BoxRec

You can watch the fight on you tube...judge for yourself, just type in Terry McGovern, or McGovern-Gans.

Some think it was a dive, but others, including me, think McGovern just overwhelmed Gans and knocked him silly early and never gave him a chance to recover.

As far as everyone yelling fake...that was not a rare occurance back then, in fact it was a claim that was made regularily by a number of fans...any time that fans lost money on a fight they yelled fake.

barry wrote:You can watch the fight on you tube...judge for yourself, just type in Terry McGovern, or McGovern-Gans.

Some think it was a dive, but others, including me, think McGovern just overwhelmed Gans and knocked him silly early and never gave him a chance to recover.

As far as everyone yelling fake...that was not a rare occurance back then, in fact it was a claim that was made regularily by a number of fans...any time that fans lost money on a fight they yelled fake.

I think that fight was a clear dive even boxing historians say Gans took a dive, if people like Langford and Walcott couldn't knock him out do you really see McGovern dominating him so badly. Didn't the state ban prize fighting for like 26 years after they wouldn't do that if the fight were legit.

The consensus really seems to be that Gans took a dive.... everything which he did in his career afterwards seems to make this a reasonable assumption... certianly the Gans I've seen against Mcgovern seems almost clueless as to how to defend himself or fight back... and we're talking here about a man who gave Battling Nelson hell when he was dying from TB...

>>>if people like Langford and Walcott couldn't knock him out do you really see McGovern dominating him so badly.<<<


If people like Frank Erne and George McFadden could knock Gans out then McGovern certainly could...in fact he did!!!

As far as Gans...watch his fight with Kid Herman and then watch his fight with McGovern! Gans looks exactly the same, his movement in the ring, in first round of his fight with Herman as he does with McGovern, so that was pretty much his style!!! His movements are the same in both fights and it would have continued that way had McGovern not tagged him and knocked him silly, which he was never able to recover from!

Talk about Gans giving Nelson trouble...so did McGovern!

Also...no...boxing was never banned in Chicago as a result of that fight...check out the database...there were hundreds of professional boxing matches that took place in Chicago following the McGovern-Gans bout...there was never a ban...just another inaccurate boxing claim/myth, which the history of boxing is loaded with!

>>> everything which he did in his career afterwards seems to make this a reasonable assumption<<<

Really...in what way??? Would it be his later "confessions" in which he claimed to have taken a dive in most all of the fights he lost, which none of the opponents seemed to know anything about!!! Was it that, or the fact that he actually peaked after the McGovern fight?

As far as the fake claims...some historians think it was a fake and others think it was legit, while others simply do not want to guess. There is no majority consensus...the views are about even for most of the people that have watched the fight!

McGovern could be outboxed early and he could also be caught early also. Olivares could do both things, and he could confuse McGovern by switching the going forward and going backwards style of fighting. McGovern's chin wasn't most solid either, yes he could recover and hold, but I don't think he'd be able to do that with Olivares. Olivares takes McGovern out within several rounds after throughly outboxing him both by going in close and going backwards and countering.
Joe Gans clearly wasn't trying to use his counter-punching abilities vs McGovern, he just backed away without trying to throw anything solid to catch McGovern. A dive, no doubt about it.

Gans with his over 80 fights didn't know how to deal with a swarmer? Sorry, I'm not buying that. He knew who he was against, same as several other fighters who were able to outbox McGovern silly about the same period of time, at least in the early rounds. And a counter-puncher of Gans' caliber couldn't figure out and catch McGovern in his wild rushes? Newspaper headlines and the people who had lost big money on it, have nothing to do with very clear display of one fighter not even trying.

McGovern was never a big puncher, Gans showed he could recover from much harder punches (Dal Hawkins) and fire back. But that's not the case. Several fighters much inferior to Gans, showed that McGovern could be outboxed rather easily, just use the footwork and the countering abilities, and he is yours (at least for several rounds). That's exactly what Gans was good at. With his excellent timing he could have caught McGovern in his wild (they were) rushes many times, if he at least attempted to do so. He simply didn't even try that, just stood there or backed away slowly, absorbing all McGovern threw at him.

How many punches did Gans throw back and how many landed?

Both explanations seem plausible. This is an interesting discussion. Dec is right though when he says that once in a while a totally improbable outcome will occur like Carter-Griffith

>>>McGovern was never a big puncher<<<

I suggest that you do some research on McGovern...he was one of the most vicious punchers p4p in history...he was always a big puncher, a monsterous puncher in fact! He also had a very solid chin and as far as him being outboxed, well, it never happened in his prime and he fought some of the better stylists and pure boxers that there have ever been. No, in his prime McGovern was different kind of beast and his style was later duplicated by Stanley Ketchel and later by Jack Dempsey.

And besides, any fighter who claimed that he threw every fight that he lost, well I would say that there was not a lot of honesty in it! After he claimed that the McGovern bout was a dive he claimed that his bout with Jimmy Britt was a fake also and like McGovern...Jimmy Britt never knew anything about a "fix."


>>>How many punches did Gans throw back and how many landed?<<<

It's a little hard to throw punches when a whirlwind in bombardering you with heavy bombs...as Dec says, he did't land one...he landed 50, or close to it and gave Gans the beating of his life...plain and simple...it can and has happened to most fighters and Gans, as great as he was, certainly was not exempt from suffering the same kind of fate that others met!

Again...watch Gans fight with Kid Herman...he fights exactly the same in that fight as he did in the McGovern bout...that is before McGovern clocked him.

One of the most telling points in the bout that makes me think it was legit is the manner in which Gans goes down that first knockdown...he falls backward still as a board...anyone faking bends, their joints bend, but when their brain has been short-circuited by a perfect shot, as Gans was, the body completely stiffens like a board. Watch any fighter who really gets clocked...they fall over stiff as a board, just as Gans did and when they just get a little stunned all of their joints work...they don't work when nailed perfect!

Both had great power, the difference was, that Jofre had an iron chin and Olivares chin was at the best mediocre, I would pick Jofre viá late KO (on points Eder slightly ahead)...


Jofre KO 11 Olivares

By big puncher I meant a guy with one-punch KO. Yeah, he had several of those, but most of the time he just wore the opponent down with his vicious attacks to the body and then finished them.

What do you consider his prime?
Fight with past his prime George Dixon. Up until the fourth round it was all Dixon, boxing Terry's ears off.
Same year, fight with Gardner, he knocked McGovern out in the 1st round, the time McGovern was down was 19 seconds according to some.
Next year, was basically out on his feet against Herrera.
Both times were the result of single punches from what I can tell.

Gans might have been hurt by the bombardment, but it is him not punching back is what shows it was clearly a fake.

>>>By big puncher I meant a guy with one-punch KO. Yeah, he had several of those, but most of the time he just wore the opponent down with his vicious attacks to the body and then finished them.<<<


He did wear down several opponents with a punishing body attack, which his body-punching may have been his best asset, but he could also end a fight with one punch as he did at times, but you are correct in that he punished opponents.


>>>What do you consider his prime?<<<


His prime was short, between middle to late 1898 and late 1900. By the end of 1900 McGovern had pretty much done away with serious training as he was acting in plays on a nightly basis followed by the partying afterward! Had McGovern continued to train as diligently as he did in late 1898 it’s very doubtful that Corbett would have beaten him, but by that time McGovern was only a glimpse of what he once was…and he certainly paid for his lack of training!


>>>>Fight with past his prime George Dixon. Up until the fourth round it was all Dixon, boxing Terry's ears off. <<<


That’s not true at all! Dixon held his own for a couple of early rounds during which he slightly had the better of the mill, but during the same time that Dixon was doing pretty well, McGovern was wearing him out to the body and when he took it to the head he stopped Dixon with relative ease. McGovern punished Dixon like no other fighter had before and McGovern was the first fighter that ever stopped Dixon and prior to facing McGovern Dixon, though up a bit in age, still very easily handled most of the best fighters in the division. McGovern essentially ended his career as a top notch contender and gave Dixon a pretty brutal beating!


>>>>Same year, fight with Gardner, he knocked McGovern out in the 1st round, the time McGovern was down was 19 seconds according to some. Next year, was basically out on his feet against Herrera. Both times were the result of single punches from what I can tell.<<<<


Again…you are quite inaccurate with the above statement!

Gardner tagged McGovern in the first round with a hard shot, which no doubt seriously hurt McGovern. McGovern went down to his knee’s from the blow and as he tumbled over he grabbed at anything in sight, which happened to be Gardner’s leg, so Terry grabbed Gardner’s leg and pulled himself up using Gardner body. Gardner yelled at referee, Charlie White to count out McGovern, but White stated, “He ain’t properly down,” which was the true. White was said to count slower than normal, but then again McGovern was up at the count of five, so if there actually was a long count it would not have been more than maybe one, or two seconds advantage that Terry received, if any.

It should also be noted that in this era of boxing a fighter could hover and stand right above a fallen opponent ready to throw punches, but had Gardner backed off instead of standing right over McGovern then Terry would not have been able to grab any part of Gardner, but he stood McGovern and Terry did what he had to do to survive, but it wasn’t like he was really trying to survive. As soon as he re-gained his feet Terry was throwing punches matching Gardner and toward the end of the round McGovern knocked Gardner down with a volley of hard shots.

You speak as though the Gardner and Herrera fights were close, but neither fight was close at all. Gardner hurt McGovern, but he was not able to finish him off. But speaking of one-punch knockouts…the fight ended up being a one-punch knockout that McGovern scored, which was not an easy feat to do as Gardner was one of the gamest and toughest fighters of the era.

The McGovern-Herrera bout was completely one-sided in favor of McGovern. Herrera clinched at every opportunity while McGovern threw punches as he pleased. McGovern, at this time, was in poor condition physically, as was noted by writers at ringside, due to his night-life which took precedent over training, but he still managed to make it a one-sided beating.

As to Herrera staggering McGovern, I have read that he landed a hard shot which had McGovern nearly out on his feet, but which Terry quickly recovered to score yet another scorching knockout. As to the punch that supposedly hurt McGovern…it’s funny, I cannot find any mention of it in any of the newspaper reports of the fight. The Los Angeles Times does not mention that Herrera hurt McGovern and neither does the San Francisco Examiner, nor does the Brooklyn Eagle, or any other account that I have. I have read that it happened in articles which were written thirty and forty years after the fight took place, but none of the primary sources that I have read mention anything about Herrera greatly staggering McGovern, so whether, or not it actually happened is certainly up for debate, especially considering that the San Francisco Examiner and Los Angeles Times do not mention anything about it. The only thing that is mentioned in the accounts of the bout is how one-sided the bout actually was and what a beating McGovern put on Herrera.

Another thing that needs to be mentioned…Gardner nailed Terry with one shot and if Herrera in fact did as well then it was certainly nothing that was extraordinary as both Herrera and Gardner were vicious punchers with one-punch knockout power! So Being staggered by either man was certainly no disgrace as many a fighter felt the same thing that McGovern did!!!


>>>Gans might have been hurt by the bombardment, but it is him not punching back is what shows it was clearly a fake.<<<


Gans was a lot more than hurt, he was out on his feet and aside from his epic bout with Nelson, Gans was given a brutal beating. As I said…watch his fight with Kid Herman and tell me what is different between the first round Gans with McGovern and the first round Gans with Herman!!! I mean really…Gans was stopped by lesser fighters than McGovern!


I almost forgot...around the third round of the McGovern-Herrera bout the fans in the gallery and around ringside began to yell "FAKE" due to the easy manner in which McGovern handled Herrera. Thing is, the claim of "fake" was a very, very common occurence, so it was not something extraordinary, or rare when it happened in the Gans-McGovern bout!

As Dec said, Gans too as good a beating as a fighter can take and there was nothing fake about that!!!!

If you want to take mid to late 1898 as the beginning of his prime.
October 1898, fight vs Harry Forbes. Forbes outboxed McGovern from the start and piled up big advantage on points, before McGovern tricked him.
March 1899, fight vs Patsy Haley. McGovern was easily outpointed in the first 8 rounds.

The rest I'll reply later, no time to dig up the clippings now.

>>>If you want to take mid to late 1898 as the beginning of his prime.
October 1898, fight vs Harry Forbes. Forbes outboxed McGovern from the start and piled up big advantage on points, before McGovern tricked him.
March 1899, fight vs Patsy Haley. McGovern was easily outpointed in the first 8 rounds.<<<



And this has exactly "what" to do with the topic????

But now that you mention it I’ll do a little better in explaining the two fighters that you mention as you again fail to give an accurate depiction of said fights.

Haley did not easily outpoint McGovern…that’s just bullshit…and a big load of it. Haley may have held his own for a number of rounds, but at no time was he “easily” out-pointing McGovern and even if he had been, which he wasn’t, it would have just shown the versatility of McGovern in being able to overcome adversity to knockout a tough opponent!

I also see that you failed to mention the rematch between McGovern and Haley in which McGovern absolutely blew Haley away with a first round knockout…sorry, but you simply cannot ignore facts if you want to be taken seriously!

Also, Harry Forbes was one of the very best boxers of the era...a stylist extraordinaire, so losing a few rounds to a fighter of his ability was certainly nothing to be ashamed of as Forbes out-boxed a slew of top rated fighters, but in the first bout Forbes held his own and probably won a couple of rounds, but most all of the rounds were closely contested, that is until McGovern turned it up and laid Forbes to rest.

But yet again, you failed to mention the rematch between McGovern and Forbes…you know…where McGovern destroyed Forbes in two rounds!!! Let’s not forget that in the return with Harry Forbes McGovern obliterated him…you cannot mention one without the other.

As to cherry-picking through a fighters record trying to find a bout that the fighter did not perform at his best, well anyone can go through the record of any fighter in history and nit-pick a couple of bouts in which the fighter was not supreme, though that was not the case with the two that you chose due to the fact that McGovern absolutely destroyed the two in a rematch their first bouts were close contests which there were no clear winner, that is until McGovern ended the bouts! But cherry-picking…hell…anyone can do it with Ray Robinson, or Joe Louis, or Henry Armstrong, or Harry Greb…nit-picking through their records and one can find bouts in which those fighters were less than stellar…but that’s just silly to do as it can very easily be picked apart with better reason and solid facts!

Why not go through and read the fight reports from McGovern’s title fights...all of his title fights? You can find most all of them in the Brooklyn Eagle database.

But if you want to try and give a fair and balanced opinion of a fighter then you have to take into account how the fighter handled a certain fighter in all of their bouts together, not just the one that fits your argument!

I was answering your claim that McGovern was never outboxed in his prime, which is not true. I'm aware of the rematches, but the thing with them is, in both cases his opponents chose not to fight from the distance, but to slug it out instead, for one reason or another. In the first fights with him they boxed and counter-punched and they had plenty of success doing so.
I stated from the very beginning that McGovern could be outboxed in the early rounds, and I stand by my words, there are several examples of that, even if we limit it only to the years you chose for his prime.
As for Gans, earlier the same year, he met with Dal Hawkins twice. I don't have to explain that Hawkins was a much-much harder hitter than McGovern. Both fights were short but vicious slug-outs, Gans proved he could fight back even when he was badly hurt by opponent's punches. He never did in the McGovern fight. Two and a half months before that fight, Gans fought George McFadden. Very fast bout, with fierce fighting in close, Gans had the better of it. The fight with Parker a month prior to meeting with McGovern, some sharp-infighting in rounds 2-4, Gans showed beautiful uppercuts and right hands to the ear, blocking and switching his punches from the head to the body.
Gans was experienced enough by that point, to be able to do it both ways, either outbox McGovern with his smart blocking and countering McGovern's wild punches, or he could slug it out (with a featherweight!), after left hooks from Hawkins he had not much to be afraid of. And he had plenty of punching power to knock McGovern out if he was at least trying to punch back. Which he did not.

>>>I was answering your claim that McGovern was never outboxed in his prime<<<


You wasn’t answering my claim because I didn't claim that McGovern was never out-boxed in his prime…I’ve never said that, but in his prime it did not happen but perhaps a couple of times and even then it was only for a couple of rounds and then McGovern would put some steam on his punches and end fights. In fact, off the top of my head without going into the multiple scrapbooks that I have compiled on McGovern, the only fighter that comes to mind who out-boxed, well…not out-boxed, but certainly held his own and who had McGovern befuddled was one Tommy White and Tim Callahan did as well, but when it came to the rematch, well like other bouts when McGovern fought rematches with White and Callahan he destroyed both with ease!!! I’ll post fight recaps from the record that I have compiled for McGovern at the bottom. There is a lot of good, accurate information which came straight from eye-witness accounts.


>>>I'm aware of the rematches, but the thing with them is, in both cases his opponents chose not to fight from the distance, but to slug it out instead, for one reason or another.<<<


LOL!!!! Are you serious??? It's not that they chose not to fight at a distance, but like Gans, they simply were not allowed to fight at a distance because McGovern just overwhelmed them completely!!! It's not like they had a choice when a steam-rolling, fireplug was bombing away at them! Now you’re just trying to invent something instead of looking at what actually happened!


>>>I don't have to explain that Hawkins was a much-much harder hitter than McGovern.<<<


That's just laughable and about as silly as anything that I have read on this forum in a long time and I'm afraid that you would have to explain how Hawkins was a much harder hitter, but the problem is...can you explain why he was the harder hitter...can you do that...tell me what makes Hawkins the "much-much" harder hitter? Do you know what Hawkins best punch was? You seem to know little about McGovern and I suspect the same with Hawkins, but I'm interested in what you have to say about Hawkins, so dazzle me!


>>>Both fights were short but vicious slug-outs, Gans proved he could fight back even when he was badly hurt by opponent's punches. He never did in the McGovern fight.<<<


That's because McGovern overwhelmed him just as he overwhelmed a lot of top rated opponents and on the other side Gans was able to do with Hawkins because Hawkins was a very one-dimensional fighter whereas McGovern was one of the greatest featherweights in history and P4P most likely the hardest-hitting featherweight, If a person had done plenty of reading from writers of the era, then that person would know who was always praised as being the hardest hitting fighter of the weight, which nine times out of ten the writers always listed McGovern. Hawkins, while certainly a hard-puncher with his best punch was never considered to be the hardest of hitters, but McGovern was given the title by most of the top writers of the day as P4p the hardest puncher of the day!


>>>Two and a half months before that fight, Gans fought George McFadden. Very fast bout, with fierce fighting in close, Gans had the better of it. The fight with Parker a month prior to meeting with McGovern, some sharp-infighting in rounds 2-4, Gans showed beautiful uppercuts and right hands to the ear, blocking and switching his punches from the head to the body.<<<


McFadden and Hawkins…both quality fighters, but neither were anywhere close to McGovern’s league. And while Gans was fighting those two McGovern won the world bantamweight title by simply overwhelming Pedlar Palmer, in the exact same manner that he did with Gans…then McGovern won the featherweight title by completely overwhelming George Dixon giving Dixon the beating of his life and then McGovern completely overwhelmed lightweight champ Frank Erne, who by the way stopped Gans in 12 rounds when Gans quit on his stool and of course Gans later claimed that that bout was a fake also (Gans won a rematch). The one thing that all three of those champions that McGovern easily beat had in common with Gans is that they were all stylist, boxer extraordinaire and McGovern handled them all exactly the same…he simply overwhelmed them with his vicious body work and his overpowering punches to the head. Like Palmer, Dixon and Erne…Joe Gans had never been hit as hard as he was hit by McGovern and the fight clearly shows that. Gans, to that point, had never faced a machine like McGovern and McGovern simply did what he does best…he overwhelmed Gans and did not allow Gans to do anything. McGovern was the ring general, McGovern took the lead and jumped all over Gans, just as he did those other three champions that he obliterated!!!


>>>Gans was experienced enough by that point, to be able to do it both ways, either outbox McGovern with his smart blocking and countering McGovern's wild punches, or he could slug it out (with a featherweight!), after left hooks from Hawkins he had not much to be afraid of.<<<


As I stated, you do not seem to know much about McGovern at all!! From very incorrectly describing his fights with Forbes and Haley to assuming that McGovern was this wild, free-swinging, wide-hooking slugger. McGovern was a slugger, but he was not a wild punching animal! McGovern threw very short and very compact punches, which is why he was able to be so effective against boxers like Palmer, Dixon and Gans. All three were a bit faster than McGovern, but McGovern’s compact punches landed before his opponent’s punches could. Aside from throwing short compact punches, McGovern also worked the body as good as any fighter in history…again powerful compact punches. McGovern threw really wild and wide punches in his bout with Young Corbett and he paid for it dearly, but in 90% to 95% of his fights he threw short, compact punches. Now Dal Hawkins threw a lot of wild punches and George McFadden, well he landed as many elbows as he did punches, hence his nickname, but McGovern mostly threw accurate and well place punches. He most certainly was not the wild swinging fighter that you seem to think he was!


>>>And he had plenty of punching power to knock McGovern out if he was at least trying to punch back. Which he did not.<<<


Of course he had the power to knockout McGovern, if he could have hit him, but McGovern did not allow him to get settled and he did not allow Gans to sit back and dictate the fight as that was one of Gans best assets…his ability to set the pace of a fight and dictate the speed of a fight…McGovern did not allow him to even think about anything…he just jumped right on Gans and did not stop until Gans was on the floor multiple times and then counted out!


Alright…below is the manner in which his fights went as it was told in various newspapers of the day. I still need to recap several fights, but what I have right now I paraphrased from multiple clippings…I’ve been doing the same thing to the records of all of McGovern’s opponents as well! I need to recap the first Forbes bout, but I have the first Haley fight paraphrased here…you know, the one in which you stated that Haley easily out-pointed McGovern for the first eight-rounds, but which in reality was a fight that was all McGovern…not at all like you stated!



McGovern Fight Notes


1897
Apr 3 vs. Jack Snee: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Snee is listed by some sources as “Jack Shea.” The agreed weight was to be 110 lbs for both fighters. The result was not a “KO 1” for Terry as was sometimes listed in various sources. McGovern had the better of the match up until the fourth round when his temper got the best of him, as it would on a couple of other occasions later on in his career. Fouling was frequent in the fourth round with McGovern being the chief offender, which resulted in the referee stopping the bout and awarding Snee the win on disqualification. McGovern was well ahead when the ref stopped the bout. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Apr 17 vs. Frank Barnes: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. The weight was set for 112 pounds, but Barnes came in over weight and lost his forfeit as a result, but the fight went on. The bout was pretty much even for the first seven rounds, but during the remaining three McGovern pulled ahead on points and in the tenth and final round Terry repeatedly jabbed the stuffing’s out of Barnes without anything in return. Police News
May 3 vs. Eddie Avery: The bout took place in New York, NY at the Polo AC. Avery had a record of 9-3-1 (9 KO) in 14 total bouts coming into this bout and at one point during his career he held the Bantamweight Championship of America. The New York World states that this was an amateur bout, but being that both me had been fighting pro for a good while, especially Avery, then it had to be a professional bout. This bout was part of a big amateur boxing tournament held at the Polo AC. Both McGovern and Eddie Avery were boxers in the 112 lb class and two of six fighters competing at that weight. No description of the result was given the next day, but these were all amateur fights.
May 22 vs. Kid Dougherty: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC.
--Weight: 112 lbs. They furnished one of the best exhibitions seen at the club for some time.
Jun 7 vs. Tom McDermott: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenpoint AC. The fight was scheduled for ten rounds at 112 pounds. McGovern controlled the fight from start to finish controlling McDermott’s rushing tactics by sticking out his left jab over and over and in the end Terry received the decision. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Jun 19 vs. “Brooklyn” Tommy Sullivan: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Sullivan had a record of 7-0-1 (6 KO) going into the bout. Scheduled for ten rounds at 112 pounds McGovern and Sullivan went at one another at a fast and exciting pace and did everything except bite each other for ten rounds without a let-up. In the end the referee declared the fight a draw. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Aug 16 vs. Eddie Goodbody: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. This was the first of two bouts versus Goodbody and it was scheduled for ten rounds at 112 pounds. Terry was the aggressor for the first few rounds using his left jab in a very clever style. The middle rounds were fairly even. During the last two rounds McGovern worked his jab hard, but Goodbody fought gamely to last out the ten rounds after which the referee named McGovern the victor. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Aug 23 vs. Billy Barrett: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenpoint SC.
--Going into the bout, Barrett had a record of 4-1-7 (1 KO) in 12 recorded bouts.
Sep 18 vs. Jack Leon: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Another bout scheduled for ten rounds at 112 pounds. Terry opened up more in this bout as he started using his right hand with telling effect. The first couple of rounds were even as both men landed effectively and often on one another. A right hook to the jaw staggered Leon in the third round and throughout the next two rounds Terry kept up a good pace landing his right to the body and head. Leon landed well in the sixth round, but it was rather short-lived and McGovern came out in the seventh round with intentions of adding the first knockout to his record. Terry drove Leon all over the ring with hard right hands to the body and head landing so effectively that the referee halted the action to save Leon from being completely knocked out. With the win came McGovern’s first stoppage victory and also pretty much the beginning of the style of fighting that not only won him scores of fans, but also a style of fighting that struck fear and terror in the hearts of his opponents! Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Oct 2 vs. Jack Reagan: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC.
Oct 9 vs. Jack Doyle: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Police stopped the bout in the seventh round and McGovern was awarded the decision, so was it a “TKO 7,” or “W TD 7.” Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Oct 23 vs. Eddie Goodbody: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Bout was scheduled for ten rounds at 112 lbs. Police stopped the bout due to a prior bout where a boxer was seriously injured and looked as though he would die! Brooklyn Daily Eagle D PTS 4 BDE
Nov 13 vs. Harry Peterson: The bout took place in New York, NY at the Polo AC.
Dec 18 vs. Charles Roden: The bout took place in New York, NY at the Polo AC.
--BDE lists “Jerry McGovern.” Wt: 112 lbs.
Dec 31 vs. Jimmy Kelly: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the National AC. A right uppercut put Kelly down and out. Some sources list “Jack Kelly.” Brooklyn Daily Eagle

1898
Feb 25 vs. Billy Maynard: This bout took place in Yonkers, NY.
Mar 12 vs. Pinkey Evans: This bout took place in Yonkers, NY.
Apr 15 vs. Fred Mayo: The bout took place in Waterbury, CT at Jacques’ Auditorium. Attendance: 1,500 (est) Scheduled for ten rounds at 112 lbs. Naugatuck Daily News
May 5 vs. George Monroe: This bout took place in Yonkers, NY. The weight of both men scaled less than 112 pounds each. It was an excellent bout from the sound of the first gong until referee Edwards declared it a draw. Terry was the aggressor for most of the bout, but George was always ready to counter the attack. There were no knockdowns, but each man suffered eye cuts and they fought one another to a standstill and were punching out of clinches. Terry was just beginning to fall into the rushing style that would make him so popular and at times, just when the audience thought that McGovern was on the verge of knocking his man out, Monroe always came back with a viscous counter. Unknown Newspaper Clip
Jun 11 vs. George Munroe: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greater New York Athletic Club. The men weighed in at 112 pounds. Both looked fit to go the entire twenty-five rounds that was scheduled. The first round was a “feeling out” round in which no damaging blows were landed by either fighter. Monroe did most of the leading in the second, but was dropped for a count in the third. McGovern started fast in the fourth and did all of the leading and the fifth round was more of the same. McGovern was cautioned twice for using his head in close. In the sixth round, McGovern cut loose knocking his opponent all over the ring and by the end of the seventh it looked as though it would only be a matter of time until Monroe was knocked out. Monroe managed to gain a little measure on McGovern in the ninth and tenth rounds. Up to the thirteenth neither man had landed any real damaging blows. McGovern again cut loose in the fourteenth hitting hard and drawing blood for the first time in the fight. Monroe was weak at the end of the fifteenth and betting was 3 to 1 that he would not last two more rounds, but Monroe regained his energy and probably had the better of the mill in the two rounds that were supposed to be his last. The fight was nearly even at the end of twenty rounds. Monroe was downed again in the twenty-second round, but still managed to land as much as he took. The twenty-third was even, but in the twenty-fourth McGovern began to land often and land hard. Terry landed a hard shot and followed it up with another hard punch which sent Monroe down for the count, the result “KO 24.” Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Jul 23 vs. Tim Callahan: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Pelican AC. George Monroe was the scheduled opponent for Terry, but when turned out to be a no-show , Callahan was substituted and he came into the bout with a record of 7-1-3 (0 KO). Scheduled for twenty-five rounds at 114 pounds, McGovern lost his head fouling Callahan on three times in which he was warned by referee Herald each time, mostly for hitting in the clinches. In the tenth round, Terry repeated the offense and although Callahan was very much the worse for the wear and taking a steady beating he was immediately named the winner by disqualification. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Aug 4 vs. George Monroe: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. The bout was scheduled for twenty rounds with Gus Pevereley acting as referee. Monroe objected to the fact that Pevereley, who was the official referee of the club, was named referee for the bout stating that Pevereley would naturally be inclined to be bias toward McGovern since Terry was a South Brooklyn boy. After a lengthy argument, Monroe agreed to go on with Pevereley acting as referee, but stipulating that the first man to hit on the break, or hit in a clinch after being ordered to do that person be immediately disqualified. As it turned out it was Monroe who broke the rule first, twice in the early rounds, but Terry did not want the win in that fashion and he generously allowed the infractions to pass unnoticed. Monroe was warned to keep his head but after receiving a blow to the wind that sorely distressed him and which he claimed to be a foul blow, Monroe rushed into a clinch and continued to hit after being ordered to break and as a result referee Pevereley had no other choice but to disqualify Monroe, so McGovern got the win by a seventh round disqualification. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Aug 20 vs. Tim Callahan: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Pelican AC. Callahan’s record was 8-1-3 (0 KO). The bout was scheduled for twenty rounds at 115 pounds and twenty rounds it went with the end result being a draw. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Sep 15 vs. Eugene Garcia: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. The bout was scheduled for fifteen rounds at catch weights. At the beginning of the second round, Terry rushed his opponent, but Garcia easily side-stepped and Terry went through the ropes, but he was up and back in immediately and went to work landing lefts and rights to the body and head. Terry used his left jab very effectively in the third round, which started to make some openings for his power shots. Garcia landed a hard right uppercut to McGovern’s mouth, but with little, or no effect and Terry tore into Garcia battering him all around the ring during the fourth round again landing lefts and rights to both the body and head. After 1:30 of fighting in the fifth round, Terry let fly a right hook that found its mark and dropped Garcia in his tracks putting him down and out by knockout in the fifth round. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Oct 1 vs. Harry Forbes: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Pelican AC. Scheduled for twenty-five rounds, Forbes had a record of 17-2-4 (8 KO) coming into the fight.
Nov 19 vs. Tim Callahan: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. Callahan’s record was 9-1-
5 (0 KO).
Nov 26 vs. Paddy Donovan: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Nonpareil AC.
Dec 17 vs. Jimmy Rose: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC.
Dec 31 vs. Austin Rice: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Pelican AC.

1899
Jan 30 vs. Casper Leon: The bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Greenwood AC. The fight was scheduled for twenty-five rounds at 115 pounds. McGovern was a favorite at 100 to 80 in the betting. Charley White, Leon’s manager stated afterward that Terry broke two of Leon’s ribs in the second round. The rules governing the bout were straight Queensberry with no hitting in the clinches, or breakaway which should have played greatly in favor of Leon as McGovern was very much an inside fighter. In Casper Leon Terry was suppose to be meeting the toughest challenge of his short career as Leon was one of the top fighters of his size in the world, but McGovern handled him as if he were a novice just starting out and Terry scored a clean knockout in the twelfth round. The club was packed with probably its largest crowd ever up to that point in time. Leon was known for his cleverness, but as it turned out his cleverness was no match for the ring generalship and McGovern’s ability to severely punish and opponent. McGovern had a slight lead going after five rounds, but it was becoming evident that it would really only be a matter of time before Leon fell. Throughout the remaining rounds Terry put in some terrific work to the head and body and his right hand was doing particular damage whenever it landed as Terry put all of his force into each blow and the shots to the body had a very telling effect on Leon as he was visibly weakening by the constant attack put forth by McGovern. In the twelfth round both men came out and swapped some quick punches, but Terry’s was much more powerful and on a quick counter, McGovern shot over a short left that landed flush on the point of Leon’s chin and down he went as if he had been shot. Referee, Owen Ziegler counted Leon out with only a few seconds remaining in the round. It took several minutes for Casper to fully recover his senses. Former world champion and human dynamo Jimmy Barry was only able to knockout Casper Leon once in 28 rounds, and failed in other return bouts to do the trick. Brooklyn Daily Eagle & The National Police Gazette
Feb 18 vs. Fred Snyder: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Nonpareil AC.
Mar 14 vs. Patsy Haley: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Lenox AC. Scheduled for twenty-five rounds at 116 pounds the bout was to determine who would face European Bantamweight Champion Pedlar Palmer in order to have a World Bantamweight Champion. This was the first of two bouts that these two would go at it. Haley was one of the most formidable opponents Terry had faced and the cleverness at which Patsy fought surpassed any other boxer Terry had yet met in the ring, but McGovern rose to the occasion and took Haley out in eighteen rounds, a feat that Oscar Gardner could not do in twenty rounds and one that Dave Sullivan took twenty-three rounds of the hardest kind of fighting to do. Going into the bout Patsy stated that he was in the absolute best shape of his life and the same could be said of McGovern. Haley put forth a good effort in which his clever footwork saved him several times, but in the end the consistent whirlwind attack to the body and head that McGovern administered to his foe was just too much for Patsy to handle. Terry finished the bout looking as fresh as when he started without a scratch on his face and he fought a very fair fight throughout. Every time that he put Haley on the floor Terry stood back until he could regain his feet. The action was lively. But Haley’s punches lacked the steam that those of McGovern carried. In the fourth round a hard right uppercut dropped Haley on his back for a count of seven and as soon as he was upright a viscous right cross dropped him for and eight count and once more in the fourth another right put Haley down for the third time, the last of which Haley was down for a nine count. Amazingly, Haley was fresh for the next few rounds despite the beating he was taking and he would often land some hard shots of his own, but to no effect on Terry. In the fifteenth round McGovern sent his man to one knee after landing a hard combination and Haley was down for another nine count. Again in round seventeen Haley found himself on the floor after Terry had landed a hard straight right and in round eighteen after forcing Haley to the ropes a brutal right cross put Haley down and out at 0:48 of the eighteenth round. It was a clean knockout and Haley had to be carried back to his corner. Referee was Charlie White. Brooklyn Eagle & Police Gazette
Apr 28 vs. Joe Bernstein: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. Scheduled for twenty-five rounds at 125 pounds. Terry was a 2 to 1 favorite going into the bout. Bernstein weighed in at 124 pounds and McGovern was 119 pounds. This was McGovern’s debut at the featherweight limit and not only did he win, but he also showed skill that he was not known to possess. The crowd was one of the largest ever up to that point in time to be put on at the Broadway AC. The fight was the best scrap since the club had reopened. Up until this bout, Terry had been viewed primarily as a slugger with little science and cleverness, but against Bernstein he showed that he not only could brawl and slug, but that he was in deed a very clever fighter with considerable skill. Terry had a solid defense throughout, but it was his offense that brought out the crowd. Bernstein used a very good defense as well and by keeping his guard up Terry was forced to work the body, which he did very, very well. Joe seemed to better at infighting, but he was still outmatched by the “Brooklyn Wonder.” Terry was the aggressor throughout and was extremely effective working the body of his opponent, while Bernstein was relegated to cover and counter punch to keep from absorbing the solid whacks that McGovern was capable of landing to the head. Although the bout was a very hard fought battle between the two the only blood that was spilled was a slight trinkle of crimson from the nose of Bernstein. At the end of the bout the referee, Johnny White, awarded McGovern the decision on points which was applauded by the crowd. Bernstein was down twice from the hard shots of McGovern, but he managed to last out the match. McGovern winner by decision after twenty-five rounds. Brooklyn Eagle and Police Gazette
May 26 vs. Sammy Kelly: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. Kelly came out fresh in the fifth round, feinted, then led, but missed, and like a flash McGovern was in, first with a left hook to the stomach, then a right to the jaw, and Kelly staggered. McGovern planted another, then a hard right jolt on the jaw, and Kelly went down like a log. He made a feeble effort to rise, but was counted out. New York Times
Jun 8 vs. Billy Barrett: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. Barrett came into this bout with a record of 16-4-10 (6 KO) in 30 total bouts. W KO 10 BDE
Jul 1 vs. Johnny Ritchie: This bout took place in Tuckahoe, NY at the Westchester AC. The fight was to be fought at 118 pounds for a purse of $2000; $1500 to the winner and $500 to the loser. Scheduled for twenty-five rounds with clean breaking and no hitting in the clinches were the stipulations of the bout. The fight was to decide the Bantamweight Champion of America and the winner would face Pedlar Palmer for World recognition as Bantamweight Champion. Jimmy Carroll was referee. A left hook to the point of the chin put Ritchie down and out in the third round. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
Sep 12 vs. Thomas "Pedlar" Palmer: Bantamweight Championship of the World. This bout took place in Tuckahoe, NY at the Westchester AC. Weights: 115 ½, 113 ½. Time: 2:32. Palmer came into the bout undefeated with a record of 27-0-1 (4 KO).
Sep 29 vs. Fred Snyder: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Industrial Hall AC.
--Snyder was down twice in the first and six times in the second after which the police stopped the bout.
Oct 9 vs. Billy Rotchford: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. McGovern went after Rotchford much the same way as he attacked Palmer in September and the result was a quick ending of around a minute.
Nov 18 vs. Patsy Haley: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA.
--Time: 1:40
Nov 18 vs. “Turkey Point” Bill Smith: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA.
--Time: 1:00
Nov 30 vs. Eddie Sprague: This bout took place in Hartford, CT at the Nutmeg State AC. It took less than a minute of the second round for Terry to put an end to matters. Sprague was down three times in the first round. He was down once in the second in which he was counted out.
Dec 12 vs. James J. Corbett, Jr: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA.
Dec 18 vs. Charlie Mason: This bout took place in Cincinnati, OH at the People’s AC.
Dec 18 vs. Freckles O'Brien: This bout took place in Cincinnati, OH at the People’s AC.
Dec 22 vs. Harry Forbes: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. Forbes came into the bout with a record of 35-3-12 (11 KO). --Time: 1:33

1900
Jan 9 vs. George Dixon: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC for the Featherweight Championship of the World. Dixon had a record of 51-5-22 (30 KO) coming in.
Jan 29 vs. Jack Ward: This bout took place in Baltimore, MD at the North Avenue Rink (Eureka AC). Ward was never given much thought of winning, but he was a decent and fairly clever opponent for Terry to show his wares against and he was expected to give Terry a few rounds of work, but that was not the case. Ward was outclassed and overwhelmed right from the get-go and was dropped for the ten count in rather quick fashion. One observer stated that the bout looked like a Topy Spaniel against a Bull Terrier. McGovern was just superior in every area and at the sound of the gong he went straight after Ward. Ward tried to fight back, but Terry was invincible to any counter shots as he bombed Ward into a corner and into submission. After landing some hard body shots Terry sent over a right that was very compact, but very powerful and Ward went down and out until referee Al Herford reached the count of ten. The time was two minutes and five seconds of the first round. Police Gazette
Feb 1 vs. Eddie Santry: The bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. For the Featherweight Championship of the World. Santry’s clever defensive work bothered Terry for a couple of rounds, but once he settled in it was only a matter of time. Santry had claimed his stake to the World Featherweight Title (122 lbs) by virtue of his knockout victory over Ben Jordan of England. Referee: George Siler. Santry was down once in the second and again in the fourth. Santry tried to keep his distance in the fifth, but when he realized that it was impossible Eddie bravely made a stand, which would turn out to be a mistake as Terry thrived on that type of fighting. Both were swinging wildly when a McGovern uppercut stopped Santry in his tracks and caused him to drop his guard and Terry instantly seized the opportunity and dropped a left to the jaw followed by a right to the ear as Santry was falling. Eddie fell face first and rolled over. At the count of nine Santry got to his knees and tried to straighten himself up, but was unable to do so and referee Siler gave the bout to McGovern by knockout in five. McGovern did not have a mark on him when he left the ring. Cripple Creek Morning Times. I have a great write-up from the Chicago Tribune by George Siler, who referee’d the fight.
Mar 9 vs. Oscar Gardner: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC.
--Featherweight Championship of the World; Weights: 123 - 123 ½. Referee: Johnny White. A left to the jaw put Terry down in the first round, but McGovern rose with a vengeance and his attack on Gardner was of cyclonic proportions. Gardner went down three times, each time almost taking the count. A left hook to the neck put Oscar down and out.
Mar 15 vs. Eddie Lenny: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Industrial Hall AC. Lenny was much better than his 15-8-25 (6 KO) would suggest. Time: 1:45.
Apr 17 vs. Tommy White: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA.
--Att: 12,000. White was mainly on the defensive while Terry was the aggressor throughout.
Apr 20 vs. Tommy Warren: This bout took place in New York, NY at the Broadway AC. When the match was made, Sam Harris, the champion's manager, did not know anything about Warren, or the bout never would have taken place. When Harris did learn about him he tried to have the match declared off, but the club insisted that he carry out his contract. At 8:30 o'clock last evening he again asked that it be canceled, but had to live up to the articles. Warren, who is about 45 years old, weighed fully 140 pounds, but did not look to be in any kind of shape and came into the bout with a record of 48-9-5 (31 KO). Terry was afraid to hit him hard and only tapped him lightly. Twice Warren went down from right hand swings and he was weak when the round closed. The crowd began hooting when they saw what Warren really was and the club officials decided to call it off. Brooklyn Daily Eagle
May 21 vs. Elwood McCloskey: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Penn Art AC.
Jun 12 vs. Tommy White: This bout took place in Brooklyn, NY at the Seaside AC.
--Featherweight Championship of the World. White was down seven times in the third and final round.
Jun 23 vs. George Dixon: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. Dixon’s record prior to entering the ring was 51-6-23 (30 KO).
Jul 16 vs. Frank Erne: This bout took place in New York, NY at Madison Square Garden. Erne had a record of 28-2-12 (13 KO) prior to the contest. Attendance: 14,000 (est). Erne was certainly the more clever of the two, but McGovern’s onslaught was so fierce, as it always is, that Erne could not hold him off. Erne, the World Lightweight Champion, had agreed to to get down to 128, which is five pounds below the lightweight limit for the bout. McGovern was sent to his knees in the first round after Erne landed a straight left to the chin, but Terry was up and on the attack again. In the third round a fusillade of punches to the body and head put Erne down for a nine count and he was a mask of crimson as he gallantly reached his feet. McGovern met him with another volley of punches and for a short time Erne tried to mix it with Terry, but McGovern’s attack was too fierce and Erne sank to the canvas. Courageously Erne was up again before the ten-count was tolled, but he was visibly in very bad shape and as Terry stalked and measured his opponent Frank’s seconds threw in the sponge signaling that McGovern was Erne’s master by technical knockout in three rounds. It was probably McGovern’s greatest performance and with it came Terry’s third knockout of current world champions all within nine months time; bantamweight, featherweight and lightweight world champions all fell under the furious onslaught that was Terry McGovern in the ring!
Nov 2 vs. Joe Bernstein: This bout took place in Louisville, KY at the Nonpareil AC. (2:05)
--Featherweight Championship of the World.
Nov 13 vs. Kid Broad: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA.
Dec 13 vs. Joe Gans: This bout took place in Chicago, IL at Tattersall’s AA. McGovern-124, Gans-133. Gans entered the ring sporting a record of 73-4-7 (52 KO). An article in the Durango Democrat of Colorado stated that McGovern was now the undisputed World Lightweight Champion. The bout itself was a “fake” on Gans part as he laid down, but it was evident that Terry was not in on the fix and went about fighting in his usual manner while Gans put forth a terrible display. Referee: George Siler. Time: 2:05

1901
Apr 30 vs. Oscar Gardner: This bout took place in San Francisco, CA at Mechanic’s Pavilion.
--Featherweight Championship of the World. Gardner went down repeatedly from Terry’s attack.
May 29 vs. Aurelio Herrera: This bout took place in San Francisco, CA at Mechanic’s Pavilion. Featherweight Championship of the World. Herrera stepped into the ring undefeated with a record of 20-0-3 (20 KO).
Nov 28 vs. Young Corbett II: This bout took place in Hartford, CT at the Nutmeg AC. Corbett had a record of 32-4-7 (26 KO) going into the fight. (1:44)
--Featherweight Championship of the World; Corbett weighed 126 lbs.

1902
Feb 22 vs. Dave Sullivan: This bout took place in Louisville, KY at the Southern AC. Sullivan carried a record of 23-8-16 (17 KO) into the bout. Some sources report this bout as a Lightweight Championship of the World contest. After fifteen grueling rounds in one of the best fights that was ever witnessed in Louisville, “Terrible” Terry came out on top with a technical knockout. It was not one of the whirlwind victories that has made Terry such an instant success, but instead a battle of attrition and one of the most difficult struggles of McGovern’s career in the ring. For the first ten rounds the battle was about as even as it could get with both men fighting furiously. Terry took over in the tenth round and in the eleventh round he floored Sullivan and upon rising it was evident that it was know only a matter of time before McGovern slipped his special brand of sleeping potion over to Sullivan. Sullivan was exhausted as the twelfth round started and from then on he was mainly in a defensive survival mode, but McGovern would not be denied that which he loved most…a knockout! Making a final stand Sullivan put together a nice little rally in the fourteenth round, but by the end of the round McGovern’s attack had Sullivan clinching for dear life as Terry blasted lefts and rights to his opponents head and body. Sullivan, game to the core, started another rally in the fifteenth round, but he was down quickly. Sullivan was not out cold, but as he rose before the fatal ten count McGovern came at him like the beast he was and Dave just sank back down to the canvas at which time referee, Bob Fitzsimmons, wisely called a halt and awarded the win to McGovern. Brooklyn Daily Eagle

1903
Feb 6 vs. Joe Bernstein: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Industrial Hall AC. After a year out of the ring, McGovern returned to the ring wars to face an old rival in Joe Bernstein this being their third bout against one another; Terry won the previous two, the last by knockout. Industrial Hall was packed long before the main bout came on. At no point during the bout did Bernstein have an advantage and although he finished on his feet through six rounds McGovern gave Bernstein considerable punishment and beat him decisively. Joe did land some hard shots on occasion, but he always took a drubbing in return. Terry did most of his work to the body and it was evident that the “old power” still lingered in McGovern’s lethal fists and had any of the vicious body blows landed to Bernstein’s head he would have surely took a nap on the canvas. Joe was down for a nine-count in the fifth round, but Terry was unable to put him away as Bernstein still possessed the heart of a winner although he lost. Not being able to put Bernstein away also may have been because of McGovern’s lengthy hiatus out of the ring, but Terry was in splendid condition physically and he fought fast throughout all six rounds and looked as though he could have went several more rounds had the occasion called for it. Philadelphia Evening Bulletin
Feb 25 vs. Billy Maynard: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Penn Art AC.
Mar 31 vs. Young Corbett II: Featherweight Championship of the World. This bout took place in San Francisco, CA at Mechanic’s Pavilion. Corbett entered the ring with a record of 39-4-8 (30 KO). At 8:30 P.M. the betting was 10 to 9 in favor of McGovern. The fight was fast and neither man showed a bit of idleness. Corbett had a shade in nearly every round and when he stunned Terry in the eleventh round, Corbett seized the moment and went after Terry without letting up until McGovern sank to the floor a battered and beaten man! Terry was down for a seven-count in the first round and again in the second. George Harding was timekeeper and he stated that the blows that put Terry out were left and right swings to the head followed by a right uppercut to the chin. The big amphitheatre was packed with an estimated 11,000 screaming fans, which was the largest crowd to ever witness a bout in San Francisco at that point in time. Corbett was attended by Alex Greggains, Tim McGraw, Billy Otts and Harry Tuthill. McGovern was accompanied by Sam Harris, Charlie Mayhood, Eddie Cain and Joe Angelo. Ed Graney was referee. Corbett came in at 127 and McGovern was several pounds under the required weight. Both me were in excellent condition and gave it their all until Corbett was declared the victor in round eleven! Daily Kennebec Journal
Sep 26 vs. Lew Ryall: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC.
Oct 3 vs. Billy Willis: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. Willis was game and although he was greatly overmatched he gave McGovern six tough rounds. Terry fought like the “Terry of old,” as he lit into his opponent in whirlwind fashion, but he was met head on by the scrappy Willis. Only once did Billy try to stall. It was in the fourth round after McGovern had landed a brutal right hand to the body and Willis, who was visibly weakened by the blow, did not hesitate to save himself by holding on. With that one exception, Willis met and fought McGovern every inch of the way. Willis put up the fight of his life, but McGovern was master of the bout in all six rounds. Willis came into the bout with a record of 36-6-18 (10 KO) in 61 total bouts. Milwaukee Free Press
Oct 20 vs. Jimmy Briggs: This bout took place in Boston, MA. For the first ten rounds it seemed as though McGovern had lost the “it” that he use to possess and a favorable decision in his favor was greatly in doubt. However, through great ring generalship Terry had his opponent at his mercy by the time the bout ended as he dealt out some terrible punishment upon his foe, but Terry never could land the homerun punch. During the last two rounds, McGovern landed around twenty shots that he put every ounce of his strength into. Briggs took it well, but he was a well-beaten fighter by this time. Briggs was overly game, but over matched. The men were teeing off at one another when the bell rang ending the fight. ***
--Briggs came into the bout with a record of 47-11-20 (18 KO) in 78 total bouts.
Dec 19 vs. Billy Willis: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC.
--Willis came into this bout with a record of 42-7-18 (9 KO) in 68 total bouts. A right to the jaw dropped Willis in the second round.

1904
Jan 1 vs. Leo Henninger: The bout took place in Allentown, PA. A right to the body ended the fight. Henninger was several pounds heavier than Terry and from the very beginning of the first round Leo tried to use it to his advantage. Time and again Henninger went straight at McGovern, which was met with hard shots to the stomach and head and by rounds end Henninger was ducking, dodging and holding on for survival. McGovern came out with a vengeance and a snarl in the second and was on top of Henninger before he could get his hands up. A feint to the body gave Terry the opening he was looking for and viscous right cross to the chin dropped Henninger for a nine count. As he staggered to his feet Leo was met with a savage barrage of punches and was soon hung over the ropes by a quick one-two punch. As Henninger bounced off the ropes Terry had him measured and cut loose a long right which crashed home with telling effect and McGovern watched as his opponent was counted out in the second round. Police Gazette
Apr 10 vs. George Barton: The bout took place in St. Paul, MN.
Oct 10 vs. Eddie Hanlon: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the Industrial Hall AC.

1905
Oct 18 vs. "Harlem" Tommy Murphy: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. The large club house was packed with 3,500 fans (tickets sold-out) that showed up to witness the bout and were given a treat as McGovern come out like the McGovern of old and annihilated Murphy at 2:08 (some list 2:02) of the first round. Terry beat Murphy into such a helpless state that referee Jack McGuigan had no other alternative other than to stop the bout. Murphy was knocked down four times during the brief encounter and Terry left the ring without a scratch. The articles of agreement called for 127 pounds at 6:00 P.M., and both were under that weight. Betting was pretty lively at even money. Both men appeared to be in good condition when they entered the ring. When the gong sounded the men went right after one another. Murphy was little impressed with McGovern’s reputation as a brawler and stood there toe-to-toe with the terror of Brooklyn on even terms until Terry landed one of his famous straight rights and down Murphy went. It was a devastating punch and it was clear to everyone present that Murphy was in a bad way. As he reached his feet at the count of nine, Murphy staggered across the ring and met with a right uppercut that dropped him like he had been shot! Up again at the count of nine, Murphy was hit with a hard left to the jaw that almost sent him through the ropes, but was pushed back by spectators and turned around into a storm of blows. At this point Tommy was defenseless and after McGovern dropped him on two more occasions referee McGuigan stopped the bout and awarded McGovern the win by technical knockout at 2:08 of the first round. Philadelphia Public Ledger
1906
Mar 14 vs. Oscar "Battling" Nelson: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC.
Att: (5000 est) Nelson entered the ring with a record of 40-10-13 (25 KO).
May 28 vs. Jimmy Britt: The bout took place in New York, NY at Madison Square Garden. Britt’s record coming in was 11-4-1 (5 KO). Att: 4000 (est). Referee: Tim Hurst.
Oct 17 vs. Young Corbett II: This bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. Corbett had a record of 56-10-10 (42 KO) coming into the fight. The bout was one of the bloodiest and most brutal ever witnessed in the city.

1908
May 16 vs. Young Loughrey: The bout took place in Philadelphia, PA at the National AC. Going into the bout, Loughrey had a record of 48-21-21 (17 KO). According to the DKJ, Loughrey had the better of the mill. Daily Kennebec Journal has a good write-up of the bout. Daily Kennebec Journal
May 26 vs. Frank "Spike" Robson: The bout took place in New York, NY at the National AC. The bout was somewhat tame. McGovern started well and landed enough blows to knock out any man had the punches had any steam on them. In the sixth round there was a glimpse of the McGovern of old, but the strength was not there. According to the Washington Post the bout was even. Washington Post
.

barry wrote:You wasn’t answering my claim because I didn't claim that McGovern was never out-boxed in his prime…I’ve never said that, but in his prime it did not happen but perhaps a couple of times and even then it was only for a couple of rounds and then McGovern would put some steam on his punches and end fights.

I'm not sure what your point is. You claim it never happened in his prime or you claim it did happen a couple of times (albeit for a couple of rounds only)?
If it is the latter, then that's exactly what I said which you started to object to. McGovern could be outboxed in the early rounds by clever counter-punchers.

It's not that they chose not to fight at a distance, but like Gans, they simply were not allowed to fight at a distance because McGovern just overwhelmed them completely!!!

Had it not happened several times during his early and prime career, it could be argued that it wasn't their abilities that let them neutralize his aggressiveness early in the fight. But it happened not once, but several times. From the fight reports it's also clear that the rematches went different way from the start, McGovern's opponents didn't even try to keep away from him in the rematches. McGovern was a beast, but it's not like his opponents were tomato cans with no skills and couldn't do anything with his rushes for a couple of rounds if they chose too. They simply didn't choose to, the second time they met, for one reason or another. Taking a more recent example, young Mike Tyson was a beast as terrible as McGovern, but even he could be made less effective early in the fight while his opponent was still fresh.

can you explain why he was the harder hitter...can you do that...tell me what makes Hawkins the "much-much" harder hitter? Do you know what Hawkins best punch was? You seem to know little about McGovern and I suspect the same with Hawkins, but I'm interested in what you have to say about Hawkins, so dazzle me!

It is easy.
http://www.boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.p ... 084#710084

That's because McGovern overwhelmed him just as he overwhelmed a lot of top rated opponents

Simple reading of fight reports shows that most of them did much better than Gans, and landed some punches in return. Gans was inferior to them or he forgot to how do what he did several times in similar situations the same year? I don't think so.

and on the other side Gans was able to do with Hawkins because Hawkins was a very one-dimensional fighter whereas McGovern was one of the greatest featherweights in history and P4P most likely the hardest-hitting featherweight,

Hawkins was a lightweight. The difference in punching power between a featherweight (even as hard punching as McGovern) and one of the hardest-hitting lightweights of all-time (albeit just a left hook, many hardest hitters in history were one-handed with their power) seems to be obvious to me.

Hawkins, while certainly a hard-puncher with his best punch was never considered to be the hardest of hitters, but McGovern was given the title by most of the top writers of the day as P4p the hardest puncher of the day!

See above link, next message after yours, author - El Intocable.

McFadden and Hawkins…both quality fighters, but neither were anywhere close to McGovern’s league.

They were lightweights. That makes the difference and closes the gap in class.

McGovern completely overwhelmed lightweight champ Frank Erne

You are, of course, aware of conditions about the weight which hurt Erne's chances a lot.

who by the way stopped Gans in 12 rounds when Gans quit on his stool and of course Gans later claimed that that bout was a fake also

What are you talking about? Gans quit with an eye injury, which was obvious to all witnesses of the bout.

Joe Gans had never been hit as hard as he was hit by McGovern

Again see the above link, last post in that thread.

From very incorrectly describing his fights with Forbes and Haley

Reports you mentioned, each came from one source, if I'm not mistaken, and was just reprinted by other newspapers through the AP (edited one way or another). While the source of info I wrote comes from a book written long after the fights took place (and are secondary sources), but I'm certain they were based on contemporary sources or on what the eye-witnesses described.

to assuming that McGovern was this wild, free-swinging, wide-hooking slugger. McGovern was a slugger, but he was not a wild punching animal! McGovern threw very short and very compact punches,

In close, with his work to the body, it'd be near impossible to throw wild swing to the body from close distance, so that's not what I meant, of course. When he was closing the distance with punches to the head, he often swinged wildly.

All three were a bit faster than McGovern, but McGovern’s compact punches landed before his opponent’s punches could.

Anyone who actually takes time to watch the Gans fight, will see plenty of wild swings to the head from McGovern. And the reason why so many of them landed being because Gans didn't try very hard to block or avoid them or to counter his opponent, he just stood there or backed away slowly, absorbing everything McGovern threw, even wild punches that even a newbie would see and do something about them (block, duck, slip, lean away, step back, step in, etc).

Of course he had the power to knockout McGovern, if he could have hit him, but McGovern did not allow him to get settled and he did not allow Gans to sit back and dictate the fight as that was one of Gans best assets…

Fight reports. Even the fighters who were overwhelmed by McGovern (almost all were) were able to hit him back more effectively than Gans in this bout.

>>>I'm not sure what your point is. You claim it never happened in his prime or you claim it did happen a couple of times<<<


It's in plain english....you claimed that I stated that McGovern was never out-pointed in his prime, which I never did claim and I thought that by giving you two examples of when he was out-pointed, the White and Callahan fights, would be evident enough...,obviously you either won't, or cannot put one and one together, although it's a little more obvious than
putting anything together and actually it's a waste of time...I'm sorry iof this soundsd like an insult as it is not intended as such, but you're like arguing with a woman!


>>>Reports you mentioned, each came from one source, if I'm not mistaken, and was just reprinted by other newspapers through the AP (edited one way or another). While the source of info I wrote comes from a book written long after the fights took place (and are secondary sources), but I'm certain they were based on contemporary sources or on what the eye-witnesses described.<<<


Reports I mentioned came from one source...Jr. I have three scrapbooks of about 300 pages each full of newspaper clippings of McGovern, so as has become typical with your rants, you have no clue as to what you are talking about! Sorry Jr. but I know more about McGovern and his career than anyone you will ever know! While you may rewly on AP reports I choose to get the primary sources...you do know what a primary sources is don't you? You know, the newspapers of the town, or city where a fighter fought...such as when McGovern fought in Philly then it is reports from the Philadelphia Record, the Philly Press, the Philly Evening Legder, the Philly Item. Ap reports can be useful if you don't have anything else, but other than that only someone who relies on books written 100 years after the fact would use such sources!

It's sad really, you assume that someone else did their homework instead of doing the work yourself and therein is where you fail because anyone who makes a claim that Haley out-pointed McGovern for eight rounds, or anyone who claimns that McGovern was a weak puncher, well it's very obvious that they simply did not read anything about the fight, or fighter and that is exactly why you should not try to use a book written 100 years after the fight, or an AP source unless it is the only thing you have...primary sources is what you need...I have ten, or twenty of the two fights and trust me...not one say anything about Haley out-pointing McGovern, nor do any back anything that you have claimed. Again, you need to use primary sources and instead of assuming that someone else did their homework you should do your own!


The rest is a waste of my time. Trying to make you understand FACT and REASON is like trying to teach a woman to hit a curve ball. Until you have the ability to accept FACT and REASON and quit trying to spin little fantasy tales that have no bearing, or truth whatsoever in the discussion then it's just a waste of time and actually I have a lot better things to do than waste it arguing with someone who obviously has not done the proper research to begin with...I mean geez...you assumed that McGovern was a feather-fisted puncher who had no skill at all. Again, I don't mean this as an insult, but if you would do the research then you won't be making silly comments like...McGovern was not a knockout puncher, or that McGovern was a wild animal like Luis Firpo, or that he was out-pointed by fighters that he actually and truthfully dominated! Learn the topic!!!


>>>Fight reports. Even the fighters who were overwhelmed by McGovern (almost all were) were able to hit him back more effectively than Gans in this bout<<<

Why don't you provide some of these vaunted fight reports that you speak of? And sorry, but giving a link to a couple of articles that someone else posted does not count. Post some source that backs you initial claims about McGovern...can you do that...I doubt it!!!

And by this kind of logic...then Michael Moorer must have faked in his fight with David Tua because Moorer did not even try to box and he could certainly box, or Crawford Ashley must have faked against Jimmy Thunder because he did not even try either. You need to watch more boxing then you might come to realize and understand that sometimes fighters are not able to do anything because their opponent completely overwhelms them and at times their opponents simply will not allow them to do anything...it's happened to all the greats at some time, or another...it's not something new to Gans!

1) Excuse me, but how should I understand the following statement?

barry wrote:He also had a very solid chin and as far as him being outboxed, well, it never happened in his prime and he fought some of the better stylists and pure boxers that there have ever been.

It claims in plain English that McGovern was never outboxed in his prime.

2) The AP vs local sources, it was a well known practice where a local journalist wrote his report and then it got to the AP newswire and was reprinted by other sources. So the AP often served as a primary source too, giving the details which could not be got from anywhere, but from direct eyewitness of the fight (which is primary source by definition). So, as I wasn't quite aware of what source you used, exactly, so I made a guess.

3) While Nat Fleischer at times got his facts incorrect or plain wrong, but I highly doubt he made up things that never were, especially where exact (non-vague) claims were involved.

Such as giving out the odds shift:

Up to the fourth round, Dixon, fighting in his oldtime form, looked so good that the betting odds began to switch. At the start, it was two to one on McGovern, in the third frame there was a complete shift around, and Dixon money, offered at odds in all parts of the house, found no takers.

or giving the details of the KD count:

Through the flying leather storm, spectators saw McGovern let go a right cross toward the head, and Gardner step inside the punch, lashing a left hook to Terry's jaw. It hit the button squarely.
McGovern dropped to the canvas. At "eight" he rolled his glazing eyes, and saw Gardner standing over him, ready to deliver a deciding wallop as soon as his opponent arose. Sam Harris was gesturing frantically to Terry to get up. Hastily the champion rolled forward and grabbed for the nearest hand-hold he could find.
That happened to be Gardner's right leg ...
Gardner's handlers afterward contended that a total of nineteen seconds passed before Terry regained his feet and resumed hostilities!

or the details of tactics

In the first eight rounds the Buffalo lad easily outpointed McGovern, utilizing a straight, flashing left jab with excellent results, and making use of every inch of the ring to avoid mixing at close quarters.
Haley was well aware that he stood no chance with Terry at slugging, and without actually making a runaway fight of it, kept perpetually on the move, letting Terry do the aggressive work, but scoring often with sharply delivered counters.

Some artistic touches in there, I admit, but to stretch the truth that far for these descriptions to have been nothing of what actually happened, would be too much for Fleischer to do, especially that he didn't dislike McGovern to make up things that make him look somewhat "worse".

4) Would you care to quote exact statements that I was the author to, where I said "McGovern was a feather-fisted puncher who had no skill at all"? Because we need to stick to facts and primary sources, and not attribute the opponent with words they never said.

5) Examples? Ok. George Dixon fight:

Round 2 - Dixon opened with a left swing for the head and McGovern ducked neatly and he drove George back with a left on the body. Dixon planted a left swing high on the head, but Terry crowded in, sending both hands to the wind. George jarred Terry's head with a straight left and followed with a right jolt on the body. They mixed it up rapidly and Dixon almost put Terry through the ropes with a left on the face. They came to the center, where George again landed a hard left on the face. In another mixup Terry worked well to the body, and after they broke away George landed left hard on face, "Mac" replying with right on body.

6) In which other fight was Gans overwhelmed by anyone from the start and had no time to even start throwing anything and was hit with such regularity as the McGovern fight? McGovern was a featherweight, I should mention again, and Gans a lightweight. So the Tua-Moorer example is way off the mark, sorry, and Moorer was nowhere near Gans' level as a counter-puncher (that was used to fight while going backwards just as well as by going forward and mixing it up in close).

barry wrote:I have ten, or twenty of the two fights

How many of them are actually different reports from different authors, and not a re-print of the same source in several newspapers (from the newswire)? I doubt there were 10 or 20 different newspapers in Brooklyn/New York City area, who each printed their own report of the fight.