BoxRec

What ever on earth was it all about then

lillywhite14 wrote: ↑05 Nov 2018, 13:02 This isn’t MMA in a cage. People assuming Mayweather is fvcked because a kick boxer is allowed to kick him in a fight are completely underplaying boxing in any boxing vs kickboxing comparison. I’d expect Mayweather to bust him up completely, even if he is allowed to kick. Even at 41 and way past his best too.

The perfect example of this is Shannon Briggs' foray into K1 where he knocked Tom Erikson spark out.

LOL


tom eriksons a wrestler with next to no kicking ability. never anywhere near being a top flght kickboxer. his stand up was mediocre even for mma and even then he was just all wild punches. that match was made to showcase briggs in k1.

Personally, I think Floyd "woke up" and the dream was over and he bailed before it got too far down the road. If the fight was modified rules of any kind Mayweather would have been embarrassed. I think, too, he didn't like the lukewarm reception from American and European fans whose responses ranged from, "Nope you won't con me again," "What is this bullshit?", "This is will be worked," and "Who the hell is this guy he's fighting?"

BTW... Is Mayweather THAT financially unstable that you can actually buy him for private exhibition bouts? That admission, bullshit or not, paints a rather pathetic picture of the so-called best boxer of our time. Maybe if he stopped traveling with entourages, buying strip joints, etc he'd have money. If I were a billionaire I'd buy him just to stage him against GGG behind closed doors--- but he'd probably run away screaming from that too.

kingmo wrote: ↑07 Nov 2018, 19:59

lillywhite14 wrote: ↑05 Nov 2018, 13:02 This isn’t MMA in a cage. People assuming Mayweather is fvcked because a kick boxer is allowed to kick him in a fight are completely underplaying boxing in any boxing vs kickboxing comparison. I’d expect Mayweather to bust him up completely, even if he is allowed to kick. Even at 41 and way past his best too.

The perfect example of this is Shannon Briggs' foray into K1 where he knocked Tom Erikson spark out.

That proves nothing except Tom Erikson was not good enough to beat Shannon the Canon. It proves nothing about Kickboxing/MMA/any other fighting discipline versus a boxer.

Why do people assume that because something happened once, it proves that it is how it would always be?

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 03:33
BTW... Is Mayweather THAT financially unstable that you can actually buy him for private exhibition bouts? :

That jumped out at me too, that he would be flying around the world to piss around in exhibition shite in front of some coked up business people. Guy has not self pride at all

i mean at least try to cherry pick a fight with an actual kickboxer and not a wrestler

tobyh5 wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 04:33

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 03:33
BTW... Is Mayweather THAT financially unstable that you can actually buy him for private exhibition bouts? :

That jumped out at me too, that he would be flying around the world to piss around in exhibition shite in front of some coked up business people. Guy has not self pride at all

It’s not that surprising, plenty of performers get paid astronomical fees for private concerts...

tobyh5 wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 04:32

kingmo wrote: ↑07 Nov 2018, 19:59

lillywhite14 wrote: ↑05 Nov 2018, 13:02 This isn’t MMA in a cage. People assuming Mayweather is fvcked because a kick boxer is allowed to kick him in a fight are completely underplaying boxing in any boxing vs kickboxing comparison. I’d expect Mayweather to bust him up completely, even if he is allowed to kick. Even at 41 and way past his best too.

The perfect example of this is Shannon Briggs' foray into K1 where he knocked Tom Erikson spark out.

That proves nothing except Tom Erikson was not good enough to beat Shannon the Canon. It proves nothing about Kickboxing/MMA/any other fighting discipline versus a boxer.

Why do people assume that because something happened once, it proves that it is how it would always be?

This 100%. Ray Mercer fought MMA twice. He KO'd former UFC Champion Tom Sylvia in 9 secs, but then got choked out in just over a minute by the relative mma novice Kimbo Slice.

Boxing. Kickboxing. MMA. Are all completely different sports, obvious same aspects transfer across but success in one doesn't guarantee success in another.

And the comment above about kicks is totally ignoring how kicking, especially kicks to the leg changes everything. Take a few decent kicks & then come back & tell me how they don't matter.

jamamb wrote: ↑07 Nov 2018, 20:02 LOL


tom eriksons a wrestler with next to no kicking ability. never anywhere near being a top flght kickboxer. his stand up was mediocre even for mma and even then he was just all wild punches. that match was made to showcase briggs in k1.

LOL

He had far more ability at kicking than Shannon Briggs!

The point lillywhite was making is not every MMA fighter/kickboxer/Thai boxer will beat a boxer just because they can kick. There are levels to every discipline. A low level MMA fighter will not beat a top level boxer just because he is able to kick.

tobyh5 wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 04:32

kingmo wrote: ↑07 Nov 2018, 19:59

lillywhite14 wrote: ↑05 Nov 2018, 13:02 This isn’t MMA in a cage. People assuming Mayweather is fvcked because a kick boxer is allowed to kick him in a fight are completely underplaying boxing in any boxing vs kickboxing comparison. I’d expect Mayweather to bust him up completely, even if he is allowed to kick. Even at 41 and way past his best too.

The perfect example of this is Shannon Briggs' foray into K1 where he knocked Tom Erikson spark out.

That proves nothing except Tom Erikson was not good enough to beat Shannon the Canon. It proves nothing about Kickboxing/MMA/any other fighting discipline versus a boxer.

Why do people assume that because something happened once, it proves that it is how it would always be?

That’s exactly my point and lillywhite’s point. Just because Tom Erickson was able to kick Briggs, he still wasn’t good enough to beat him.

If he had beat Briggs, then it would prove Briggs was not good enough to beat Erickson; not that being able to kick a boxer means you are guaranteed a win.

I reckon Tenshin would have gave this old version of Floyd a doing. The guy can punch as well as kick and his knees are deadly. One of the quickest fighters I’ve ever seen.

is anyone seriously saying that simply throwing kicks at a boxer means your going to beat them? were talking about top level kickboxers who are good kickers, not mma wrestlers like tom erikson who have never shown any remotely decent kick game .that was just a sloppy fight to compare with.

and of course under certain rules some styles are superior. as i said, if someone made it there goal to conqueror the muay thai world, do you really think it would make no difference as to whether they went about training in muay thai or only just pure boxing?

under a set of rules that allow kicks, there is defo an overall style advantage to kickboxers. that doesnt mean any one who throws some kicks will beat a boxer in a kickboxing match, but it will be heaivly skewed to the kickboxers who are adept in there discipline

jamamb wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 07:53 is anyone seriously saying that simply throwing kicks at a boxer means your going to beat them? were talking about top level kickboxers who are good kickers, not mma wrestlers like tom erikson who have never shown any remotely decent kick game .that was just a sloppy fight to compare with.

and of course under certain rules some styles are superior. as i said, if someone made it there goal to conqueror the muay thai world, do you really think it would make no difference as to whether they went about training in muay thai or only just pure boxing?

under a set of rules that allow kicks, there is defo an overall style advantage to kickboxers. that doesnt mean any one who throws some kicks will beat a boxer in a kickboxing match, but it will be heaivly skewed to the kickboxers who are adept in there discipline

Perhaps you should read and try to comprehend what lillywhite initially wrote, the post I responded to, rather than going off on a rant about how adept kickboxers will have a massive advantage over someone who doesn’t specialise in that discipline.

And for the record there are plenty of examples at the very top level in MMA where guys who were far better with their legs got knocked spark out by opponents who had better hands.

nah, it seems to be you who doesnt comprehend it, lily said people have been totally underplaying a boxer in a match vs a kickboxer, but people were talking about a boxer facing an elite kickboxer with excellent kicking skills. thats not tom erikson at all, tom erikson is a wrestelr who did mma and couldnt kick worth sh!T. he wasnt even a decent striker in mma. that example just shows shannon briggs plowing through a mediocre striker who really brought none of the abilities that give kickboxers a general advantage vs boxers in kickboxing matches.

ya, of course someone throwing kicks at a boxer doesnt mean the boxer cant beat them, thats pretty basic stuff that really goes without saying.. im sure floyd could beat a number of grapplers in kickboxing even if they tried kicking him

Tenshin is a decent kickboxer

Has bashed up some lumpinee guys

tobyh5 wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 04:33

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 03:33
BTW... Is Mayweather THAT financially unstable that you can actually buy him for private exhibition bouts? :

That jumped out at me too, that he would be flying around the world to piss around in exhibition shite in front of some coked up business people. Guy has not self pride at all

Stevie Wonder isn't short of a bob or two but he can be hired for private gigs.
I know that because I was paid to prep the house prior to his arrival. That was in Scotland a few years ago. There weren't more than 10 people there.
Throw enough money at someone for an easy gig and they'll most likely take it if all the boxes are ticked without question.

Very funny turnout either way isn't it

jamamb wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 09:07 nah, it seems to be you who doesnt comprehend it, lily said people have been totally underplaying a boxer in a match vs a kickboxer, but people were talking about a boxer facing an elite kickboxer with excellent kicking skills. thats not tom erikson at all, tom erikson is a wrestelr who did mma and couldnt kick worth sh!T. he wasnt even a decent striker in mma. that example just shows shannon briggs plowing through a mediocre striker who really brought none of the abilities that give kickboxers a general advantage vs boxers in kickboxing matches.

ya, of course someone throwing kicks at a boxer doesnt mean the boxer cant beat them, thats pretty basic stuff that really goes without saying.. im sure floyd could beat a number of grapplers in kickboxing even if they tried kicking him

Lily was saying that a high level boxer beats a low lever kick boxer.... just as a high level kick boxer/thai boxer would easily beat a low level boxer. Two fighters from different disciplines at the same level presents a different story.

The video I posted shows a high level boxer vs someone with a low level of kicking ability. No one is suggesting Erickson has good kicking ability.

Erickson was a top class wrestler but not very good when it came to stand up but still had far more training in kicks and kicking ability than Briggs, having been around the MMA scene for many years.

tom erikson wasnt even a career kickboxer. he was an mma fighter with a wreslting background brought over for some sideshow kickboxing matches. lily specifically mentioned kickboxers, and he refereed specifically to mayweather f@cking up nasukawa ("this guy"), who is miles beyond erikson in striking and kicking in particular. that is a statment about mayweather battering an elite, top level kickboxer who has excellent kicks

of course some grappler whose only done an absolute minimal amount of training or fighting with kicks might be a different scenario. its completely obvious that not just anyone will beat a boxer simply by throwing kicks, it doesnt even need pointing out

According to the revised proposal, which was presented to him after the press conference was held, Mayweather was expected to face Nakusawa in a "non-record fight" with the following stipulations:

- Standing bout rules (no kicking or wrestling)

- fought in a ring

- 3 x 3 minute rounds

- Weight limit 145lbs (65.7kg)

- It is scheduled for 11 PM Tokyo time which is 10 AM in NY the morning of New Year’s Eve

- Rizin is open to discussing the start time to accommodate the US Rights Holder

Clearly the proposal confirms Mayweather's understanding that he would be participating in what amounts to a 3-round boxing exhibition. However, it also greatly expands on what he was originally told the scope of the event would be. Evidently, without his consent, the organizers decided to use Mayweather's name as an opportunity to secure long-term U.S. broadcast rights for future events. Not only was Rizin seeking a U.S. distribution model that guaranteed them a 50/50 split of the gross revenue for that single event, but they were also requesting to "bundle this deal" with an offer that included a multi-year contract to distribute their MMA content. Furthermore, in an attempt to secure that deal, they guaranteed that Mayweather would participate in "two more non-recorded fights within the year," something we're told that Mayweather most certainly did not agree to.

Judging from Mayweather's lengthy Instagram post, it's clear that these "revisions" were not part of the original concept that was pitched to him. Although we have yet to speak to Mayweather directly, we're guessing that the misleading information about additional "non-record fights" and the attempt to use his name to secure a separate multi-year deal was the motivating factor in his decision not to participate in what was supposed to be a one-off exhibition bout.

pablothunder wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 14:17

tobyh5 wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 04:33

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 03:33
BTW... Is Mayweather THAT financially unstable that you can actually buy him for private exhibition bouts? :

That jumped out at me too, that he would be flying around the world to piss around in exhibition shite in front of some coked up business people. Guy has not self pride at all

Stevie Wonder isn't short of a bob or two but he can be hired for private gigs.
I know that because I was paid to prep the house prior to his arrival. That was in Scotland a few years ago. There weren't more than 10 people there.
Throw enough money at someone for an easy gig and they'll most likely take it if all the boxes are ticked without question.

To be fair though, if Stevie Wonder could see then there’s no amount of money he’d accept to visit Scotland.

PredatorHayds wrote: ↑09 Nov 2018, 18:29

pablothunder wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 14:17

tobyh5 wrote: ↑08 Nov 2018, 04:33

That jumped out at me too, that he would be flying around the world to piss around in exhibition shite in front of some coked up business people. Guy has not self pride at all

Stevie Wonder isn't short of a bob or two but he can be hired for private gigs.
I know that because I was paid to prep the house prior to his arrival. That was in Scotland a few years ago. There weren't more than 10 people there.
Throw enough money at someone for an easy gig and they'll most likely take it if all the boxes are ticked without question.

To be fair though, if Stevie Wonder could see then there’s no amount of money he’d accept to visit Scotland.

I believe this is back in the works.