Tyson V.S. Holyfieled (In Prime)

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 07 Feb 2007, 12:06

Lou Duva said it best after Evander KO'd Tyson. He said despite claims that Holyfield was going down hill at the time, he never had any doubts that he'd beat Tyson. Why ? Because, Duva stated "You don't understand Evander, every night when he goes to bed, he fights Tyson in his dreams". I don't think you can beat someone that obsessed. It's part of a fighter's just having another guy's number, and Evander would always have Iron Mike's in my estimation.

thismodernlove · Post by **thismodernlove** » 07 Feb 2007, 12:06

you know... Tyson never fought a dude like Holyfield. Holyfield has so much guts, chin and heart, plus hes got staying power. i think what happened in their first fight (TKO 11) is basically the same thing that would happen if they were both prime.

if anything... i would say Holyfield TKO 10 because Tyson was younger and more aggressive and such... i think Holyfield is too tough for Tyson... and Holyfield wouldnt give in... and so Tyson gets KTFO again.

cultus · Post by **cultus** » 07 Feb 2007, 12:10

Ezzard wrote:Peak Holy would have reached right in and ripped Tyson's heart out just like he did when he was washed up after the Bowe fights. Once Evander gets through those early rounds and begins to turn the tide it's all over.

Ezzard my man

were does prime Tyson NOOT have heart. Please tell us!

elmersalsa · Post by **elmersalsa** » 07 Feb 2007, 12:40

People are talking about a PRIME TYSON...I never saw that prime Tyson, even when he was knocking out everybody else. He looked very amateurish against someone like Frank Bruno, another goofy-goofy guy in his own right. Holyfield had more heart and more determination and fought better than Tyson on the inside. Holyfield in his prime was a COMPLETE FIGHTER that could slug it out or box when he wanted to.

Also people always rate the speed of Tyson that was one of the fastest heavys that ever lived, but Holyfield's speed was excellent. Probably Holyfield's speed was his most UNDERRATED ASSET. He was much faster than Tyson in my view. He also knew how to fight in grueling battles of attrition, and when Tyson fought his FIRST battle of attrition against Buster Douglas, he lost big time, and by KO.

Tyson was gettinf there in terms of real prime, but in my view, I never saw it. Holyfield beats Tyson with great combinations like he did Riddick Bowe in the first fight and Tyson would have not take well those shots, because he was accostumed to give the punishment and not being the other guy at the other side of the boxing glove.

Holyfield beats Tyson by KO or by decision in spectacular fashion.

Crease · Post by **Crease** » 07 Feb 2007, 12:51

HMMMM... A Prime Tyson VERSUS A Prime Holyfield...

I would predict a Tyson KO.
(altough a Holyfield decision is certainly visible).

Some people on this forum confessed to "never seeing THE prime Tyson" as if there isn't one.

Let me just say this: Tyson, a brute? YES. a quick-tempered bulldog? YES...But amaturish, HARDLY.

Tyson had incredible explosive firepower in BOTH his fists, he was a true slugger and a crucial KO artist...
Tyson fought with a ferocity not seen since the days of Joe Frazier...And that mercilessness hasn't been seen since (and these includes Nikolai Valuev in this statement).

The only way Holyfield would be able to defeat Tyson is by frustrating him with countless jabs and pestering him with his speed...If Tyson caught Holyfield I believe the game would be over (even thought Holyfield, warrior that he is, would et back up again)...But Tyson would get him in my opinion...

JC · Post by JC » 07 Feb 2007, 13:18

Crease wrote:Tyson fought with a ferocity not seen since the days of Joe Frazier...And that mercilessness hasn't been seen since (and these includes Nikolai Valuev in this statement).

The only way Holyfield would be able to defeat Tyson is by frustrating him with countless jabs and pestering him with his speed...If Tyson caught Holyfield I believe the game would be over (even thought Holyfield, warrior that he is, would et back up again)...But Tyson would get him in my opinion...

Sorry Crease, I don't understand your arguement here are you saying that Prime Tyson's power was so much better than the version that Holyfield fought that Holyfield would not be able to take it?

If so then how do you explain Boncrusher Smith and Tony Tucker etc surviving the distance with the pre-prison Tyson?

Also was the Valuev bit a joke?

Crease · Post by **Crease** » 07 Feb 2007, 13:49

I'm saying that when Holyfield beat Tyson (twice) Tyson's power might've still remained but Tyson had become a lazy boxer. The fiery young Tyson of the late 80s had great stepwork (so that he could throw angled punches, & be that much more accurate).

The Tyson that Holyfield fought just stood toe-to-toe, he was just pounding away as hard as he could. It didn't matter if his punches hit arm, shoulder, pad or rope...He just pounded away and relied too much on his power.

That Tyson looked flustered and out-of-ideas, there was simply no creativity or ferocity in his boxing....So Yes, I would say that that was the difference.

PS. I'm trying not to slate Holyfield here, (because although I'm not a fan of his, I do repsect the man...& I'm not oblivious to his achievements at Light Heavyweight level).

PPS. Yeah, that Valuev statement was a joke...I'm sick of people going nuts about the WBA champ...Yeah the guys big, yeah he's kinds tough...But any of the ring legends would put him away (with the exception of Lewis) NO SWEAT!

turn2stone · Post by **turn2stone** » 07 Feb 2007, 14:27

Loki wrote:No HW in history would have lasted against Iron Mike of the late 80's.

Tyson KO 6.

Agreed Holyfield was a legend, but prime v prime there is only one outcome.........Big KO.

Also, Cus D'Amato was Tyson best trainer.

For what it's worth: The Tyson of 88, beats Ali, Marciano, Louis, Lewis, Johnson and Dempsey.

In terms of career, Tyson is below Holyfield and on the same level as Liston.

so....tyson can defeat everyone, but still remains ranked behind them all (which really is all about who would win against each other for the msot part). makes alot of sense

generic screen name · Post by **generic screen name** » 07 Feb 2007, 23:59

elmersalsa wrote:People are talking about a PRIME TYSON...I never saw that prime Tyson, even when he was knocking out everybody else. He looked very amateurish against someone like Frank Bruno, another goofy-goofy guy in his own right. Holyfield had more heart and more determination and fought better than Tyson on the inside. Holyfield in his prime was a COMPLETE FIGHTER that could slug it out or box when he wanted to.

Also people always rate the speed of Tyson that was one of the fastest heavys that ever lived, but Holyfield's speed was excellent. Probably Holyfield's speed was his most UNDERRATED ASSET. He was much faster than Tyson in my view. He also knew how to fight in grueling battles of attrition, and when Tyson fought his FIRST battle of attrition against Buster Douglas, he lost big time, and by KO.

Tyson was gettinf there in terms of real prime, but in my view, I never saw it. Holyfield beats Tyson with great combinations like he did Riddick Bowe in the first fight and Tyson would have not take well those shots, because he was accostumed to give the punishment and not being the other guy at the other side of the boxing glove.

Holyfield beats Tyson by KO or by decision in spectacular fashion.

Ex-friggin-actly
Holyfield said it himself, Tyson only fights one way to win forward, When they fought Holyfield implimented the perfect strategy, roughed Tyson up made him go backwards out-fouled him and intimidated back. People also talked about Tyson's speed, Holyfield wasn't exactly slow at heavyweight in his prime, he stood toe to toe w/Dokes. When they fought in '96 Holyfield was more passed his prime than Tyson.

m1kee50 · Post by **m1kee50** » 08 Feb 2007, 04:38

For what its worth

m1kee50, Holyfield, UD, close

Stace do you have Irish roots mate? you look like my pal from County Cork

The Durable Dane · Post by **The Durable Dane** » 08 Feb 2007, 13:35

I think that only Joe Luis or Muhammad Ali could have beaten a prime Mike Tyson.

The Durable Dane, Tyson, UD, wide

zuru · Post by **zuru** » 08 Feb 2007, 18:53

American Clubfighter wrote:If they would have fought at the top of there game who would have won? Tyson+Rooney V.S. Holyfield+Duva

Be strait and not a hater bitch either !

Who would have won ?????????????

Tyson in his prime was awesome and a true potential GREAT! As brave and durable as Holyfield was,he in no way, shape, or form,could have beaten a "Prime" Tyson.Look at the big,strong,durable skilled Heavys that Tyson beat,not bums,but Champs,and guys in their prime,no,Tyson may have been a disappointment,but in his prime,few had a chance against him,past or present.His combination of speed,power,and explosiveness,was unequalled in my opinion,
zuru

cultus · Post by **cultus** » 09 Feb 2007, 04:52

turn2stone wrote:
Loki wrote:No HW in history would have lasted against Iron Mike of the late 80's.

Tyson KO 6.

Agreed Holyfield was a legend, but prime v prime there is only one outcome.........Big KO.

Also, Cus D'Amato was Tyson best trainer.

For what it's worth: The Tyson of 88, beats Ali, Marciano, Louis, Lewis, Johnson and Dempsey.

In terms of career, Tyson is below Holyfield and on the same level as Liston.
so....tyson can defeat everyone, but still remains ranked behind them all (which really is all about who would win against each other for the msot part). makes alot of sense

read the fine print

In terms of career

I swear im not a stalker

just have nothing else to do at the moment.

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 09 Feb 2007, 05:18

cultus wrote:
Ezzard wrote:Peak Holy would have reached right in and ripped Tyson's heart out just like he did when he was washed up after the Bowe fights. Once Evander gets through those early rounds and begins to turn the tide it's all over.
Ezzard my man were does prime Tyson NOOT have heart. Please tell us!

Hi Cultus

I'm not saying he didn't have heart but I think in both fights with Holy Tyson's spirit was slowly crushed and I see that happening 80% of the time when they meet.

cultus · Post by **cultus** » 09 Feb 2007, 05:31

Ezzard wrote:
cultus wrote:
Ezzard wrote:Peak Holy would have reached right in and ripped Tyson's heart out just like he did when he was washed up after the Bowe fights. Once Evander gets through those early rounds and begins to turn the tide it's all over.
Ezzard my man were does prime Tyson NOOT have heart. Please tell us!
Hi Cultus

I'm not saying he didn't have heart but I think in both fights with Holy Tyson's spirit was slowly crushed and I see that happening 80% of the time when they meet.

Ezzard;)

I understand your point.

What im saying is that Tyson did not care no more after the jail that's why he's spirit was crushed. But not in the 80's. Tyson then was in completely differente state of mind. Holyfield would have been the best he had fought, still, you can not transfer after jail Tyson to his prime times.

it would have been a close battle.. and I certainly see Tyson being beaten. But not by Holyfield's will and Tyson's lack of heart. Tyson was 110 percent determined back then.

walshb · Post by **walshb** » 09 Feb 2007, 07:39

Mike definitely has a better chance, but Holy's prome was quite impressive and his speed was great.
I think his heart, stamina, chin and confidence will see him beat Tyson, who lacked the mental depth Holy had.

Tyson V.S. Holyfieled (In Prime)

Who would have won ????

Re: Tyson V.S. Holyfieled (In Prime)