BoxRec

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:26 What strikes me, especially comparing him to the likes of Joshua, is how natural Lewis' physique was, no huge bulging muscles, just a naturally big man. He was actually quite slim at 235 though on a very large frame.

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:17

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 12:45

oogiebe wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 12:26

He said 'there at the Olympics.' just a wording thing for sure.

And I was correct too--Tyson was at the 84 Olympics.

When i read what you wrote i was thinkin "no tyrell biggs beat tyson in the trials so tyson didnt go" haha, i didnt know he was there with the US team in 84.

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:03 The Lewis jab wasn't as focused and punishing as the Holmes jab imo. With Holmes it was the chief weapon, employed to soften up opponents. With Lewis it was often pawed, the big right behind it being his main interest. Lewis's jab was critcised throughout his career--Holmes's never was, ever.

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:06

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:03 The Lewis jab wasn't as focused and punishing as the Holmes jab imo. With Holmes it was the chief weapon, employed to soften up opponents. With Lewis it was often pawed, the big right behind it being his main interest. Lewis's jab was critcised throughout his career--Holmes's never was, ever.

Iv never heard it criticised tbh mate,imo he has always had a brilliant jab,LL was the last great heavyweight imo

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:19

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:06

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:03 The Lewis jab wasn't as focused and punishing as the Holmes jab imo. With Holmes it was the chief weapon, employed to soften up opponents. With Lewis it was often pawed, the big right behind it being his main interest. Lewis's jab was critcised throughout his career--Holmes's never was, ever.

Iv never heard it criticised tbh mate,imo he has always had a brilliant jab,LL was the last great heavyweight imo

I think he was the last great heavyweight too. But there was often frustration with his use of the jab, think others here will corroborate. It was in the press and often referenced during fights.

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 06:56

bennie wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 04:21

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 09:26 I'm sure Lennox got shaken up by Al Malcolm in that fight. There's a brief moment where he gets walloped and looks out of it! Not seen it in years tho so brain may have exaggerated it.

Aside: So strange that his second fight was bottom of the Mike Tyson/Carl Williams bill. Both Lewis and Tyson were there at the 84 Olympics and yet by 1989 Tyson was a glorious 37-0, undisputed heavyweight champion, already an all-time great, the highest earner in sport--and a global icon to boot!--and Lewis was 2-0.

Hardcore Lewis fans love to remind people that in the 2002 Lewis/Tyson spectacle both men are the same age, in order to undermine the idea of Tyson being over the hill--as if one having accomplished everything before the other even turned pro couldn't possibly have doused his fire. Holding out for another Olympics was in the long run enormously beneficial to LL.

Lewis was still pretty raw in 1984, even though he was world junior champion going into the Olympics. He lost to Tyrell Biggs in the Games, fighting well at first but Biggs gradually got on top and pulled out a big third round to make sure of the decision. Biggs went on to win the gold medal with a decision over Franceso Damiani so it was a decent display from Lewis.
Biggs and Lewis met again, of course, years later and Lewis really got stuck into the American and stopped him early.

So too was Tyson in 84 but still he turned pro. Would be interesting to see how Lewis's career played out had he done the same.

That 91 rematch with Biggs is fairly meaningless, Tyson had knocked the stuffing out of poor Tyrell years earlier.

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:47

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:26 What strikes me, especially comparing him to the likes of Joshua, is how natural Lewis' physique was, no huge bulging muscles, just a naturally big man. He was actually quite slim at 235 though on a very large frame.

Just been watching this james and i was thinking exactly the same,looking at how natural LL threw his punches,how slim he looked for a big man and was also thinking how brilliant his jab was,id rate LL as a better jabber than Larry holmes,probably the best jabber of all time.

bigjack wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 14:29

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:47

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:26 What strikes me, especially comparing him to the likes of Joshua, is how natural Lewis' physique was, no huge bulging muscles, just a naturally big man. He was actually quite slim at 235 though on a very large frame.

Just been watching this james and i was thinking exactly the same,looking at how natural LL threw his punches,how slim he looked for a big man and was also thinking how brilliant his jab was,id rate LL as a better jabber than Larry holmes,probably the best jabber of all time.

I love both Larry and Lennox but for me Holmes's jab was far sharper,i heard it once described as like being hit with a broom handle with broken glass on the end.

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:06

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:03 The Lewis jab wasn't as focused and punishing as the Holmes jab imo. With Holmes it was the chief weapon, employed to soften up opponents. With Lewis it was often pawed, the big right behind it being his main interest. Lewis's jab was critcised throughout his career--Holmes's never was, ever.

Iv never heard it criticised tbh mate,imo he has always had a brilliant jab,LL was the last great heavyweight imo

oogiebe wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 13:05

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:06

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 08:03 The Lewis jab wasn't as focused and punishing as the Holmes jab imo. With Holmes it was the chief weapon, employed to soften up opponents. With Lewis it was often pawed, the big right behind it being his main interest. Lewis's jab was critcised throughout his career--Holmes's never was, ever.

Iv never heard it criticised tbh mate,imo he has always had a brilliant jab,LL was the last great heavyweight imo

Tuan is right, early Lennox had a pawing jab, not the stinging piston like jab he developed under Emmanual Stewart.

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:47

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:26 What strikes me, especially comparing him to the likes of Joshua, is how natural Lewis' physique was, no huge bulging muscles, just a naturally big man. He was actually quite slim at 235 though on a very large frame.

Just been watching this james and i was thinking exactly the same,looking at how natural LL threw his punches,how slim he looked for a big man and was also thinking how brilliant his jab was,id rate LL as a better jabber than Larry holmes,probably the best jabber of all time.

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 16:02

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:47

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:26 What strikes me, especially comparing him to the likes of Joshua, is how natural Lewis' physique was, no huge bulging muscles, just a naturally big man. He was actually quite slim at 235 though on a very large frame.

Just been watching this james and i was thinking exactly the same,looking at how natural LL threw his punches,how slim he looked for a big man and was also thinking how brilliant his jab was,id rate LL as a better jabber than Larry holmes,probably the best jabber of all time.

No. Lennox was outjabbed badly by very stiff Frank Bruno. Prime Lewis was outjabbed by much smaller Ray Mercer, while 42-years-old Larry Holmes easily outboxed and outjabbed Ray. Lewis had a good jab, but it wasn't as good as Holmes' one.

thechump wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 16:26

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 16:02

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:47

Just been watching this james and i was thinking exactly the same,looking at how natural LL threw his punches,how slim he looked for a big man and was also thinking how brilliant his jab was,id rate LL as a better jabber than Larry holmes,probably the best jabber of all time.

No. Lennox was outjabbed badly by very stiff Frank Bruno. Prime Lewis was outjabbed by much smaller Ray Mercer, while 42-years-old Larry Holmes easily outboxed and outjabbed Ray. Lewis had a good jab, but it wasn't as good as Holmes' one.

Maybe it was a stupid statement by myself,i remember bruno out jabbing him aswell and i remember mercer beating him but LL got the decision. Tbh i remember the morrison fight and LL took him to school and i think that image has been ingrained in my mind lol

thechump wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 16:26

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 16:02

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:47

Just been watching this james and i was thinking exactly the same,looking at how natural LL threw his punches,how slim he looked for a big man and was also thinking how brilliant his jab was,id rate LL as a better jabber than Larry holmes,probably the best jabber of all time.

No. Lennox was outjabbed badly by very stiff Frank Bruno. Prime Lewis was outjabbed by much smaller Ray Mercer, while 42-years-old Larry Holmes easily outboxed and outjabbed Ray. Lewis had a good jab, but it wasn't as good as Holmes' one.

Maybe it was a stupid statement by myself,i remember bruno out jabbing him aswell and i remember mercer beating him but LL got the decision. Tbh i remember the morrison fight and LL took him to school and i think that image has been ingrained in my mind lol

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑21 May 2018, 06:55

thechump wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 16:26

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 16:02
No. Lennox was outjabbed badly by very stiff Frank Bruno. Prime Lewis was outjabbed by much smaller Ray Mercer, while 42-years-old Larry Holmes easily outboxed and outjabbed Ray. Lewis had a good jab, but it wasn't as good as Holmes' one.

Maybe it was a stupid statement by myself,i remember bruno out jabbing him aswell and i remember mercer beating him but LL got the decision. Tbh i remember the morrison fight and LL took him to school and i think that image has been ingrained in my mind lol

I think certain guys who scared him--Morrison, Tua, Holyfield--concentrated his jab. He used it very effectively versus Gary Mason too. But it wasn't used to it fullest potential in so many other fights.

thechump wrote: ↑21 May 2018, 07:50

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑21 May 2018, 06:55

thechump wrote: ↑20 May 2018, 16:26
Maybe it was a stupid statement by myself,i remember bruno out jabbing him aswell and i remember mercer beating him but LL got the decision. Tbh i remember the morrison fight and LL took him to school and i think that image has been ingrained in my mind lol

I think certain guys who scared him--Morrison, Tua, Holyfield--concentrated his jab. He used it very effectively versus Gary Mason too. But it wasn't used to it fullest potential in so many other fights.

I think when he knew he was gonna be in a fight and was abit scared he blew them away i.e Michael Grant,Andrew Golota and Razor Ruddock. I forget fights where he never used the jab to its potential,imagine larry holmes being out jabbed by frank bruno lol

bigjack wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 14:29

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:47

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:26 What strikes me, especially comparing him to the likes of Joshua, is how natural Lewis' physique was, no huge bulging muscles, just a naturally big man. He was actually quite slim at 235 though on a very large frame.

Just been watching this james and i was thinking exactly the same,looking at how natural LL threw his punches,how slim he looked for a big man and was also thinking how brilliant his jab was,id rate LL as a better jabber than Larry holmes,probably the best jabber of all time.

I love both Larry and Lennox but for me Holmes's jab was far sharper,i heard it once described as like being hit with a broom handle with broken glass on the end.

MightyWarrior wrote: ↑21 May 2018, 17:23

bigjack wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 14:29

thechump wrote: ↑19 May 2018, 07:47

Just been watching this james and i was thinking exactly the same,looking at how natural LL threw his punches,how slim he looked for a big man and was also thinking how brilliant his jab was,id rate LL as a better jabber than Larry holmes,probably the best jabber of all time.

I love both Larry and Lennox but for me Holmes's jab was far sharper,i heard it once described as like being hit with a broom handle with broken glass on the end.

Someone once described Sonny Liston’s jab as like a two-by-four smashing through a plate glass window.