BoxRec Boxing Hall of Fame, Round 3 ballots - CLOSED

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 30 Apr 2006, 21:31

J-C wrote:Lou Ambers
Carmine Basilio
Jack Britton
Newsboy Brown
Tony Canzoneri
Kid Cocolate
Billy Conn
Jack Dempsey (Non Pareil)
George Dixon
Johnny Dundee
Joe Frazier
Bob Foster
Kid Galvin
Emile Griffith
Fighting Harada
Harold Johnson
Jake Lamotta
Ted Kid Lewis
Sonny Liston
Freddie Mller
Ruben Olivares
Maxie Rosenbloom
John L Sullivan
(Barbados) Joe Walcott
Ike Williams

Why on earth would somebody NOT nomiante Gene Tunney, but instead a whole bucketload of borderline candidates including Maxie Rosenbloom, who didn't equal Tunney not even at l-h.

JC · Post by JC » 01 May 2006, 07:34

pundit wrote:
J-C wrote:Lou Ambers
Carmine Basilio
Jack Britton
Newsboy Brown
Tony Canzoneri
Kid Cocolate
Billy Conn
Jack Dempsey (Non Pareil)
George Dixon
Johnny Dundee
Joe Frazier
Bob Foster
Kid Galvin
Emile Griffith
Fighting Harada
Harold Johnson
Jake Lamotta
Ted Kid Lewis
Sonny Liston
Freddie Miller
Ruben Olivares
Maxie Rosenbloom
John L Sullivan
(Barbados) Joe Walcott
Ike Williams
Why on earth would somebody NOT nomiante Gene Tunney, but instead a whole bucketload of borderline candidates including Maxie Rosenbloom, who didn't equal Tunney not even at l-h.

To be honest I assumed Tunney was already in, I don't consider Rosenbloom a boarderline candidate but if you do, fair enough.

I'll admit Newsboy Brown and Johnny Dundee are probably sentimental picks, I've been reading up on newspaper reports on both of late and that probably influenced by choice.

As for the rest being a bucketload of boarderline candidates, you're entitled to your opinion I'm not going to waste time arguing about it.

Kidlefty, this is a good idea keep up the good work!

sockdolager · Post by **sockdolager** » 01 May 2006, 08:36

Carmen Basillio
Wilfred Benitez
Kid Chocolate
Billy Conn
Jim Corbett
Les Darcy
Joe Frazier
Khaosai Galaxy
Joe Gans
Kid Gavilan
Wilfredo Gomez
Jim Jeffires
Jake LaMotta
Sonny Liston
Tommy Loughran
Carlos Ortiz
Floyd Patterson
Aaron Pryor
Barney Ross
Salvador Sanchez
Michael Spinks
John L. Sullivan
Gene Tunney
Ike Williams
Fritze Zivic

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 01 May 2006, 09:53

J-C wrote:
pundit wrote:
J-C wrote:Lou Ambers
Carmine Basilio
Jack Britton
Newsboy Brown
Tony Canzoneri
Kid Cocolate
Billy Conn
Jack Dempsey (Non Pareil)
George Dixon
Johnny Dundee
Joe Frazier
Bob Foster
Kid Galvin
Emile Griffith
Fighting Harada
Harold Johnson
Jake Lamotta
Ted Kid Lewis
Sonny Liston
Freddie Miller
Ruben Olivares
Maxie Rosenbloom
John L Sullivan
(Barbados) Joe Walcott
Ike Williams
Why on earth would somebody NOT nomiante Gene Tunney, but instead a whole bucketload of borderline candidates including Maxie Rosenbloom, who didn't equal Tunney not even at l-h.
To be honest I assumed Tunney was already in, I don't consider Rosenbloom a boarderline candidate but if you do, fair enough.

I'll admit Newsboy Brown and Johnny Dundee are probably sentimental picks, I've been reading up on newspaper reports on both of late and that probably influenced by choice.

As for the rest being a bucketload of boarderline candidates, you're entitled to your opinion I'm not going to waste time arguing about it.

Kidlefty, this is a good idea keep up the good work!

I admit "borderline candidates" was a bit harsh.

JC · Post by JC » 01 May 2006, 10:08

I'm thinking leaving out Terry McGovern was a big mistake, but then there are just sooo many others too.

kidlefty · Post by **kidlefty** » 01 May 2006, 11:54

J-C wrote:
pundit wrote:
J-C wrote:To be honest I assumed Tunney was already in.

Everyone ought to double-check the list of fighters who have already been enshrined at the top of this thread.

Keep up the good work everyone, let's get a lot of ballots for this one.

kidlefty · Post by **kidlefty** » 01 May 2006, 11:55

And don't forget, you can continue editing and revising your ballot right on up until May 25. Don't be shy.

elmersalsa · Post by **elmersalsa** » 01 May 2006, 15:48

kidlefty wrote:
elmersalsa wrote:Hello kidlefty:

These are my 25 inductees for April 25th, even though is kind of late:

Sugar Ray Leonard
Joe Walcott

Leonard isn't eligible yet (10 year rule), and do you mean Barbados Joe or Jersey Joe?

I mean The Barbados Demon Joe Walcott

Sorry about SRL. I thought he retired 10 years ago. Let me put Ted "Kid" Lewis

JCS · Post by **JCS** » 01 May 2006, 16:50

pundit wrote:
kidlefty wrote:
Mattyp151 wrote:Jake Lamotta
Joe Frazier

jcs83md wrote:Wow, being able to vote in a million people is monotonous.

Salvador Sanchez
Jake LaMotta
Joe Frazier
Carmen Basilioi
Bob Foster
Tony Canzoneri
Ike Williams
Wilfredo Gomez
Actually, the ballot is 25 max. Someone has to be on 75% of the ballots to get in, so I don't see more than 7 or 8 at the very most making it this round.

I have no problem with people submitting shorter ballots if they really feel like no one else is worthy of induction, but excessively short ones are a little more suspect. I can't assume that a ballot with just two names is not an official entry. jcs, you're a little closer, but are you sure that those are the only fighters you think deserve induction?
I'd enforece the 25 rule strictly. I'll complement mine

Why? pretty soon there won't be 25. I'm not interested enough to vote on 25. SHould be like 10 a turn.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 01 May 2006, 17:37

jcs83md wrote:
pundit wrote:
kidlefty wrote: Actually, the ballot is 25 max. Someone has to be on 75% of the ballots to get in, so I don't see more than 7 or 8 at the very most making it this round.

I have no problem with people submitting shorter ballots if they really feel like no one else is worthy of induction, but excessively short ones are a little more suspect. I can't assume that a ballot with just two names is not an official entry. jcs, you're a little closer, but are you sure that those are the only fighters you think deserve induction?
I'd enforece the 25 rule strictly. I'll complement mine
Why? pretty soon there won't be 25. I'm not interested enough to vote on 25. SHould be like 10 a turn.

This is also fine; but whatever # of fighters is set this should be enforced, otherwise chances are slim to get the necessary percentage of votes.

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 01 May 2006, 22:02

As Kid Lefty has said, you have until the deadline to revise your picks, and if you want you can pick just 1 fighter. Realistically I think 25 allows for some very interesting picks, and a quick look at the IBHOF shows you we're not going overboard picking too many.

Personally, I don't think it's a good idea for us to be second guessing each others picks, because we can debate who was better than who on any other thread, without tying up the ballots. Plus I think everyone without exception wonders why certain fighters they've picked aren't picking up the votes. With me it's Packey McFarland and Jimmy McLarnin. The former lost his 7th fight, and that was it for a 110 fight career. One loss and an 11 and a half year unbeaten streak. And the latter, in a 68 fight career managed to defeat 12 Hall of Famers. By comparison Sugar Ray Robinson beat 10 in 200 fights, and Harry Greb beat 10 in 299.

kidlefty · Post by **kidlefty** » 01 May 2006, 22:22

pundit wrote:
jcs83md wrote:
pundit wrote: I'd enforece the 25 rule strictly. I'll complement mine
Why? pretty soon there won't be 25. I'm not interested enough to vote on 25. SHould be like 10 a turn.
This is also fine; but whatever # of fighters is set this should be enforced, otherwise chances are slim to get the necessary percentage of votes.

jcs - keep in mind that by listing 25 people on your ballot, that does not mean that anywhere near 25 will get in any given round. More than likely, we'll have less than 8 or 9. As the consensus picks are enshrined, there'll be even less each time. I do think that a 10 fighter ballot at this time is not a good faith effort. What you are saying with that is that there only ten more fighters that you think should EVER be inducted. Is that your point?

kidlefty · Post by **kidlefty** » 01 May 2006, 22:25

Seamus wrote:As Kid Lefty has said, you have until the deadline to revise your picks, and if you want you can pick just 1 fighter. Realistically I think 25 allows for some very interesting picks, and a quick look at the IBHOF shows you we're not going overboard picking too many.

Personally, I don't think it's a good idea for us to be second guessing each others picks, because we can debate who was better than who on any other thread, without tying up the ballots. Plus I think everyone without exception wonders why certain fighters they've picked aren't picking up the votes. With me it's Packey McFarland and Jimmy McLarnin. The former lost his 7th fight, and that was it for a 110 fight career. One loss and an 11 and a half year unbeaten streak. And the latter, in a 68 fight career managed to defeat 12 Hall of Famers. By comparison Sugar Ray Robinson beat 10 in 200 fights, and Harry Greb beat 10 in 299.

I like the idea of promoting the merits of personal favorites on this thread, "lobbying" for them in essence, but you might be right about second-guessing being a bad thing. I don't want people to feel like they're gonna get shit from people by posting a ballot. It's one thing to promote why you think someone should be included, but it's not really productive to harrass someone about their picks. I don't think we should have to police this kind of stuff - we're all reasonable people here, let's just keep it civil.

kidlefty · Post by **kidlefty** » 01 May 2006, 22:31

elmersalsa wrote: Sorry about SRL. I thought he retired 10 years ago. Let me put Ted "Kid" Lewis[/size]

You must have forgotten the Macho Camacho fight, I know Ray would like to.

You ought to go ahead and edit your original post, if you haven't already.

Thanks.

sockdolager · Post by **sockdolager** » 02 May 2006, 08:59

Decagon wrote: Ray Leonard

Leonard faught in 1997.

JCS · Post by **JCS** » 02 May 2006, 15:53

kidlefty wrote:
pundit wrote:
jcs83md wrote: Why? pretty soon there won't be 25. I'm not interested enough to vote on 25. SHould be like 10 a turn.
This is also fine; but whatever # of fighters is set this should be enforced, otherwise chances are slim to get the necessary percentage of votes.
jcs - keep in mind that by listing 25 people on your ballot, that does not mean that anywhere near 25 will get in any given round. More than likely, we'll have less than 8 or 9. As the consensus picks are enshrined, there'll be even less each time. I do think that a 10 fighter ballot at this time is not a good faith effort. What you are saying with that is that there only ten more fighters that you think should EVER be inducted. Is that your point?

My point is.. that I don't feel like researching. Sorry for participating if that wasn't good enough.

kidlefty · Post by **kidlefty** » 02 May 2006, 18:11

jcs83md wrote: My point is.. that I don't feel like researching. Sorry for participating if that wasn't good enough.

No problem, participation is not mandatory.

Funny though, I'm hardly at the point where I have to do any research. The issue for me right now is keeping down to just 25.

Boxer561 · Post by **Boxer561** » 04 May 2006, 21:03

Lou Ambers
Max Baer
James J. Braddock
Otha Brown
Red Burman
Mushy Callahan
Tony DeMarco
Florentino Fernandez
Bob Foster
Beau Jack
King Levinsky
Sonny Liston
Jimmy Martinez
Vince Martinez
Bob Montgomery
Frank Moran
Casper Ortega
Willie Pastrano
Jack Root
Max Schmeling
Billy Soose
Lew Tendler
Battling Torres
Jersey Joe Walcott
Jess Willard

Expug · Post by **Expug** » 04 May 2006, 21:15

How come Im the only one that ever gives poor old Fritzie Zivic any consideration around here?

Boxer561 · Post by **Boxer561** » 04 May 2006, 21:26

Fritzie is an excellent candidate and should be in the Hall of Fame. Will probably be one of my candidate's for next month.

Keep punching, your chin down & your ass off the canvas,

Tony Triem
Boxing Historian

Expug · Post by **Expug** » 04 May 2006, 21:28

Boxer561 wrote:Fritzie is an excellent candidate and should be in the Hall of Fame. Will probably be one of my candidate's for next month.

Keep punching, your chin down & your ass off the canvas,

Tony Triem
Boxing Historian

Cheers. Thats always been one of my favorite boxing sayings.

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 04 May 2006, 22:23

I know what you mean Expug, but frankly, I can't believe I'm the only one to pick Kid McCoy and Tommy Ryan, and only one other person in addition to myself has picked, Jimmy Barry, Les Darcy, Packey McFarland and Jimmy McLarnin. Also surprised that Panama Al Brown, James J Jeffries, Terry McGovern, Philadelphia Jack O'Brien and Pascual Perez are not among the early leaders.

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 05 May 2006, 05:45

1. Panama Al Brown
2. Tony Canzoneri
3. Marcel Cerdan
4. Billy Conn
5. George Dixon
6. Jim Driscoll
7. Tiger Flowers
8. Bob Foster
9. Joe Frazier
10. Tommy Gibbons
11. Emile Griffith
12. Jim Jeffries
13. Sonny Liston
14. Terry McGovern
15. Jimmy McLarnin
16. Mauro Mina
17. Jose Napoles
18. Ruben Olivares
19. Carlos Ortiz
20. Luis Rodriguez
21. Salvador Sanchez
22. Michael Spinks
23. Gene Tunney
24. Barbados Joe Walcott
25. Carlos Zarate

kidlefty · Post by **kidlefty** » 06 May 2006, 21:56

Nice turnout so far, we've already exceeded the last round in total number of ballots submitted, and there's still plenty of time. Let's spread the word and try to beat the 20 we got for the first round.

Les Darcy · Post by **Les Darcy** » 07 May 2006, 03:41

right i have what i think is a very good question, jeff fenechs last fight was may 18 1996, the voting ends on the 25th may 2006 so by then he will be eligible, am i allowed to vote for him?

my list anyway:

Carmen Basilio
Wilfred Benitez
Tony Canzoneri
Marcel Cerdan
Billy Conn
Les Darcy
Jeff Fenech
Bob Foster
Joe Frazier
Wilfredo Gomez
Emile Griffith
Young Griffo
Masahiko Harada
Jim Jeffries
Sonny Liston
Terry McGovern
Jose Napoles
Carlos Ortiz
Aaron Pryor
Salvador Sanchez
Dave Sands
Michael Spinks
Gene Tunney
Barbados Joe Walcott
Tony Zale

BoxRec Boxing Hall of Fame, Round 3 ballots - CLOSED

My nominees