Crawford's Opponents for 2021?

[jockpunk]

How is spence a bigger star than crawford? He may have the bargaining power due to having more options with PBC, but he is far from being a mainstream star. Not that crawford is, but the fact that he is recognized as p4p #1 has to make crawford more recognizable among casual fans.

All of the non-PBC options are pretty bad. Crawford should just go ahead and make the fight with vergil ortiz. He may not want to take that after what happened to loma, but long term that will be a win that will look very good when assessing his legacy.

Oh, and Danny Garcia is going to beat spence anyway.

[Enlightened-One]

Come on EO, compared to other boxing fights in the last 5 years, Crawfords numbers with HBO and ESPN have been high..

Whilst Spence does have better PPV numbers, you can put that on the opponents he's fought, Spence's Showtime figures have been abysmal.

I want to say that they're both to blame.. I'm not pointing fingers at one person.

Both are to blame, PBC and Top Rank are to blame.

FOX/Showtime/ESPN are to blame.

If any of them wanted the fight, they'd make it..

Then you have purse splits and concessions of course.

Your asking him a loaded question...aka a question he wont answer because it makes him look bad

He's putting the blame solely on Crawford..

Did anybody hold Terence Crawford at gunpoint when he chose to receive paycheque's from Top Rank instead of joining the PBC to face the very best welterweights the division had to offer?

And I'd like to think I accurately described a complex, nuanced situation that objectively describes reality.

Do you feel that what I wrote is somehow inaccurate?

[Jeff_lacy_ko]

Is anybody holding promotional free agent Errol spence at gunpoint forcing him to fight PBC guys and not go after Crawford?

[Enlightened-One]

Is anybody holding promotional free agent Errol spence at gunpoint forcing him to fight PBC guys and not go after Crawford?

I already answered that question a couple of posts ago.

I assume you were trying to be a smart alec, but I guess it backfired.

And seriously, answer this question...

Did anybody hold Terence Crawford at gunpoint when he chose to receive paycheque's from Top Rank instead of joining the PBC to face the very best welterweights the division had to offer?

[Jeff_lacy_ko]

No. Nobody is more critical of Crawford than me for his career trajectory

Facts are facts though. Spence has the power to make the fight if he wants.

[Enlightened-One]

How is spence a bigger star than crawford?

More options. Bigger viewing figures and greater PPV buys.

Even Crawford's advocates concede this point. They've also seen the same evidence and media reports that I have, which endorses this claim.

[Enlightened-One]

No. Nobody is more critical of Crawford than me for his career trajectory

Facts are facts though. Spence has the power to make the fight if he wants.

What did you think of my response to this point though (i.e. my post containing the LouDiBella situation that I submitted earlier in this thread)?

You can’t claim that Spence Jr. can do whatever he damn well pleases without considering the point I raised about the relationship with his business partners.

[Jeff_lacy_ko]

Lou got screwed for sure. He made wilder more money by taking that meeting than al haymon ever did. He cost showtime a lot of money by making them match the dazn money.

But that is irrelevant here- not the same situation at all. Joint ppvs have recently happened. Spence v Crawford is the biggest fight at 147 and the most lucrative. He isnt burning any bridges by doing what is best for himself because the ppv would make money for spence side and espn

If fury v wilder did it this works too. Again spence is his own boss

[Ruthless-RKO]

Crawford 'wants' to fight Spence..

Spence isn't mentioning Crawford.

Instead, Porter has said he is next in line for Spence/Garcia... Then Thurman said he will fight Spence in 2021..

Of course it's easier to make fights with fellow PBC guys..

So realistically, guys like Spence, Charlo's and co should not say they're free to do what they can, because clearly uncle Al, their manager/advisor has the final say.

Just because Crawford signed a contract extension with TR which guarantees him $3m per fight, doesn't mean he can't have a fight with a PBC boxer. He didn't do himself any favours, but surely the fight can still be made.

[Enlightened-One]

Crawford 'wants' to fight Spence..

Crawford needs Spence Jr., because Errol is facing credible opposition, whereas Terence is fighting underwhelming foes.

The American willingly extended his contract with Top Rank despite clearly appreciating the consequences of his actions, knowing full well he'd be excluded from competing against the big-name fighters affiliated with the PBC.

However, that doesn't mean that Crawford doesn't want to have his cake and eat it, because he keeps mentioning Spence Jr's name to the media.

However, didn't Top Rank recently declare their disinterest in staging bouts for Crawford to face Porter and Thurman?

And didn't Bob Arum also claim they were attempting to make a fight between Crawford and Pacquiao, but then subsequently admitted to not even contacting the Filipino's handlers?

And wasn't it only a couple of months ago, when Crawford claimed he'd refuse to compete if he had to take a pay cut, despite acknowledging the finanancial impact the global pandemic was having on the amount of revenue being generated by boxing events?

And hasn't Bob Arum stated on several occasions that Haymon’s boxers are overpaid, with the likes of Thurman and Garcia commanding double the purses that Crawford was previously earning (on his old contract with Top Rank)?

Am I also correct in saying that Top Rank submitted an insincere lowball offer to Danny Garcia's trainer for him to take the Crawford fight, when Bob Arum knew full well that it should have gone through Al Haymon?

Even though Garcia beat Amir Khan, the purse being offered was $2m less than what the Brit received. Basically, Arum offered Garcia the same sum he earned facing Rod Stalka.

People keep forgetting these things! Crawford's fans choose to only dwell on his boasts about his willingness to fight anyone, but when you scratch the surface, you’ll realise that’s not quite true. And the same rule applies to most fighters.

Also, I submitted a post to this forum during January 2018, shortly before Crawford extended his contract with Top Rank, whereby I successfully predicted that if the American remains tied to Bob Arum, he’d never get to fulfil his ambition of facing all of the top dogs in the welterweight division.

And that is precisely what has happened, but people still feel compelled to fully or partially blame the PBC guys for a decision that Crawford made himself.

On a side note, I agree, the PBC guys, despite being self-promoted, shouldn’t claim they’re able to make fights without obtaining permission from their business partners. However, that’s an entirely separate issue.

Like most promoters, they can't make decisions without obtaining agreements from the people they have a working relationship with, which is something I've already discussed at length in this thread.

[Enlightened-One]

Lou got screwed for sure. He made wilder more money by taking that meeting than al haymon ever did. He cost showtime a lot of money by making them match the dazn money.

But that is irrelevant here- not the same situation at all.

The situation is precisely the same. You're suggesting Spence Jr. makes a decision without seeking permission from his business partners. He won't. He can't. And he shouldn't.

There's a reason why so many people remain loyal to Haymon and the PBC.

Joint ppvs have recently happened. Spence v Crawford is the biggest fight at 147 and the most lucrative.

I've already covered this point. It's not a super-fight on a par with Lewis-Tyson or Mayweather-Pacquiao. And Bob Arum, despite being on the proverbial B-side (from a commercial perspective) insists on splitting the pot 50:50.

And I guess you'll expect the A-side to cave into Crawford's demands? Rather than vice versa.

He isnt burning any bridges by doing what is best for himself because the ppv would make money for spence side and espn

Spence Jr. can't make decisions without involving his business partners. And Errol, Haymon, Showtime/Fox etc. aren't going to cave into Bob Arum's 50:50 demands.

If fury v wilder did it this works too. Again spence is his own boss

The Fury-Wilder II PPV event achieved a buy-rate that was slightly more than 750K, but both fighters were guaranteed $25m purses and 50% to 60% of this gross PPV revenue figure would have been retained by the various cable and satellite distributors. Do the maths and draw your own conclusions as to whether that event worked or not.

Anyway, Fury-Wilder III didn't work because it wasn't financially viable, hence the reason why the date kept getting pushed back by ESPN & Fox... to the point the immediate rematch clause has expired and the event has now been cancelled.

And let’s be perfectly honest, back in July I successfully predicted that this would happen.

Once again, Spence Jr. isn't his own boss. Even Bob Arum appreciates this fact. It's a wrong assumption on your part. And I've already discussed in great detail the reason why in an earlier post in this thread.

[jockpunk]

How is spence a bigger star than crawford?

More options. Bigger viewing figures and greater PPV buys.

Even Crawford's advocates concede this point. They've also seen the same evidence and media reports that I have, which endorses this claim.

If they were both fighting the same guy on the same network, who do you think would do better numbers?

[Enlightened-One]

How is spence a bigger star than crawford?

More options. Bigger viewing figures and greater PPV buys.

Even Crawford's advocates concede this point. They've also seen the same evidence and media reports that I have, which endorses this claim.

If they were both fighting the same guy on the same network, who do you think would do better numbers?

I suspect Spence Jr. would still achieve better viewing figures than Crawford if they were both with the same network, because more people have watched his previous bouts.

The thing is, we’ll never know for certain, because Crawford is tied to ESPN for the remainder of his career.

However, Crawford's viewing figures would be much better if his fights were televised by Fox.

[Onetimeonly]

Why would his viewing figures be much better on fox? ESPN just had the highest viewing figures in 3 years since another ESPN bout. Care to dispute those numbers?

[Enlightened-One]

Why would his viewing figures be much better on fox? ESPN just had the highest viewing figures in 3 years since another ESPN bout. Care to dispute those numbers?

The average for the Kownacki-Helenius PBC fight card televised by Fox achieved 1.533m viewers (headlined by fringe contenders that are fairly anonymous names), exceeded the 1.481m average for the ESPN's Crawford-Kavaliasuskas event.

Care to dispute those numbers?

[Onetimeonly]

[Onetimeonly]

The benchmark for viewing figures is on ESPN. Obviously, you're wrong once again.

[Enlightened-One]

The benchmark for viewing figures is on ESPN. Obviously, you're wrong once again.

What on earth are you talking about?

[Onetimeonly]

The benchmark for viewing figures is on ESPN. Obviously, you're wrong once again.

What on earth are you talking about?

Not surprised you're confused yet again.

[Enlightened-One]

The benchmark for viewing figures is on ESPN. Obviously, you're wrong once again.

What on earth are you talking about?

Not surprised you're confused yet again.

Are you suffering from keyboard Tourette's?

You asked me to prove that boxing events on Fox attracted bigger viewing figures than ESPN. And I provided an example.

But you somehow respond with some random meaningless "benchmarl" b*llsh*t that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

[Onetimeonly]

What on earth are you talking about?

Not surprised you're confused yet again.

Are you suffering from keyboard Tourette's?

You asked me to prove that boxing events on Fox attracted bigger viewing figures than ESPN. And I provided an example.

But you somehow respond with some random meaningless "benchmarl" b*llsh*t that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

No, I didn't ask you that at all. You claimed Crawford would achieve better numbers on fox yet ESPN has the highest boxing ratings. Your example is irrelevant and a typical change of direction after you've incorrectly talked out of your ass.

[Enlightened-One]

Not surprised you're confused yet again.

Are you suffering from keyboard Tourette's?

You asked me to prove that boxing events on Fox attracted bigger viewing figures than ESPN. And I provided an example.

But you somehow respond with some random meaningless "benchmarl" b*llsh*t that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

No, I didn't ask you that at all. You claimed Crawford would achieve better numbers on fox yet ESPN has the highest boxing ratings. Your example is irrelevant and a typical change of direction after you've incorrectly talked out of your ass.

Why do you even bother to make claims if you don't perform any research?
https://www.sportico.com/leagues/boxing ... 234613171/

[Onetimeonly]

That doesn't relate to Crawford at all. Anyway, bored, you're so easily schooled my little puppet.

[Enlightened-One]

That doesn't relate to Crawford at all. Anyway, bored, you're so easily schooled my little puppet.

At least I proved you wrong.