BoxRec

gregregegg wrote: ↑17 Jun 2022, 18:48 Really wish this wasnt done yet and gorman could of called him out after his fight today. Gorman vs joyce is a fun fight i think, i actualy quite rate gorman although i think joe would be too much. at least there would be somthing coming back at joyce.

True. I like how some promoters do it, put names out there and pull back if public sentiment is extremely negative.

a 'fun' fight i'd like to see would be fury giving joyce a shot while usky gets rid of Josh the 2nd time.

instead we get joyce vs. hammer & fury talking about wwe & 'exhibitions' vs. ngannou and God knows what else, surely 'entertaining' stuff but not the kind of entertainment real boxing fans care for.

While this is dull and a walkover, I guess Joe needs to get back in the ring, and who's really eagerly wanting to step up against him? Joyce is huge risk and no reward for anyone who isn't a journeyman.
Not exactly sure he has legions of fans either to make him a ticket seller and thus give one of those other contenders at least a decent payday for their troubles.

Fightnight Scores wrote: ↑18 Jun 2022, 08:43 While this is dull and a walkover, I guess Joe needs to get back in the ring, and who's really eagerly wanting to step up against him? Joyce is huge risk and no reward for anyone who isn't a journeyman.
Not exactly sure he has legions of fans either to make him a ticket seller and thus give one of those other contenders at least a decent payday for their troubles.

got the reward of being WBO number 1. thats a pretty big reward. also seems to have a good following so theres money in it. but true he is a huge risk, and if you lose, its likely to be a horrible, take years of your life loss. Anyone with any cardio concerns would avoid that fight like the plauge, last place you ever want to be is in round 10, gassed, with big joe gaining his plodding momentum, he just thuds you till either your face gives up, you give up, or you go back to reading at a kindergarten levle.

I’ve just watched a couple of videos of interviews with Fṛḁṅk Wḁṛṛȅṅ and Joseph Parker.

Apparently Fṛḁṅk Wḁṛṛȅṅ had spent a long time negotiating the bout between the Kiwi and Joe Joyce, with Queensberry on the cusp of announcing the fight.

Both sides had agreed terms. And the bout seemed confirmed.

But the day before the scheduled announcement (on the 9th June) Fṛḁṅk Wḁṛṛȅṅ received a text message from Joseph Parker stating that he could no longer go through with the bout, because he’d changed his mind and received a better offer from Sky Sports and BOXXER.

On the 11th June, Joseph Parker’s deal with Sky Sports and BOXXER was officially announced.

This meant that Fṛḁṅk Wḁṛṛȅṅ was forced to find a new opponent for Joe Joyce, which resulted in the announcement of the bout between the ‘Juggernaut’ and Christian Hammer on the 16th June.

Joseph Parker’s decision to sign with Sky Sports and BOXXER has probably scuppered any hope of the Joe Joyce bout materialising, because the ‘Juggernaut’ is aligned with Queensberry and BT Sports.

Therefore, anyone criticising the Joyce-Hammer bout, claiming that Joe needs to be facing someone much better, should really consider revising their opinion.

Fṛḁṅk Wḁṛṛȅṅ only had three weeks to find a late substitute opponent for Joe Joyce's 2nd July fight-date.

One stories always good till another ones told ,, Warren was a bit scathing pf Parker , pulling out , has you said stating it was all finalized money ect ect ,, said he rang Joe and said we had a handshake deal and Parker said he had a better offer , all good until you listen to Parkers version

He said they did have a deal and shook hands on the deal , in fact he said thit was all good until he got the contract which WAS NOT for the deal he shook hands on , in fact he said eacvh time they agred terms Frank would send a contract with different terms , so that null and voided the handshake .

Now with Franks history of suing and taking people to court for ANY INFRACTION of any rule that costs him money i tend to believe Parkers version ,, Parker also says not a problem it can still happen Franks just going to have to renegotiate and do a new deal , and possibly allow it on another platform

coneye wrote: ↑21 Jun 2022, 10:13 One stories always good till another ones told ,, Warren was a bit scathing pf Parker , pulling out , has you said stating it was all finalized money ect ect ,, said he rang Joe and said we had a handshake deal and Parker said he had a better offer , all good until you listen to Parkers version

He said they did have a deal and shook hands on the deal , in fact he said thit was all good until he got the contract which WAS NOT for the deal he shook hands on , in fact he said eacvh time they agred terms Frank would send a contract with different terms , so that null and voided the handshake .

Now with Franks history of suing and taking people to court for ANY INFRACTION of any rule that costs him money i tend to believe Parkers version ,, Parker also says not a problem it can still happen Franks just going to have to renegotiate and do a new deal , and possibly allow it on another platform

Regardless as to who’s side of the story you believe, the upshot of this information is that Queensberry had to find a last-minute substitute opponent at only three weeks’ notice for Joe Joyce.

And to be perfectly honest with you, it’s exceptionally rare to see fighters aligned with BT Sports/Queensberry compete on Sky Sports.

In fact, I can’t think of a single instance, that didn’t resort to the purse bid process.

So I don’t think we’ll see Joyce-Parker anytime soon. It’s much easier to match the Kiwi against someone not aligned with BT Sports/Queensberry.

coneye wrote: ↑21 Jun 2022, 10:13 One stories always good till another ones told ,, Warren was a bit scathing pf Parker , pulling out , has you said stating it was all finalized money ect ect ,, said he rang Joe and said we had a handshake deal and Parker said he had a better offer , all good until you listen to Parkers version

He said they did have a deal and shook hands on the deal , in fact he said thit was all good until he got the contract which WAS NOT for the deal he shook hands on , in fact he said eacvh time they agred terms Frank would send a contract with different terms , so that null and voided the handshake .

Now with Franks history of suing and taking people to court for ANY INFRACTION of any rule that costs him money i tend to believe Parkers version ,, Parker also says not a problem it can still happen Franks just going to have to renegotiate and do a new deal , and possibly allow it on another platform

Didnt fwank send a different contract to the WBC standard one to dillian too enitialy. likes to be a bit sneaky with a contract ol fwanky boy.

Only way this fight happens now is if it gets called for an elliminator or vaccant title.

Enlightened-One wrote: ↑21 Jun 2022, 11:13

coneye wrote: ↑21 Jun 2022, 10:13 One stories always good till another ones told ,, Warren was a bit scathing pf Parker , pulling out , has you said stating it was all finalized money ect ect ,, said he rang Joe and said we had a handshake deal and Parker said he had a better offer , all good until you listen to Parkers version

He said they did have a deal and shook hands on the deal , in fact he said thit was all good until he got the contract which WAS NOT for the deal he shook hands on , in fact he said eacvh time they agred terms Frank would send a contract with different terms , so that null and voided the handshake .

Now with Franks history of suing and taking people to court for ANY INFRACTION of any rule that costs him money i tend to believe Parkers version ,, Parker also says not a problem it can still happen Franks just going to have to renegotiate and do a new deal , and possibly allow it on another platform

Regardless as to who’s side of the story you believe, the upshot of this information is that Queensberry had to find a last-minute substitute opponent at only three weeks’ notice for Joe Joyce.

And to be perfectly honest with you, it’s exceptionally rare to see fighters aligned with BT Sports/Queensberry compete on Sky Sports.

In fact, I can’t think of a single instance, that didn’t resort to the purse bid process.

So I don’t think we’ll see Joyce-Parker anytime soon. It’s much easier to match the Kiwi against someone not aligned with BT Sports/Queensberry.

Too be perfectly honest its not a fight i would tune in and bother watching anyway , Only way this gets my imagination is if i read the next day it was a cracker or the undercard was a really good one , and i doubt any off them things ould happen , so no way would i pay for this one

I've just read that Joe Joyce's handlers are speaking to Dillian Whyte for a potential fight.

I don't know whether this bout will come to fruition or not.

But if it does, despite Joyce being the older man, I reckon he's physically "younger" and fresher than Dillian, because he has far fewer miles on the proverbial clock.

And also, within the last three years, Dillian has lost two from his last four bouts.

He recently looked terrible against Mariusz Wach and was also KO’d by Fury and Povetkin.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m a massive fan of Dillian Whyte. He’s one of the very few heavyweights willing to take risks and keep facing the best.

But I feel that Whyte's recent defeats, coupled with a particularly tough run of back-to-back bouts within the last 5½ years, has resulted in him aging prematurely and already being considered well-past-his-prime.

And if I was Joe Joyce’s trainer, I’d heavily work on throwing uppercuts, because:

• A right uppercut thrown by Oscar Rivas floored Dillian Whyte in their fight.

• Anthony Joshua hurt Dillian Whyte three times during completely different stages of the first round of their bout via two uppercuts and one hookercut.

• AJ then landed a right uppercut to badly hurt Dillian Whyte during the midway point of the second round.

• And of course, it was a right uppercut that AJ threw which KO’d Dillian Whyte in the seventh round of their bout.

• Alexander Povetkin KO’d Dillian Whyte in the fifth round of their bout via a left uppercut.

• Tyson Fury ended Dillian Whyte’s world title challenge during the dying seconds of the sixth round via a right uppercut.

The blueprint to defeat Dillian Whyte has been exposed, which can only improve Joe’s chances.

Joe Joyce does exactly what was expected of him.

Thomastearns wrote: ↑03 Jul 2022, 08:02 Joe Joyce does exactly what was expected of him.

What taking too many shots to the head?

Enlightened-One wrote: ↑27 Jun 2022, 12:20 I've just read that Joe Joyce's handlers are speaking to Dillian Whyte for a potential fight.

I don't know whether this bout will come to fruition or not.

But if it does, despite Joyce being the older man, I reckon he's physically "younger" and fresher than Dillian, because he has far fewer miles on the proverbial clock.

And also, within the last three years, Dillian has lost two from his last four bouts.

He recently looked terrible against Mariusz Wach and was also KO’d by Fury and Povetkin.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m a massive fan of Dillian Whyte. He’s one of the very few heavyweights willing to take risks and keep facing the best.

But I feel that Whyte's recent defeats, coupled with a particularly tough run of back-to-back bouts within the last 5½ years, has resulted in him aging prematurely and already being considered well-past-his-prime.

And if I was Joe Joyce’s trainer, I’d heavily work on throwing uppercuts, because:

• A right uppercut thrown by Oscar Rivas floored Dillian Whyte in their fight.

• Anthony Joshua hurt Dillian Whyte three times during completely different stages of the first round of their bout via two uppercuts and one hookercut.

• AJ then landed a right uppercut to badly hurt Dillian Whyte during the midway point of the second round.

• And of course, it was a right uppercut that AJ threw which KO’d Dillian Whyte in the seventh round of their bout.

• Alexander Povetkin KO’d Dillian Whyte in the fifth round of their bout via a left uppercut.

• Tyson Fury ended Dillian Whyte’s world title challenge during the dying seconds of the sixth round via a right uppercut.

The blueprint to defeat Dillian Whyte has been exposed, which can only improve Joe’s chances.

I agree with all that Lightie,
Problem you haven't touched on is promoters and Whyte's paycheck expectations.
Whyte has been paid far to much for far to many insignificant fights and his expectations are in the (£) millions. After his losses at the top level, Whyte just isn't worth as much as he thinks he is anymore. Joe Joyce is not in the same earning stratosphere as Dillion Whyte's overblown expectations.
Joyce has been fighting buget guys, hence his "C" level resume.
So I just don't think Joyce and his team can put enough on the table to satisfy Whyte's demands.
Personally I would prefer Joyce to fight Parker, or rematch DDD - both of which he would lose.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑04 Jul 2022, 01:05

Enlightened-One wrote: ↑27 Jun 2022, 12:20 I've just read that Joe Joyce's handlers are speaking to Dillian Whyte for a potential fight.

I don't know whether this bout will come to fruition or not.

But if it does, despite Joyce being the older man, I reckon he's physically "younger" and fresher than Dillian, because he has far fewer miles on the proverbial clock.

And also, within the last three years, Dillian has lost two from his last four bouts.

He recently looked terrible against Mariusz Wach and was also KO’d by Fury and Povetkin.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m a massive fan of Dillian Whyte. He’s one of the very few heavyweights willing to take risks and keep facing the best.

But I feel that Whyte's recent defeats, coupled with a particularly tough run of back-to-back bouts within the last 5½ years, has resulted in him aging prematurely and already being considered well-past-his-prime.

And if I was Joe Joyce’s trainer, I’d heavily work on throwing uppercuts, because:

• A right uppercut thrown by Oscar Rivas floored Dillian Whyte in their fight.

• Anthony Joshua hurt Dillian Whyte three times during completely different stages of the first round of their bout via two uppercuts and one hookercut.

• AJ then landed a right uppercut to badly hurt Dillian Whyte during the midway point of the second round.

• And of course, it was a right uppercut that AJ threw which KO’d Dillian Whyte in the seventh round of their bout.

• Alexander Povetkin KO’d Dillian Whyte in the fifth round of their bout via a left uppercut.

• Tyson Fury ended Dillian Whyte’s world title challenge during the dying seconds of the sixth round via a right uppercut.

The blueprint to defeat Dillian Whyte has been exposed, which can only improve Joe’s chances.

I agree with all that Lightie,
Problem you haven't touched on is promoters and Whyte's paycheck expectations.
Whyte has been paid far to much for far to many insignificant fights and his expectations are in the (£) millions. After his losses at the top level, Whyte just isn't worth as much as he thinks he is anymore. Joe Joyce is not in the same earning stratosphere as Dillion Whyte's overblown expectations.
Joyce has been fighting buget guys, hence his "C" level resume.
So I just don't think Joyce and his team can put enough on the table to satisfy Whyte's demands.
Personally I would prefer Joyce to fight Parker, or rematch DDD - both of which he would lose.

kiwi! wtf!!? where were u? outta picks too?

not u too!? shit is fallin apart.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑04 Jul 2022, 01:05I agree with all that Lightie,
Problem you haven't touched on is promoters and Whyte's paycheck expectations.
Whyte has been paid far to much for far to many insignificant fights and his expectations are in the (£) millions. After his losses at the top level, Whyte just isn't worth as much as he thinks he is anymore.

Dillian Whyte has always been a promotional and network free agent.

He worked with Queensberry Promotions for the Tyson Fury bout.

And the Matchroom events he headlined were on a per-fight basis.

'The Body Snatcher' has been KO’d twice and only won one fight (against a 41½ year old post-COVID version of Alexander Povetkin) within the last 2½ years.

Dillian Whyte will be on the cusp of turning 35 years of age the next time he competes.

And if he still harbours ambitions to become a world heavyweight champion, then he needs to get his skates on, by quickly recovering with a win over a fellow top-ten world-rated fighter.

The defensively irresponsible Joe Joyce turns 37 years of age in September and is widely-regarded as a top-ten world-rated heavyweight.

From a commercial standpoint, the Juggernaut is an Olympic silver medallist, he’s unbeaten in the paid ranks and is also a fellow Brit.

Joe Joyce’s bout against Daniel Dubois would have been a pay-per-view event had it not been staged during a COVID lockdown (it was originally scheduled to be covered by BT Sports Box Office).

I don’t see any commercial reason why Whyte-Joyce couldn’t be done, though I’d expect Joe to be considered the B-side.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑04 Jul 2022, 01:05Joe Joyce is not in the same earning stratosphere as Dillion Whyte's overblown expectations.

He doesn’t need to be. The only thing that matters is whether Queensbury Promotions and BT Sports are willing to fund the event and meet Whyte’s purse demands.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑04 Jul 2022, 01:05Joyce has been fighting buget guys, hence his "C" level resume.

Joe will be 37 years of age in September. Time isn’t on his side.

He needs to be thrown in at the deep end by facing a top-ten world-rated heavyweight within the next six months.

If he loses, then so what? At least he’s given it a go and would have received a decent payday.

The only alternative is that he keeps treading water against journeymen, which will probably result in him eventually suffering an upset due to his age.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑04 Jul 2022, 01:05So I just don't think Joyce and his team can put enough on the table to satisfy Whyte's demands.

I disagree with this point.

Canelo’s loyal fans are willing to fund his fights regardless of the network he appears on or the opposition he faces.

Dillian Whyte can do the same, but to a much lesser degree.

The problem that BT Sports and Queensberry have is that they’d need to outbid Matchroom/DAZN and BOXXER/Sky Sports in order to acquire Whyte’s services.

Even though Dillian’s stock has clearly fallen, he’ll still command decent paydays, because he generates decent audience viewing figures.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑04 Jul 2022, 01:05Personally I would prefer Joyce to fight Parker, or rematch DDD - both of which he would lose.

The idea of a battle of the two Joe’s is something that really appeals to me.

I don’t know who wins that one.

Parker looked terrible in the first Chisora fight, but looked fantastic in the rematch.

Was that because of Dereck or did the Kiwi improve a lot?

I suspect it’s the former, rather than the latter. But don’t get me wrong, I really rate Parker.

Can Parker hurt Joe? Can Parker cope with Joyce’s hideously obscene work rate?

Parker is the better boxer with the superior resume, but is that enough?

I’m not 100% sure either way. But I do know that Joyce beats the iteration of Parker we saw in the first Chisora bout.

In terms of Dubois-Joyce II, Daniel has fought terribly soft opposition since that loss. And I haven’t seen any signs of improvement.

Dubois couldn’t hurt Joyce and he couldn’t cope with his jab either.

I’d like to see Daniel going the distance in a competitive fight, where things aren’t always going his way, before seeing him face Joyce again.

He seems to be a front-runner type fighter. I’d like to see him overcome adversity during a gruelling ten or twelve round fight.

For all we know, he could have a Frank Bruno-esque type engine, because he looked like he was fading during the two rounds prior to his stoppage against Joyce.

Therefore, I’d expect Dubois-Joyce II to be a replica of their first fight, but with Daniel fading earlier.

adislav123 wrote: ↑18 Jun 2022, 07:20 a 'fun' fight i'd like to see would be fury giving joyce a shot while usky gets rid of Josh the 2nd time.

instead we get joyce vs. hammer & fury talking about wwe & 'exhibitions' vs. ngannou and God knows what else, surely 'entertaining' stuff but not the kind of entertainment real boxing fans care for.

Agree wholeheartedly.

I like Tyson Fury, but he is full of brown stuff.

He talks about driving a 15 year old VW Passat and not caring about money or fast cars while forgetting to mention that his other cars are a Ferrari, Porsche Taycan and Mercedes G Class.

He talks about retirement, yet still has the belt.

I personally hope he fights on, but if he is retiring, just get on with it, vacate it and let the likes of Joyce fight for the belt.

I love his charisma, but his BS is getting boring.

Syntax Error wrote: ↑05 Jul 2022, 00:37

adislav123 wrote: ↑18 Jun 2022, 07:20 a 'fun' fight i'd like to see would be fury giving joyce a shot while usky gets rid of Josh the 2nd time.

instead we get joyce vs. hammer & fury talking about wwe & 'exhibitions' vs. ngannou and God knows what else, surely 'entertaining' stuff but not the kind of entertainment real boxing fans care for.

Agree wholeheartedly.

I like Tyson Fury, but he is full of brown stuff.

He talks about driving a 15 year old VW Passat and not caring about money or fast cars while forgetting to mention that his other cars are a Ferrari, Porsche Taycan and Mercedes G Class.

He talks about retirement, yet still has the belt.

I personally hope he fights on, but if he is retiring, just get on with it, vacate it and let the likes of Joyce fight for the belt.

I love his charisma, but his BS is getting boring.

Fury finds motivation only in the biggest fights possible. Of course, there're double standards in the business and the corrupt WBC allows him just to wait for the Usyk-Joshua winner after the retirement announcement without stripping him or proposing a mandatory. Anyway, the fight of Fury against the Usyk-Jushua winner sounds real to be next. If it won't happen after all this stuff, it'll be utterly frustrating.

DrDuke wrote: ↑05 Jul 2022, 01:26Fury finds motivation only in the biggest fights possible. Of course, there're double standards in the business and the corrupt WBC allows him just to wait for the Usyk-Joshua winner after the retirement announcement without stripping him or proposing a mandatory. Anyway, the fight of Fury against the Usyk-Jushua winner sounds real to be next. If it won't happen after all this stuff, it'll be utterly frustrating.

There’s another way to look at the situation.

If Tyson Fury had kept schtum and refrained from announcing his retirement plans, he’d be allowed to retain ownership of his WBC world heavyweight title until the 23rd April 2023 without even needing to compete, because it has only been ten weeks since he performed a mandatory defence of that strap.

Boxers say lots of things, mostly hyperbole, to promote themselves via grabbing media headlines.

And to be fair, none of the media, including most fans, believe that Tyson Fury will never compete again.

I can recall ten different occasions since 2013 when media coverage of Tyson Fury’s alleged retirement plans was rife.

But he predictably always ends up resuming his career.

It’s kind of interesting, Deontay Wilder once claimed he wanted to “kill a man” inside the ring, but no one criticises him for failing to fulfil his ambition.

Tyson Fury claims he wants to retire, but he is ridiculed for failing to vacate his world title.

Enlightened-One wrote: ↑05 Jul 2022, 03:06

DrDuke wrote: ↑05 Jul 2022, 01:26Fury finds motivation only in the biggest fights possible. Of course, there're double standards in the business and the corrupt WBC allows him just to wait for the Usyk-Joshua winner after the retirement announcement without stripping him or proposing a mandatory. Anyway, the fight of Fury against the Usyk-Jushua winner sounds real to be next. If it won't happen after all this stuff, it'll be utterly frustrating.

There’s another way to look at the situation.

If Tyson Fury had kept schtum and refrained from announcing his retirement plans, he’d be allowed to retain ownership of his WBC world heavyweight title until the 23rd April 2023 without even needing to compete, because it has only been ten weeks since he performed a mandatory defence of that strap.

Boxers say lots of things, mostly hyperbole, to promote themselves via grabbing media headlines.

And to be fair, none of the media, including most fans, believe that Tyson Fury will never compete again.

I can recall ten different occasions since 2013 when media coverage of Tyson Fury’s alleged retirement plans was rife.

But he predictably always ends up resuming his career.

It’s kind of interesting, Deontay Wilder once claimed he wanted to “kill a man” inside the ring, but no one criticises him for failing to fulfil his ambition.

Tyson Fury claims he wants to retire, but he is ridiculed for failing to vacate his world title.

He should be.

Honestly I think Sanchez and Jared Anderson beat Joyce. Like to see them get a shot. Joyce is just too damn slow to compete with the top proven guys. Maybe take the winner of Ruiz vs Ortiz? Otherwise, Whyte or Parker maybe.

Bandog wrote: ↑07 Jul 2022, 15:06 Honestly I think Sanchez and Jared Anderson beat Joyce. Like to see them get a shot. Joyce is just too damn slow to compete with the top proven guys. Maybe take the winner of Ruiz vs Ortiz? Otherwise, Whyte or Parker maybe.

Sanchez Vs Joyce would be hilarious to watch simply because of the speed disparity.

joshj909 wrote: ↑07 Jul 2022, 17:18

Bandog wrote: ↑07 Jul 2022, 15:06 Honestly I think Sanchez and Jared Anderson beat Joyce. Like to see them get a shot. Joyce is just too damn slow to compete with the top proven guys. Maybe take the winner of Ruiz vs Ortiz? Otherwise, Whyte or Parker maybe.

Sanchez Vs Joyce would be hilarious to watch simply because of the speed disparity.

It would be a repeat of Usyk vs Joyce.
Only problem is that big Frank fights like a Cuban and only does just enough - and he isn't the A side, so he would be robbed on the cards.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑07 Jul 2022, 18:38

joshj909 wrote: ↑07 Jul 2022, 17:18

Bandog wrote: ↑07 Jul 2022, 15:06 Honestly I think Sanchez and Jared Anderson beat Joyce. Like to see them get a shot. Joyce is just too damn slow to compete with the top proven guys. Maybe take the winner of Ruiz vs Ortiz? Otherwise, Whyte or Parker maybe.

Sanchez Vs Joyce would be hilarious to watch simply because of the speed disparity.

It would be a repeat of Usyk vs Joyce.
Only problem is that big Frank fights like a Cuban and only does just enough - and he isn't the A side, so he would be robbed on the cards.

Could be fairly similar to Joyce/Jennings then...

the way Joyce refuses to use head movement and stop taking punches to the face and head, even Trevor Bryan would lock good against him for a round before Joe knocked him out in the 2nd