Wlad was "lucky". He turns down Joshua last year apparently, and now says he wants 3 or 4 months to train. Wlad retired a month ago, so the fight should be made already. I hope they fight soon. In the meantime, hopefully Wilder fights Ortiz.

As I said, pulev would 100% be Wilders best ever opponent. So while you bemoan Joshua opposition, he'll be fighting a guy better than Wilders ever faced for the second fight in a row. Joshua's had half the fights Wilders had as well.

Think it's clear where you should direct your disappointment

caldo2025 wrote: Joshua needs to stay busy if he wants to be the next great one.

Joshua had 9 fights in 24 months leading up to and including the Klitschko fight, 7 of those 9 were title fights. I think he was due and deserved a break!

In the same period of time Wilder has fought just 4 times, it's pretty clear which of the two needs to work harder and build his case inclusion in a superfight

Ossyrules wrote:

Badhusker wrote:I'm glad someone is impressed by Pulev....I'm not. a 38 yr old Wlad knocked him down 4 times and stopped him in 5. Pulev said Wlad was "lucky". He turns down Joshua last year apparently, and now says he wants 3 or 4 months to train. Wlad retired a month ago, so the fight should be made already. I hope they fight soon. In the meantime, hopefully Wilder fights Ortiz.

As I said, pulev would 100% be Wilders best ever opponent. So while you bemoan Joshua opposition, he'll be fighting a guy better than Wilders ever faced for the second fight in a row. Joshua's had half the fights Wilders had as well.

Think it's clear where you should direct your disappointment

What you say about Pulev is probably true. No one can logically defend Wilder's resume, but before Wlad (who was 41 years old and at the end of his career) Joshua's resume was not impressive either. Joshua's biggest win by far is against a guy that is/was 41. Lets not get too excited about that. After the Fury fight, I would have put about 50 heavyweights ahead of Wlad, as crappy as he looked. He played a big part in the worst performance of any champions at any weight in the history of championship boxing. Wlad was very close to stopping Joshua, and should have.

Pulev would be a good opponent for Wilder, but the point I try to make is that Wilder is a much, much more dangerous opponent that Pulev would be for Joshua, which is why they are choosing to fight him instead.

Joshua has had less fights, but he came into the pros as an olympic champion, so more is expected of him. Wilder admits he is a work in progress and awkward at times. I just want them to fight. Some say he doesn't deserve the fight??? He is WBC champ. Did Joshua's last few opponents deserve a shot at him? Joshua's title grab was about as pathetic as Wilder's....even more so. (Martin and Stiverne)

Pulev didn't want it last year. Hearn promised Wilder last year he would be next. Wilder wants to fight either Ortiz or Joshua. Nothing wrong with that. As much hate as Wilder gets, I can only think of one time that he turned down anyone that put forth an offer, and that was Whyte, because Wilder wanted Joshua instead. If you have some info about who Wilder has ducked, I'm all ears.

In the meantime, keep straddling the fence, so you are never wrong. Keep criticizing posters that actually take a position or have an opinion. Keep ripping on boxers like Wilder that are easy because the majority will agree with you. I'll keep doing what I do, but at least I am honest with myself and with others.

Badhusker wrote:

Ossyrules wrote:

Badhusker wrote:I'm glad someone is impressed by Pulev....I'm not. a 38 yr old Wlad knocked him down 4 times and stopped him in 5. Pulev said Wlad was "lucky". He turns down Joshua last year apparently, and now says he wants 3 or 4 months to train. Wlad retired a month ago, so the fight should be made already. I hope they fight soon. In the meantime, hopefully Wilder fights Ortiz.

As I said, pulev would 100% be Wilders best ever opponent. So while you bemoan Joshua opposition, he'll be fighting a guy better than Wilders ever faced for the second fight in a row. Joshua's had half the fights Wilders had as well.

Think it's clear where you should direct your disappointment

What you say about Pulev is probably true. No one can logically defend Wilder's resume, but before Wlad (who was 41 years old and at the end of his career) Joshua's resume was not impressive either. Joshua's biggest win by far is against a guy that is/was 41. Lets not get too excited about that. After the Fury fight, I would have put about 50 heavyweights ahead of Wlad, as crappy as he looked. He played a big part in the worst performance of any champions at any weight in the history of championship boxing. Wlad was very close to stopping Joshua, and should have.

Pulev would be a good opponent for Wilder, but the point I try to make is that Wilder is a much, much more dangerous opponent that Pulev would be for Joshua, which is why they are choosing to fight him instead.

Joshua has had less fights, but he came into the pros as an olympic champion, so more is expected of him. Wilder admits he is a work in progress and awkward at times. I just want them to fight. Some say he doesn't deserve the fight??? He is WBC champ. Did Joshua's last few opponents deserve a shot at him? Joshua's title grab was about as pathetic as Wilder's....even more so. (Martin and Stiverne)

Pulev didn't want it last year. Hearn promised Wilder last year he would be next. Wilder wants to fight either Ortiz or Joshua. Nothing wrong with that. As much hate as Wilder gets, I can only think of one time that he turned down anyone that put forth an offer, and that was Whyte, because Wilder wanted Joshua instead. If you have some info about who Wilder has ducked, I'm all ears.

In the meantime, keep straddling the fence, so you are never wrong. Keep criticizing posters that actually take a position or have an opinion. Keep ripping on boxers like Wilder that are easy because the majority will agree with you. I'll keep doing what I do, but at least I am honest with myself and with others.

Wlad after fury... 50 other boxers would not be above him or beat him, come on man. 1 defeat after 10 years at the top. He's always going to be allowed another fight for people to judge whether he has truly slipped or whether it was just a bad night for him. Despite his age vs josh he was mega impressive, so he still had it

Nothing wrong with wanting wilder to fight Joshua. He gets criticism cos his resume for 40 fights is so poor. Joshua's is poor too, except he's fought Wlad, which makes it a lot better. Don't forget wilder is an Olympic medalist. There's only so far being a work in progress will go. We've been fed that comment a lot re wilder.

Enjoy your boxing

Joshua T.K.O Wlad and that's the best win he could possibly have in the HW division, period! So Wilder has to work a lot and get 1 or 2 good names on his resume like Ortiz and Parker/Hughie winner to call out AJ!

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:

Ossyrules wrote:
If wilder fights Joshua in England I can guarantee that makes money

Re Joshua inactivity and no fight announced, Wlad took his time on whether he wanted the rematch, so a lot of water has passed under the bridge while Joshua has been waiting on him. He's not been sitting on his arse refusing fights. This current delay is mostly out his hands

Fair enough. Wlad's announcement wasn't too long ago so you're right. He's got to get something on the books now though...even if it's against a fish like Wilder only defends his title against. Yes, I agree that any Joshua fight in England will be a huge draw in England but not worldwide like it could be with proper marketing. Wilder vs. Joshua would be a fantastic fight IMO that is PPV worthy and it would be a shame to leave so much money on the table when it could be the largest grossing fight in 2018.

Does Wilder have much of a following? I don't know much about his fanbase to be honest.

A lot of US fighters don't really sell much outside their home towns, and I would say Wilder is far from being some sort of global superstar.

I would imagine Joshua is a fairly big name relatively speaking in the US, after his up and down thriller against Wlad.

Wilder doesn't have a big following in the US at all. He's big in Alabama and maybe some people know him down south but in the US area's that count...East Coast and California...he's a no one. In fact, if you asked people on the streets in Manhattan who he was, i'd say maybe 5% would know whom he is perhaps?

This is why i think that the fight with Joshua doesn't happen. UNLESS Joshua knows that he'll roll all over him and it doesn't matter then yeah. But in terms of making it a money making event...he could do better than Wilder.

But Joshua is still pretty unknown here in the states. Though, the fight with Kilt definitely got some people excited.

The Clan wrote:

caldo2025 wrote: Joshua needs to stay busy if he wants to be the next great one.

Joshua had 9 fights in 24 months leading up to and including the Klitschko fight, 7 of those 9 were title fights. I think he was due and deserved a break!

In the same period of time Wilder has fought just 4 times, it's pretty clear which of the two needs to work harder and build his case inclusion in a superfight

I don't care if he fought 20 straight days before his fight with Wlad, his brand took a huge step forward in that fight. Now is not the time to go into exile for a year. He'll lose all traction that he made and have to start again. I'm speaking internationally, of course, England is already his.

Badhusker wrote:Pulev would be a good opponent for Wilder, but the point I try to make is that Wilder is a much, much more dangerous opponent that Pulev would be for Joshua, which is why they are choosing to fight him instead.

AJ has to fight Pulev if he wants to keep his IBF belt. Then he has to fight his WBA mandatory if he wants to keep his WBA belt.
Joshua is not choosing to avoid Wilder - providing they both keep winning, I reckon AJ v Wilder will be a big event sometime later next year.

caldo2025 wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:
Fair enough. Wlad's announcement wasn't too long ago so you're right. He's got to get something on the books now though...even if it's against a fish like Wilder only defends his title against. Yes, I agree that any Joshua fight in England will be a huge draw in England but not worldwide like it could be with proper marketing. Wilder vs. Joshua would be a fantastic fight IMO that is PPV worthy and it would be a shame to leave so much money on the table when it could be the largest grossing fight in 2018.

Does Wilder have much of a following? I don't know much about his fanbase to be honest.

A lot of US fighters don't really sell much outside their home towns, and I would say Wilder is far from being some sort of global superstar.

I would imagine Joshua is a fairly big name relatively speaking in the US, after his up and down thriller against Wlad.

Wilder doesn't have a big following in the US at all. He's big in Alabama and maybe some people know him down south but in the US area's that count...East Coast and California...he's a no one. In fact, if you asked people on the streets in Manhattan who he was, i'd say maybe 5% would know whom he is perhaps?

This is why i think that the fight with Joshua doesn't happen. UNLESS Joshua knows that he'll roll all over him and it doesn't matter then yeah. But in terms of making it a money making event...he could do better than Wilder.

But Joshua is still pretty unknown here in the states. Though, the fight with Kilt definitely got some people excited.

Thanks. I kind of knew the answer, but wanted it confirmed. Those outside tge US tend to assume that US fighters have a nationwide following, when in fact this is very rarely the case.

I think wilder is looking to cash out. He has s punchers chance against Joshua of course, but joshua has better skills and should be able to contain the threat. I think its about how much he demands and what hearn is prepared to pay him. Its probably a bigger fight in the Uk though the timing could be right for joshua to make a name for himself stateside.