BoxRec

Crawford would slaughter him. Not only is he bigger, he's better too.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:50 Crawford would slaughter him. Not only is he bigger, he's better too.

Not sure he's better than Loma, but even Loma said 135 was his limit, if I'm not mistaken. We'll never see it.

I don't think loma does anything better than bud.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:54 I don't think loma does anything better than bud.

You said Crawford was BETTER and BIGGER, I'm saying he's not better than Loma (not sure Loma is better than Crawford). Two different fighters. Tough to compare skillsets, IMHO.

lol craw vs loma was obviously never going to happen

i agree craws better, i think mainly he has more power p4p and also adapts his work rate to the situation better imo. also just seems to have more of that killer finishing instinct.

i think for things like acurracy, footwork, overall defense, etc though lomas at least comparable. craw just seems to have some more phsyicality and raw fighter in him imo to compliment his skill. i dont see him getting bullied in the way i can see someone doing to loma (salido already did but tbf that was a 1 fight loma)

jamamb wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:58 lol craw vs loma was obviously never going to happen

i agree craws better, i think mainly he has more power p4p and also adapts his work rate to the situation better imo. also just seems to have more of that killer finishing instinct.

i think for things like acurracy, footwork, overall defense, etc though lomas at least comparable. craw just seems to have some more phsyicality and raw fighter in him imo to compliment his skill. i dont see him getting bullied in the way i can see someone doing to loma (salido already did but tbf that was a 1 fight loma)

Solid points. You may have swayed me, but in pure ring movement and adopting to what the opponent gives him, I'll take Loma. Power and more aggressive fighting style, I'll take Crawford.

ya. specifically in terms of pivots and side steps in close-mid range , loma is the best in the sport imo.

Different styles. Not really comparable. One does something better than the other and it's splitting hairs either way.

Crawford may or may not be better but his resume is very weak, I think his best wins are in order Postol, undersized Gamboa, and Dulorme, very weak resume...

oogiebe wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:57

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:54 I don't think loma does anything better than bud.

You said Crawford was BETTER and BIGGER, I'm saying he's not better than Loma (not sure Loma is better than Crawford). Two different fighters. Tough to compare skillsets, IMHO.

I understand what I said.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 23:04

oogiebe wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:57

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:54 I don't think loma does anything better than bud.

You said Crawford was BETTER and BIGGER, I'm saying he's not better than Loma (not sure Loma is better than Crawford). Two different fighters. Tough to compare skillsets, IMHO.

I understand what I said.

I'm elated to know that, thank you.

victor-romeo wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 21:26 Crawford may or may not be better but his resume is very weak, I think his best wins are in order Postol, undersized Gamboa, and Dulorme, very weak resume...

That's a very weak statement. His resume is as good as lomas. Neither is spectacular. Loma has the best guy either faced and he lost to him. Past that it's splitting hairs. Vasily has an impressive resume for his amount of fights. Historically it's "very weak" too.

Gary Russell jr is way better than anything on Crawfords resume and thats just the crown jewel,

Is he way better? How weak is his resume?

It truly sucks that neither have an easy way to big fights, partly due to Arum and partly due to the other semi high profile fighters wanting nothing to do with Crawford nor Lomachenko. 147 is an absolute joke - never have I seen such a group being such absolute pansies in fighting frequency or competition. Absolutely loathe the division. Haven't watched any of their once a year crap fights.

Breaducce wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 02:43 Loma's a great fighter but I'm just not buying this best thing since slice bread narrative that is perpetuated by a lot of Loma's fans and the boxing media. The guy very skilled and no one disputes that but he continues to be sold as the second coming when he obviously is not. We have seen better fighters then him come and go. If people would push the breaks on these overblown expectations and narratives and just let the guy fight it would be the best thing that will ever happen for his career.

I think he IS the best thing since sliced bread in terms of skills movement, tactics - the mastery of the techniques of boxing. All that smoke we blow up his arse "you could enjoy watching just his feet" etc - that's all fair.
BUT
There is a but of course - he's clearly lacking size and physicality at LW.

Let's be fair too - Pedraza is a 2 weight alphabet champ, he fought the fight of his life, was tactically superb, (surely he wrote the blueprint on how to beat Loma) and yet he still lost widely and was lucky to last the distance.

Breaducce wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 03:50

victor-romeo wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 02:54

Breaducce wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 02:43 Loma's a great fighter but I'm just not buying this best thing since slice bread narrative that is perpetuated by a lot of Loma's fans and the boxing media. The guy very skilled and no one disputes that but he continues to be sold as the second coming when he obviously is not. We have seen better fighters then him come and go. If people would push the breaks on these overblown expectations and narratives and just let the guy fight it would be the best thing that will ever happen for his career.

Loma is a 2 time olympic gold medalist , 3 weight division champion and boxing innovator, who coming off shoulder surgery not fighting at his best weight beat a larger fighter by wide score ..Loma is one of the better fighters I have ever seen..The thing with Loma is he had the long amateur career is already 30 years old has about 2 good years in him. So he enjoy him while he lasts you won't see a special fighter like this again ..in a long while

I was referring to his pro career and in that regard he is not meeting this once ever special fighter narrative that is being projected on him. He has yet to fight a great fighter at or above his weight class and has lost to Salido so how can he be one of the better fighters you have ever seen at this point in his career? I don't control his career trajectory I just comment on what I see which is a fighter that is greatly skilled but still vastly overrated by so many fans and media members. And I've seen better boxers then Loma come and go and I have no doubt that this will continue much sooner then you anticipate. I mean I would argue that Terrence Crawford is more of a special fighter the Loma.

Lol what? gary Russell. Rigonduex is an all time great

could loma be permanently impacted?

Nah.

Best Coast wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:48

TheGingerBomber wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 11:31 Pedraza’s ability and gameplan made Loma look tentative. Credit to him, his feints and switching made for an interesting fight for most of it.

You make a good point about Loma having trouble with Pedraza's switching from orthodox to southpaw. I think Loma definitely had trouble adjusting to that.

There used to be talk of Loma eventually moving up in weight to face Terence Crawford. That's clearly not a legit option now that Terence has gone up to 147 but even ignoring TC's height and reach advantage, Crawford's ability to seamlessly transition back and forth between righty and lefty would make him too much for Loma to handle, even at 140.

If they were identical in dimensions and weight, it would make for an amazing bout. It’s crazy that three of the top five fighters currently, are occupying divisions above and below each other, just pounds away. Mikey Garcia could have made Crawford or Loma fights, but instead jumps in with a monster welterweight.

danconnollyeire wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 08:52

Breaducce wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 03:50

victor-romeo wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 02:54

Loma is a 2 time olympic gold medalist , 3 weight division champion and boxing innovator, who coming off shoulder surgery not fighting at his best weight beat a larger fighter by wide score ..Loma is one of the better fighters I have ever seen..The thing with Loma is he had the long amateur career is already 30 years old has about 2 good years in him. So he enjoy him while he lasts you won't see a special fighter like this again ..in a long while

I was referring to his pro career and in that regard he is not meeting this once ever special fighter narrative that is being projected on him. He has yet to fight a great fighter at or above his weight class and has lost to Salido so how can he be one of the better fighters you have ever seen at this point in his career? I don't control his career trajectory I just comment on what I see which is a fighter that is greatly skilled but still vastly overrated by so many fans and media members. And I've seen better boxers then Loma come and go and I have no doubt that this will continue much sooner then you anticipate. I mean I would argue that Terrence Crawford is more of a special fighter the Loma.

Lol what? gary Russell. Rigonduex is an all time great

Beating a 38 year old Rigondeux going up to weight divisions and Gary Russel Jr which is a good win does not justify the level of praise the Loma receives. Again, I'm not disputing that Loma is a great fighter but better fighters have existed and currently one does now, and when a top 147 pounder steps up to fight T.C. he will prove it. If and when Loma fights Mikey Garcia we will learn exactly who and what he is.

Breaducce wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 20:52

Beating a 38 year old Rigondeux going up to weight divisions and Gary Russel Jr which is a good win does not justify the level of praise the Loma receives. Again, I'm not disputing that Loma is a great fighter but better fighters have existed and currently one does now, and when a top 147 pounder steps up to fight T.C. he will prove it. If and when Loma fights Mikey Garcia we will learn exactly who and what he is.

Lomachenko's resume is currently miles better than Crawford's. Crawford may well prove to be the superior talent in time, but Loma has much higher quality wins at the moment, and it's not even close.

Crawford's best win is still arguably Gamboa back in 2014. Lomachenko keeps raising the bar, Crawford has just kinda stagnated.

This is not meant to be insulting as I'm a big fan of both fighters, but facts is facts.

skanksta wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 06:38

Breaducce wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 02:43 Loma's a great fighter but I'm just not buying this best thing since slice bread narrative that is perpetuated by a lot of Loma's fans and the boxing media. The guy very skilled and no one disputes that but he continues to be sold as the second coming when he obviously is not. We have seen better fighters then him come and go. If people would push the breaks on these overblown expectations and narratives and just let the guy fight it would be the best thing that will ever happen for his career.

I think he IS the best thing since sliced bread in terms of skills movement, tactics - the mastery of the techniques of boxing. All that smoke we blow up his arse "you could enjoy watching just his feet" etc - that's all fair.
BUT
There is a but of course - he's clearly lacking size and physicality at LW.

Let's be fair too - Pedraza is a 2 weight alphabet champ, he fought the fight of his life, was tactically superb, (surely he wrote the blueprint on how to beat Loma) and yet he still lost widely and was lucky to last the distance.

I disagree that he is the best thing since sliced bread. I agree that his movement and skills are impressive but are people that removed from boxers like say Andre Ward who was technically brilliant and proved his greatness by defeating virtually every elite fighter in his weight class.

Loma's skills are impressive but I just don't think heaping this out worldly praise on him makes sense given that he still has work to do.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 21:44

Breaducce wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 20:52

Beating a 38 year old Rigondeux going up to weight divisions and Gary Russel Jr which is a good win does not justify the level of praise the Loma receives. Again, I'm not disputing that Loma is a great fighter but better fighters have existed and currently one does now, and when a top 147 pounder steps up to fight T.C. he will prove it. If and when Loma fights Mikey Garcia we will learn exactly who and what he is.

Lomachenko's resume is currently miles better than Crawford's. Crawford may well prove to be the superior talent in time, but Loma has much higher quality wins at the moment, and it's not even close.

Crawford's best win is still arguably Gamboa back in 2014. Lomachenko keeps raising the bar, Crawford has just kinda stagnated.

This is not meant to be insulting as I'm a big fan of both fighters, but facts is facts.

I disagree with your first point as I think Loma's resume is not miles better then Crawfords. I agree that he's fought some better comp, but also has the L to Salido which counts as well. And Crawford's is still undefeated and his undisputed 140 run counts although the comp was a bit suspect. Also, the guy that Loma is looking to for his legacy defining fight Crawford has already defeated in the Amateurs.

Also, Pedraza is a skilled fighter but was a step down from LInares , so I would not consider that raising the bar.

I agreed that Crawford has work to do to prove his standing but, the difference is I also feel the same way about Loma.

Crawford is going have some difficulty getting the fights he needs because all the elites at 147 are Haymon fighters but the fights will eventually happen as he is a champion at the weight. And Loma will eventually continue to step up his comp, and will fight Mikey and then we will see where the chips fall. I'm also a big fan of both fighters, but if I were to bet I'm going to push my chips in behind Crawford for who I think is left in higher standing between the two in terms of Legacy.

No insult taken, this is just good boxing talk which I always welcome.

TheGingerBomber wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 15:46

Best Coast wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 20:48

TheGingerBomber wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 11:31 Pedraza’s ability and gameplan made Loma look tentative. Credit to him, his feints and switching made for an interesting fight for most of it.

You make a good point about Loma having trouble with Pedraza's switching from orthodox to southpaw. I think Loma definitely had trouble adjusting to that.

There used to be talk of Loma eventually moving up in weight to face Terence Crawford. That's clearly not a legit option now that Terence has gone up to 147 but even ignoring TC's height and reach advantage, Crawford's ability to seamlessly transition back and forth between righty and lefty would make him too much for Loma to handle, even at 140.

If they were identical in dimensions and weight, it would make for an amazing bout. It’s crazy that three of the top five fighters currently, are occupying divisions above and below each other, just pounds away. Mikey Garcia could have made Crawford or Loma fights, but instead jumps in with a monster welterweight.

Looked to me like Pedraza (who I expected Loma to KO for sure)hung in there pretty well overall. I think he may have gained some respect with some bodyshots he was landing here and there. Loma isn't fighting amateurs anymore. These fights are more grueling if for nothing else they are longer and they will take their toll. Loma's style relies on all out physical discharge and it's difficult to maintain that if you are getting hit. By how he looked at the end of the fight he at least took a bit of leather and Pedraza doesn't have the heaviest gloves in the business.. I agree with the poster who said "enjoy watching him while you can, he may not last long"

grueling? really? thats like saying crawford had a gruelling fight vs benavidez

honestly i thought pedraza landed next to nothing of note, loma just marks up, he did in his pro debut too, vs marriaga etc, fights where he wasnt exactly taking loads

pedraxa was hardly a grueling fight for him and he won a landslide, pedraza accuracy was geting into single digit territory and he hand almost no memorable offense. i just wanted loma to go for it more but lets be honest he was handily outboxing pedraza and never really had to take a big assault