BoxRec

Kalan wrote:http://bleacherreport.com/articles/6611 ... f-all-time

Any British list I've seen doesn't have those boys on it.

Harvey fought for the title 3 times and lost to Thil and Lewis who were both exceptional fighters. Mcavoy was a killer puncher who went over to the states and fought the current champ Risko but in a non title affair. Jock won in 2 minutes. Harvey was good as a light heavy that he had to fight heavyweights like jack peterson and larry gains - who apart from joe louis was the best black heavy of the 30s. Harvey beat him twice. He had 146 fights and was only koed once in his last fight. Macavoy fought at the highest level throughout the 30s and koed 88 men - he went over to the states - had four fights - won them all but all the middles were too scared to face him so, he got a shot at...john henry lewis and got outpointed.

Two truly great fighters who would have won multiple belts in multiple weight divisions if they were around today. You could see mcavoy winning straps at middle, super middle for sure and a portion of the lt heavy. Harvey would certainly garner some lt heavy straps and maybe cruiser too.

Oh and both were far far better than bruno. bruno lost to every world class boxer he faced until he met the messed up mcCall. In fact, look at frank's resume and apart from that win - where he just just about got over the line, he doesn't have a good win against any decent heavy in his prime - he was very carefully matched with past it guys like bugner or quick tillis or gerry coetzee but put him in with smith, witherspoon, lewis or tyson and he gets beaten up. So, you have two fighters who were so good they had to figure outside their weight class and only lost to the best lt heavy of the 30s and defo one of the top3 middles of the 30s - who both had multiple wins against top class boxers - or a guy who had cherry picked opponents for years and lost pretty much every time he went into the big league.

Frank Bruno was sorry. A big man like that got pushed over by a little guy like Iron Mike is beyond my imagination.

scorpio83 wrote:What I've found about John Henry Lewis that this past season of Finding Your Roots, DNA revealed that he was rapper L.L. Cool J's great-uncle and John Henry's brother Christy Lewis was the biological father of LL's mother.

Wow! It is Great to know that.

Kalan wrote:

APerno wrote:Lewis should never have been detained in the first place. I am certain that everyone on this board agrees that when one of these warrior, those fighters we all so respect, climbs through the ropes, he knows full well that he is placing his life in jeopardy, and if what occurred that night was in-fact a sanctioned (legal) prize fight

It's shocking that John Henry Lewis would be arrested because an opponent died in a fight. That would be like a fire fighter rushing into a burning building, grabs a man who passed out, and runs out carrying his body... and afterwards he's arrested because the man he tried to save died of smoke inhalation.. or a surgeon being arrested because the person his team was trying to transplant a heart for died on the operating table.. In certain jobs, death can be part of the job.. People in law enforcement should understand this more than most.

maybe they were ijust nterested in finding out if maybe his gloves were loaded,before he left town.

Caractacus wrote:

Kalan wrote:

APerno wrote:Lewis should never have been detained in the first place. I am certain that everyone on this board agrees that when one of these warrior, those fighters we all so respect, climbs through the ropes, he knows full well that he is placing his life in jeopardy, and if what occurred that night was in-fact a sanctioned (legal) prize fight

It's shocking that John Henry Lewis would be arrested because an opponent died in a fight. That would be like a fire fighter rushing into a burning building, grabs a man who passed out, and runs out carrying his body... and afterwards he's arrested because the man he tried to save died of smoke inhalation.. or a surgeon being arrested because the person his team was trying to transplant a heart for died on the operating table.. In certain jobs, death can be part of the job.. People in law enforcement should understand this more than most.

maybe they were ijust nterested in finding out if maybe his gloves were loaded,before he left town.

That is a fair thought, (and possible) but I believe he was held for two days until the autopsy was completed.

well, I was just wondering what was usually done back in the old days (pre-1940)
whenever a fighter died in the ring.
Did Arthur Pelkey have to stick around town when they were doing on autopsy on Luther McCarty ?

Caractacus wrote:well, I was just wondering what was usually done back in the old days (pre-1940)
whenever a fighter died in the ring.
Did Arthur Pelkey have to stick around town when they were doing on autopsy on Luther McCarty ?

I am unaware of the fight - but I am certain that you are correct, things were definitely done different pre-1956 (pre-Warren Court) - I also want to go back to your statement about 'loaded gloves' - whereas I stated that a fighter should never be held accountable for another fighter's death - well when you add in any kind of cheating (especially loaded gloves) then I believe you are looking at a horse of a different color, likely a manslaughter charge - so certainly he should never have been allowed to leave town until they were certain the fight was a 'fair fight'

When was the Pelkey fight? - and how did they handle that fight compared to the way they handled the Mancini-Kim fight ? The Davey Moore fight falls right into that sweet spot (1963) when procedural law was be blown-up and restructured by the Warren Court. - that would be an interesting situation to look at . . .

elmersalsa wrote:Frank Bruno was sorry. A big man like that got pushed over by a little guy like Iron Mike is beyond my imagination.

Haha, yes little Mike Tyson shouldn't be able to push anyone about should he?

Prime vs prime, could see Lewis beating Conn.

Nile4000 wrote: ↑12 Jan 2018, 21:10 Prime vs prime, could see Lewis beating Conn.

I agree, but could John Henry Lewis beat Billy Conn in 1939 had Lewis not retired due to eye problems?

scorpio83 wrote: ↑13 Jan 2018, 04:17

Nile4000 wrote: ↑12 Jan 2018, 21:10 Prime vs prime, could see Lewis beating Conn.

I agree, but could John Henry Lewis beat Billy Conn in 1939 had Lewis not retired due to eye problems?

In all the honesty, probably not.

Nile4000 wrote: ↑15 Jan 2018, 01:12

scorpio83 wrote: ↑13 Jan 2018, 04:17

Nile4000 wrote: ↑12 Jan 2018, 21:10 Prime vs prime, could see Lewis beating Conn.

I agree, but could John Henry Lewis beat Billy Conn in 1939 had Lewis not retired due to eye problems?

In all the honesty, probably not.

Thanks for your opinion, but I think Lewis would out-boxed Conn to a decision win in 15 rounds with his experience and counter his attempted attacks should Conn tried to brawl with him. That is my opinion.

That's a great viewpoint, the thing is, how advanced is John Henry's eye problem?