BoxRec

asdfjkl wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 07:44 Well, last week there was someone on this forum that acted like taking illegal stuff is not a problem, as long as you do it "out of competition", if this isn't out of competition, then what is? On top of that, even the doping people claim that this is most likely because of meat because it's such a low value if I understand it correct. Now I don't know about the details, but I'm confident he genuinly didn't do it on purpose. It's not like he had a bunch of weed with him or something.

Deleted_Scenes wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 04:07

jamamb wrote: ↑06 Mar 2018, 18:27 could it be merely 'trace' amounts left if someone used it a few months ago and then stopped before testing, thinking it would be long enough off it to not get caught ?

Exactly this.

Someone who takes clenbuterol outside of competition could very easily have trace amounts left in their system if they mistime the flush, or have VADA turn up slightly sooner than expected.

That's why the 'tainted meat' excuse is unacceptable. It opens to door to athletes going back to Mexico between fights, juicing up deliberately, then having a ready made excuse if they get caught.

So what if it could be from tainted meat. It also could be a result of cheating. As a professional athlete (especially one earning 20mil+ per fight, and with Canelo's profile) you and only you are responsible for what goes into your body. You know you're going to get tested at some point. You know where the risks of contamination are (it's been very widely known for at least a decade). You easily have the means to avoid those risks, if you desire.

However it got in your body, that's on you.
Deliberately or accidentally, that's something you we're able to avoid.

Canelo should be banned, regardless of his excuse. 1 year minimum, plus a hefty fine to get his license back afterwards (to be put towards funding anti-doping programmes). 2nd offence, banned for life.

Badhusker wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 07:53

asdfjkl wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 07:44 Well, last week there was someone on this forum that acted like taking illegal stuff is not a problem, as long as you do it "out of competition", if this isn't out of competition, then what is? On top of that, even the doping people claim that this is most likely because of meat because it's such a low value if I understand it correct. Now I don't know about the details, but I'm confident he genuinly didn't do it on purpose. It's not like he had a bunch of weed with him or something.

Only Canelo and those very close to him know for sure if it was done on purpose. Like I said before, having traces in his system could be from tainted meat, or from him not cycling off soon enough. Like I also said before, if he is dumb enough to eat meat from Mexico after numerous warnings were issued world-wide 6 years ago, and more recently, specifically pointing at Mexico and China, he at least deserves a big fine for being stupid.

It sucks to be Erik Morales I guess, who got a 2 yr ban from USADA for the same drug, also saying it was from eating tainted meat. Guess he should have dyed his hair red.

boxing_rocks wrote: ↑06 Mar 2018, 16:32

apollo creed wrote: ↑06 Mar 2018, 16:29 I think the rematch will happen.

Yes, it will. There is too much money to be earned by everybody to pay attention to little things like PEDs. WBC and WBA presidents already backed Clenbnelo up.

Badhusker wrote: ↑06 Mar 2018, 22:57

SenorPipino wrote: ↑06 Mar 2018, 17:34 If a Mexican fighter has a sizeable amount of clenbuterol in his system, then a suspension is warranted.

But if it's the insignificant trace amounts that so far many Mexican have tested positive for, then it's irrelevant.

It's wonderful that brain surgeon Garcia can theorize and suggest what foods Canelo should or shouldn't eat.

More Mexican athletes will continue to test positive because Mexican industries feel that clenbuterol is a cheap means of tenderizing and keeping meats lean.

No one can prove he has been using it or if it came from meat. With only a 48hr Half-Life, he could have been cycling off it, which would only leave trace amounts.....the same as eating tainted meat.
If Canelo or his team are that Damn dumb that they would jeapordize losing millions by eating meat from Mexico vs having it shipped in, I don't feel sorry for him if caught.
I don't buy the meat story, unless they are much dumber than I thought. Strict warnings about the possibility of this happening began in 2011.
Erik Morales got a 2yr ban for the same drug, and gave the same excuse of tainted meat.

asdfjkl wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 12:28

Badhusker wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 07:53

asdfjkl wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 07:44 Well, last week there was someone on this forum that acted like taking illegal stuff is not a problem, as long as you do it "out of competition", if this isn't out of competition, then what is? On top of that, even the doping people claim that this is most likely because of meat because it's such a low value if I understand it correct. Now I don't know about the details, but I'm confident he genuinly didn't do it on purpose. It's not like he had a bunch of weed with him or something.

Only Canelo and those very close to him know for sure if it was done on purpose. Like I said before, having traces in his system could be from tainted meat, or from him not cycling off soon enough. Like I also said before, if he is dumb enough to eat meat from Mexico after numerous warnings were issued world-wide 6 years ago, and more recently, specifically pointing at Mexico and China, he at least deserves a big fine for being stupid.

It sucks to be Erik Morales I guess, who got a 2 yr ban from USADA for the same drug, also saying it was from eating tainted meat. Guess he should have dyed his hair red.

Tell me about Erik Morales, did he also have just a tiny bit, or actually a hell of a lot? Also, did he have it within the week of the fight, or several months before? And did he fight a bum, or was he about to get the fight of his life?

apollo creed wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 15:31 If a regular guy eats 'tainted meat' instead of organic meat does he becomes more stronger ?

boxing_rocks wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 16:08

apollo creed wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 15:31 If a regular guy eats 'tainted meat' instead of organic meat does he becomes more stronger ?

Any chance you become "more smarter" ?

caldo2025 wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 08:16 I'm not sure what happens after a fighter tests positive for something like Clenbuterol. Is it just reported and countered with a canned response blaming the livestock or is there a more invasive test then scheduled to clarify what else could be inside the boxer's system?

We all saw Canelo's physique last fight and he ended up looking like a body builder. I've never been so sure of a fighter juicing without any evidence than i am about Canelo. He's dirty as hell. He's been hanging out with Sly Stallone and his pockets are filled with WinstrolV at all times.

Golden Boy again trying to tip the tables in his fighters way from the judges, the venue and he drug tests i'm sure which are very Floydlike. If I'm GGG, i'm moving on. This fight is already too difficult to win with all of the shady business surrounding it.

ewenhay wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 15:25

asdfjkl wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 12:28

Badhusker wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 07:53

Only Canelo and those very close to him know for sure if it was done on purpose. Like I said before, having traces in his system could be from tainted meat, or from him not cycling off soon enough. Like I also said before, if he is dumb enough to eat meat from Mexico after numerous warnings were issued world-wide 6 years ago, and more recently, specifically pointing at Mexico and China, he at least deserves a big fine for being stupid.

It sucks to be Erik Morales I guess, who got a 2 yr ban from USADA for the same drug, also saying it was from eating tainted meat. Guess he should have dyed his hair red.

Tell me about Erik Morales, did he also have just a tiny bit, or actually a hell of a lot? Also, did he have it within the week of the fight, or several months before? And did he fight a bum, or was he about to get the fight of his life?

If someone tests over an agreed limit for any substance then they should face an agreed punishment.

You tend to defend all fighters who fail drug tests. You don't think these things should be taken seriously in a contact sport?

Thomastearns wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 17:57

caldo2025 wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 08:16 I'm not sure what happens after a fighter tests positive for something like Clenbuterol. Is it just reported and countered with a canned response blaming the livestock or is there a more invasive test then scheduled to clarify what else could be inside the boxer's system?

We all saw Canelo's physique last fight and he ended up looking like a body builder. I've never been so sure of a fighter juicing without any evidence than i am about Canelo. He's dirty as hell. He's been hanging out with Sly Stallone and his pockets are filled with WinstrolV at all times.

Golden Boy again trying to tip the tables in his fighters way from the judges, the venue and he drug tests i'm sure which are very Floydlike. If I'm GGG, i'm moving on. This fight is already too difficult to win with all of the shady business surrounding it.

I'm sure that the Golovkin camp could now pull out of this fight legally at any time, but we all know they won't. No boxer will turn their nose up at this kind of money. All kinds of dodgy matchups can be made if the price is right, and they often are. Boxers will fight anyone IF the money is right - rightly or wrongly.

I'm still happy for this fight to go ahead because now there should be a greater chance that Canelo will be clean on fight night. I'm more concerned with what message this might send out to all the clean fighters out there.

The contaminated meat excuse coming from a multi-millionaire superstar like Canelo Alvarez?? This coming not long after the Tyson and Hughie Fury's nandralone fiasco.

You can't have it both ways, its proof of either gross cheating or gross negligence.

Badhusker wrote: ↑08 Mar 2018, 15:52 Canelo has tested positive twice in February, not just once. Not sure how far apart they were though.

https://www.BS.com/golovkin-ca ... rt--125997

Bob Arum wrote: “Look, I don’t know whether it was tainted beef or not. I’m sick and tired of the excuse of tainted beef. Everybody knows that a lot of fighters in Mexico use that drug to turn heavy muscle mass into lean muscle mass. I don’t know whether that’s the case with Canelo — no way I would know — but somebody needs to investigate and put witnesses on the stand and if they tell the truth, fine, if they commit perjury, it’s on them. But somebody needs to investigate this!

“This is nonsense that these amounts of this drug are only from tainted beef, when everybody knows that a lot of trainers in Mexico — before the drug testing, before they get into camp — they use this drug to do the work and then they stop when the drug testing starts. Everybody knows that!

“No whether it happened in this case or not, I don’t know. And I’m not accusing anybody of anything, but I’m suspicious and I think it needs to be investigated for the good of the sport.”

boxing_rocks wrote: ↑09 Mar 2018, 13:24

Bob Arum wrote: “Look, I don’t know whether it was tainted beef or not. I’m sick and tired of the excuse of tainted beef. Everybody knows that a lot of fighters in Mexico use that drug to turn heavy muscle mass into lean muscle mass. I don’t know whether that’s the case with Canelo — no way I would know — but somebody needs to investigate and put witnesses on the stand and if they tell the truth, fine, if they commit perjury, it’s on them. But somebody needs to investigate this!

“This is nonsense that these amounts of this drug are only from tainted beef, when everybody knows that a lot of trainers in Mexico — before the drug testing, before they get into camp — they use this drug to do the work and then they stop when the drug testing starts. Everybody knows that!

“No whether it happened in this case or not, I don’t know. And I’m not accusing anybody of anything, but I’m suspicious and I think it needs to be investigated for the good of the sport.”

asdfjkl wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 12:28

Badhusker wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 07:53

asdfjkl wrote: ↑07 Mar 2018, 07:44 Well, last week there was someone on this forum that acted like taking illegal stuff is not a problem, as long as you do it "out of competition", if this isn't out of competition, then what is? On top of that, even the doping people claim that this is most likely because of meat because it's such a low value if I understand it correct. Now I don't know about the details, but I'm confident he genuinly didn't do it on purpose. It's not like he had a bunch of weed with him or something.

Only Canelo and those very close to him know for sure if it was done on purpose. Like I said before, having traces in his system could be from tainted meat, or from him not cycling off soon enough. Like I also said before, if he is dumb enough to eat meat from Mexico after numerous warnings were issued world-wide 6 years ago, and more recently, specifically pointing at Mexico and China, he at least deserves a big fine for being stupid.

It sucks to be Erik Morales I guess, who got a 2 yr ban from USADA for the same drug, also saying it was from eating tainted meat. Guess he should have dyed his hair red.

Tell me about Erik Morales, did he also have just a tiny bit, or actually a hell of a lot? Also, did he have it within the week of the fight, or several months before? And did he fight a bum, or was he about to get the fight of his life?