Page 2 of 3
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 05:30
by leejonesjnr
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:27
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:25
RKY wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 23:49
The winner will be the biggest draw in the sport, period.
Nah. That will still be Alvarez or Joshua.
Nah
What makes you think that two men who don't sell massive numbers boxing a draw and then a whatever happens in the rematch against one another elevates them to the premier attraction in the sport?
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 05:59
by MF DOOM
I've been told it was said in jest. Wilder-Fury II should and probably will happen in America. It is too big to take place in the UK.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 06:06
by bluenoseshf
Boxing fans are completely insane.......
How is Frank suddenly the hero of British boxing?
This is the guy who has folded multiple companies to avoid paying boxers. Done Burns, Calzaghe and Hatton out of millions each.
Took many of his fighters on WBO reigns of terror and put on some of the worst tv shows during the 2000s.
Suddenly Hearn is the villain because he wears nice suits and like to have "bants" on video with Kugan and want to get Joshua a fair deal vs Wilder?
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 07:24
by Steveh583
bluenoseshf wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 06:06
Boxing fans are completely insane.......
How is Frank suddenly the hero of British boxing?
This is the guy who has folded multiple companies to avoid paying boxers. Done Burns, Calzaghe and Hatton out of millions each.
Took many of his fighters on WBO reigns of terror and put on some of the worst tv shows during the 2000s.
Suddenly Hearn is the villain because he wears nice suits and like to have "bants" on video with Kugan and want to get Joshua a fair deal vs Wilder?
who called frank a hero here exactly?
Eddies quality of output appears to have dropped a little (maybe he is spreading himself a little thin lately, that Brook card wasnt anything to write home about ) and he does have a portion of his fanbase that think he's some sort of wisecracking saviour of the sport. Putting whyte vs Del Boy on the same night is a shitty move for the fans. And as for getting Joshua a fair deal.....that's nonsense. History shows he doesn't want AJ anywhere near wilder.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 07:49
by banjo
The AJ fight, the casual fans prefer the glamour of Hearns glitzy promotions and singing along to Neil Diamond.
No matter how much better the contest between Fury and Wilder is over whoever AJ would fight that night Old Trafford is a pointless venue to host it, neither Fury or Wilder draw the crowds like AJ does to even pay for the stadium hire, the Arena would be a far better choice.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 08:24
by skanksta
Stuarty wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 20:28
If uncle Fwank stuck the Fury/Wilder rematch at Old Trafford on the same date as AJ @ Wembley how would you see it going?
I watched a podcast recently and apparently there's a rumour doing the rounds that Fwanks gonna do that! Can't see it personally but it made me think....
I think the biggest factor is SKY and their platform.
EVERYONE has Sky or a pub/friend that does. SS News is on free everywhere - pubs, sports clubs, I even saw it this morning on about 7 tellys in Tesco's .
THAT'S what makes AJ popular. Yes -he's a handsome, marketable, young athlete - and people like a winner. He's not exactly box-office poison. He's more fun to watch than Fury's 'purist' style too.
But I dunno... his banal faux-humble, media-trained, anodyne schtick is no match for Fury's 'warts and all' PERSONALITY. He says some silly things, some Un-PC things, but he's so easy to forgive, (or like even more - if you hate gays and liberals as many do).
People love Fury, love-to-hate Fury and want to join him in sing-songs after fights.
If he had the Sky Machine behind him he'd be
twice the draw AJ is.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 08:38
by MF DOOM
Sky would love to have Fury on their books.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 08:41
by danconnollyeire
AJ vs Sprott 2 would sell more than Wilder/Fury at this moment in time, they just don't do the numbers
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 08:48
by Ricky
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:30
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:27
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:25
Nah. That will still be Alvarez or Joshua.
Nah
What makes you think that two men who don't sell massive numbers boxing a draw and then a whatever happens in the rematch against one another elevates them to the premier attraction in the sport?
Fury is already as famous as AJ in the UK. The first fight has helped Wilders fame in the US - he even appeared on James Cordon show a couple of days after the fight. The rematch will be Vegas and it will be twice as big... with a Hatton-esque british invasion.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 08:54
by banjo
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 08:48
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:30
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:27
Nah
What makes you think that two men who don't sell massive numbers boxing a draw and then a whatever happens in the rematch against one another elevates them to the premier attraction in the sport?
Fury is already as famous as AJ in the UK. The first fight has helped Wilders fame in the US -
he even appeared on James Cordon show a couple of days after the fight. The rematch will be Vegas and it will be twice as big... with a Hatton-esque british invasion.
Poor bloke
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 09:09
by ironbeard
According to Wilder on Rogan, the rematch is pretty much set due to Fury and Wilder both wanting it and the fact that they both largely control their own directions. They have been communicating directly and they are both already promoting it.
Wilder suggested that he has been promoting it since a few days after the fight. He claims that “you are going to see a whole new Deontay.”
Very insightful podcast. Reveals how his team and mind works. Becomes obvious why he cannot work with top trainers. Makes no sense and good sense in the course of about three sentences about it.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 09:14
by Coco
bluenoseshf wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 06:06
Boxing fans are completely insane.......
How is Frank suddenly the hero of British boxing?
This is the guy who has folded multiple companies to avoid paying boxers. Done Burns, Calzaghe and Hatton out of millions each.
Took many of his fighters on WBO reigns of terror and put on some of the worst tv shows during the 2000s.
Suddenly Hearn is the villain because he wears nice suits and like to have "bants" on video with Kugan and want to get Joshua a fair deal vs Wilder?
For me Sky is the problem, FW acted in the same way as Eddie, and Barry did the same with Eubank.
There business model is all about keeping winning records and making money while giving the customer a poor service.
FW has gone back to basics because he had too.
Again Adam Smith is the root of all evil!
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 09:25
by samwbr
banjo wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 07:49
The AJ fight, the casual fans prefer the glamour of Hearns glitzy promotions and singing along to Neil Diamond.
No matter how much better the contest between Fury and Wilder is over whoever AJ would fight that night Old Trafford is a pointless venue to host it, neither Fury or Wilder draw the crowds like AJ does to even pay for the stadium hire, the Arena would be a far better choice.
Sweet Caroline was blasting out at the Staples Centre btw
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 09:26
by banjo
Coco wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 09:14
bluenoseshf wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 06:06
Boxing fans are completely insane.......
How is Frank suddenly the hero of British boxing?
This is the guy who has folded multiple companies to avoid paying boxers. Done Burns, Calzaghe and Hatton out of millions each.
Took many of his fighters on WBO reigns of terror and put on some of the worst tv shows during the 2000s.
Suddenly Hearn is the villain because he wears nice suits and like to have "bants" on video with Kugan and want to get Joshua a fair deal vs Wilder?
For me Sky is the problem, FW acted in the same way as Eddie, and Barry did the same with Eubank.
There business model is all about keeping winning records and making money while giving the customer a poor service.
FW has gone back to basics because he had too.
Again Adam Smith is the root of all evil!
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 09:27
by banjo
samwbr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 09:25
banjo wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 07:49
The AJ fight, the casual fans prefer the glamour of Hearns glitzy promotions and singing along to Neil Diamond.
No matter how much better the contest between Fury and Wilder is over whoever AJ would fight that night Old Trafford is a pointless venue to host it, neither Fury or Wilder draw the crowds like AJ does to even pay for the stadium hire, the Arena would be a far better choice.
Sweet Caroline was blasting out at the Staples Centre btw
Must have caught on
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 11:01
by leejonesjnr
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 08:48
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:30
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:27
Nah
What makes you think that two men who don't sell massive numbers boxing a draw and then a whatever happens in the rematch against one another elevates them to the premier attraction in the sport?
Fury is already as famous as AJ in the UK. The first fight has helped Wilders fame in the US - he even appeared on James Cordon show a couple of days after the fight. The rematch will be Vegas and it will be twice as big... with a Hatton-esque british invasion.
Twice as big still leaves them way behind Alvarez and Joshua.
Fame and popularity are not the same thing.
There seems to be a lot of interest in Tyson Fury but so far it just hasn’t translated into massive sales.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 11:16
by Ricky
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 11:01
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 08:48
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:30
What makes you think that two men who don't sell massive numbers boxing a draw and then a whatever happens in the rematch against one another elevates them to the premier attraction in the sport?
Fury is already as famous as AJ in the UK. The first fight has helped Wilders fame in the US - he even appeared on James Cordon show a couple of days after the fight. The rematch will be Vegas and it will be twice as big... with a Hatton-esque british invasion.
Twice as big still leaves them way behind Alvarez and Joshua.
How does it? If this rematch goes ahead in Vegas it will be the biggest heavyweight event in America since... Tyson vs Lewis maybe?
You have the lineal heavyweight champion, unbeaten, coming back from the ashes of depression, and rose from the ashes in 1 of the most dramatic 12th rounds in heavyweight history and probably the best self-promoter in sports right now apart from Conor MAcgregor..., vs the WBC champion, and American just starting to get some mainstream fame, who's knocked out every opponent he's faced until Fury.
Is AJ even known in America? I get he's popular with the Sweet Caroline lads & Sky subscribed football fans, but even with them his act is wearing thin. I've even began to notice the casuals who know F all about boxing start to claim that Fury would outbox AJ.
He's not as big as Hearn would like you to think he is; how much can you trust a guy that claims Parker vs Whyte sold 300k in England alone?
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 11:55
by leejonesjnr
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 11:16
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 11:01
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 08:48
Fury is already as famous as AJ in the UK. The first fight has helped Wilders fame in the US - he even appeared on James Cordon show a couple of days after the fight. The rematch will be Vegas and it will be twice as big... with a Hatton-esque british invasion.
Twice as big still leaves them way behind Alvarez and Joshua.
How does it? If this rematch goes ahead in Vegas it will be the biggest heavyweight event in America since... Tyson vs Lewis maybe?
You have the lineal heavyweight champion, unbeaten, coming back from the ashes of depression, and rose from the ashes in 1 of the most dramatic 12th rounds in heavyweight history and probably the best self-promoter in sports right now apart from Conor MAcgregor..., vs the WBC champion, and American just starting to get some mainstream fame, who's knocked out every opponent he's faced until Fury.
Is AJ even known in America? I get he's popular with the Sweet Caroline lads & Sky subscribed football fans, but even with them his act is wearing thin. I've even began to notice the casuals who know F all about boxing start to claim that Fury would outbox AJ.
He's not as big as Hearn would like you to think he is; how much can you trust a guy that claims Parker vs Whyte sold 300k in England alone?
Well it’s simple really, add the number of tickets sold to the PPV buys for Wilder v Fury and double it.
Add the number of tickets sold to the PPV buys for Alvarez v Golovkin.
Which number is larger?
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 12:14
by Pukka Cheese
Would love the fight to be at Old Trafford but no way that happens April 13th.
Surely Wilder Vs Fury 2 is heading to Vegas anyway?
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 12:18
by tobyh5
It was clearly a wind up by Fwank, why are people discussing a clear piss take ?
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 12:22
by ewenhay
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 11:01
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 08:48
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 05:30
What makes you think that two men who don't sell massive numbers boxing a draw and then a whatever happens in the rematch against one another elevates them to the premier attraction in the sport?
Fury is already as famous as AJ in the UK. The first fight has helped Wilders fame in the US - he even appeared on James Cordon show a couple of days after the fight. The rematch will be Vegas and it will be twice as big... with a Hatton-esque british invasion.
Twice as big still leaves them way behind Alvarez and Joshua.
Fame and popularity are not the same thing.
There seems to be a lot of interest in Tyson Fury but so far it just hasn’t translated into massive sales.
Things change quickly in boxing. Casuals are also notoriously fickle.
Wilder v Fury 2 can definitely bring in more revenue than Joshua v Whyte 2.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 12:45
by oogiebe
Two out of the three best HW's in the world, or one of the three v. perhaps the 8th or 10th best...with such a dropoff to number 4 in the world, I'd have to watch Wilder/Fury, rather than some AJ walkover. Put AJ v. Ortiz and I have to think about it, theoretically.
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 12:57
by Nightmare Roy
Stuarty wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 21:27
Nightmare Roy wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 21:08
Stupid move, just taking money out of the pockets of all the fighters involved.
Hearn has just done it to Frampton and allegedly though so fairs fair? Usually I wouldn't like to see this type of thing but because Hearn has tried to stick it to allegedly and Frampton twice now I'd like to see him get his comeuppance.
Two promoters having a pissing war is bad for the fighters though, yeah Hearn has started it but Wazzer should rise above it, also if it was down to buying one fight, sadly AJ would win by a landslide IMO. My aunties even know who he is
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 13:14
by Stuarty
Nightmare Roy wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:57
Stuarty wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 21:27
Nightmare Roy wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 21:08
Stupid move, just taking money out of the pockets of all the fighters involved.
Hearn has just done it to Frampton and allegedly though so fairs fair? Usually I wouldn't like to see this type of thing but because Hearn has tried to stick it to allegedly and Frampton twice now I'd like to see him get his comeuppance.
Two promoters having a pissing war is bad for the fighters though, yeah Hearn has started it but Wazzer should rise above it, also if it was down to buying one fight, sadly AJ would win by a landslide IMO. My aunties even know who he is
I think Fwank should put Ed over his knee and slipper his rump
Re: Hypothetically....
Posted: 11 Dec 2018, 14:12
by Ricky
ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:22
leejonesjnr wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 11:01
RKY wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 08:48
Fury is already as famous as AJ in the UK. The first fight has helped Wilders fame in the US - he even appeared on James Cordon show a couple of days after the fight. The rematch will be Vegas and it will be twice as big... with a Hatton-esque british invasion.
Twice as big still leaves them way behind Alvarez and Joshua.
Fame and popularity are not the same thing.
There seems to be a lot of interest in Tyson Fury but so far it just hasn’t translated into massive sales.
Things change quickly in boxing. Casuals are also notoriously fickle.
Wilder v Fury 2 can definitely bring in more revenue than Joshua v Whyte 2.
Its not even close.
Fury Wilder 2, according to Bunce, is due to get some serious weight behind it by Showtime.
The first 1 i believe was limited to Americas more dedicated boxing market (figures seem close to the likes of Bradley v JMM for instance).
A rematch is going to expand into the fringes & casual market in America (which we know maxes out at 4m).
AJ vs Whyte 2 is a good fight imo but the footy fans they sell AJ to have already seen it. The uk market is obviously smaller too.