BoxRec

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑08 May 2020, 08:33 The last line sums up your posts pretty well.

IF you think that that was longevity, then we should have another meaning of the word. That doesn't look like longevity to me.

Not the greatest, but a few names
Jemal Hinton, looked like a certain future champion, quit at 22
Leo Randolph. Beat a pretty good beltholder in his 18th fight in 1980, gets KO'd by much more experienced Sergio Palma in his first title defense three months later and retires.

Another one: Aaron "The Hawk" Pryor

From 1976 to 1983, he was sensational. AFTER 1983? Say no to drugs, Aaron!

elmersalsa wrote: ↑08 May 2020, 10:31

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑08 May 2020, 08:33 The last line sums up your posts pretty well.

IF you think that that was longevity, then we should have another meaning of the word. That doesn't look like longevity to me.

When you make a sh*t load of money every time you fight, and are one of Boxing's biggest superstars you're not going to be as active naturally.

That happens now too.

Leonard had a hell of a run up until '82, and there's really nothing to be ashamed of in his latter run.

I'm not sure Terry Norris wouldn't have always been a problem for him, but there's no shame in that either. Terry Norris was pretty damn good.

There's no fighter I can think of that built such a legacy with so few fights as Jim Jeffries. Barely over 20 Professional fights, but he was a HUGE star in his day, and to his credit almost all of those fights were against top guys of the day.

Meldrick Taylor

elmersalsa wrote: ↑07 May 2020, 16:59 Sugar Ray after 1982:
1983: no fights. Understandable, retina problems.

1984: Came back one fight, Kevin Howard dropped him. Sugar Ray "wins" by TKO. Strictly garbage! Strictly politics! HE retires, saying he doesn't have it anymore.

1985: 0 fights

1986: 0 fights

1987: 1 fight. His best fight, win or lose against Marvelous

1988: 1 fight. Two titles in one night against Donny Lalonde? What a joke!

1989: A "draw" against The Hitman and a snoozer against Manos de Piedra????

1990: 0 fights

1991: 1 fight. Chooses Terry Norris and got smacked around at age 34. BUT, Duran loss should count in his fight at age 33 against Hearns. Oh! Figures!

1992: 0 fights
1993: 0 fights
1994: 0 fights
1995: 0 fights
1996: 0 fights
1997: 1 fight. Got embarrassed by MACHO MAN

IF this is longevity, then maybe we should have another meaning of what we are talking about. ONLY 7 fights after 1982? WHAT a joke! What a circus!

Typical you, contradicting yourself. How was his best fight, your words, in 1987, I thought it was 86, when his longevity of greatness ended in 82?

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 May 2020, 20:17 Greatest? Can't tell that if they fizzled out fast, regardless of what they did.

Not counting deaths like Sal Sanchez, I would have liked to have seen what Baby Joe Mesi would have been like.

Hey by the way Oog. I thought of something as it relates to Joe Mesi, now given what we know now this probably doesn't amount to much, but it's something.

You may remember when he first came onto the scene there was a Ring Magazine covered that heralded him, Dominick Guinn and Audley Harrison as the potential future of the Heavyweight division.

Now how far he would or wouldn't have gone aside, I do believe he would've beaten Guinn and Harrison if given the chance. For what that's worth.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑09 May 2020, 16:28

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 May 2020, 20:17 Greatest? Can't tell that if they fizzled out fast, regardless of what they did.

Not counting deaths like Sal Sanchez, I would have liked to have seen what Baby Joe Mesi would have been like.

Hey by the way Oog. I thought of something as it relates to Joe Mesi, now given what we know now this probably doesn't amount to much, but it's something.

You may remember when he first came onto the scene there was a Ring Magazine covered that heralded him, Dominick Guinn and Audley Harrison as the potential future of the Heavyweight division.

Now how far he would or wouldn't have gone aside, I do believe he would've beaten Guinn and Harrison if given the chance. For what that's worth.

I jus t can't figure if he got broken or exposed in the Jirov fight. (I think the latter) Monte def made him look bad, but Monte was a level above at the time IMHO. He probably would have beaten Guinn, def would've beaten Audley. Just curious about what might have been. Not having sleepless nights about Baby Joe.

oogiebe wrote: ↑09 May 2020, 16:52

gilgamesh wrote: ↑09 May 2020, 16:28

Hey by the way Oog. I thought of something as it relates to Joe Mesi, now given what we know now this probably doesn't amount to much, but it's something.

You may remember when he first came onto the scene there was a Ring Magazine covered that heralded him, Dominick Guinn and Audley Harrison as the potential future of the Heavyweight division.

Now how far he would or wouldn't have gone aside, I do believe he would've beaten Guinn and Harrison if given the chance. For what that's worth.

I jus t can't figure if he got broken or exposed in the Jirov fight. (I think the latter) Monte def made him look bad, but Monte was a level above at the time IMHO. He probably would have beaten Guinn, def would've beaten Audley. Just curious about what might have been. Not having sleepless nights about Baby Joe.

Barrett beat Guinn right?

giacomino wrote: ↑08 May 2020, 12:44 Not the greatest, but a few names
Jemal Hinton, looked like a certain future champion, quit at 22
Leo Randolph. Beat a pretty good beltholder in his 18th fight in 1980, gets KO'd by much more experienced Sergio Palma in his first title defense three months later and retires.

In all honesty, Leo probably wasn't full into the pro game. He lost to Capo, in addition to turning pro late. Good he got out.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑09 May 2020, 06:32

elmersalsa wrote: ↑07 May 2020, 16:59 Sugar Ray after 1982:
1983: no fights. Understandable, retina problems.

1984: Came back one fight, Kevin Howard dropped him. Sugar Ray "wins" by TKO. Strictly garbage! Strictly politics! HE retires, saying he doesn't have it anymore.

1985: 0 fights

1986: 0 fights

1987: 1 fight. His best fight, win or lose against Marvelous

1988: 1 fight. Two titles in one night against Donny Lalonde? What a joke!

1989: A "draw" against The Hitman and a snoozer against Manos de Piedra????

1990: 0 fights

1991: 1 fight. Chooses Terry Norris and got smacked around at age 34. BUT, Duran loss should count in his fight at age 33 against Hearns. Oh! Figures!

1992: 0 fights
1993: 0 fights
1994: 0 fights
1995: 0 fights
1996: 0 fights
1997: 1 fight. Got embarrassed by MACHO MAN

IF this is longevity, then maybe we should have another meaning of what we are talking about. ONLY 7 fights after 1982? WHAT a joke! What a circus!

Typical you, contradicting yourself. How was his best fight, your words, in 1987, I thought it was 86, when his longevity of greatness ended in 82?

I'm saying after 1982, the best that he did was his win against fading Marvelous. AFTER 1982, his career, with the exception of the MARVELOUS FIGHT, was a complete joke. A circus. YOU could defend that he had longevity all you want to, but the numbers say something else.

What Ali was for Granberry and Il Duce. Sugar Ray Leonard is for you.

Your hate for him is so blatantly obvious it's hard to take any opinion you have on him seriously.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 May 2020, 00:17 What Ali was for Granberry and Il Duce. Sugar Ray Leonard is for you.

Your hate for him is so blatantly obvious it's hard to take any opinion you have on him seriously.

YOU don't even know me, bro. I don't know what the fuuck you're talking about. SUGAR RAY is one of my favorite fighters. I have said in here for years. HE was a phenomenal fighter that I always say that he and DURAN beat SUGAR Ray ROBINSON at welterweight. I have also said that ROBINSON WAS not a great inside fighter. HE was not the most complete fighter in no form of my imagination. I can name at least 10 fighters that were more complete than ROBINSON and LEONARD and DURAN were two of them. I criticize the fighters like I see it. That's my opinion. I have criticized my favorite fighter, DURAN, too. I have said that beyond 147lbs, DURAN didn't had any business to fight in those weight classes. Now, I hate DURAN, too? GTFOH!

YOU can't see the longevity that he had. ONLY 7 fights after 1982 in 15 years of boxing. IF you claim that is longevity, then we should have another meaning of the word. AFTER the year 1982, Leonard's career was a complete circus and a farce joke. It is what it is, bro!

oogiebe wrote: ↑09 May 2020, 16:52

gilgamesh wrote: ↑09 May 2020, 16:28

Hey by the way Oog. I thought of something as it relates to Joe Mesi, now given what we know now this probably doesn't amount to much, but it's something.

You may remember when he first came onto the scene there was a Ring Magazine covered that heralded him, Dominick Guinn and Audley Harrison as the potential future of the Heavyweight division.

Now how far he would or wouldn't have gone aside, I do believe he would've beaten Guinn and Harrison if given the chance. For what that's worth.

I jus t can't figure if he got broken or exposed in the Jirov fight. (I think the latter) Monte def made him look bad, but Monte was a level above at the time IMHO. He probably would have beaten Guinn, def would've beaten Audley. Just curious about what might have been. Not having sleepless nights about Baby Joe.

That generation was... well... Mesi had charisma(got hit by Jirov badly and then it was over for him) and Harrison had some of that also solid amature with a gold-medal but is seen as a hypejob. Guinn... became a journeymen who is still fighting on against up and comers.

Guinn beat Harrison by the way.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑10 May 2020, 08:14

AND why are you laughing, laughy-laughy?

elmersalsa wrote: ↑10 May 2020, 12:28

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑10 May 2020, 08:14

AND why are you laughing, laughy-laughy?

Your such a strange character. You've obviously seen these fighters and love the sport, but your bias towards the ones you like and dislike is unbelievable for a grown man. Leonard didn't cease competing at a great level until Norris.

Leonard was a great fighter, but I think that it hurt him some when he split with Angelo.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑10 May 2020, 12:41

elmersalsa wrote: ↑10 May 2020, 12:28

AND why are you laughing, laughy-laughy?

Your such a strange character. You've obviously seen these fighters and love the sport, but your bias towards the ones you like and dislike is unbelievable for a grown man. Leonard didn't cease competing at a great level until Norris.

The only fighters that I disliked in my lifetime were Oscar De La Hoya and the great Wilfred Benitez.

SUGAR Ray was fighting one fight a year. We're talking about longevity, not level of opposition.

elmersalsa wrote: ↑11 May 2020, 12:22

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑10 May 2020, 12:41

Your such a strange character. You've obviously seen these fighters and love the sport, but your bias towards the ones you like and dislike is unbelievable for a grown man. Leonard didn't cease competing at a great level until Norris.

The only fighters that I disliked in my lifetime were Oscar De La Hoya and the great Wilfred Benitez.

SUGAR Ray was fighting one fight a year. We're talking about longevity, not level of opposition.

You despise Leonard, so do I but it doesn't change how great he was.

Richie Sandoval looked like a Hall of Famer when he beat Jeff Chandler like a redheaded stepchild, but then Gaby Canizales obliterated him. Lloyd Honeyghan looked unstoppable until Marlon Starling laid a beatdown on him. Jimmy Paul appeared to be headed for stardom until the less talented Greg Haugen imposed his will on him and it was downhill for JP after that.

It feels like JuanMa Lopez faded fast. He looked so dominant ... and then the Salido fight.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑11 May 2020, 13:54

elmersalsa wrote: ↑11 May 2020, 12:22

The only fighters that I disliked in my lifetime were Oscar De La Hoya and the great Wilfred Benitez.

SUGAR Ray was fighting one fight a year. We're talking about longevity, not level of opposition.

You despise Leonard, so do I but it doesn't change how great he was.

I have never said that I don't like Sugar Ray. HE is one of my favorite fighters after Ali and Duran.

One thing that we both agree: he was a great fighter. ESPECIALLY, from 1977-82 time frame.
AFTER 1982? Well, his career was a total joke, with the exception of the Marvelous fight.

elmersalsa wrote: ↑12 May 2020, 10:24

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑11 May 2020, 13:54

You despise Leonard, so do I but it doesn't change how great he was.

I have never said that I don't like Sugar Ray. HE is one of my favorite fighters after Ali and Duran.

One thing that we both agree: he was a great fighter. ESPECIALLY, from 1977-82 time frame.
AFTER 1982? Well, his career was a total joke, with the exception of the Marvelous fight.