BoxRec

As mediocre as Klit may be he has shown everything it would take to beat a Jim Braddock which isnt a whole lot. Some people have brought up the Chris Byrd fight. Byrd is bigger (damn near THIRTY POUNDS) and better at just about everything except power than Braddock. Klit blew his shoulder out by missing the defensively adept Byrd. Something he wouldnt have to worry about with Braddock. Even then he pretty much dominated Byrd.

Clumsy? Yes! Ive seen the footage that exists on Braddock from light heavyweight (where hillbilly swears he was very good) to heavyweight, and he was clumsy. Its as plain as that.

People can tout his one decent win against Baer but lets face it, Baer wasnt unbeatable, he wasnt GREAT, he wasnt dedicated, and he himself won his title from a guy who had the majority of his fights fixed by unscrupulous managers and gangsters.

The hillbilly can bring up Greb and try to rile me. Thats fine, hes entitled to his opinion and regardless of what he thinks I respect that. Im entitled to mine and this is it. Klit would beat Braddock and do it easily whether by KO or not is irrelevent, it would be one sided.

Try to rile you…I haven’t even thought about it, but I very easily could!

Speaking of Greb though…It's funny Klompton told me once that the record for Greb here on boxrec is badly incorrect and poorly researched, just like he says to anyone who disagrees with him about anything, yet it was researched by probably one of the greatest record compilers and top historians in history in Luckett Davis, who by the way, was researching the career of Greb before Klompton was even born. I will certainly take Luckett’s version over that of just about anyone, especially someone as blantantly biased as Klompton…there are a couple of other fellows besides Luckett and Klomptom that have really researched Greb’s career very thoroughly as well, but Klompton is the God of boxing research and wrong about nothing in boxing history…at least in his mind!

Klompton obviously knows a hell of a lot about Greb, no doubt a lot more than I know about Greb, but the thing is, he cannot stand any kind constructive criticism, or any opinions that differ from his about Greb, or any other boxer and he instantly rebukes it with insults about one's intelligence whenever someone disagrees with anything he says, or he uses more subtle insults like the person probably only read one article in an old Ring, or he is a hillbilly, and other super-intelligent remarks that only someone of Klompton’s ability could conceive. But the thing that just screams of insecurity is that Klompton is not big enough to admit when he is wrong about something, he chooses instead to leave a site when he has been proven wrong, which is really sad when you think about it, but mosty just juvenile!

Where is this so called Klomper charachter? Let me at em!
He needs a dose of humility by way of sheer intellectual high brow reprimandin. Which way did he go? Greb's ghost is itchin to set him straight and I'm agreein to channel the human windmill for that purpose.

I didnt mention that I moonlight as a medium? Just one of my many talents.

Vitali Klitschko is not only much bigger than Braddock, he is also a much better boxer than Braddock. Klitschko's boxing skills are far superior to that of Braddock. He is faster than Braddock and uses an awkward style that confuses all of his opponents. It even took Lennox Lewis a good 4 rounds before figuring out how to work with Vitali. Remember, if Vitali hadn't tested positive for steroids, he would in all likelyhood be an Olympic Gold Medalist that just so happens to stand 6'7 and weigh 250 lbs.

Now, I have nothing against Braddock, and in fact behind Joe Louis and Max Schmeling he is my favorite boxer of the 1930's. However, with the exception of Joe Louis, I don't see any fighter in the 30's beating Klitschko. This is not that I think Klitschko is some all-time great fighter, or that he is unbeatable in the modern era...because if you have read some of my posts on Vitali in the past I clearly don't. However, boxing, just like baseball, basketball and football, has evolved in the past 70 years. Pitchers throw faster now in baseball and hitters use lighter bats to keep up with them. Back in the 30's, basketball players barely dribbled the ball in a game...forget about dunking or layups or shooting for high field goal percentages. In football, the all-time record for throwing touchdowns in a season was 20 back in the 1930s. Now, it's 49. Just like other sports, boxing has become more specialized. There are new and better tactics and new ways to employ the skills you have than there were 70 years ago. I'm not bashing the older fighters at all. That's just the way sports evolves. Boxers 50 years from now will have skill sets that boxers of today don't, just like boxers 50 years ago don't have the same skill sets that boxers of today have. This is why it's so hard to debate era's that are so far apart. Just like you shouldn't compare the Dead Ball Era in baseball to modern baseball, you shouldn't really compare boxing in the 30's to modern boxing. It just doesn't work. There are too many things different in the sport now then there were 70 years ago.

But, if we are going to compare these two fighters, lets make it simple. Is Braddock a better boxer than Klitschko? No. Is Braddock faster than Klitschko? No. Is Braddock stronger than Klitschko? No. Does Braddock have faster hands than klitschko? No. Does Braddock have better defense than Klitschko? No. Add that with the fact that Klitschko is essentially in a completely different size and weight class from Braddock, and one finds it hard to see anyway for Braddock to win. It boils down to a simple question: Is Braddock actually "better" at any one thing that Vitali? Yes...and that is heart...unfortunately a fighter with only heart going for him ends up getting beat up for a long period of time...and that's what would happen if Vitali fought Braddock.

Very good points Iceman. Arguing that Braddock would be a force in the Heavyweight division today is like saying an All Pro offensive lineman of the 1930's who weighed 230 would be a dominant player in the NFL today while facing 290 lb pass rushers. Braddock's story is a very interesting inspirational one, just like Jersey Joe Walcott's and I see much to admire in the man. But the facts clearly prove that Braddock simply was not one of the all time greats in the heavyweight division. He retired when he was only 32 yrs old and already had 25 losses, some of those at the hands of less than world class opposition.

Is this a greb thread or a braddock thread? you couldnt tell by the title or by hillbillys inane ramblings...

well i agree with some of ur points iceman. but i think it boils down to this, if a guy thats 190 lbs like dempsey and marciano and a 200 lb guy is gonna beat a 6'7 240 lb guy like vitali they have to have the edge over vitali in a lot of categories. and as u know both marciano and dempsey and louis all have much greater power, have much more strength for their size, have better stamina, better body punchers, have bigger heart, more toughness, better agression.

but braddock is limited in these categories and thats why its harder for him to beat a big 6'7 250 lb vitali. but guys like marciano and dempsey and who have the power, defense, leverage, strength, etc they have the tools to take out the big guys. braddock doenst have as much. but i still dont think much of vitali at all. hes way overated. i think braddock would give him a close match.

when u get up to 185 lbs, its not that big a weight issue anymore. its not like wrestling, where even in the higher weights, it matters. ur not grabbing onto ur opponnent (unless ur ruiz) ur hitting them, and 190lb guys like dempsey and marciano can KO guys a lot bigger than them. the biggest guy dempsey Koed was 6'6 245 lb jess willard who was a good heavyweight. dempsey always took out the big heavyweights. the biggest guy marciano knocked out was with one overhand right in the first round against 6'4 254 lb jerry jackson.

but the point is, if ur gonna give the huge siza adnvatange like braddock would, u have to have a lot of tools which braddock doesnt possess like a marciano, or dempsey or louis or walcott. thats why the EDGE goes to vitali.



and i think max baer has a good chance at knocking out vitali klitschko. its lights out for vitali if he gets hit with that right hand. i also think jack sharkey and max schmelling would do very wel against him. vitali is not that good. jack sharkey is a lot more skillful.

You know what, I was going to leave Barry's comments alone but Ill bite. Barry your right. Luckett is a hell of a researcher. However he and I differ on one point in regards to our approach to Greb. He thinks that you can read one newspaper (in his case the Pittsburgh Post) and use that as the basis for creating Greb's record. I disagree for two reasons: 1. The Pittsburgh Post was basically the mouthpiece for James Red Mason Greb's manager and as such an overreliance on that paper tends to give a skewed picture of Greb's career, particularly early on. This is why you and my critics who say Im a zealot and biased are wrong. Because my picture of Greb will be complete it will correct the mistakes that researchers like Luckett have made by actually TAKING away wins from Greb's newspaper decisions when he didnt win the concensus vote or adding them when he did. The second reason Lucketts research is flawed and much more to the point is that by looking at one newspaper, situated in Pittsburgh for the majority of Greb's fights whether they were in Pittsburgh or not you get a narrow and biased view of his career (especially taking into account that papers close association with Mason). Luckett often quotes Post fight accounts for fights which were held outside of Pittsburgh and invariably those accounts are inaccurate. Why? Because Red Mason WROTE THE ACCOUNTS(!) which were almost always small, one or two sentence reports. If Greb fought in Steubenville I got the accounts from Steubenville, not the Post. I didnt simply take for granted what Greb's hometown paper said. If Greb fought in Pittsburgh I didnt just end with the Post, I also got the Dispatch, Press, Leader, Gazette-Times, Sun, Chronicle-Telegraph, etc. When Greb went to Kalamazoo I got all the Kalamazoo papers, when he went to Cleveland, Cincinnati, Newark, Atlantic City, etc etc. I got those PAPERS. Plural. I didnt stop there though. I also got the papers from smaller sorrounding towns that may have covered the event. When I couldnt get the actual microfilm of the paper I paid a small fortune to have various libraries, universities, and paid researchers to dig these old, original newspapers up in archives, universities, local libraries, and even the old newspaper offices themselves and make copies for me. So here is a challenge to Barry who has been one of my biggest critics and seems to think that Im writing some loveletter to Harry Greb. Ill pick out some of the fights that Luckett comments on in his record for Greb here at boxrec. I will pick out corresponding sections of my book and let Barry read them. If hes wrong and agrees that Im not being overprotective of Greb's legacy or his opponents then let him post it here publicly along with his opinions of the passages, and make the corrections to Greb's record with my name on them. If not then he can go on ranting about me like he always does. Sound fair?

I don't think any of the sub 200 lb fighters would be able to survive in todays heavyweight division. They might be able to pull off a couple upsets, but it wouldn't be long before even the best of them ended up on the wrong end of a brutal knockout. There's a very good reason why it's been so long since we've seen a dominant heavyweight under 200 lbs. With the evolution of size in the division it's just about impossible nowdays for a guy under 200 (actually more like under 215) to become a contender.

So ur telling me that vitali klitschko and guys like jameel mccline, wladimri klitschko,lamon brewster, andrew golota would beat rocky marciano, jack dempsey, joe louis,gene tunney,ezzard charles and jersey joe walcott???

i didnt know a out of shape, slow,uncoordinated 250 lb overblown man could outbox or outslug a ferocius muscle bound rock solid tough as nails 185-200 lb.

first of all if rocky marciano and jack dempsey were fighting today, they would take the same root as evander holyfield and take advatnage of modern technology and and all that shit and be about 200-215 lbs.

the fact is rocky marciano was naturally over 200lb and could have carried the extra weight but both him and dempsey chose to trim down their bodies to 190 to be rock solid.

and they dont even need the extra 20 pounds of muscle, they ARE RARE EXCEPTIONS. they have the KO power to flatten the big guys as well as the strength, heart, toughness, chin, and stamina. they also both really use their leverage to their advatnage they know how to get low and pound the body and make themself a tough target to hit.

jersey joe walcott and ezzard charles could win today. if roy jones could do it ezzard could do it. and walcott was another jack johnson who was incredible defense and smart and could also knock u out with a punch. walcott wa veyr muscular.

joe louis was 200 lb , 198 1/2 against max schmelling in his peak fight and weighed in under 200 5 times in title fights.

how bout muhammad ali was only 201 lb in his fight with henry cooper and 203lb in his peak fight with cleveland williams.

JOe frazier was only 203-205 in his prime. he was 205 lb in his peak fightt vs muhammad ali.

could these guys win today???

is their that much of a difference between 190- and 205????
answer no.
how bout 190-260???? answer NO

the reason there have been no dominate heavyweights under 200lb is cause they invented the cruiserweight diviison and now we got out of shape overweight blubbery heavyweights fighting at 240 when they will be in better shape at 215.


u see theirs a big difference between 100-160 then 200-260. the bigger u are the less the weight matters. giving up ten pounds in lighter weights is a lot different than at heavyweight. once ur 185, the weight doesnt matter as much. this isnt wrestling, ur not grabbing the other guy, ur hitting him.

jack dempsey and rocky marciano are both only 2 examples out of many that would dominate heavyweights today. u see i nkow if they fought today they would be 210 but the fact is going by there career at 190 they could take guys like vitali klitschko out. look what dempsey did to jess willard. look what joe louis did to buddy baer.


so i gues nicolay valuev would knock out jack dempsey since hes 7' 334 lbs. lol.

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:well i agree with some of ur points iceman. but i think it boils down to this, if a guy thats 190 lbs like dempsey and marciano and a 200 lb guy is gonna beat a 6'7 240 lb guy like vitali they have to have the edge over vitali in a lot of categories. and as u know both marciano and dempsey and louis all have much greater power, have much more strength for their size, have better stamina, better body punchers, have bigger heart, more toughness, better agression.

but braddock is limited in these categories and thats why its harder for him to beat a big 6'7 250 lb vitali. but guys like marciano and dempsey and who have the power, defense, leverage, strength, etc they have the tools to take out the big guys. braddock doenst have as much. but i still dont think much of vitali at all. hes way overated. i think braddock would give him a close match.

when u get up to 185 lbs, its not that big a weight issue anymore. its not like wrestling, where even in the higher weights, it matters. ur not grabbing onto ur opponnent (unless ur ruiz) ur hitting them, and 190lb guys like dempsey and marciano can KO guys a lot bigger than them. the biggest guy dempsey Koed was 6'6 245 lb jess willard who was a good heavyweight. dempsey always took out the big heavyweights. the biggest guy marciano knocked out was with one overhand right in the first round against 6'4 254 lb jerry jackson.

but the point is, if ur gonna give the huge siza adnvatange like braddock would, u have to have a lot of tools which braddock doesnt possess like a marciano, or dempsey or louis or walcott. thats why the EDGE goes to vitali.



and i think max baer has a good chance at knocking out vitali klitschko. its lights out for vitali if he gets hit with that right hand. i also think jack sharkey and max schmelling would do very wel against him. vitali is not that good. jack sharkey is a lot more skillful.

I agree with pretty much everything you say, brockton, except for the final paragraph.

I don't think Baer would have a very good chance at all against vitali, because as good as baer's right hand is, there are two things going against him. The first is that obviously the power from his right hand won't be at maximum force considering the angles he would have to get in order to hit vitali. The second is that vitali has a great chin. Lennox Lewis was punishing Vitali in the last couple rounds of their fight, yet Klitschko didn't fall. Lewis, in my opinion, with his size, was hitting Klitschko with at least the same amount of force that Baer would have hit Klitschko (I personally think that Lewis' power is vastly underrated). I don't think Baer had the skills necessary to outpoint him, and I also think that Vitali has the ability to keep away from baer when he gets in trouble. If you remember the Corrie Sanders fight (and I am in NO way comparing Max Baer to Corrie Sanders), as soon as Vitali got tagged with a good punch in the early rounds, he retreated and went into a defensive mode. Vitali knows how to take care of himself when he gets hit with a great shot, and he doesn't lose composure under pressure. Do I think Max Baer could beat Vitali? Yes. But I would make Vitali the favorite against every heavyweight of the 30's except Joe Louis, and I would probably make a Vitali/Schmeling bout even money. Jack Sharkey, on the other hand, got KO'd by Primo Carnera, so I personally don't think he would stand much of a chance against an even bigger, more talented fighter like Vitali Klitschko. Just my opinions, and as I've already said, I hate comparing this era to the modern era because of all the differences in the sport that occurred over the last 70 years (well, not the sport, but the size of fighters, the training habits, the supplements you can take now, etc.)

iceman, i agree about lennox lewis power being underated especially his left hook. but let me tell u this, the lennox lewis vitali fought was way overweight, much slower reflexes, very sloppy and loss of coordination, defintely past his prime. lewis looked awful against vitali, a lot different than his fight with tyson.


ill say this, a prime lennox lewis right hand knocks out vitali. vitali still hasnt gone up against enough big punchers yet. he still has more to prove. rahman has good punching power so if he cna take rahmans best, hell get some respect.

wh ycouldnt they give wladimir vitalis chin??? wladimir would rule the division, he has so much more potential than vitali and a lot more power and better offense.

and i see ur points about vitali beating baer and being favored over him. baer will have a hard time outpointing vitali, but baer also had a very good chin. i just dont know if he can take baers best right hand. baer would have ti attack and attack him for 15 rounds.



and about jack sharkey on a side note, sharkey took a dive against carnera.

I dont believe Sharkey took a dive to Carnera. Ive seen most if not all of Carneras films including the ultra rare fights like the long versions of his fights with Uzcudan, and Schaaf, his fight with Larry Gains, and both fights with Sharkey among others. Carnera is greatly underrated. Its as simple as that. He had a lot of fixed fights, his manager admitted this, but his performances in fights that werent fixed are very telling. Against Gains he loses the bout but holds his own and drops gains with a short left hook inside. Modern accounts say he was embarrased by Sharkey in their first bout but this isnt true. The film clearly shows a very competetive, tactical match, in which Carnera was down once but shows to very good capability. In the Schaaf fight he spears Schaaf over and over and over with a long hard telephone poll of a jab and it is this punch which eventually killed Schaaf. The same thing is true of the ultra durable, bullish Uzcudan in their Rome fight. Uzcudan simply couldnt cope with Carneras size and jab. When Carnera won the title from Sharkey he gets hurt in the last round and Sharkey goes in for the kill (not something a guy throwing the fight would do) in the process he walks into a punch himself and tries to back away, bobbing and weaving. Sharkey bobs right into an uppercut and that was all she wrote. Even the fight with Baer was competetive despite the knockdowns. I dont think ALL smaller heavyweights would be unsuccessful in this era and I dont think all former greats would be successful. It, like anything in boxing, is a matter of styles. However when comparing how Joe Louis, Jack Dempsey, Jack Johnson and others would do today, we have to remember that they were great. They had that "x" factor. Braddock was not a great fighter. He wasnt even that "good". He had a good or great story, and he was a good or great person, but neither of those have anything to do with how well he would be able to handle someone who stood at least 5 inches taller than he, outweighed him by 50 pounds, was stronger, hit harder, took as good a punch if not better, boxed as well, moved as well, was as smart etc.

Wow Klompton, I must say that I am very impressed that you would offer to let me read some of your book! I hope very much that you do present a well rounded and complete view of Greb, but it's certainly suspicious since I Have never heard you say anything negative at all about Greb.

There's no doubt Greb was one of the top three greatest fighters ever in my opinion, but the man was very flawed.

As to Luckett, well again you just assume that he has only used Pittsburgh Post reports, but I know that he probably has the largest collection of sources, or one of the largest in the world, and it's not just the Pittsburgh Post, many newspapers, of course he probably hasn't tracked down every single various hometown newspaper account like you say you have, but that I don't know, I do know that he has really researched Greb's career very thouroughly though, but Luckett has compiled the best record that I have ever seen for Greb.

I would be very interested to see what your record for Greb looks like as compared to that of Luckett's and also a couple of other records researched by a couple of others that thouroughly researched Greb's career and if I am wrong in anything that I have ever said to you, then I will gladly apologize, but in the past it was hard because you had your materials on lockdown like Fort Knox, and you just downed pretty much the hard and passionate research of anyone that had a view that differed from you without sharing any research that you have done, which I know you said that you just wanted people to buy the book, but most will buy the book regardless of what you have shared from the research and if you do decide to share some, and I'm not asking you to give all the info away that you no doubt have spent a lot of time researching, just share some of the very important things that have come into question many times during the past couple of years.

Right now I would be completely satisified with just looking at the record that you have for Greb and I'd gladly buy the book to read, and not from a second hand book store as I have said in the past. Hell, I won't give the record to anyone else, I would just really like to compare it to the others that I have seen.

As to Klitschko, well maybe if he proves some thing in the next couple of years, but at the moment, he has showed nothing that would merit him handling Braddock on his very best night, sure Vitali would beat Braddock probably six, or seven out of ten, but going up against Braddock, when Braddock was at his very best...well Vitali hasn't proved that he could rise to the occasion, which Braddock did rise to the occasion when it was most important, not counting the years before. Vitali choked in one of his biggest tests and was well on the way of being knocked out in his second big test of which he was lucky that it was stopped because anyone who has watched the fight (against Lewis) can see from the physical and facial expressions of Vitali that he was very near the point of giving up.

Seamus wrote:I don't think any of the sub 200 lb fighters would be able to survive in todays heavyweight division. They might be able to pull off a couple upsets, but it wouldn't be long before even the best of them ended up on the wrong end of a brutal knockout. There's a very good reason why it's been so long since we've seen a dominant heavyweight under 200 lbs. With the evolution of size in the division it's just about impossible nowdays for a guy under 200 (actually more like under 215) to become a contender.

I agree with you for the most part. You're going to find, however, that trying to establish this point against some of these guys is going to be like walking into a revival meeting and telling everyone God doesn't exist.

I only say "for the most part" because there are cases where the smaller man beats the significantly larger man. Probably going to happen tonight on ESPN2 when Terry Smith knocks out Julius Long. But you put a 190-pound man in the ring, giving up 8-10 inches in reach (or more) and 30-40 pounds (or more), against a big man who is also GOOD, the little man's chances are slim. Not saying he can't win. I'm just saying his chances aren't good.

I believe size is one of the things that kept Jerry Quarry from being a champion. I believe size is one of the reasons Leon Spinks would have gotten his head handed to him if he'd had to defend against someone other than the same old, soft punching "on his way out" Ali he won the title from to begin with.

I'm findin I'm in agreement on many counts with the Klomper.
Greb just told me himself that the research the Klomper has done is indeed rather bonafide.

My way of sayin I'm impressed.

Seamus wrote:I don't think any of the sub 200 lb fighters would be able to survive in todays heavyweight division. They might be able to pull off a couple upsets, but it wouldn't be long before even the best of them ended up on the wrong end of a brutal knockout. There's a very good reason why it's been so long since we've seen a dominant heavyweight under 200 lbs. With the evolution of size in the division it's just about impossible nowdays for a guy under 200 (actually more like under 215) to become a contender.

Alot of todays fighters just have more fat than they actually need ex. James Toney, John Ruiz,Jameel Mccline etc. If Toney were to get down to around 190 to 200 he would be a much better fighter than he is at 233. That's all that the old fighters did is get rid of extra fat lots of them were pretty big guys that just got into good shape.

Now when I say this I say it with extreme confidence and really mean it, that Joe Louis and Rocky Marciano would beat any heavyweight alive today and probably do it by knockout.

this is obsured.... people here think that size means everything... what about talent? what about speed? what about heart? what about strength? sure vitali is strong, but he sure as hell does hit harder then dempsey or baer or louis.. none of which were his size.. he does have any heart. hes a bum. ive decided to switch the fighter to hasim rahman... both are 6"2..rahman is 225, braddock is about 194.. not nearly as big of a difference...how do u guys think he fairs in this one>?


as for the light heavyweights and cruiserweights that people asked me about

roy jones-(prime?) too quick and too good for jimmy... Jones UD..he cant knock him out but he'll win.. if the fight was today...then i dunno i wouldnt be able to tell you cause i dont know what has become of roy since his last fight.

antonio tarver-- i dunno...i could see this becoming a good fight. either braddock KO's him or Tarver picks up a decision.. i dunno maybe a Sd for someone.

jean mccormack- im not really impressed with mccormack..i would take braddock 9 out of 10 times. KO

One of the most important factors of this mythical match-up is that I just honestly cannot see Vitali going 15 rounds, hell he has big trouble going ten and unless he scored an early knock out, then Braddock would come on after the six, or seventh round and Vitali would be too exhausted to finish the fight because he certainly doesn't have the brutal punching power to take out a good chin early!

i think thats a great point..braddock would make vitali hit him and i think vitali would get frustrated when braddock didnt go down..it happened to baer it could happen to bvitali....i think vitali would be punching away at braddock and win probly the first 6 rounds and then fade away, after expending all his energy.. vitali has never gone 15 rounds, and braddock would mop the floor with him and out box him the rest of the way...

ill make a new thread for hasim braddock this one is old

Barry, it would be better if I sent excerpts of my book. You would probably be dissappointed in the record I am using in the book as it doesnt list newspaper decisions. This isnt because I disagree with listing them. I actually like the idea. Its more a way of giving equal time to the various newspapers without favoring a single one. The record in my book is more of a reference tool which appears in the appendix. You can look at it to cross reference the various fight descriptions found in the book. Probably the only thing of interest which you wouldnt find in most other printed records of his are a couple of minor date changes and the addition of all of the exhibition bouts.

Steve, Actually, a lot of people would prefer to not list the newspaper results for the exact same reason that you mention, which is certainly very understandable, personally I just like to have the W, L, or D as I feel that it gives a better representation to a fighters career, especially if the fighter had many ND bouts, but neither way is wrong, it's just a matter of personal taste, or opinion.

I'd be glad to read any excerpts that you want to send. Send me an e-mail at [email protected] and I'll send you another e-mail from my main e-mail, which is where I would prefer to have anything sent. How many pages does, or is your book going to have in all?

As to records, I started using a format that is not only good for listing the record, but also historical as I have began to paraphrase all fight reports, example below, which is about as thourough a record as you will ever see, but it is still far from complete. It really helps, or at least it has me, to do this before starting any kind of writing, of course the format here probably sucks, but I have the document in word. I like to seperate a record into three, or four parts. First part is just the straight record without note, next notes and then exhibitions, scheduled bouts, etc. It's a very long a drawn out process, but when you want to be very meticulous it helps...or it has me. Of course it's difficult to try and do this to every single record as I probably have 7000+ records in word format, but I have tried to use this format to most pre-1920 fighters.



Terry McGovern
(John Terrance McGovern)
“Terrible Terry,” “The Brooklyn Terror”
Born: March 9 1880; Johnstown, Pennsylvania
Died: February 26 1918, Brooklyn, New York
Ht: 5’ 4”
Wt: 112-127
Reach: 67”
Race: White/Irish-American
Manager: Jimmy Dunn, Sam Harris, and Joe Humphreys
Career: 1897-1908

Total Bouts: 80
67-7-6 (44 KO)

1897
Apr 3 Jack Snee Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) L DQ 4
Apr 17 Frank Barnes Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W PTS 10
May 3 Eddie Avery New York, NY (Polo AC) W PTS 4
May 22 Kid Dougherty Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W PTS 10
Jun 7 Tom McDermott Brooklyn, NY (Greenpoint SC) W PTS 10
Jun 19 “Brooklyn” Tommy Sullivan Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) D PTS 10
Aug 16 Eddie Goodbody Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W PTS 10
Aug 23 Billy Barrett Brooklyn, NY (Greenpoint SC) W PTS 10
Sep 18 Jack Leon Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W KO 7
Oct 2 Jack Reagan Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W TKO 6
Oct 9 Jack Doyle Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W TKO 7
Oct 23 Eddie Goodbody Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) D PTS 4
Nov 13 Harry Peterson New York, NY (Polo AC) W PTS 6
Dec 18 Charles Roden New York, NY (Polo AC) W PTS 6
Dec 31 Jimmy Kelly Brooklyn, NY (National AC) W KO 2

1898
Feb 25 Billy Maynard Yonkers, NY (Waverly AC) W PTS 8
Mar 12 Pinkey Evans Yonkers, NY (Waverly AC) W PTS 8
Apr 15 Fred Mayo Waterbury, CT (Jacques’ Auditorium) W KO 6
May 5 George Monroe Yonkers, NY (Waverly AC) D PTS 20
Jun 11 George Monroe Brooklyn, NY (Greater New York AC) W KO 24
Jul 23 Tim Callahan Brooklyn, NY (Pelican AC) L DQ 11
Aug 4 George Monroe Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W DQ 7
Aug 20 Tim Callahan Brooklyn, NY (Pelican AC) D PTS 20
Sep 15 Eugene Garcia Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W KO 5 (1:30)
Oct 1 Harry Forbes Brooklyn, NY (Pelican AC) W KO 15
Nov 19 Tim Callahan Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W KO 10
Nov 26 Paddy Donovan Philadelphia, PA (Nonpareil AC) W KO 3
Dec 17 Jimmy Rose Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W KO 2
Dec 31 Austin Rice Brooklyn, NY (Pelican AC) W TKO 14

1899
Jan 30 Casper Leon Brooklyn, NY (Greenwood AC) W KO 12
Feb 18 Fred Snyder Philadelphia, PA (Nonpareil AC) W NWS 6
Mar 14 Patsy Haley New York, NY (Lenox AC) W KO 18 (0:48)
Apr 28 Joe Bernstein New York, NY (Broadway AC) W PTS 25
May 26 Sammy Kelly New York, NY (Broadway AC) W KO 5
Jun 8 Billy Barrett New York, NY (Broadway AC) W KO 10
Jul 1 Johnny Ritchie Tuckahoe, NY (Westchester AC) W KO 3
Sep 12 Thomas "Pedlar" Palmer Tuckahoe, NY (Westchester AC) W KO 1 (2:32)
--Bantamweight Championship of the World.
Sep 29 Fred Snyder Philadelphia, PA (Industrial Hall AC) W TKO 3
Oct 9 Billy Rotchford Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) W KO 1
Nov 18 Patsy Haley Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) W KO 1 (1:40)
Nov 18 “Turkey Point” Bill Smith Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) W KO 3 (1:00)
Nov 30 Eddie Sprague Hartford, CT (Nutmeg State AC) W KO 2
Dec 12 James J. Corbett, Jr. Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) W KO 2
Dec 18 Charlie Mason Cincinnati, OH (People’s AC) W KO 2
Dec 18 Freckles O'Brien Cincinnati, OH (People’s AC) W KO 1
Dec 22 Harry Forbes New York, NY (Broadway AC) W TKO 2 (1:33)

1900
Jan 9 George Dixon New York, NY (Broadway AC) W TKO 8
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
Jan 29 Jack Ward Baltimore, MD (Eureka AC) W KO 1 (2:05)
Feb 1 Eddie Santry Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) W KO 5
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
Mar 9 Oscar Gardner New York, NY (Broadway AC) W KO 3
--Featherweight Championship of the World; Weights: 123 - 123 ½.
Mar 15 Eddie Lenny Philadelphia, PA (Industrial Hall AC) W TKO 2 (1:45)
Apr 17 Tommy White Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) D PTS 6
Apr 20 Tommy Warren New York, NY (Broadway AC) W TKO 1
May 21 Elwood McCloskey Philadelphia, PA (Penn Art AC) W NWS 6
Jun 12 Tommy White Brooklyn, NY (Seaside AC) W KO 3
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
Jun 23 George Dixon Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) W PTS 6
Jul 16 Frank Erne New York, NY (Madison Square Garden) W TKO 3
Nov 2 Joe Bernstein Louisville, KY (Nonpareil AC) W KO 7 (2:05)
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
Nov 13 Kid Broad Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) W PTS 6
Dec 13 Joe Gans Chicago, IL (Tattersall’s AA) W KO 2 (2:05)

1901
Apr 30 Oscar Gardner San Francisco, CA (Mechanic’s Pavilion) W KO 4
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
May 29 Aurelio Herrera San Francisco, CA (Mechanic’s Pavilion) W KO 4
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
Nov 28 Young Corbett II Hartford, CT (Nutmeg AC) L KO 2 (1:44)
--Featherweight Championship of the World; Corbett weighed 126 lbs.

1902
Feb 22 Dave Sullivan Louisville, KY (Southern AC) W TKO 15
--Some sources report this bout as a Lightweight Championship of the World contest.

1903
Feb 6 Joe Bernstein Philadelphia, PA (Industrial Hall AC) W NWS 6
Feb 25 Billy Maynard Philadelphia, PA (Penn Art AC) W KO 4
Mar 31 Young Corbett II San Francisco, CA (Mechanic’s Pavilion) L KO 11
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
Sep 26 Lew Ryall Philadelphia, PA (National AC) W NWS 6
Oct 3 Billy Willis Philadelphia, PA (National AC) W NWS 6
Oct 20 Jimmy Briggs Boston, MA (Criterion AC) W PTS 15
Dec 19 Billy Willis Philadelphia, PA (National AC) W NWS 6

1904
Jan 1 Leo “Yock” Henninger Allentown, PA W KO 2
Apr 10 George Barton St. Paul, MN L PTS 6
Oct 10 Eddie Hanlon Philadelphia, PA (Industrial Hall) W TKO 4

1905
Oct 18 "Harlem" Tommy Murphy Philadelphia, PA (National AC) W TKO 1 (2:02)

1906
Mar 14 Oscar "Battling" Nelson Philadelphia, PA (National AC) L NWS 6
May 28 Jimmy Britt New York, NY (Madison Square Garden) W NWS 10
Oct 17 Young Corbett II Philadelphia, PA (National AC) W NWS 6

1908
May 16 Young Loughrey Philadelphia, PA (National AC) L NWS 6
May 26 Frank "Spike" Robson New York, NY (National AC) D NWS 6




Career Summary

Year TB W L D KO ND NC
1897 15 12 1 2 2 0 0
1898 14 11 1 2 8 0 0
1899 17 17 0 0 15 0 0
1900 14 13 0 1 10 0 0
1901 5 4 1 0 3 0 0
1902 1 1 0 0 1 0 0
1903 7 6 1 0 1 0 0
1904 3 2 1 0 2 0 0
1905 1 1 0 0 1 0 0
1906 3 2 1 0 0 0 0
1907 Did Not Fight
1908 2 0 1 1 0 0 0
12 Years 82 69 7 6 43 0 0



Fight Notes


1897
Apr 3 vs. Jack Snee: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Snee is listed by some sources as “Jack Shea.” The agreed weight was to be 110 lbs for both fighters. The result was not a “KO 1” for Terry as was sometimes listed in various sources. McGovern had the better of the match up until the fourth round when his temper got the best of him, as it would on a couple of other occasions later on in his career. Fouling was frequent in the fourth round with McGovern being the chief offender, which resulted in the referee stopping the bout and awarding Snee the win on disqualification. McGovern was well ahead when the ref stopped the bout. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Apr 17 vs. Frank Barnes: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. The weight was set for 112 pounds, but Barnes came in over weight and lost his forfeit as a result, but the fight went on. The bout was pretty much even for the first seven rounds, but during the remaining three McGovern pulled ahead on points and in the tenth and final round Terry repeatedly jabbed the stuffing’s out of Barnes without anything in return. Police News
May 3 vs. Eddie Avery: The bout took place in New York, NY at the Polo AC. The New York World states that this was an amateur bout. This bout was part of a big amateur boxing tournament held at the Polo AC. Both McGovern and Eddie Avery were boxers in the 112 lb class and two of six fighters competing at that weight. No description of the result was given the next day, but these were all amateur fights. W PTS 4 NYW
May 22 vs. Kid Dougherty: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. W PTS 10 BDE
--Weight: 112 lbs. They furnished one of the best exhibitions seen at the club for some time.
Jun 7 vs. Tom McDermott: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenpoint AC. The fight was scheduled for ten rounds at 112 pounds. McGovern controlled the fight from start to finish controlling McDermott’s rushing tactics by sticking out his left jab over and over and in the end Terry received the decision. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Jun 19 vs. “Brooklyn” Tommy Sullivan: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Sullivan had a record of 7-0-1 (6 KO) going into the bout. Scheduled for ten rounds at 112 pounds McGovern and Sullivan went at one another at a fast and exciting pace and did everything except bite each other for ten rounds without a let-up. In the end the referee declared the fight a draw. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Aug 16 vs. Eddie Goodbody: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. This was the first of two bouts versus Goodbody and it was scheduled for ten rounds at 112 pounds. Terry was the aggressor for the first few rounds using his left jab in a very clever style. The middle rounds were fairly even. During the last two rounds McGovern worked his jab hard, but Goodbody fought gamely to last out the ten rounds after which the referee named McGovern the victor. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Aug 23 vs. Billy Barrett: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenpoint SC. W PTS 10 BDE
--Going into the bout, Barrett had a record of 4-1-7 (1 KO) in 12 recorded bouts.
Sep 18 vs. Jack Leon: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Another bout scheduled for ten rounds at 112 pounds. Terry opened up more in this bout as he started using his right hand with telling effect. The first couple of rounds were even as both men landed effectively and often on one another. A right hook to the jaw staggered Leon in the third round and throughout the next two rounds Terry kept up a good pace landing his right to the body and head. Leon landed well in the sixth round, but it was rather short-lived and McGovern came out in the seventh round with intentions of adding the first knockout to his record. Terry drove Leon all over the ring with hard right hands to the body and head landing so effectively that the referee halted the action to save Leon from being completely knocked out. With the win came McGovern’s first stoppage victory and also pretty much the beginning of the style of fighting that not only won him scores of fans, but also a style of fighting that struck fear and terror in the hearts of his opponents! Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Oct 2 vs. Jack Reagan: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. W TKO 6 --
Oct 9 vs. Jack Doyle: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Police stopped the bout in the seventh round and McGovern was awarded the decision, so was it a “TKO 7,” or “W TD 7.” Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Oct 23 vs. Eddie Goodbody: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Bout was scheduled for ten rounds at 112 lbs. Police stopped the bout due to a prior bout where a boxer was seriously injured and looked as though he would die! Brooklyn Daily Eagle D PTS 4 BDE
Nov 13 vs. Harry Peterson: The bout took place in New York, NY at the Polo AC. W PTS 6 --
Dec 18 vs. Charles Roden: The bout took place in New York, NY at the Polo AC. W PTS 6 BDE
--BDE lists “Jerry McGovern.” Wt: 112 lbs.
Dec 31 vs. Jimmy Kelly: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the National AC. A right uppercut put Kelly down and out. Some sources list “Jack Kelly.” Brooklyn Daily Eagle W KO 2 BDE

1898
Feb 25 vs. Billy Maynard: This bout took place in Yonkers, NY. W PTS 8 --
Mar 12 vs. Pinkey Evans: This bout took place in Yonkers, NY. W PTS 8 --
Apr 15 vs. Fred Mayo: The bout took place in Waterbury, CT at Jacques’ Auditorium. Attendance: 1,500 (est) Scheduled for ten rounds at 112 lbs. Naugatuck Daily News
May 5 vs. George Monroe: This bout took place in Yonkers, NY. The weight of both men scaled less than 112 pounds each. It was an excellent bout from the sound of the first gong until referee Edwards declared it a draw. Terry was the aggressor for most of the bout, but George was always ready to counter the attack. There were no knockdowns, but each man suffered eye cuts and they fought one another to a standstill and were punching out of clinches. Terry was just beginning to fall into the rushing style that would make him so popular and at times, just when the audience thought that McGovern was on the verge of knocking his man out, Monroe always came back with a viscous counter. Unknown Newspaper Clip
Jun 11 vs. George Munroe: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greater New York Athletic Club. The men weighed in at 112 pounds. Both looked fit to go the entire twenty-five rounds that was scheduled. The first round was a “feeling out” round in which no damaging blows were landed by either fighter. Monroe did most of the leading in the second, but was dropped for a count in the third. McGovern started fast in the fourth and did all of the leading and the fifth round was more of the same. McGovern was cautioned twice for using his head in close. In the sixth round, McGovern cut loose knocking his opponent all over the ring and by the end of the seventh it looked as though it would only be a matter of time until Monroe was knocked out. Monroe managed to gain a little measure on McGovern in the ninth and tenth rounds. Up to the thirteenth neither man had landed any real damaging blows. McGovern again cut loose in the fourteenth hitting hard and drawing blood for the first time in the fight. Monroe was weak at the end of the fifteenth and betting was 3 to 1 that he would not last two more rounds, but Monroe regained his energy and probably had the better of the mill in the two rounds that were supposed to be his last. The fight was nearly even at the end of twenty rounds. Monroe was downed again in the twenty-second round, but still managed to land as much as he took. The twenty-third was even, but in the twenty-fourth McGovern began to land often and land hard. Terry landed a hard shot and followed it up with another hard punch which sent Monroe down for the count, the result “KO 24.” Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Jul 23 vs. Tim Callahan: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Pelican AC. L DQ 11 BDE
Aug 4 vs. George Monroe: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. W DQ 7 BDE
Aug 20 vs. Tim Callahan: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Pelican AC. D PTS 20 BDE
Sep 15 vs. Eugene Garcia: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. WKO 5 (1:30) BDE
Oct 1 vs. Harry Forbes: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Pelican AC. Forbes had a record of 17-2-4 (8 KO) coming in. W KO 15 BDE
Nov 19 vs. Tim Callahan: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. W KO 10 BDE
Nov 26 vs. Paddy Donovan: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Nonpareil AC. W KO 3 PN
Dec 17 vs. Jimmy Rose: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. W KO 2 BDE
Dec 31 vs. Austin Rice: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Pelican AC. W TKO 14 BDE

1899
Jan 30 vs. Casper Leon: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. The fight was scheduled for twenty-five rounds at 115 pounds. McGovern was a favorite at 100 to 80 in the betting. Charley White, Leon’s manager stated afterward that Terry broke two of Leon’s ribs in the second round. The rules governing the bout were straight Queensberry with no hitting in the clinches, or breakaway which should have played greatly in favor of Leon as McGovern was very much an inside fighter. In Casper Leon Terry was suppose to be meeting the toughest challenge of his short career as Leon was one of the top fighters of his size in the world, but McGovern handled him as if he were a novice just starting out and Terry scored a clean knockout in the twelfth round. The club was packed with probably its largest crowd ever up to that point in time. Leon was known for his cleverness, but as it turned out his cleverness was no match for the ring generalship and McGovern’s ability to severely punish and opponent. McGovern had a slight lead going after five rounds, but it was becoming evident that it would really only be a matter of time before Leon fell. Throughout the remaining rounds Terry put in some terrific work to the head and body and his right hand was doing particular damage whenever it landed as Terry put all of his force into each blow and the shots to the body had a very telling effect on Leon as he was visibly weakening by the constant attack put forth by McGovern. In the twelfth round both men came out and swapped some quick punches, but Terry’s was much more powerful and on a quick counter, McGovern shot over a short left that landed flush on the point of Leon’s chin and down he went as if he had been shot. Referee, Owen Ziegler counted Leon out with only a few seconds remaining in the round. It took several minutes for Casper to fully recover his senses. Former world champion and human dynamo Jimmy Barry was only able to knockout Casper Leon once in 28 rounds, and failed in other return bouts to do the trick. Brooklyn Daily Eagle & The National Police Gazette
Feb 18 vs. Fred Snyder: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Nonpareil AC. W NWS 6 PI
Mar 14 vs. Patsy Haley: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Lenox AC. Scheduled for twenty-five rounds at 116 pounds the bout was to determine who would face European Bantamweight Champion Pedlar Palmer in order to have a World Bantamweight Champion. This was the first of two bouts that these two would go at it. Haley was one of the most formidable opponents Terry had faced and the cleverness at which Patsy fought surpassed any other boxer Terry had yet met in the ring, but McGovern rose to the occasion and took Haley out in eighteen rounds, a feat that Oscar Gardner could not do in twenty rounds and one that Dave Sullivan took twenty-three rounds of the hardest kind of fighting to do. Going into the bout Patsy stated that he was in the absolute best shape of his life and the same could be said of McGovern. Haley put forth a good effort in which his clever footwork saved him several times, but in the end the consistent whirlwind attack to the body and head that McGovern administered to his foe was just too much for Patsy to handle. Terry finished the bout looking as fresh as when he started without a scratch on his face and he fought a very fair fight throughout. Every time that he put Haley on the floor Terry stood back until he could regain his feet. The action was lively. But Haley’s punches lacked the steam that those of McGovern carried. In the fourth round a hard right uppercut dropped Haley on his back for a count of seven and as soon as he was upright a viscous right cross dropped him for and eight count and once more in the fourth another right put Haley down for the third time, the last of which Haley was down for a nine count. Amazingly, Haley was fresh for the next few rounds despite the beating he was taking and he would often land some hard shots of his own, but to no effect on Terry. In the fifteenth round McGovern sent his man to one knee after landing a hard combination and Haley was down for another nine count. Again in round seventeen Haley found himself on the floor after Terry had landed a hard straight right and in round eighteen after forcing Haley to the ropes a brutal right cross put Haley down and out at 0:48 of the eighteenth round. It was a clean knockout and Haley had to be carried back to his corner. Referee was Charlie White. Brooklyn Eagle & Police Gazette
Apr 28 vs. Joe Bernstein: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. W PTS 25 BDE
May 26 vs. Sammy Kelly: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. Kelly came out fresh in the fifth round, feinted, then led, but missed, and like a flash McGovern was in, first with a left hook to the stomach, then a right to the jaw, and Kelly staggered. McGovern planted another, then a hard right jolt on the jaw, and Kelly went down like a log. He made a feeble effort to rise, but was counted out. New York Times W KO 5 BDE
Jun 8 vs. Billy Barrett: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. W KO 10 BDE
Jul 1 vs. Johnny Ritchie: This bout took place in Tuckahoe, NY at the Westchester AC. The fight was to be fought at 118 pounds for a purse of $2000; $1500 to the winner and $500 to the loser. Scheduled for twenty-five rounds with clean breaking and no hitting in the clinches were the stipulations of the bout. The fight was to decide the Bantamweight Champion of America and the winner would face Pedlar Palmer for World recognition as Bantamweight Champion. Jimmy Carroll was referee. A left hook to the point of the chin put Ritchie down and out in the third round. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Sep 12 vs. Thomas "Pedlar" Palmer: Bantamweight Championship of the World. This bout took place in Tuckahoe, NY at the Westchester AC. Weights: 115 ½, 113 ½. Time: 2:32. Palmer came into the bout undefeated at 23-0-1 (4 KO). KO 1 BDE
Sep 29 vs. Fred Snyder: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Industrial Hall AC. WTKO 3 PI
--Snyder was down twice in the first and six times in the second after which the police stopped the bout.
Oct 9 vs. Billy Rotchford: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. McGovern went after Rotchford much the same way as he attacked Palmer in September and the result was a quick ending of around a minute. W KO 1 BDE
Nov 18 vs. Patsy Haley: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. WKO 1 BDE
--Time: 1:40
Nov 18 vs. “Turkey Point” Bill Smith: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. WKO 3 BDE
--Time: 1:00
Nov 30 vs. Eddie Sprague: This bout took place in Hartford, CT at the Nutmeg State AC. It took less than a minute of the second round for Terry to put an end to matters. Sprague was down three times in the first round. He was down once in the second in which he was counted out. W KO 2 PG/DD
Dec 12 vs. James J. Corbett, Jr: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. WKO 2 --
Dec 18 vs. Charlie Mason: This bout took place in Cincinnati, OH at the People’s AC. WKO 2 BDE
Dec 18 vs. Freckles O'Brien: This bout took place in Cincinnati, OH at the People’s AC. WKO 1 BDE
Dec 22 vs. Harry Forbes: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. Forbes came into the bout with a record of 35-3-12 (11 KO). --Time: 1:33 W TKO 2 BDE

1900
Jan 9 vs. George Dixon: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC for the Featherweight Championship of the World. Dixon had a record of 51-5-22 (30 KO) coming in.W TKO 8 BDE
Jan 29 vs. Jack Ward: This bout took place in Baltimore, MD at the Eureka AC. (2:05)WKO 1 PG
Feb 1 vs. Eddie Santry: The bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. For the Featherweight Championship of the World. Santry’s clever defensive work bothered Terry for a couple of rounds, but once he settled in it was only a matter of time. Santry had claimed his stake to the World Featherweight Title (122 lbs) by virtue of his knockout victory over Ben Jordan of England. Referee: George Siler. Santry was down once in the second and again in the fourth. Santry tried to keep his distance in the fifth, but when he realized that it was impossible Eddie bravely made a stand, which would turn out to be a mistake as Terry thrived on that type of fighting. Both were swinging wildly when a McGovern uppercut stopped Santry in his tracks and caused him to drop his guard and Terry instantly seized the opportunity and dropped a left to the jaw followed by a right to the ear as Santry was falling. Eddie fell face first and rolled over. At the count of nine Santry got to his knees and tried to straighten himself up, but was unable to do so and referee Siler gave the bout to McGovern by knockout in five. McGovern did not have a mark on him when he left the ring. Cripple Creek Morning Times. I have a great write-up from the Chicago Tribune by George Siler, who referee’d the fight.
Mar 9 vs. Oscar Gardner: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. WKO 3 BDE
--Featherweight Championship of the World; Weights: 123 - 123 ½. Referee: Johnny White. A left to the jaw put Terry down in the first round, but McGovern rose with a vengeance and his attack on Gardner was of cyclonic proportions. Gardner went down three times, each time almost taking the count. A left hook to the neck put Oscar down and out.
Mar 15 vs. Eddie Lenny: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Industrial Hall AC. WTKO 2 PN
--Time: 1:45
Apr 17 vs. Tommy White: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. WPTS 6 BDE
--Att: 12,000. White was mainly on the defensive while Terry was the aggressor throughout.
Apr 20 vs. Tommy Warren: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. When the match was made, Sam Harris, the champion's manager, did not know anything about Warren, or the bout never would have taken place. When Harris did learn about him he tried to have the match declared off, but the club insisted that he carry out his contract. At 8:30 o'clock last evening he again asked that it be canceled, but had to live up to the articles. Warren, who is about 45 years old, weighed fully 140 pounds, but did not look to be in any kind of shape. Terry was afraid to hit him hard and only tapped him lightly. Twice Warren went down from right hand swings and he was weak when the round closed. The crowd began hooting when they saw what Warren really was and the club officials decided to call it off. Brooklyn Daily Eagle W TKO 1
May 21 vs. Elwood McCloskey: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Penn Art AC. W NWS 6BDE
Jun 12 vs. Tommy White: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Seaside AC. WKO 3 BDE
--Featherweight Championship of the World. White was down seven times in the third and final round.
Jun 23 vs. George Dixon: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. Dixon’s record prior to entering the ring was 51-6-23 (30 KO). W PTS 6 BDE
Jul 16 vs. Frank Erne: This bout took place in New York, NY at Madison Square Garden. Erne had a record of 28-2-12 (13 KO) prior to the contest. Attendance: 14,000 (est). Erne was certainly the more clever of the two, but McGovern’s onslaught was so fierce, as it always is, that Erne could not hold him off. Erne, the World Lightweight Champion, had agreed to to get down to 128, which is five pounds below the lightweight limit for the bout. McGovern was sent to his knees in the first round after Erne landed a straight left to the chin, but Terry was up and on the attack again. In the third round a fusillade of punches to the body and head put Erne down for a nine count and he was a mask of crimson as he gallantly reached his feet. McGovern met him with another volley of punches and for a short time Erne tried to mix it with Terry, but McGovern’s attack was too fierce and Erne sank to the canvas. Courageously Erne was up again before the ten-count was tolled, but he was visibly in very bad shape and as Terry stalked and measured his opponent Frank’s seconds threw in the sponge signaling that McGovern was Erne’s master by technical knockout in three rounds. It was probably McGovern’s greatest performance and with it came Terry’s third knockout of current world champions all within nine months time; bantamweight, featherweight and lightweight world champions all fell under the furious onslaught that was Terry McGovern in the ring!
Nov 2 vs. Joe Bernstein: This bout took place in Louisville, KY at the Nonpareil AC. (2:05)WKO 7 BDE
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
Nov 13 vs. Kid Broad: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. W PTS 6 BDE
Dec 13 vs. Joe Gans: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. Gans entered the ring sporting a record of 73-4-7 (52 KO). An article in the Durango Democrat of Colorado stated that McGovern was now the undisputed World Lightweight Champion. The bout itself was a “fake” on Gans part as he laid down, but it was evident that Terry was not in on the fix and went about fighting in his usual manner while Gans put forth a terrible display. Referee: George Siler. Time: 2:05 W KO 2 BDE

1901
Apr 30 vs. Oscar Gardner: This bout took place in San Francisco, CA at Mechanic’s Pavilion. WKO 4BDE
--Featherweight Championship of the World. Gardner went down repeatedly from Terry’s attack.
May 29 vs. Aurelio Herrera: This bout took place in San Francisco, CA at Mechanic’s Pavilion. Featherweight Championship of the World. Herrera stepped into the ring undefeated with a record of 20-0-3 (20 KO).
W KO 4 TT
Nov 28 vs. Young Corbett II: This bout took place in Hartford, CT at the Nutmeg AC. Corbett had a record of 32-4-7 (26 KO) going into the fight. (1:44) L KO 2 BDE
--Featherweight Championship of the World; Corbett weighed 126 lbs.

1902
Feb 22 vs. Dave Sullivan: This bout took place in Louisville, KY at the Southern AC. Sullivan carried a record of 23-8-16 (17 KO) into the bout. Some sources report this bout as a Lightweight Championship of the World contest. After fifteen grueling rounds in one of the best fights that was ever witnessed in Louisville, “Terrible” Terry came out on top with a technical knockout. It was not one of the whirlwind victories that has made Terry such an instant success, but instead a battle of attrition and one of the most difficult struggles of McGovern’s career in the ring. For the first ten rounds the battle was about as even as it could get with both men fighting furiously. Terry took over in the tenth round and in the eleventh round he floored Sullivan and upon rising it was evident that it was know only a matter of time before McGovern slipped his special brand of sleeping potion over to Sullivan. Sullivan was exhausted as the twelfth round started and from then on he was mainly in a defensive survival mode, but McGovern would not be denied that which he loved most…a knockout! Making a final stand Sullivan put together a nice little rally in the fourteenth round, but by the end of the round McGovern’s attack had Sullivan clinching for dear life as Terry blasted lefts and rights to his opponents head and body. Sullivan, game to the core, started another rally in the fifteenth round, but he was down quickly. Sullivan was not out cold, but as he rose before the fatal ten count McGovern came at him like the beast he was and Dave just sank back down to the canvas at which time referee, Bob Fitzsimmons, wisely called a halt and awarded the win to McGovern. Brooklyn Daily Eagle

1903
Feb 6 vs. Joe Bernstein: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Industrial Hall AC. After a year out of the ring, McGovern returned to the ring wars to face an old rival in Joe Bernstein this being their third bout against one another; Terry won the previous two, the last by knockout. Industrial Hall was packed long before the main bout came on. At no point during the bout did Bernstein have an advantage and although he finished on his feet through six rounds McGovern gave Bernstein considerable punishment and beat him decisively. Joe did land some hard shots on occasion, but he always took a drubbing in return. Terry did most of his work to the body and it was evident that the “old power” still lingered in McGovern’s lethal fists and had any of the vicious body blows landed to Bernstein’s head he would have surely took a nap on the canvas. Joe was down for a nine-count in the fifth round, but Terry was unable to put him away as Bernstein still possessed the heart of a winner although he lost. Not being able to put Bernstein away also may have been because of McGovern’s lengthy hiatus out of the ring, but Terry was in splendid condition physically and he fought fast throughout all six rounds and looked as though he could have went several more rounds had the occasion called for it. Philadelphia Evening Bulletin
Feb 25 vs. Billy Maynard: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Penn Art AC. W KO 4 PEB
Mar 31 vs. Young Corbett II: Featherweight Championship of the World. This bout took place in San Francisco, CA at Mechanic’s Pavilion. Corbett entered the ring with a record of 39-4-8 (30 KO). At 8:30 P.M. the betting was 10 to 9 in favor of McGovern. The fight was fast and neither man showed a bit of idleness. Corbett had a shade in nearly every round and when he stunned Terry in the eleventh round, Corbett seized the moment and went after Terry without letting up until McGovern sank to the floor a battered and beaten man! Terry was down for a seven-count in the first round and again in the second. George Harding was timekeeper and he stated that the blows that put Terry out were left and right swings to the head followed by a right uppercut to the chin. The big amphitheatre was packed with an estimated 11,000 screaming fans, which was the largest crowd to ever witness a bout in San Francisco at that point in time. Corbett was attended by Alex Greggains, Tim McGraw, Billy Otts and Harry Tuthill. McGovern was accompanied by Sam Harris, Charlie Mayhood, Eddie Cain and Joe Angelo. Ed Graney was referee. Corbett came in at 127 and McGovern was several pounds under the required weight. Both me were in excellent condition and gave it their all until Corbett was declared the victor in round eleven! Daily Kennebec Journal
Sep 26 vs. Lew Ryall: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. W NWS 6 DDR
Oct 3 vs. Billy Willis: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. Willis was game and although he was greatly overmatched he gave McGovern six tough rounds. Terry fought like the “Terry of old,” as he lit into his opponent in whirlwind fashion, but he was met head on by the scrappy Willis. Only once did Billy try to stall. It was in the fourth round after McGovern had landed a brutal right hand to the body and Willis, who was visibly weakened by the blow, did not hesitate to save himself by holding on. With that one exception, Willis met and fought McGovern every inch of the way. Willis put up the fight of his life, but McGovern was master of the bout in all six rounds. Willis came into the bout with a record of 36-6-18 (10 KO) in 61 total bouts. Milwaukee Free Press
Oct 20 vs. Jimmy Briggs: This bout took place in Boston, MA. For the first ten rounds it seemed as though McGovern had lost the “it” that he use to possess and a favorable decision in his favor was greatly in doubt. However, through great ring generalship Terry had his opponent at his mercy by the time the bout ended as he dealt out some terrible punishment upon his foe, but Terry never could land the homerun punch. During the last two rounds, McGovern landed around twenty shots that he put every ounce of his strength into. Briggs took it well, but he was a well-beaten fighter by this time. Briggs was overly game, but over matched. The men were teeing off at one another when the bell rang ending the fight. ***
--Briggs came into the bout with a record of 47-11-20 (18 KO) in 78 total bouts.
Dec 19 vs. Billy Willis: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. W NWS 6 PR
--Willis came into this bout with a record of 42-7-18 (9 KO) in 68 total bouts. A right to the jaw dropped Willis in the second round.

1904
Jan 1 vs. Leo Henninger: The bout took place in Allentown, PA. A right to the body ended the fight. Henninger was several pounds heavier than Terry and from the very beginning of the first round Leo tried to use it to his advantage. Time and again Henninger went straight at McGovern, which was met with hard shots to the stomach and head and by rounds end Henninger was ducking, dodging and holding on for survival. McGovern came out with a vengeance and a snarl in the second and was on top of Henninger before he could get his hands up. A feint to the body gave Terry the opening he was looking for and viscous right cross to the chin dropped Henninger for a nine count. As he staggered to his feet Leo was met with a savage barrage of punches and was soon hung over the ropes by a quick one-two punch. As Henninger bounced off the ropes Terry had him measured and cut loose a long right which crashed home with telling effect and McGovern watched as his opponent was counted out in the second round. Police Gazette
Apr 10 vs. George Barton: The bout took place in St. Paul, MN. L PTS 6 --
Oct 10 vs. Eddie Hanlon: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Industrial Hall AC. WTKO 4 PR

1905
Oct 18 vs. "Harlem" Tommy Murphy: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. The large club house was packed with 3,500 fans (tickets sold-out) that showed up to witness the bout and were given a treat as McGovern come out like the McGovern of old and annihilated Murphy at 2:08 (some list 2:02) of the first round. Terry beat Murphy into such a helpless state that referee Jack McGuigan had no other alternative other than to stop the bout. Murphy was knocked down four times during the brief encounter and Terry left the ring without a scratch. The articles of agreement called for 127 pounds at 6:00 P.M., and both were under that weight. Betting was pretty lively at even money. Both men appeared to be in good condition when they entered the ring. When the gong sounded the men went right after one another. Murphy was little impressed with McGovern’s reputation as a brawler and stood there toe-to-toe with the terror of Brooklyn on even terms until Terry landed one of his famous straight rights and down Murphy went. It was a devastating punch and it was clear to everyone present that Murphy was in a bad way. As he reached his feet at the count of nine, Murphy staggered across the ring and met with a right uppercut that dropped him like he had been shot! Up again at the count of nine, Murphy was hit with a hard left to the jaw that almost sent him through the ropes, but was pushed back by spectators and turned around into a storm of blows. At this point Tommy was defenseless and after McGovern dropped him on two more occasions referee McGuigan stopped the bout and awarded McGovern the win by technical knockout at 2:08 of the first round. Philadelphia Public Ledger
1906
Mar 14 vs. Oscar "Battling" Nelson: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. L NWS 6PN
Att: (5000 est) Nelson entered the ring with a record of 40-10-13 (25 KO).
May 28 vs. Jimmy Britt: The bout took place in New York, NY at Madison Square Garden. Britt’s record coming in was 11-4-1 (5 KO). Att: 4000 (est). Referee: Tim Hurst. W NWS 10 TT
Oct 17 vs. Young Corbett II: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. Corbett had a record of 56-10-10 (42 KO) coming into the fight. The bout was one of the bloodiest and most brutal ever witnessed in the city. W NWS 6 PN

1908
May 16 vs. Young Loughrey: The bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. Going into the bout, Loughrey had a record of 48-21-21 (17 KO). According to the DKJ, Loughrey had the better of the mill. Daily Kennebec Journal has a good write-up of the bout. Daily Kennebec Journal
May 26 vs. Frank "Spike" Robson: The bout took place in New York, NY at the National AC. The bout was somewhat tame. McGovern started well and landed enough blows to knock out any man had the punches had any steam on them. In the sixth round there was a glimpse of the McGovern of old, but the strength was not there. According to the Washington Post the bout was even. Washington Post



Exhibition Bouts

1900
Feb 21 George Dixon New York, NY EX 3 PI
Dec 8 Tommy White Milwaukee, WI EX 4 --

1901
Jan 18 Louden Campbell Pittsburgh, PA (Bijou Theater) EX 4 PI
--Campbell was down three times. Every round was a slugging match and Campbell gave McGovern some good shots and gave such a good account of himself that his friends want to see him face Terry in a ten round bout.
Apr 12 Danny Dougherty Denver, CO (Colorado AC) EX 4 CNP
Apr 12 Danny Dougherty Denver, CO (Denver Wheel Club) EX 4 CNP
-The previous 2 bouts were held the same date
Sep 28 Joe Tipman Baltimore, MD EX 2 --
Nov 10 Kid Abel Chicago, IL EX 4 --
Dec 3 John Donahue Reading, PA EX 2 PI

1904
Dec 16 Johnny Burdick Pittsfield, MA EX 4 --

1905
Dec -- Johnny Burdick Boston, MA EX -- --

Scheduled Bouts

1897
Mar 17 William Downey Brooklyn, NY (Broadway AC) SCH

McGovern as Referee

1901
May 2 Al Neill [KO 1] Jim Trimble Bakersfield, CA


Notes

Moved to Brooklyn from Pennsylvania when he was about a year old.

Short blows to the body followed by a viscous straight right is McGovern’s strongest asset, particularly his work to the body.

Died of pneumonia and kidney ailment in the charity ward of King's County Hospital, Brooklyn, New, York, USA, on February 22, 1918.
http://www.antekprizering.com/mcgovernobitpage.html
Inducted into the International Boxing Hall of Fame.

Measurements for his first bout against George Dixon

McGovern Corbett
Neck:
Biceps:
Forearm:
Chest:
Wrist:
Waist:
Thigh:
Calf:

Measurements for his bout against Frank Erne

McGovern Corbett
Neck:
Biceps:
Forearm:
Chest:
Wrist:
Waist:
Thigh:
Calf:


Measurements for his first bout against Young Corbett 11/28/1901

McGovern Corbett
Age 21 21
Height 5-3 5-2 1/2
Neck 14 1/4 15
Chest 33 1/2 36
Chest (expanded) 35 1/2 38
Waist 27 1/2 29
Thigh 19 1/2 19 1/2
Calf 13 13
Biceps 13 13
Forearm 10 11
Reach 65 66 ½

Measurements for his second bout against Young Corbett

McGovern Corbett
Neck:
Biceps:
Forearm:
Chest:
Wrist:
Waist:
Thigh:
Calf:

KO % .5375 (43 Knockouts in 80 Total Bouts)



Sources
BDE= Brooklyn Daily Eagle
REG= Reno Evening Gazette
NYW= New York World (Courtesy of Deepak)
PG= Police Gazette
PEB= Philadelphia Evening Bulletin (Courtesy of Harry Shaffer)
PR= Philadelphia Record Yearly Results (Courtesy of Chuck Hasson)
PN= Philly Newspaper Clipping (Courtesy of Chuck Hasson)
DNSJ= Daily Nevada State Journal
RC= Record Compilation
IBRO= Additions and Corrections from IBRO Journals
NDN= Naugatuck Daily News
BDW= Bangor Daily Whig
WP= Washington Post
TT= Trenton Times
Various Newspaper Clips from Harry Shaffer