BoxRec

dirk2686 wrote:

jameswilson wrote:Yeah their shows were horrendous back then. Possibly the worst of the bunch (Sports network, Hennessy, Hobson and Maloney were the others weren't they?). I'm trying to illustrate the point that I think boxing is far better now than it was then and put paid to this daft 'if someone else had Sky they'd be amazing' argument. Other promoters did have sky and did have box office back then, and it was mostly crap.

I have to agree with this. Can you imagine someone having someone with the talent of Calzaghe or Hatton and allowing them to get to 30-0 fighting the likes of Ashira/Mkrtchian/Salem/Pudwill.

I'm not saying Cleverly and Flanagan are in the same boat of talent but look at their WBO runs too so you can't just say it's just those two (Calzaghe and Hatton) either. I can see Saunders going a similar way as well with the 'we made them an offer and they don't want the fight' line coming out over and over.

Yeah - Froch really seems to have started something important in wanting fighters to continuously test themselves against quality opponents. People can give or take Joshua but he's had domestic contenders, fringe title contenders and Wlad before he's had twenty fights. That would never happen with Warren's ultra-cautious approach.

sweetscience wrote:can anyone with the knowledge list the 2 promoters fighters side by side then I can judge

x2

jameswilson wrote:

dirk2686 wrote:

jameswilson wrote:Yeah their shows were horrendous back then. Possibly the worst of the bunch (Sports network, Hennessy, Hobson and Maloney were the others weren't they?). I'm trying to illustrate the point that I think boxing is far better now than it was then and put paid to this daft 'if someone else had Sky they'd be amazing' argument. Other promoters did have sky and did have box office back then, and it was mostly crap.

I have to agree with this. Can you imagine someone having someone with the talent of Calzaghe or Hatton and allowing them to get to 30-0 fighting the likes of Ashira/Mkrtchian/Salem/Pudwill.

I'm not saying Cleverly and Flanagan are in the same boat of talent but look at their WBO runs too so you can't just say it's just those two (Calzaghe and Hatton) either. I can see Saunders going a similar way as well with the 'we made them an offer and they don't want the fight' line coming out over and over.

Saunders next fight is far from a gimme. Lee and Eubank weren't bad, either.

seems like each has their loyal sucker offers

hearn not nearly as bad as ppl say (anyone in top spot gets negativity esp when do lots of public stuff that draws feedback), but i like to see this extra bit of competition.but it wont end up meaning much if we get crap.and ppl deffo rose tinted on a certain bulging eyes. but maybe now having been pushed out of top and needing to fight back hell make better fights with this new money? please sir

or maybe hes just using the money to fund yardes next 20 hungarian roadsweepers

paddy chavez wrote:Eddie signs established fighters and Warren builds them up .

Nah, poppycock. Eddie hangs around the team GB locker room like a nonce at a playground. O'Hara, Joshua, C Smith, Campbell, et al.

was ohara ever one team GB? thought he had not much amateur career

KiwiRider wrote:

paddy chavez wrote:Eddie signs established fighters and Warren builds them up .

Nah, poppycock. Eddie hangs around the team GB locker room like a nonce at a playground. O'Hara, Joshua, C Smith, Campbell, et al.

Established might be the wrong wood , known fighters or dead certs

jamamb wrote:was ohara ever one team GB? thought he had not much amateur career

Correct. But is a non established fighter before signing with Eddie.

mickey1975 wrote:

Autobarn wrote:I think some people are forgetting how bad things were when FW was the top man in UK boxing.or weren’t following Boxing about 10 years ago.

His fighters wouldn’t fight on way promotions (the classic Dean Francis v Tony Oakley fight being an exception to the rule) and his world champions were matched extremely conservatively, although he rescued some of their reputations delivering the right opponent at the right time - the old “career-defining fight.”

Of the fighters FW promoted I can only think of Nigel Benn actually going for the jugular, taking the hard fights. And that was in the 1990s.

It is so strange to see FW become the sentimental favourite. At one point Boxing was so disappointing it was moved onto Friday nights by Sky Sports.

Ricky v Kostya, Bruno v Tyson, Liam Smith v Canelo? Hamed fought loads of good men, so have loads of others.

Allow me to correct, Benn and Hamed.

Ricky v Kostya was the “career defining fight” following double digit fringe “world title” defenses that I was alluding to earlier

KiwiRider wrote:

jamamb wrote:was ohara ever one team GB? thought he had not much amateur career

Correct. But is a non established fighter before signing with Eddie.

You're hugely contradicting yourself there.

boxingknockout wrote:

paddy chavez wrote:

Autobarn wrote:I think some people are forgetting how bad things were when FW was the top man in UK boxing.or weren’t following Boxing about 10 years ago.

His fighters wouldn’t fight on way promotions (the classic Dean Francis v Tony Oakley fight being an exception to the rule) and his world champions were matched extremely conservatively, although he rescued some of their reputations delivering the right opponent at the right time - the old “career-defining fight.”

Of the fighters FW promoted I can only think of Nigel Benn actually going for the jugular, taking the hard fights. And that was in the 1990s.

It is so strange to see FW become the sentimental favourite. At one point Boxing was so disappointing it was moved onto Friday nights by Sky Sports.

Nigel Benn fought plenty of easy fights as well take McClellan out and it was the likes of Lou Gent , sugar boy malinger ,Gimenez ,perez all completely forgettable boxers .

Sugar Boy Malingerer (sic) actually beat Nigel Benn however (second time.)

Benn was spent after the McClellan epic tragic fight. I don’t think a Brit had ever been in such a dangerous title defense, and we’ve never seen this level of intensity on these shores ever again.

Autobarn wrote:

boxingknockout wrote:

paddy chavez wrote:
Nigel Benn fought plenty of easy fights as well take McClellan out and it was the likes of Lou Gent , sugar boy malinger ,Gimenez ,perez all completely forgettable boxers .

Sugar Boy Malingerer (sic) actually beat Nigel Benn however (second time.)

Benn was spent after the McClellan epic tragic fight. I don’t think a Brit had ever been in such a dangerous title defense, and we’ve never seen this level of intensity on these shores ever again.

Cleverly Vs kovalev and burns Vs Crawford recently turned into equally hard defences.

Autobarn wrote:I think some people are forgetting how bad things were when FW was the top man in UK boxing.or weren’t following Boxing about 10 years ago.

His fighters wouldn’t fight on way promotions (the classic Dean Francis v Tony Oakley fight being an exception to the rule) and his world champions were matched extremely conservatively, although he rescued some of their reputations delivering the right opponent at the right time - the old “career-defining fight.”

Of the fighters FW promoted I can only think of Nigel Benn actually going for the jugular, taking the hard fights. And that was in the 1990s.

It is so strange to see FW become the sentimental favourite. At one point Boxing was so disappointing it was moved onto Friday nights by Sky Sports.

This

There’s no way that Hatton and Calzaghe would have been able to pad up a record for as long under Hearn. Warren much more conservative airing on the side of caution. Hearn seems more aggressive in his match making.

Boxing is big in England right now and matchroom have played the lead part with a really good amateur programme now

Yes, Warren is why I stopped my Sky Sports subscription.


I only came back to Boxing after AJ’s first genuine fight, Whyte, and when Frampton v Quigg was made.

(In the interval I only followed Froch, who did great things for post recession UK with gruelling fights against genuine top ten opponents)

Boxing still isn’t perfect but I’ve seen a considerable amount of fighters, from Brook to Crolla to McDonnell, fulfilling their potential.

I wouldn’t write off FW, he cand definitely still do things and no doubt he will come up with something of worth.

It used to be, sadly, Calzaghe v Salem, Macca v Lamontagne, Hatton-Stewart, Lockett-Katsimpas as the rule.

Calzaghe went on a run from beating Eubank in 1997, after which his record went to 23-0 to the Lacy fight nine years later, at which point he was 40-0.

Seventeen fights in nine years at world championship level and who was the pick of the opposition? Reid? Veit? Mitchell? Yes there were decent fights but largely it was very disappointing, especially considering Warren would barely stop talking about Roy Jones/Bernard Hopkins/Glen Johnson/Sven Ottke after Joe won, but would inevitably deliver David Starie/Will McIntyre/Evans Ashira.

Warren delivered fantastic fights but largely they were very few and far between in amongst a lot of really poor contests. I really get the impression that had Joshua been with Warren we'd be building up to the 'acid test' that is Dereck Chisora, and that would represent Joshua's biggest test to date.

Surely Hearn is done the moment Joshua leaves matchroom?
Even more so if he takes some of his Olympian friends with him...
Pretty sure i read Buatsi & Okollie are already signed to some kind of AJ boxing thing...

Pukka Cheese wrote:Surely Hearn is done the moment Joshua leaves matchroom?
Even more so if he takes some of his Olympian friends with him...
Pretty sure i read Buatsi & Okollie are already signed to some kind of AJ boxing thing...

I don’t realky know what the AJBXNG programme is, but Hearn has a good group but they’re fresh from the olympics and amateurs so will take a while

His stable is almost in transition mode

boxingknockout wrote:

paddy chavez wrote:

Autobarn wrote:I think some people are forgetting how bad things were when FW was the top man in UK boxing.or weren’t following Boxing about 10 years ago.

His fighters wouldn’t fight on way promotions (the classic Dean Francis v Tony Oakley fight being an exception to the rule) and his world champions were matched extremely conservatively, although he rescued some of their reputations delivering the right opponent at the right time - the old “career-defining fight.”

Of the fighters FW promoted I can only think of Nigel Benn actually going for the jugular, taking the hard fights. And that was in the 1990s.

It is so strange to see FW become the sentimental favourite. At one point Boxing was so disappointing it was moved onto Friday nights by Sky Sports.

Nigel Benn fought plenty of easy fights as well take McClellan out and it was the likes of Lou Gent , sugar boy malinger ,Gimenez ,perez all completely forgettable boxers .

Sugar Boy Malingerer (sic) actually beat Nigel Benn however (second time.)

Sugar Boy was an awkward pain in the ass to a few Brits! Was him that dethroned Robin Reid wasn't it?

Stuarty30 wrote:

boxingknockout wrote:

paddy chavez wrote:
Nigel Benn fought plenty of easy fights as well take McClellan out and it was the likes of Lou Gent , sugar boy malinger ,Gimenez ,perez all completely forgettable boxers .

Sugar Boy Malingerer (sic) actually beat Nigel Benn however (second time.)

Sugar Boy was an awkward pain in the ass to a few Brits! Was him that dethroned Robin Reid wasn't it?

I think he beat Reid and woodhall bear sugar boy

paddy chavez wrote:

Stuarty30 wrote:

boxingknockout wrote:
Sugar Boy Malingerer (sic) actually beat Nigel Benn however (second time.)

Sugar Boy was an awkward pain in the ass to a few Brits! Was him that dethroned Robin Reid wasn't it?

I think he beat Reid and woodhall bear sugar boy

That's right mate

paddy chavez wrote:Eddie signs established fighters and Warren builds them up .

In fairness Hearn (and sky) have done amazing with Joshua who they signed from scratch.

Though you had to be an idiot to fail with a heavyweight who won gold at home.

sugar boy malinga was not a patsy at all.

Naandrew wrote:

paddy chavez wrote:Eddie signs established fighters and Warren builds them up .

In fairness Hearn (and sky) have done amazing with Joshua who they signed from scratch.

Though you had to be an idiot to fail with a heavyweight who won gold at home.

I think you can say the difference in Froch's profile was greater from the point he went to Matchroom to the end of his career then before.

mickey1975 wrote:

KiwiRider wrote:

jamamb wrote:was ohara ever one team GB? thought he had not much amateur career

Correct. But is a non established fighter before signing with Eddie.

You're hugely contradicting yourself there.

Your right. And I should have taken the time to seperate things. I chucked a square peg in, and lazily beat it with a mallet into the round hole