Williams V Gammer RBR anyone??????

JC · Post by JC » 02 Mar 2007, 19:25

Has there ever been anyone as inconsitent as Danny Williams?

lvlarc · Post by **lvlarc** » 02 Mar 2007, 19:31

I agree if Danny is to stick around then he shouldn't bother wasting time rehashing fights with Skelton/Sprott/Harrison, not much comes of them. I don't give him much chance against any of the champs, too hot and cold. I think he should def go the EBU route. Let's just hope he lays off the cakes!

rhino222 · Post by **rhino222** » 02 Mar 2007, 19:35

well.....i called the williams KO but it took a bit longer than i thought. even before the fight i thought gammer looked like an amateur on the pads, every time he threw a shot he dropped his defensive hand, therefore he was wide open.

lets be honest, danny is way past his best, so it goes to show how poor gammer is as british champion, yes he was ok defensively (when he was not throwing shots), yes he threw a few combos to williams unprotected abdo region, but in the grand scheme of thiongs gammer was clueless when williams popped out the jab repeatedly then followed it in with some heavy artillery. perhaps the first opponent gammer had had who could hit back !!

all in all im over the moon for danny, lovely guy and nice to see him with a belt on again. but he is right to be considering his career, because where does he go from here....

the public dont want him to fight audley again for the third time, they dont want him to fight sprott again for the forth time.

its a shame that the 'old guard' are still streets better than the new heavies. the domestic scene is empty of talent below the age of 30, we are going to have a 5 year lull im afraid in decent british heavyweight, unless david haye comes to the fore.

the likes of mullarvie etc are still 5 years off the pace.

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 02 Mar 2007, 19:38

rhino222 wrote:its a shame that the 'old guard' are still streets better than the new heavies. the domestic scene is empty of talent below the age of 30, we are going to have a 5 year lull im afraid in decent british heavyweight, unless david haye comes to the fore.

the likes of mullarvie etc are still 5 years off the pace.

perhaps maybe this tyson fury can be a factor somewhere down the line.

obviously david haye will keep us interested for now.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 02 Mar 2007, 19:53

rhino222 wrote:well.....i called the williams KO but it took a bit longer than i thought. even before the fight i thought gammer looked like an amateur on the pads, every time he threw a shot he dropped his defensive hand, therefore he was wide open.

lets be honest, danny is way past his best, so it goes to show how poor gammer is as british champion, yes he was ok defensively (when he was not throwing shots), yes he threw a few combos to williams unprotected abdo region, but in the grand scheme of thiongs gammer was clueless when williams popped out the jab repeatedly then followed it in with some heavy artillery. perhaps the first opponent gammer had had who could hit back !!

all in all im over the moon for danny, lovely guy and nice to see him with a belt on again. but he is right to be considering his career, because where does he go from here....

the public dont want him to fight audley again for the third time, they dont want him to fight sprott again for the forth time.

its a shame that the 'old guard' are still streets better than the new heavies. the domestic scene is empty of talent below the age of 30, we are going to have a 5 year lull im afraid in decent british heavyweight, unless david haye comes to the fore.

the likes of mullarvie etc are still 5 years off the pace.

Danny might be past his prime, but that was his best performance in some time. Even his punch resistance was better - if you consider that Gammer stopped Krence and Audley never hurt Krence. I don't think Gammer hurt Danny at all. Crying shame he wasn't in that shape for his peak years - and AGAIN Danny didn't seem to be thinking that the improved speed was down to his reduced weight. I think Danny would be better again say in July fighting at this weight - I think he will be able to sustain attacks more when more used to the weight.

I do agree with your assessment of Gammer- I'm not sure he has the proffesionalism to make it. I live by him, sparred with him and do know his father. I know that about 2-3 years before turning pro - Gammer had no intention of turning over.... I definately had the impression that the standard of competition around was the primary reason for turning over. Would need a more proffesional approach should he make it.

I still think the crowd would come to see Harrison vs Williams, if there is a chance Harrison will fall - people will come to see.

leforge · Post by **leforge** » 02 Mar 2007, 20:28

Haye would beat most of the british heavy weight easily imo

vargas · Post by **vargas** » 02 Mar 2007, 20:35

leforge wrote:Haye would beat most of the british heavy weight easily imo

Skills wise he would have no problems with the likes of Skelton, Williams etc. The big question is whether he can take a shot from a natural heavyweight. He hasn't always looked that comfortable taking a shot at Cruiser.

leforge · Post by **leforge** » 02 Mar 2007, 20:42

Haye will do well at heavyweight. He got a good punch himself.
Williams should either go for Euro title retire no point Harrison 3 etc, the only reason fraudley won last fight cause trained properly.

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 02 Mar 2007, 21:27

I had Danny 5 rounds to 3 going Into the 9th.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 02 Mar 2007, 22:02

stujones wrote:
rhino222 wrote:well.....i called the williams KO but it took a bit longer than i thought. even before the fight i thought gammer looked like an amateur on the pads, every time he threw a shot he dropped his defensive hand, therefore he was wide open.

lets be honest, danny is way past his best, so it goes to show how poor gammer is as british champion, yes he was ok defensively (when he was not throwing shots), yes he threw a few combos to williams unprotected abdo region, but in the grand scheme of thiongs gammer was clueless when williams popped out the jab repeatedly then followed it in with some heavy artillery. perhaps the first opponent gammer had had who could hit back !!

all in all im over the moon for danny, lovely guy and nice to see him with a belt on again. but he is right to be considering his career, because where does he go from here....

the public dont want him to fight audley again for the third time, they dont want him to fight sprott again for the forth time.

its a shame that the 'old guard' are still streets better than the new heavies. the domestic scene is empty of talent below the age of 30, we are going to have a 5 year lull im afraid in decent british heavyweight, unless david haye comes to the fore.

the likes of mullarvie etc are still 5 years off the pace.
Danny might be past his prime, but that was his best performance in some time. Even his punch resistance was better - if you consider that Gammer stopped Krence and Audley never hurt Krence. I don't think Gammer hurt Danny at all. Crying shame he wasn't in that shape for his peak years - and AGAIN Danny didn't seem to be thinking that the improved speed was down to his reduced weight. I think Danny would be better again say in July fighting at this weight - I think he will be able to sustain attacks more when more used to the weight.

I do agree with your assessment of Gammer- I'm not sure he has the proffesionalism to make it. I live by him, sparred with him and do know his father. I know that about 2-3 years before turning pro - Gammer had no intention of turning over.... I definately had the impression that the standard of competition around was the primary reason for turning over. Would need a more proffesional approach should he make it.

I still think the crowd would come to see Harrison vs Williams, if there is a chance Harrison will fall - people will come to see.

Looking at Danny tonight I think his main problem lately has been his lack of confidence/desire... despite all the fights he's had I really dont think he's shot physically... if he can improve so drastically in just 3 months then he could improve even more I think with more work and more confidence... its the mental thing that is the big problem for Danny... he has world class talent if he;d only believe in it himself...

rhino222 · Post by **rhino222** » 03 Mar 2007, 06:31

its almost if danny has to be shaken into producing things in the ring, he likes to coast a bit, and when he gets tagged he thinks shit, i need to do something.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 03 Mar 2007, 07:39

What I didn't like about Danny's post fight interviewing wasn't the retirement talk - but again he seemed to be dissmissive of the fact that lumbering 3/4 stone doesn't do him any harm. I wouldn't be at all surprised that he'll be back at 19/20 stone again.

If I were Spencer Fearon - I would have been really cheering him up after the rounds he did well "you look really good in there" etc. If Danny thinks he fought better vs Harrison fight 1 and vs Skelton fight 1, then he does need to be telling different - cause it was.

Indeed Silkov, we can all blame this performance on Gammer being overated and untested. But surely, Gammer is every bit as good as the likes of Keith Long and Harry Senior - Danny did a more conclusive job against Gammer than he did Senior and Long had some moments aswell (and I consider that when he was at his physical peak).

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 03 Mar 2007, 11:52

I didnt think Gammer was bad at all, he's very solid, got nice hand speed and looks strong... I think it was his lack of experience and a lack of confidence that was his undoing, as well as the fact that he fought probably the best Williams I've seen since the Tyson fight...
Williams has got to know that that was the best he's been since Tyson... definately better than against Harrison and Skelton... maybe he didnt feel as good because of his lack of confidence.... if he cant get that back then he should probably get out now... Gammer can come again if he wants it enough... though he lost I think he gave his best performance so far...

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 03 Mar 2007, 12:03

silkov wrote:I didnt think Gammer was bad at all, he's very solid, got nice hand speed and looks strong... I think it was his lack of experience and a lack of confidence that was his undoing, as well as the fact that he fought probably the best Williams I've seen since the Tyson fight...
Williams has got to know that that was the best he's been since Tyson... definately better than against Harrison and Skelton... maybe he didnt feel as good because of his lack of confidence.... if he cant get that back then he should probably get out now... Gammer can come again if he wants it enough... though he lost I think he gave his best performance so far...

I might be in the minority, but it possibly excelled his Tyson performance. Tyson mark 2004 was tailor made for a slow Danny, just as Skelton in fight one was. The didn't make Danny move his legs and after the first Tyson was pretty much a stationary target. Plus, his knee injury did affect Tyson's punching technique and power.

I do believe that the Tyson fight and result was possibly the worst thing that happened to Danny boxing wise - obviously not financially.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 03 Mar 2007, 12:18

He was erratic in there against Gammer but at times he looked very good, his workrate was definately the best I've seen since before the Tyson fight probably... but there was still spells when he seemed to switch off and just stand there taking shots... other than his weight this is Dannys mayjor problem.... when he puts it together he's world class though imo....
beating Tyson when he was about 20+ pounds too heavy was a bad thing for Danny...

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 03 Mar 2007, 12:28

World class is about being consistent, not looking great for 20 second of a round here and there.

I didn't get to watch the fight last night, but I'm not going to get overexcited about Williams beating Gammer. I predicted a grisly end for Danny, but he obviously has enough left to beat a fighter like Scott, but let's not start getting our knickers in a twist and suppose he is going to start beating people up and winning world titles.

The only caveat to that, is the fact that Danny was woefully out of shape when he challenged Klitchsko, and could probably have done better than he did, but no way would he have won that fight no matter what he weighed, he's too easy to hit.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 03 Mar 2007, 12:48

jamesmcdonnell wrote:World class is about being consistent, not looking great for 20 second of a round here and there.

I didn't get to watch the fight last night, but I'm not going to get overexcited about Williams beating Gammer. I predicted a grisly end for Danny, but he obviously has enough left to beat a fighter like Scott, but let's not start getting our knickers in a twist and suppose he is going to start beating people up and winning world titles.

The only caveat to that, is the fact that Danny was woefully out of shape when he challenged Klitchsko, and could probably have done better than he did, but no way would he have won that fight no matter what he weighed, he's too easy to hit.

Agree, but suggest you watch Vilches vs Sprott and Briggs vs Lyakovich before saying Danny is incapable of winning a better title than the British.

Klitchsko was too good, but if Danny was a little faster to catch Vitali then who knows - although Vitali's chin looked strong. He was quite easy to hit also.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 03 Mar 2007, 14:42

jamesmcdonnell wrote:World class is about being consistent, not looking great for 20 second of a round here and there.

I didn't get to watch the fight last night, but I'm not going to get overexcited about Williams beating Gammer. I predicted a grisly end for Danny, but he obviously has enough left to beat a fighter like Scott, but let's not start getting our knickers in a twist and suppose he is going to start beating people up and winning world titles.

The only caveat to that, is the fact that Danny was woefully out of shape when he challenged Klitchsko, and could probably have done better than he did, but no way would he have won that fight no matter what he weighed, he's too easy to hit.

Yeah he would never beat Vitali but on his best form I'd give him a chance at Briggs and Maskeyev... as you said you didnt watch the fight and I'm not one to get over excited but Danny did look very good in there last night at times... and considering how bad he was just 3 months ago it was quite a revelation...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 03 Mar 2007, 14:46

stujones wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote:World class is about being consistent, not looking great for 20 second of a round here and there.

I didn't get to watch the fight last night, but I'm not going to get overexcited about Williams beating Gammer. I predicted a grisly end for Danny, but he obviously has enough left to beat a fighter like Scott, but let's not start getting our knickers in a twist and suppose he is going to start beating people up and winning world titles.

The only caveat to that, is the fact that Danny was woefully out of shape when he challenged Klitchsko, and could probably have done better than he did, but no way would he have won that fight no matter what he weighed, he's too easy to hit.
Agree, but suggest you watch Vilches vs Sprott and Briggs vs Lyakovich before saying Danny is incapable of winning a better title than the British.

Klitchsko was too good, but if Danny was a little faster to catch Vitali then who knows - although Vitali's chin looked strong. He was quite easy to hit also.

Briggs is there for the taking imo and Maskeyev is beatable as well...

Air Rodney · Post by **Air Rodney** » 03 Mar 2007, 19:34

is this on you tube yet? thanks

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 03 Mar 2007, 20:17

lvlarc_uk wrote:I agree if Danny is to stick around then he shouldn't bother wasting time rehashing fights with Skelton/Sprott/Harrison, not much comes of them. I don't give him much chance against any of the champs, too hot and cold. I think he should def go the EBU route. Let's just hope he lays off the cakes!

Virchis will probably be beat by Krasniqi, but If Brewster can nail Luan, then Danny could.

I give him a big chance against Briggs and Maskaev though, theres not much who would disagree. Valuev Is easy to hit and not too strong If Danny used enough head movement and got on the Inside Valuev would struggle like with Ruiz who he lost to really.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 03 Mar 2007, 20:25

Valuev is surprisingly fast for such a lump. Can get hurt, and the McCline fight was getting interesting. However, I think getting Danny to move his head at this stage is a tough ask and Valuev has simply got to be strong. If Gammer can stop him in his tracks and the likes of Samil Sam then Valuev arm punches will do the same.

Ruiz gets crucified a fair amount, but he is not bad - at least he is consistent. He holds alot, but thats his style and its effective cause he is usually the smaller man. It worked well vs Valuev.

Think Kransiqi will beat Virchis - should they meet. Kransiqi is getting on but is a much better boxer.

Only champion I would give Danny a chance with (beside a punchers chance) is Briggs. I think Skelton and Williams could beat him. Maskaev is an underated boxer, vulnerable but can hit.

Danny/Skelton have got to be quick about this. I think both would have a shot at Ibramighov also, but its a harder ask than Briggs.

states · Post by **states** » 03 Mar 2007, 20:27

Give over Max. I suspect Danny would take a bit of a pasting from Valuev. It's all well and good saying 'if he used enough head movement', but the fact is he simply can't do that.

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 03 Mar 2007, 20:42

states wrote:Give over Max. I suspect Danny would take a bit of a pasting from Valuev. It's all well and good saying 'if he used enough head movement', but the fact is he simply can't do that.

Give Over? Did I say Danny would win, No I did not.

Valuev sucks, his opponents are carefully picked to make him look good, Wlad would lay a beating on him or anyone with good speed and head movement would have a chance.

Chagaev will be made for Valuev though, strong and limited In skill but a foot shorter.

Ruiz gets crucified a fair amount, but he is not bad - at least he is consistent. He holds alot, but thats his style and its effective cause he is usually the smaller man. It worked well vs Valuev.

I thought more of the holding came from Valuev. All Valuev did was jab and hold. The only rounds he won was when Ruiz didn't do as much, I gave Ruiz 8 rounds to 4. He was moving with the head, outworked and got on the Inside well.

states · Post by **states** » 03 Mar 2007, 20:50

No, you didn't say he'd win. But you implied that Valuev could struggle against Williams. Which I don't think he would. Valuev may, as you say, 'suck' but Danny has lost to worse fighters.