maverick23 wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 09:11
It’s sad. Goes to show how important it is to surround yourself with good, knowledgeable people with proven track records.
How the hell do you go £8m over budget, have no records against it (legally they should have invoices etc. to support) and only flag it now?!
I've always thought, and this is a bit of an unsubstantiated personal conspiracy theory, that one of the "dark arts" of business is to secure a big expensive project and embark on it knowing full well it won't come in on budget and on schedule, the trick being that once the project is past the point of no return, the money tap basically has to stay on until the bitter end. The Scottish Holyrood building is an incredible example, the Millenium Dome was another, and more recently HS2.
You can believe the tens/hundreds of millions in overspend (or even billions) is down to incompetence, bad luck and unforseen circumstances, but I don't buy it. I think its a case of getting the snouts into the trough, knowing that money tap has to stay on.
I grew up in Batley, West Yorkshire, and in the 80's the town was awarded a massive "City Challenge" bonanza, tens of millions in investment. It got a new small shopping centre that has only ever housed a few shops. Batley was a xxxx hole back then, and is even worse now. Think it was about £60m which in the 80's was worth even more than now obviously. My mum was into local politics and said it was just a gravy train, and that a lot of "executives" employed in the start up agencies to "spend" this money wisely had come over from an area of Liverpool, where a previous "City Challenge" project had blown even more money. They just followed the money. I don't doubt there was some material investment but Batley remains a small run down town, more or less the same now as it was before that massive investment, and its not like that kitty was its only investment, because it comes under Kirklees, ranked 11th biggest local authority in the country. Towns generally stay the same as the decades pass, but that "City Challenge" thing was meant to turn it all around. Bugger all changed....
Anyway getting back to Amir, it seems he has been taken to the cleaners going by his post. His project manager has some serious questions to answer, it seems incredulous that Amir would literally put in £11m of his own money. I can see him eventually selling out ownership, and being taken to the cleaners in the process.
maverick23 wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 09:11
It’s sad. Goes to show how important it is to surround yourself with good, knowledgeable people with proven track records.
How the hell do you go £8m over budget, have no records against it (legally they should have invoices etc. to support) and only flag it now?!
I've always thought, and this is a bit of an unsubstantiated personal conspiracy theory, that one of the "dark arts" of business is to secure a big expensive project and embark on it knowing full well it won't come in on budget and on schedule, the trick being that once the project is past the point of no return, the money tap basically has to stay on until the bitter end. The Scottish Holyrood building is an incredible example, the Millenium Dome was another, and more recently HS2.
You can believe the tens/hundreds of millions in overspend (or even billions) is down to incompetence, bad luck and unforseen circumstances, but I don't buy it. I think its a case of getting the snouts into the trough, knowing that money tap has to stay on.
I grew up in Batley, West Yorkshire, and in the 80's the town was awarded a massive "City Challenge" bonanza, tens of millions in investment. It got a new small shopping centre that has only ever housed a few shops. Batley was a xxxx hole back then, and is even worse now. Think it was about £60m which in the 80's was worth even more than now obviously. My mum was into local politics and said it was just a gravy train, and that a lot of "executives" employed in the start up agencies to "spend" this money wisely had come over from an area of Liverpool, where a previous "City Challenge" project had blown even more money. They just followed the money. I don't doubt there was some material investment but Batley remains a small run down town, more or less the same now as it was before that massive investment, and its not like that kitty was its only investment, because it comes under Kirklees, ranked 11th biggest local authority in the country. Towns generally stay the same as the decades pass, but that "City Challenge" thing was meant to turn it all around. Bugger all changed....
Anyway getting back to Amir, it seems he has been taken to the cleaners going by his post. His project manager has some serious questions to answer, it seems incredulous that Amir would literally put in £11m of his own money. I can see him eventually selling out ownership, and being taken to the cleaners in the process.
I have no doubt this is generally correct - if you can create an incentive to keep getting paid way beyond budget, why wouldnt you? Reputation? Well, for a big enough reward, most people will happily sell theirs, and in this golden age of disinformation, NDAs, libel tourism, defunct local press and just general noise, a rogue can still do much to overcome or mitigate reputational damage even if their misdeeds do make it into public view.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 26 Oct 2020, 15:59
by margaret thatcher
bizarre
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 26 Oct 2020, 17:30
by Onamastus
I can see the appeal of the idea from his perspective--3m and you have a big magnificent building in which you can host one hugely expensive Asian wedding after another and coin it in. From my perspective... it sounds like a daunting project in which everything that can go wrong will go wrong, as costs spiral out of control.
Poor Amir. I hate to see any boxer get fleeced like this. Could he not just have invested that 3m in existing swish city centre pads and just rent those out for his pension? Smaller profits I suppose, but a good living and a lot less risky than this venture.
maverick23 wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 09:11
It’s sad. Goes to show how important it is to surround yourself with good, knowledgeable people with proven track records.
How the hell do you go £8m over budget, have no records against it (legally they should have invoices etc. to support) and only flag it now?!
I've always thought, and this is a bit of an unsubstantiated personal conspiracy theory, that one of the "dark arts" of business is to secure a big expensive project and embark on it knowing full well it won't come in on budget and on schedule, the trick being that once the project is past the point of no return, the money tap basically has to stay on until the bitter end. The Scottish Holyrood building is an incredible example, the Millenium Dome was another, and more recently HS2.
You can believe the tens/hundreds of millions in overspend (or even billions) is down to incompetence, bad luck and unforseen circumstances, but I don't buy it. I think its a case of getting the snouts into the trough, knowing that money tap has to stay on.
I grew up in Batley, West Yorkshire, and in the 80's the town was awarded a massive "City Challenge" bonanza, tens of millions in investment. It got a new small shopping centre that has only ever housed a few shops. Batley was a xxxx hole back then, and is even worse now. Think it was about £60m which in the 80's was worth even more than now obviously. My mum was into local politics and said it was just a gravy train, and that a lot of "executives" employed in the start up agencies to "spend" this money wisely had come over from an area of Liverpool, where a previous "City Challenge" project had blown even more money. They just followed the money. I don't doubt there was some material investment but Batley remains a small run down town, more or less the same now as it was before that massive investment, and its not like that kitty was its only investment, because it comes under Kirklees, ranked 11th biggest local authority in the country. Towns generally stay the same as the decades pass, but that "City Challenge" thing was meant to turn it all around. Bugger all changed....
Anyway getting back to Amir, it seems he has been taken to the cleaners going by his post. His project manager has some serious questions to answer, it seems incredulous that Amir would literally put in £11m of his own money. I can see him eventually selling out ownership, and being taken to the cleaners in the process.
I’d say you are spot there, happens time and time again with these huge projects. I can’t believe he’s dropped that much money though, sounds like chasing money at the casino. Hopefully he gets some of it back.
maverick23 wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 09:11
It’s sad. Goes to show how important it is to surround yourself with good, knowledgeable people with proven track records.
How the hell do you go £8m over budget, have no records against it (legally they should have invoices etc. to support) and only flag it now?!
I've always thought, and this is a bit of an unsubstantiated personal conspiracy theory, that one of the "dark arts" of business is to secure a big expensive project and embark on it knowing full well it won't come in on budget and on schedule, the trick being that once the project is past the point of no return, the money tap basically has to stay on until the bitter end. The Scottish Holyrood building is an incredible example, the Millenium Dome was another, and more recently HS2.
You can believe the tens/hundreds of millions in overspend (or even billions) is down to incompetence, bad luck and unforseen circumstances, but I don't buy it. I think its a case of getting the snouts into the trough, knowing that money tap has to stay on.
I grew up in Batley, West Yorkshire, and in the 80's the town was awarded a massive "City Challenge" bonanza, tens of millions in investment. It got a new small shopping centre that has only ever housed a few shops. Batley was a xxxx hole back then, and is even worse now. Think it was about £60m which in the 80's was worth even more than now obviously. My mum was into local politics and said it was just a gravy train, and that a lot of "executives" employed in the start up agencies to "spend" this money wisely had come over from an area of Liverpool, where a previous "City Challenge" project had blown even more money. They just followed the money. I don't doubt there was some material investment but Batley remains a small run down town, more or less the same now as it was before that massive investment, and its not like that kitty was its only investment, because it comes under Kirklees, ranked 11th biggest local authority in the country. Towns generally stay the same as the decades pass, but that "City Challenge" thing was meant to turn it all around. Bugger all changed....
Anyway getting back to Amir, it seems he has been taken to the cleaners going by his post. His project manager has some serious questions to answer, it seems incredulous that Amir would literally put in £11m of his own money. I can see him eventually selling out ownership, and being taken to the cleaners in the process.
It happens all the time in business with the major management or IT consultancies. They win a big contract get all their people in and rinse the budget.
The worst is when they do it to public sector ie taxpayer money and services. It gets murkier when you notice that those major consultancies offer plum jobs to former politicians (normally from one specific ‘nasty’ party), so it’s in their interests to outsource our services to their mates to bless them dry. Has been going on for decades.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 03:56
by banjo
Noxy wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 11:49
Khan‘s a philanthropist trying to put a few quid into Bolton. He‘s involved in other projects too. If people have been fleecing him it’s just contemptible. Never mind how switched on he may or may not be. His heart‘s in the right place.
I agree with this, I don't think he's a bad guy at all but he's never been the sharpest knife in the drawer.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 05:13
by tonyevs
I really hope this is not true.
Amir Khan has been one of our best ever boxers from the UK; there have not been many better value British boxers in my lifetime.
Amirs gifts were in the boxing ring - that fighting brain made his millions. I really hope it's fake what has been reported for his sake.
Independently building such a big building does seem a recipe for disaster though; and a potential money pit.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 05:31
by vidal
Working on these types of projects as I do, I find that there are always two sides to every story.
His architect is chartered, so will have pretty robust codes of conduct to adhere to and will carry professional indemnity insurance, so if there is an issue with his performance, then there's certainly recourse.
Similarly, he's engaged a QS and PM, so it seems to be professionally managed.
I suspect the problem is closer to home and his professional team are tired of telling him.
maverick23 wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 09:11
It’s sad. Goes to show how important it is to surround yourself with good, knowledgeable people with proven track records.
How the hell do you go £8m over budget, have no records against it (legally they should have invoices etc. to support) and only flag it now?!
I've always thought, and this is a bit of an unsubstantiated personal conspiracy theory, that one of the "dark arts" of business is to secure a big expensive project and embark on it knowing full well it won't come in on budget and on schedule, the trick being that once the project is past the point of no return, the money tap basically has to stay on until the bitter end. The Scottish Holyrood building is an incredible example, the Millenium Dome was another, and more recently HS2.
You can believe the tens/hundreds of millions in overspend (or even billions) is down to incompetence, bad luck and unforseen circumstances, but I don't buy it. I think its a case of getting the snouts into the trough, knowing that money tap has to stay on.
I grew up in Batley, West Yorkshire, and in the 80's the town was awarded a massive "City Challenge" bonanza, tens of millions in investment. It got a new small shopping centre that has only ever housed a few shops. Batley was a xxxx hole back then, and is even worse now. Think it was about £60m which in the 80's was worth even more than now obviously. My mum was into local politics and said it was just a gravy train, and that a lot of "executives" employed in the start up agencies to "spend" this money wisely had come over from an area of Liverpool, where a previous "City Challenge" project had blown even more money. They just followed the money. I don't doubt there was some material investment but Batley remains a small run down town, more or less the same now as it was before that massive investment, and its not like that kitty was its only investment, because it comes under Kirklees, ranked 11th biggest local authority in the country. Towns generally stay the same as the decades pass, but that "City Challenge" thing was meant to turn it all around. Bugger all changed....
Anyway getting back to Amir, it seems he has been taken to the cleaners going by his post. His project manager has some serious questions to answer, it seems incredulous that Amir would literally put in £11m of his own money. I can see him eventually selling out ownership, and being taken to the cleaners in the process.
The worst is when they do it to public sector ie taxpayer money and services. It gets murkier when you notice that those major consultancies offer plum jobs to former politicians (normally from one specific ‘nasty’ party), so it’s in their interests to outsource our services to their mates to bless them dry. Has been going on for decades.
and this is also why government now lacks those skills in-house, which means they're dependent on very expensive outsourcing to get done things they used to manage fine on their own. If it happened anywhere else we'd call it what it is - massive corruption.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 05:59
by tonyevs
vidal wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 05:31
Working on these types of projects as I do, I find that there are always two sides to every story.
Hope he gets it sorted though.
From my experience there are typically 3 sides to every story: his side; their side .. and then the truth.
A quick Google and it does unfortunately appear true.
Successful sportsmen and women are often assumed to be as intellectually gifted as they are in their chosen sport; unfortunately they rarely are ... schooling and education was often secondary during the early years, and their ego which pushed them to success is often a barrier to acknowledging their cognitive deficiencies in keeping their accumulated wealth. I know a small number of successful sportspeople, both boxers and cyclists, and can honestly say I wouldnt feel confident they were clever enough to manage their dinner money let alone millions of pounds.
Thats why most successful sportspeople are skint within 10 years.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 06:11
by rhino222
For the record. Khans net worth is 30 million USD.
Must be tough being that skint.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 06:21
by Ruthless-RKO
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 06:22
by Ruthless-RKO
original posts
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 06:30
by BigDoofus
A fool and his money are easily parted.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 06:35
by BigDoofus
Tweets that he needs a lawyer. Shortly after he tweets he's already got a legal team.
He's not going to blame Anthony Joshua again is he?
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 06:36
by Noxy
Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 06:22original posts
That’s more like it.
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 06:40
by cormack
I have zero sympathy for idiots like that !
in fact
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 06:41
by cormack
rhino222 wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 06:11
For the record. Khans net worth is 30 million USD.
rhino222 wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 06:11
For the record. Khans net worth is 30 million USD.
Must be tough being that skint.
is that before or after this loss ????
Those things are always a guess/estimate. Often based on hearsay, rumour and blatant lies. Google 50 Cent to see how someone once gets listed as making $150 million and then $8 million on bitcoin based on nothing but him saying so.
£11 million is potentially half his claimed wealth gone ... and he is only 33 yrs old. How much will be left by time he is 43?
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 08:39
by vidal
Looks very impressive:
I struggle to believe that any QS, Project Manager or Architect would give that a budget estimate of £3.2m.
Suspect serious over ambition and scope creep, and he started falling out with people when the bills started landing on the door mat.
£300k for an architect on a £10m plus building....... he's probably not talking to him because he owes a sh*t load more!!
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 10:09
by tonyevs
Yep - thats a very big project to manage. It appears that the Project manager (Ash&Sons) only began operating the previous year .. maybe being so inexperienced they did think it would only cost £3.3 million; and that would have been a very good reason to have not considered them any further to take on the job!
Looking at Ash& Sons company finances I wouldnt be too comforted on getting any money back ... apparently they only have £15k of assets with £6.5k of that in liabilities ... looks a devastating blow for Amir!
Re: Khan's wedding venue woe's......
Posted: 27 Oct 2020, 10:37
by Nightmare Roy
vidal wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 08:39
Looks very impressive:
I struggle to believe that any QS, Project Manager or Architect would give that a budget estimate of £3.2m.
Suspect serious over ambition and scope creep, and he started falling out with people when the bills started landing on the door mat.
£300k for an architect on a £10m plus building....... he's probably not talking to him because he owes a sh*t load more!!
Jesus I had no idea it was so big, it does look very nice though, as you said someone saying something of that size will come in at £3.2m must be clueless. It looks the size of a school and they cost about £30m to make.
and this is also why government now lacks those skills in-house, which means they're dependent on very expensive outsourcing to get done things they used to manage fine on their own. If it happened anywhere else we'd call it what it is - massive corruption.